Daniel Leeds. Justly Rebuked for abusing WILLIAM PENN AND HIS FOLY and FALIS-HOODS Contained in his two Printed Chalenges to CALEB PUSEY made Manifest; With some remarks also by way of Rebuke on the Author of the Book called News of a Strumpet.
Every day they Wrest my Words: all their thoughts are against me for evill.
They Imagined a mischievous device, which they are not able to perform.
They encourage themselves in an evil matter: vers, 6. They search out iniquities; they accomplish a diligent search.
Printed at Philadelphia by REYNIER JANSEN 1702.
THE PREFACE
AS I hope, upon thy Serious consideration, thou [...] not take it amiss, that we have at this time, and in this manner appeared, against G. K. especially, considering the Fresh occasion he hath given us, since his [...] Arivall in America; some Relation of which appears in this following Book, so also thou art Seriously desired to consider, whether it doth not necessarily behove G. K. as he would approve himself, not only to be a Man of Pen; but also a Man Sound in Judgment, to prove himself consistant with himself, in and about divers Principles of Christianity, acknowledged by himself to be Fundamentalls, concerning which he is hereby plainly proved, to ly under great variations, Inconsistances, and Confusions; I say, doth it not behove him so to prove himself, inste [...]d of his thus Disturbing us, (or others in our peaceable Religious Assembly [...], or otherwise, since he that T [...]ches another, ought certainly first to Teach himself. And now as to the difference between our Friends, and G. K. here, begun by him, about eleven or twelve Years ago; it was chiefly about that of the universall necessity of the Faith and knowledge of Christ's outward Death and Suffering, in order to Salvation; for tho' he begun at that time, to Pick up such Sentences and passages, out of our Friends works, [...]s by S [...]aining and perverting, he thought he could render Odious to the People; and also to catch at some weak, unadvised, and unwarrantable Expressions, from here and there an unweary Person, about other matters, (and disapproved by our Friends, on all occasions [...] yet that about the universall necessity of Faith in Christ without us, was confessed by himself, severall times in Print, to be the main matter of Controversie with our Friends here, as in the following book is shewn: and he charged [...] that time, severall Friends, with such words, as I have heard them [Page] [...] to be in her [...]. And indeed, the first [...] him [...] with [...] Friends, was about this [...] in a Private Meeting at P [...]ph [...], in the year 169 [...]. [...] and [...] he vehe [...]tly, P [...]t the universall necessary [...] this manner viz Saith he, I deny him to be a [...] of C [...]st, who doth not in the Course of his Ministry, [...] without us; Ri [...]en again without us; Ascen [...] Is [...]n without us; & not only so [...] he); but that the [...] and knowledge of Christ's Sufferings &c. without us, [...] Univers [...]y [...] di [...]ensibly necessary, to all and every one, in [...] to out in E [...]nall [...]fe, and Salvation; and yet said he, I say, if an honest Indian o [...] H [...]athen &c. do but live Faithfull to the Light within him, he could not miss of Salvation. And I found in a Book of his, Printed but a little before, where he saith of such, they could not perish, tho' they I [...] in that [...]at. Se Re [...]u [...] [...] pa. 40. This made me I must Confess begin to admire, what the Man was all of a Sad [...] so hard driving at; for thought I, it such Gentiles could not perish, tho' they Dyed without that Faith and knowledge of Christ in the outward, and yet could not [...]e Saved, without they had that Faith and knowledge; where then must they have it, in order to save them? But quickly upon this, there was an honest Friend, and then a late Intimate of G. K's told me, G. K's Notions of the twelve Revolutions of Humane Souls: And that according to those Notions, those Faithful Gentiles, as also Infants, born Idiots &c. should some time or other live again, by being born in other Bodies, in some place of this World, where they may have the Gospell expressly Preached to them, in order to perfect their Salvation: These things of so long standing, I speak not as trusting only to Memory; for I committed them quickly to writing, to prevent mistakes, through shortness of Memory. And hearing also, that G. K. had been deeply Concerned, in Writing a Book of 200 Queries, concerning those twelve Revolutions. I got a sight of it, and soon found, that his above method of Doctrine Exactly, Coresponded with the said Revolution Notions, as also did divers Passages though some of them Coucht in severall of his [Page] Books, than lately Printed against some in New England and Rhoad Island; in which I [...]ound, that he then held, that the [Express] Faith and knowledge of Christ without &c. was absolutely, and Indespensibly necessary, to the perfecting of me [...]s Salvation: And hearing, that that Revolution Book was [...] in the year 81 or thereabouts, I searcht what Books I could get, of all he had published, from that time to the time of his differing here with us: And I think, I found scarce one; but had more or less, some Expression dropt, or at least Co [...]ch [...], which really seemed to depend upon those Revolution Notions; but most plain, as the time came, or drew near, to his suffering with our Friends here.
And now, since in pa. 25. 26. of this book, I gave a relation of some concern betwixt G. K. and an other Person, about the Revolutions, James Coper Cloth worker of Darby, did many years ago give it, and more of his Strange Nations under his hand and is ready to give more (yet upon occasion) of his Whim [...]ies, that he was then [...] with, as he is now [...]gg with Inveterate Hatred, and Persecuting Enmity, against his old Friends, who seing, and being sensible of his Spirit in time, could not humour him, upon which he grew so disorderly and ungovernable in the Church, that our Friends saw a necessity of disowning him as a Minister of the Peacable Gospell among us.
And whereas, in this book pa. 8 there is mention made of G. K's Couching the Revolution Notions, In severall [...]eks; but for brevitys sake, did not insert them there, being Pl [...]y of the said books, the Country, yet least some may be des [...]ous to [...]e something of it who cannot get the books, I shall the [...] however insert one or two Pass [...]es, not [...]etracted, that I think, must needs make his Revolution Notions, speak out plain enough, to shew, how deep he has Prank those Notio [...]s in.
Object. But he says, he could never Justly own himself to be the Author of that Book, for others were concerned pa. [...].
Ans. I know not who ever Charged him to be the whole Author; but for him to say, others were concerned, Implys, he was concerned as well as others.
[Page] Ob. But he says, those Books, (meaning those, where [...] him about the Revolutions), they were generally approved as, [...] Friends of the Ministry Anti. and S [...]duce. pa. 9.
Ans. But he doth not say, they were all so aproved, however we Read in J [...]de 9. There were some, who were not Right that Crept in at unawares, Mark, at [unawares]; and it was told by the Apostle Peter: that there should be false Teachers, who would Privet [...]y bring in Damnable Heri [...]ies &c. So that's no new thing.
And now, whereas, there are in the said Revolution Book, many of the Queries, that really seem to be as Texts, to save all Passages in some books, afterwards writt by him, as above; I shall therefore, before I cite the Passages, lay down one of them, that it may be seen, how close he keeps his Doctrine to the Text, it's the 37. query, and the words are these, (viz.) ‘seing Christ said, that this Gospell of his Kingdom,should be Preacht to all the World, for a witness against them; is it not evident, that all the World, that is every Man that is born into the World, from the First to the Last, must have that very Gospell of the Kingdom, in which Mention is made, of the Womans Powring Ointment on his Body, Preacht unto them, as well [Outwardly] as inwardly, before it can be made a witness against them; compare Math. 24.14. with Math. 26.13.’ Thus much as to the Text: Now let's se G. K's Doctrine, as agreeable thereto, Pretended Antidote pa. 105. Where speaking of the meaning, [...] Extant of Christ's words, where he Commands his Gospell to be Preached to all Nations, and of his saying, so it shall be before the End; he saith, as his meaning upon those Texts, thus; ‘The Gospell that began to be Preacht, from Adams Fall Immediately, shall be Preacht to all Men, that Ever lived in the World: some time or other, before the End of the World; so that such as shall not Live in the latter Ages of the World, have had it Preacht in the former Ages when they Lived in the World’
‘And therefore, (saith he) the Preaching of the Gospell to all the World; is the Preaching of it, to all Mankind, that ever [Page] Lived, and shall Love in the World, in all Ages, from the beginning to the End &c. Thus far G. K. in pa. 104. 105. Pretend. Antidote. pa. 107.’ Speaking of the like matter, he saith (as a Scripture Proof) ‘Else how is the Gospell Preacht to every Creature; and how is Christ's Command to be fulfilled, that he hath given to his faithfull Apostles, and to their Faithfull Successors, in all Ages? And how is the Prophecy of Christ fullfilled, that so it shall be before the End? &c.’ From all which the Reader may observe, that as the above cited Revolution Text explains the above mentioned Commands of Christ, to Preach the Gospell to all Nations &c.) to mean, that it shall be Preacht to all Mankind that Ever lived, or shall live in the World, so does G. K's Doctrine too: And as that Text, by saying, it shall be so Universally Preacht; not only Inwardly, but also OUTWARDLY, Implys, that it shall be so Preacht by the Apostles, o [...] their Successors; so does G. K's Doctrine too: But how the Apostles, or their Successors should Preach the Gospell to that part of Mankind, that have hitherto dyed without it, as Infants, Heathens, Deaf and Dumb Persons &c. unless they come again, according to the Revolution Doctrine, I think it might beh [...]ve G. K. to make out if he can; since he says, he is of the same Faith, as he hath been above this [...]0 years, Exact Narrati [...]s pa. 20.
IT is surely a certain truth, that the Church of CHRIST, [...] because of the many Adversaries and [...] she hath to encounter [...], before it can be truly said of her, her warfare is accomplished &c. For [...], her members have many inward enemies, many inward butterrings▪ as well as many inward temptations and allurements; and accordingly it is truly said, a mans greatest enemies are those of his own house: & as mans Soul's e [...]ty was never wanting to suite his temptations according to the natural inclinations of men in general; so [...]e was, and also is at this [...] no less industrious to ensure assault and overcome the members of Christ's Church [...] particular; some whereof, for want of watchfulness, he hath caused in all ages to stumble and fall; and although evil minded men have taken occasion thereby to vaunt and cry, Abe, Ab [...]; yet it would be good for them to consider, that, unless they repent, their own Judgment lingers no [...], [...] their condemnation [...]umbers not. And in the day of account all those false suggestions against us, and particularly those in the preface to the book called News of a Strumpet; (viz:) that we deny our selves to be fallible or deceiveable &c. and the pretence therein made, for denying us the common priviledge of mankind on that score, will not abide the test of gods righteous and just Tribunal; [...] as much as God the searcher of all hearts knows, that from the beginning he hath caused by his light and grace the people called QUAKERS to see their own exceeding great weak [...]esses, infirmities, and failings, through a true sight and sense of which they have still professed and owned themselves to be both fallible and deceiveable; and therefore have they in [...] santly made it their business to provoke and stir up one another to hear and to fear, to watch and to pray, as assuredly [...] that without which, and without the assistance of Gods Holy Spirit, which they pray for, they can no wa [...]es be [...] [Page 2] from falling under, and into Temptation; nor are indeed [...] secure than other men; notwithstanding the [...] adversaries in their straining of our Principles about perfection and their misconstruing some of our friends writings [...] [...]allibility and discerning: and although thousands should [...] on the right hand, and ten thousands on the left; yet that should be no reason now, any more than of [...]old, to discourage or hinder others from keeping streight on in the way of the Lord their God [...]: and whereas the Strumpet-Author saith in his title page. (viz.) nothing can be written, but something may be objected agai [...]st it. And▪ That's true (Else, how could D. L. in his pag: 71 have objected against a passage writ by G: W: (viz.) where G: W▪ saith "We preferr the holy Scriptures above all the [...]ooks extant in the World; But because he did not there name the Book called the Bible expressly. Therefore D: L: in [...]inua [...]es that he did not mean the BIBLE; but that he carried a double face to deceive his Reader; Nevertheless as when things are truly written, nothing can be truly objected against the truth thereof; so, if the said Strumpet Author, did but dare to show his head, he might possibly be told and shewed that he hath written things of our Friends, very unjustly and thereby hath basely aabused honest men among th [...] m [...]in particular and numb [...] them with the guilty; as well as that he hath abused the Quakers in general although indeed by this his doing and then concealing his name [...] [...]ing of the [...] the Serpent, [...] nothing of the [...] but whereas he in [...]inuates that we called [...] that's not so it's true in as much as D: L: would [...] medling and [...] ing our Society with having [...] among them; it was but reasonable that to clear the [...] a so have named the guilty, otherwise every innocent member [...] as guilty; but first as this was not calling for [...] thing; so 2dly, what was said, was [...]o D. L. the [...] to no body; For so I call this nameless Strumpet: [...] [Page 3] though some matters of fact mentioned by the Strumpet, were not true; yet they were not all done about Delaware that D. L. spake of; neither did D. L. speak of any other, but of late [...] but this Strumpet hath not only brought examples of above [...] years standing; but also hath extended his ropes to pull some of them as far as from Rhoad Island, Mary-land; yea, and [...] Old-England to: but lastly, however, methinks, he should make no Pretence whatsoever for abuising honest men, as he hath done: & now this Strumpet-author in his page 19. seems to suspect we will reflect on him for taking up dir [...]; well in as much as nothing short of turning scavenger hath served him, let him not blame us, if we reflect on him for being partial, and not trusty in his office; for a Scavenger ought to go through the streets and take up the dirt, where found, at every door; but instead of doing that, and instead of taking up the dirt that lies, [...] is generaly suffered to lye at the doors of other protest Christians [...] moved and possibly much unreproved, he la [...]es his dirty [...]a [...]e only at the door of the Quakers; though the dirt, to witt, such as was the actions of J: M: T: T: H: J. and that about Keyes-Boat, with other condemnable practices, that have been found to have lain there, have been by themselves removed, and the parties concerned proceeded against by Church Di [...]cipline, as in such cases under the Gospel, is required, long before this Scavenger appeared with his dirty [...]ake to heap it up; and so the poor Man therein hath lost his labour; but, pray, what is all this labour for? What is all this exceeding partiality and inve [...]eracy against us for? But to render honest men odious by [...] bring them with the guilty: and would this Strumpets innocently but defend him▪ now he hath done this, from being [...] to shew his [...]; but come forth, and defend what he hath done, and prove to us, that there lies at our doors unremoved such aforesaid black dirty stuff, as he charges us with, and that he hath writ nothing there against us, but what is true he might then be the more excused for appearing with [...] [Page 4] [...] us; but on the other hand, we shall expect thou [...] that when, we have proved, that he hath brought dirt from his own Channel (to witt, [...] his own evil heart) and laid it at [...], endeavouring thereby to make the world believe we are chargeable with what we are not; I say, then we shall expect [...] he should own and confess he hath abused us, and it [...] this come forth and shew himself, we might think i [...] [...]o nothing more worth ou [...] while. [...]o make a more strict and [...] into those dirty ma [...]e [...]s many of [...] unjustly [...] at the doors of several persons among [...] in particular; as also at the Quakers door in general; but [...] shall one say? such lying i [...] wa [...] for haltings, and such inv [...]te [...]e [...]atr [...]d [...]o [...]n evil [...] have been the [...] of good People in all ages: And [...] man gives a [...] i [...]: wi [...]d. ch [...]p 2. (viz: [...] they were grievou [...] unto him ever [...] behold: and for that his life [...] mens and [...] of another f [...]ion; [...]) let us [...] the righteous: [...] [...]ng the Law [...] which leads me to have the [...] and come to speak [...] thing of another way and manner the [...] had [...] hath to try and [...] the professors of Tru [...]h with, which hath [...] up his instruments pri [...]ts and others to prove the [...] which they have lived [...] is [...] that was born [...] Ba [...]ist [...]ts Confiscations of goods and [...] by [...] how also some for want of [...] of he [...] and the ease the [...] [...]ook Paul for [...]ook the [...] [...] they [...] truth: Another [...] again the [...] had: and still hath, which is to cause some who [...] to be of the Church of Christ, [...] up from [...] of speaking perverse things; [...] and that as many formerly [Page 5] [...] done, (the witt) [...] but [...] those sorts [...], though [...] of their profession▪ as also to the exercise and [...] of the [...] have stood faithfully; yet those [...] who have been truly penitent, have [...] against and by deep humility and repentance have found mercy wit [...] the Lord for his [...] who [...] others [...] the evil men [...] old have [...] by their [...] have [...] and [...] enemy [...] the Christians, that Julian the [...] as to [...] past and also in this Age in which the [...] gathered and drawn [...] people to worship [...] sp [...]rit and in truth; divers have risen up [...] thereof to oppose the progress of [...] this [...] now concerned [...] one who in his [...] against out Friend [...] grievously to abuse [...] them and then works as [...] be seen in my book [...] is being [...] of [...]n answer so his News of a Trumpet &c. we began not [...] with us endeavouring by his many abuses and [...] in the way of the weak; our part hath been defensive, in o [...]de [...] to remove those stumbling blocks [...] the way: and now among the rest of his abuses he hath strangely [...] accusation against W. P. & falsely accuses him with [...] particular [...] as a great abuse: Next he [...] [...]per called a challenge to [...] which [...] freedom to [...]ly [...] and [...] better in [...], and [...] it by [...] [Page 6] [...] instead of his [...] had [...] threatening [...] he sends [...] which he [...] and [...] put out a fresh challenge [...] to that purpose but under [...] he could think [...] with the challenge and Letters are hereafter [...] book on [...] hath packed out the [...] against him; the publishing whereof must [...] more ganerally to shew whether D. L. hath [...] matter or not, more than the greatest dis [...] would do, and [...] he hath taken to [...] to Answer his challenge [...] for him now to be c [...]ntent to take an Answer in as publick a manner as he hath given his challenge and charge.— [...] of the following discourse I have laid down by [...] [...]tion, [...]uestion and Answer [...]aking it [...] I may in a more familiar manner clearly set forth those things I have undertaken to speak to; and so in that method I shall proceed having first laid down his first [...] challe [...] [...] large, which is as followeth. —
A Challenge to Caleb Pusey [...], [...] & Forge [...]es, &c. [...]
I Tis three years since I published a Book ca [...]led, [...] [...]et &c. which has [...] and [...]all'd the [...] vile Errors and Heresies further disco [...] [...] some Consultations there has been among [...] bring forth an Answer, which accordingly, [...] and at last have met with a right. Scurril [...] [...] [Page 7] [...] Caleb Pusey, Satan's Harb [...]ger by Title wherein he preten [...] [...] there a bit of my said Book: [...] with silence; and what he [...] place [...] [...] my Sentences to pieces, [...] of the [...] to make me speak [...] had of G. Fox.] to re [...]der me [...]dio [...] To prove this, I'll [...] pa [...]age, [...] very first Quotation he brings of [...] where he le [...]ves out these Words▪ According to wh [...] was made manifest to them and so makes it spe [...] as he [...] has a [...] a wind. B [...], he [...]ing sucked such Wickedness from he fo [...]d [...] of their Religion, he cannot leave it [...] he ceases to be a [...].
For great part of those confused sayings which I quote he sends me to a Quakers Book for an answer, viz. to G. K's. Books while he was one [...] th [...]m. Alas poor man! is the Quakers ca [...]se so [...] he is forced to support it with one Quakers Book to help [...]other, which duely considered, no ways helps him [...]th [...]r. I have [...]read above half his Pamphlet, yet meet with between [...] and forty Lyes, Perversions, Forgeries, &c. Lyes of all sorts double and single; in order to prove this I'll not [...] his Book neither, but take that one Passage, that he quotes in his Pref [...] where he charges me of shamefully al [...]ng a saying of [...]. Penn in [...] Sandy Foundation, p. 20 There [...]e denys that [...] W. Penn [...] Christ, as ma [...] The finite impotent Creature.
This I charge on Caleb Pusey as a Lye; Nay, 'tis [...] for he [...] W. P. [...] [...]t of us sinners; whereas the ou [...]ly [...] that W. P.'s there [...] is Jesus Christ as the [...] son in the [...] ca [...]s. The finite Impotent Creature [...] [...]nd deneis him to haue satisfied the offended infinite Ju [...]tice [...] [...]ther for [...] sin, for that [...] Books of W. P [...] People that [...] the Book for that purpose to discover the baseness of [...] Caleb Pusey.
[Page 8] [...] admire [...] W. Penn [...] and [...] should [...] so deeply [...] Power to [...] prevented it; certainly if he believes [...] giue account of his Steward [...]hip to Almighty God [...]he [...] believes this thing [...]ill rise in Judgment against him which is p [...] sely [...] to deceive and delude poor ignorant People. [...] C. Pusey I have [...]ore son to expect better fruits from him [...]or he is [...] honest in Morals, he unjustly with holds par of in Estate from the Executor of Thomas Cross; but be it known to him [...] force him so [...] be honest provided his [...]rethren are no Judges in the case. However he's a fit Tool in [...]erve the Q [...]akers [...] be th [...] [...]ye and abuse men without shame. But to the neither.
Let this one passage in his Preface, which he [...] Crime against me [by repeating it divers times over and over in [...] Book, and calls it an abo [...]i [...]able L [...]e] he th [...] [...] and [...] of Tryall between us in the case, and to try the rest of [...] stuff in his Book. Therefore I here challenge him in the face of the World to let us chuse four six or more [...]ud [...]rious Men to judge of this Passage, and if they find wrong and he right, I'll be bound to print what sort of Con [...]emnation Caleb Pusey shall assign. But if they find me right and he wrong, he shall be [...] to print what Condemntation I shall assign him.
Now with this Mill [...]stone, through Gods [...]stance, will I grind this Miller and by this Token it [...] be known to the World that his case is Naught, that he makes Lyes the Quakers Refuge, [...] not refer it to any but his own Party who are his encouraggers in this wicked Work, and at whose Charge he prints and not at his own for New Rome has a Publick Stock to carry on her under ground Designes [...] is otherwise with [...], I must [...] [Page 9] [...] [...]efore till [...], my Challenge, this is [...] to give [...]. Mean tim, [...] by d [...]vine Providence in England, [...] has been Re-printed and [...] for the [...] my [...] in De [...]ance of [...] of his [...] which will prevail [...] [...]hose [...] Conquered.
[...] perceive by the foregoing discourse, I may expect an [...] said challenge relating to D. L. charging W: P: with calling the Man-Christ, the finite, impotent creature, by w [...]t [...]; But why sayest thou to some other matter of his challenge as first where he speaks, as i [...] his the [...] Quakers [...] errors and heresies hath vexed and gall [...]d [...]?
An [...]: That's meerly begging the question, he not having prov [...] what they hold [...]ny vile errors and heresies; nor that what he writ [...] vexed o [...] g [...]ed them.
Obj: [...] he saves there was some consultations among you how to bring [...] answer.
An [...]: As to that, I know of none; and there being so many [...] [...]is [...]oods and [...]urri [...]es [...] in the said Tru [...]pet, and the Author so notoriously known to most people her [...] away, [...] for [...]y part [...] Friends here (speaking generally) [...] the notice of [...] care to answer, as of any book that [...] came [...]; neither was what I writ, the effect of any consultation about it▪
Obj▪ Well▪ but he [...], thou [...]eaps ver 4, 5, or 6. pages at [...] to answer here [...] a [...]itt.
[...] was sufficient to [...] o [...] manifest his great abuses of our Friends; and [...] did not answer other parts of his book [...] not many of [...] [Page 10] quoted, by me to examine them by his quotations; and I sufficiently shewed, I had no reason to credit them (as from him) without tryal and examination.
Obj. But he saies, that what thou speaks to in many places▪ thou tears his Sentences to p [...]e [...]es &c. The true Method of G. Fox &c. And leaves out these words [according to what was manifest to them.]
Ans. I shall pass by his proofless reflections upon that good and heavenly minded man G. F. and now tell D. L. that unless he had shewn wherein those words I left out, would have given him any relief, if I had added them, I look upon his Objection but meerly frivolous, and I know no relief it would have given him; for whereas, he saies it is his real belief that Quakers at first came forth in life and power and made a good beginning; now, that it was but according to what was made manifest unto them; surely all sensible people will take it for granted; for Good men in all ages came forth in life and power, no further than what was manifest to them; this is therefore surely a poor cavil; but how his citing this one place should prove my tearing his Sentences to pieces in many places as he speakes of, he will be harder put to make out, than the passage' it self proves him to have committed a great blunder, for how could his citing this one place prove me guilty in many places.
Obj. But he speaks, as if then sends him to G. K's. books (whilst a Quaker) for answer.
Ans. I do not remember, neither hath he shewed me one place that I have undertook to answer him, in which I have not used sound arguments prove him in the wrong, and our Friends in the right, besides what I cited of G. K's. books; and my often citing G. K's. books was chiefly by way of arguing Ad h [...]minem, and to shew his great partiality in pretending he would have taken in G: K's. books equal with our Friends; but that he hath retracted &c: as aforesaid; whereas those of G: K's. passages which I cited, as agreeable to those D. L. cited of our Friends, was not retracted by him; and therefore w [...]ren [Page 11] I cited G. K. I often used these words [not retracted] as is to be seen in divers places o [...] my Book; and therefore often [...] upon D. L. to be impartial, o [...] the like, see page 12. 14. and 17 &c. As for G: K's writings, they are still his, being not retracted; and why might not I make use of them against himself or his Friends: did not Paul make use of the Heathen Poets Doctrine, [...] 17: 28. to prove that in God we lived, moved and had our being; also did not be make use of un [...]dy vain talkers and deceivers to prove the Cr [...]tians lyars &c. When he said, one of themselves, even a Prophet of their own said, the Cretians are alwayes lyars &c▪ [...]. [...].10.12.
Qu [...]: B [...]t what sayest [...]. Lies he sayes [...] in reading about [...] thy books?
Ans: As I know of none; so he hath proved none, and I [...] he charge.
O [...]j: [...] to prove it, he saith; he will take but one passage in thy [...].
Ans: [...] help his blundering here neither, how can th [...] o [...]e passage in my preface prove me guilty of Thirty or Fourty [...] in my book O [...]trange infatuation!
Obj: But he [...] thou adds that W. P. meant the words, FINITE IMPOTENT CREATURE of us sinners; And this he calls a double lie.
An [...]: [...] question not, but I shall prove it less than a single one by and by.
Obj: But he sai [...]s, the only subject W. P. there treats upon, was Jesus Christ, as he is the second person in the Trinity &c.
Ans: That's not so; the chief and only subject W: P: there treated upon was against impossibility of Gods pardoning sins upon repentance, without a plenary satisfaction made by Christ the second person &c. as will be seen hereafter.
Obj. But D. L. admires that W. P. should countenance such [...].
Ans: [...] hath no need to be touched or concerned at what [Page 12] D. L. faith of him in the matter, knowing himself who [...] innocent as to what he charges him with; and he absolutely, denies his infamous and false accusation, and saies it's a horrid abuse upon him.
Obj: Well, but he taxed thee for with holding part an Estate belonging to the Executor of Tomas Cross, and that he can for [...] thee thus far to be honest &c.
Ans: I suppose by this, as well as by what I have formerly heard, that D. L. himself is one of the Executors; now, as I am not satisfied I owe the Estate of Tomas Cross any thing; so neither hath D. L. at any time, either by word or writing, demanded any thing of me: Thomas Cross and I had formerly, many years concern of business and dealings together; and from the first true of our being concerned to the day of his D [...]ath, I do not remember that ever we differed about our accounts or payments; and had he been living himself, I do think he would have disdained to have thus deal [...] by me: what, accuse a man of being dishonest, and unjustly with-holding part of an Estate, and yet never ask him for it, nor discourse him, about it, this surely shews his invete [...]te and disigenuous aptness to take Poor mean, and pitifull advantages to b [...] s [...]atter those he differs with; but what shall I say? As is the man; so is his manner of treatment; however, as I think I formerly told his then Nighbou [...] George Deacon that there was a matter that had long been in susp [...] betwixt Tomas Cross, on the Account of his deceased Son, my self, and another person; so know tell D. L. that, for ought I know, it lies [...]n suspence still, and notwithstanding his [...], yet if he or any on his Account come to me or meet me, at any time at Philadelphia I shall be ready to inform and assist him, as to that B [...]siness and I presume, no man can inform better than my self: and if it can be made out that there is any thing due from me to the Executor o [...] Tomas Cross; as I have alwaies been, so I shall be ready to pay it to any person legally authorized to recei [...]e [...]
[Page 13] Ques: But what sayest thou to the substance of his challenge where he saith, [...] us cause Four, Six or more judicious persons to Judge whether WILLIAM PENN called the man Christ, the FINITE IMPOTENT CREATURE?
Ans: About a Weeks time after I received his said challenge, I writ this following Letter. (viz;)
Daniel Leeds, Though I much more prefer peace above controversie; Yet in consideration of thy particular charge against me as a Lyar; and also that the truth and the matter about which thou takest so much occasion to traduce me, may be cleared, I do hereby lett thee know that I accept of thy challenge to me, in thy Pamphlet, Entituled a Challenge to Caleb Pusey &c. And am ready (by Gods assistance) to meet thee at Philadelphia, or rather than fail, at Burlington at any time within Ten-dayes from the date hereof in de [...]en [...] of W. P. against thy infamous and blasphemous charge of his calling the Man Christ the Finite Impotent Creature, about which it is, thou hast so much traduced me: the appointing the day within the said Tenn-dayes; as also which of the above places we sh [...]ll meet at, I leave to thy self to appoint, And desire thy answer to the whole by this bearer, who am thy abused Friend.
[...]est: What was D. L's answer?
Ans: Why, after all this Goliah-like; boasting and his threatening to grind me with that Milstone, as he terms his Challenge; and that by it, it shall be known, that my case is naught; and that I dare not refer to any but my own Party &c. I say after all this great vaunting I taking him up, he sends me back this following Letter (viz.)—
Caleb Pusey, In answer to what thou hast sent me I retu [...]n this, I did order a Challenge to be printed [...] August wa [...] [...] (viz) [...] August 1700. I then [...]lling a [...] [...] aware, [Page 14] convenient to have taken thee up; but if it, or something else instead thereof, be Printed, I have not seen it nor so much as heard of any thing printed in my name now; but I cannot blame thee, but the Printer for that; however what I have written I will stand to; and cannot but admire at thy confident impudence, who after thy many lies and abuses in thy book besides, that thou should insist upon that passage of W. P. and that only too I suppose for that you have a mind to kidnap me; that would be brave sport for you having the power and command of Prisons in your own hands; yea in both Provinces, if I mistake not: Be it known to thee I will first have some ground to believe thou meanest what thou writest to me, and also be secure in person, before I will so fool my self to follow an idle piece of Paper subscribed CALEB PUSEY. If I should so do, not only you, but those you call the World would laugh me to scorn who am thy Abused Friend.
Pray excuse the sence if it be not well penn'd; for the Messenger was in such haste, that I had not time to consider, as well as to write.
Quest: Well, what thinkest thou by all this?
Ans. What do I think: I think the old Proverb is much verified in D. L. (to witt) the hellow [...]ub makes the greatest sound; & the stick that makes the greatest Crack soonest breaks; for, as for his formerly dwelling at Delaware, what is that to the purpose? if he had not been desirous his vaunting challenge should have come abroad, because of his going to Egg-h [...]rbour; why did he not stop the Printing of it? a thing I do not find, he [...] much [...] pretends to: I question not, but his Printing it, was upon a presumption, that I would not take him up.
Obj: But he saies he supposes you have a mind to kidnap him.
Ans: Truly notably thought on; but had I been in his place, and the messenger in such [...]aste as he said, I think I must have [Page 15] stayed his longer than he was willing to have staid, before I should have found out such a trivolous, and altogether groundless excuse; though possibly the guilt of his Conscience for abusing W. P. might put him in mind of such a thing; I know not what else it could be; for was not the power and command of Prisons in both Provinces as much in our hands, when he ordered his Challenge to be printed; as it hath been since; therefore what sincerity can there be in this excuse.
Quest. But why doth he call thy Letter an idle piece of paper Subscribed C. P.
Ans. I know not indeed; and I think there is no reason in the world, but that I might as well have called both his challenges to me subscribed D. L. by the same name; especially considering how idly he excuses his not standing to his first challenge; and pray what certainty have or had I from him that he mean [...] what he writt when he challenged me, more than he had from me, when I took him up thereupon; Now as for his aforesaid Almanack challenge, before I go any further, I think fit [...] to [...]ranscribe, as followeth (viz.)
Whereas I lately published a challenge to Caleb Pusey; but appointed no day when to meet, whereby he took an advantage to put a trick upon me, by sending me a Letter dated October the sixth, to meet him within ten days after the date of that le [...] [...]r, Seven of the said ten being expired before I received his better: he either knew it impossible for me to prepare my self, and come near eighty-miles, and end the business, and all in [...] [...]ays time; or else had some base design upon me: therefore I now renew my challenge to him, formerly printed, and appoint the twelfth day of May next at Burlington, to refer the matter to some judicious men, (not Quakers) as noted in my challenge in the manuscript, to judge whether or no W. P. call [...] the manhood of Christ [...]he finite impotent Creature; but there happened a typographical error in the printed coppy, so that the words [not Quakers] were left out; however they are inserted [Page 16] in the following words, where I say he dare not refer it to any but his own party, and I hope he will take no advantage of a Typographical error, seeing his Brother Tomas [...]hood would not allow G. K. to do it; for I know right well that if take two Quakers against two others we do just nothing at all▪ for the Quakers dare not in such cases determine any thing against one another: I say, I will (God willing) be ready at Burlington the Twelfth of May, provided he gives me at least Tw [...] months notice under his hand and the hand of one of their Iustices that he designs to meet me then and there; Burlington▪ November the 4th.
Q [...]st: Well, what doest thou observe from this challenge?
Ans: I observe Four falshoods; first that I either put a trick upon him or else had some base design; for my Letter and intent was without Trick or Base design. Secondly, that Seven days were expired before he had my Letter; for it was but Six: Thirdly that the words [not Quakers] are inserted, meaning, in his First printed Challenge; for there is no such words inserted there. And Lastly that the Quakers in such cases dare not determine any thing against one another; for, that they are tha [...]g [...]t to do where there is just cause; not only in such, but in all case. Next I observe, that whereas he tells of near Eighty miles he was off, that was more than I knew; I was told o [...] about Fifty [...] most; and really expected he might ride it in one day: And the same day of the date of my Letter I sent it over the River to D. C. in order for conveyance with all speed; and at the messengers return he told that he (viz: D. C.) intended to go with it that Night or at furthest the next day Early; but it happened he did not go so soon as expected, and lost his way to [...]; so that it was the Twelfth day of the Month early in the Morning that he delivered the Letter [...]o D. L. but th [...] was also more than I knew till after his second Challenge was published; however, as impossible as D. L. makes it come [...] [Page 17] [...]ar, and end the business in the limited time; and as far as it was D. C. told me he came from D. L's. house on the twelfth day and riding all night was at Philadelphia [...]n the [...] teenth day in the morning: besides it ten days time had been too little to suite any circumstances he might then be under, why did not he make that his plea, and desire more time? But not one word of that then; no then it was in general terms, that he did not live convenient, and wanted to be Secured in person &c. but how is it, that he hath not conditioned the security of his person in his second challenge? [...]re being the same reason for it, as when he writ his letter; but what doth he [...] of three days time to come and end the business: for in the first place he had near four days notice. Secondly, what great business was it but to see whether. W. Penn in his 20 page of S [...]n [...]y Foundation Shaken, called the man Christ, the finite impotent creature? that surely needed no [...] time to see? besides though the tenth day was the [...] day [...]mitted to meet; yet that would not have tied us up to have [...]nded the business on that day. As for his saying, I dare not r [...]er it to any but my own party, he is at best much mistaken in that; for when I took him up, I did [...]lly expect he would chu [...]e on his part such as was not of our own party; and then why I should I be tyed up from chusing my friends, any more than he? and why he should say, let [us] cause four, six or more; and yet limit [me] in my choice; pray what choice is that? besides I see no reason at all, why I my not suspect the candidness of his party, with as much reason as he doth mine: and what obligation doth he think ou [...] Justices are under, any more than theirs, to set their [...]ands to any design of mine, sons to signify what design to do? and why had not he Justice's hand to his challenge? doth he th [...]k his credit so much better than his neighbour's, after his [...] [...]rif [...]ing with the world by his vaunting and whi [...]ing cha [...]? Upon the whole, as I am satisfied [...]s [...] way [...] with the honour and reputation of the Truth we pro [...]ess, to [...] pose [Page 18] this adversary in the same path that he comes out against us; which in this case is by the way of the press; and therefore▪ by gods assistance, so I intend so to do and clear W. P. and my [...]eit of those false charges this D. L. hath cast upon us, and trouble my self no further to answer him in his vaunting and uncertain challenges, let him challenge as oft as he pleases. And so I come now to the great point (viz to try whether WILLIAM PENN in the 20 page of his Sandy Foundation Shaken, did call Christ as man, the FINITE IMPOTENT CREATURE D. L. saith he did; I say he did not; and that the reader may see for himself without going either to Burlington or to [...] harbour for satisfaction or Information, I shall transcribe the [...]ssage at large [...], as it lies in the said book, so far as relates to that head in which those words [finite, impotent creature] are placed.
Quest. Prey [...], what was that head that occasioned those words?
Ans▪ Why the Presbyterian doctrine being this (viz.) That it was impossible for God to remitt or forgive sins without a full satisfaction made him by Christ the Second person in the Trinity. William Penn to prove that doctrine false; undertakes to re [...]u [...]e it under two distinct heads, the one from Scripture, the other from right reason; now, that wherein those words are, is at the conclusion of that head, by which he refutes the said doctrine from Scripture.
Quest. By what arguments doth he refute the said doctrine from Scripture.
Ans [...] By three sorts of Arguments, the first is, that it cannot be impossible for God to pardon and forgive; because he had often promised so to do; for which he cites Exodus 34.6, 7. And the lord passed by before him, [Moses] the Lord God mercifull and gracious, keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity▪ transgression and Sin; with many more of the like import in his Second argument was, that it could not be impossible for God to forgive, since it was not only possible, but enjoin'd to men to do it, for which he produced Matthew the 6.12.14 thus, Forgive us [Page 19] our debts, [...] forgive our debtors; for if you forgive men then [...] passes, your Heavenly Father will also forgive you &c. The Third Argument was, that Gods love to us, was not the effect of Christ's satisfaction; but that Christ is the proper gift & effect of Gods love; for which he produced this Scripture, Iohn the 3.16. For God so loved the World, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believed in him should not perish, but have everlasting Life; with many more such like Scriptures; now, he having proved by those Three sorts of Arguments back'd with Three sorts of Suitable and distinct Scriptures, that it was not impossible for God to forgive without a plenary satisfaction made, he in the conclusion sums up the matter in short in his page 20. shewing thereby the absurdity o [...] that Doctrine when compared with the sense of those Sciptures and so places them in order in 1st. 2d. and 3d. heads; as hee had before placed his Scripture arguments to shew their Doctrine false by; and made the First absurdity to be thus; (viz.) that God is gracious to forgive (he having so proved from Scripture) and yet impossible for him, unless the debt be f [...]ll satisfied.
The Second obsurdity, which is to our point, was thus that the Finite impotent Creature is more capable of extending Mercy and forgiveness than the infinite and omnipotent Creator, he having before proved that Man who is a Finite and Impotent Creature was not only capable of extending Mercy and forgiveness, but was enjoin'd to do it. And now that the Reader may more fully see that I have not mingled or clipped William Pen's words so as to pervert the sense of them. I shall bestow the Transcribing of them verbatim where he begins thus viꝪt.
Doct [...].
That man having transgress'd the Righteous Law of God, and so [...]x [...]c [...]d to the penalty of eternal Wrath, it's altogether impossible for God to remit or forgive without a Plenary satisfaction; and that there was no other way by which God could obtain satisfaction, or save men, than by inflicting the penalty of infinite w [...]ath and vengeance on Jesus Christ the Second Person of the Trinity, who for sins past, present, and to come, hath wholly [...]or [...] and paid it (weather for all or but some) to the offended infinite justice of his Father.
[Page 20] 1 And the Lord passed by before him, Moses) and proclaimed, [...]xod. 34.6, 7.The Lord, The Lord merciful and gracious, keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity; transgression and sin. [From whence I shall draw this Position, that since God has proclaim'd himself a Gracious, Merciful, and forgiving God, it's no [...] inconsistent with his Nature to remit, without any other consideration than his own Love; otherwise he could not justly come under the imputation of so many gracious Attributes; with whom it is impossible to pardon, and necessary to exact the payment of the utmost fasthing.]
2. For if ye return again to the Lord,2. Chron. 30.6the Lord your God is gracious and merciful, and will not turn away his face from you. [Where how natural is it to observe that God's remission is grounded on them repentance; and not that it's impossible for God to pardon, without a Plenary satisfaction, since the possibility, nay, certainty of the contrary, viz. his Grace and Mercy, is a great Motive or Reason or that loving invitation to return,]—
3. They hardened their Necks, and hearkened not to thy Commandments, but thou art a God ready to pardon, [...]ch. 16.17.gracious and merciful. [Can the honest hearted Reader conceive that God should be thus mercifully qualified, whilst executing the rigor of the Law transgrest, or not acquitting without the Debt be paid him by another? I suppose not.
4. Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts;Isa. 55.7.and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him, and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. [Come let the unprejudiced judge, if this Scripture-Doctrine is not very remote from saying his Nature cannot forgive sin, therefore let Christ pay him full satisfaction, or he will certainly be avenged; which is the substance of that strange opinion.]
5. Behold, the days come, saith the Lord,Jer. 31.31, 33, 34.that I will make a New Covenant with the House of Israel; I will put my Law in their inward Parts; I will forgive their iniquity, I will remember their sin no more. [Here is God's meer Grace asserted▪ against the pretended necessity of a satisfaction to procure his Remission: And this Paul acknowledgeth to be dispensation of the Gospel, [Page 21] his eighth Chapter to the Hebrews. So that this New Doctrine doth not only contradict the Nature and [...] of the second Covenant, but seems in short to discharge God both from his Mercy and Omnipotente.Mich. 7.18.]
6. Who is a God [...], that pard [...]ne [...] iniquity, & posseth by the transgression of the [...] of his [...]? He retaineth not his a [...], because he [...]e [...]gin [...] in Mercy. [Can there be a [...] express passage to clear, not only the possibility, but t [...]l inclinations in God to pardon sin, and not [...] his anger for ever; since the Prophet seems to challenge all other Gods to try their excellency by his God, herein de [...]thing the supremacy of his Power, and superexcellency of his Nature, [...] be [...] iniquity and [...] not his anger for ever: so that i [...] the S [...]st [...]ctionists should ask the Question, [...] is a God [...] to ours, that cannot pardon iniquity, but retain his anger until [...]me body make him satisfaction [...] answer, Many amongst the [...] and [...] of the Nations; but as for my God, he is exalted above them [...], upon the Throne of his Mercy, who [...] iniquity, and retaine [...] not his anger for ever, but will have com [...]ss [...]on upon us.]
7. And forgive us our Debts,M [...]t. 6.12as we forgive our Debtors. [Where nothing can be more obvious than that which is for given, is not paid: And if it is our duty to forgive without a [...]atisfaction received, and that God is to forgive [...]s us as we forgive them, then is a satisfaction totally excluded: Christ further paraphrases upon that part of his Prayer. v. 14. For if ye forgive their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will also forgive you. Where he as well argues the equity of Gods forgiving them, from their forgiving others, as he [...] [...] ges them to forgive others, from the example of God's Mercy in forgiving them; which is more amply exprest in chap. 18. where the Kingdom of Heaven (that consist in Righteousness) is represented by a King; Who upon his Debtors Petition, had compassion, and forgive him; but the same treating his fellow Servant without the least forbearance, the King condemned his unrighteousness, and delivered him over to the [Page 22] Tormentors. But how had this been a fault in the Se [...] if his Kings Mercy had not beer proposed for his Exam [...] How most unworthy therefore is it of God, and blasphe [...] ous, may I jus [...]ly tearm it, to be in [...]y's daring to assert that forgiveness impossible to God, which is not only possible but enjoynd to men.]
John 3.16. 8. For God so loved the World, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosover believed in him, should not perish but have everlasting Life. [By which it appears, that God's Love is not the effect of Christ's satisfaction, but Christ is the proper Gift and Effect of God's Love.]
Act. 10.34. 9. To him gave all the Prophets w [...]nes [...], that through his Name whosoever believed in him, shall receive Remission of sins [So that Remission came by believing his Testimony, and obeying his Precepts, and not by a pretended satisfaction.]
Rom. 8.31, 32. 10 If God be for us, who can be against us? He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all. [which evidently declares it to be Gods Act of free Love, otherwise if he must be paid, he should be at the charge of his own satisfaction, for he delivered up the Son.]
2 Cor. 11 5.18, 19. 11. And all things are [...]s God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given us the Ministry of Reconciliation, to [...] that God was in Christ, [...] the World unto [...], no repating their tress [...] unto them. [How unde [...]ably [...] parent is it that God is so far from standing on [...] high displeasure, and upon his tearms, contracting win his Son for a satisfaction, as being otherwise [...] to be reconciled, that he became himself the Reconcile by Christ, and afterwards by the Apostles, his Ambassadors, to whom was committed the Ministry of Reconciliation.]
Eph. 1.7. 12. In whom we have [...] through his blood, the forgiveness of sins occording in the riches of his [...]. [Now what relation, satisfactor has to forgiveness of [...] or how any can construe Grace to [...] Justice, the meanest understanding may determine.]
[Page 23] 12 But the God of all [...], to [...] us unto his1 Pet. [...] 10. [...] Glory, by Christ Jesus [He does [...] say that God's [...] consideration of Christ's Satisfaction, acquitted [...] has past, present and to come, & therefore hath [...] to his eternal Glory, but from his Grace.]
1 [...]. In this, was manifested [...] love of God toward us,1 John 4: [...]:because that God sent his one [...] begotten Son into the World, that [...] through him: [Which plainly attributes Christ in his Doctrine, Life, Miracles, Death, and Sufferings to God, as the Gift and Expression of his Eternal Love, for the Salvation of men.]
1: In [...]o [...]hing that other Covenant, which consisted in External and [...] Ordinances, and that made none clean as concerning the Conscience.
2: In [...] his message of a most free and universal tender of Life and [...] all that believed and followed him, (the Light) in all his Righteousness, the very end of his appearance being to destroy the wo [...]s of the D [...]il, and which every man only comes to experiment, as he walks in a holy subjection to that measure of Light and Grace, wherewith the fulness hath enlightned him.
3: In seconding his Doctrines with Signs, Miracles and a most innocent self denying life.
4: In ratifying and confirming all(with great love, and holy resignation) by the offering up of his Body to be crucified by wicked hands; who is now ascended far above all Heavens, and is thereby become a most compleat Captain, and prefect Example:
So that I can by no means conclude, but openly declare that the Scriptures of truth are not onely silent in reference to this Doctrine of Satisfaction; but that it's altogether in to silent with the Dignity of God, and very repugnant to the Conditions, Nature, and Tendency of the second Covenant, concerning which their Testimony is so clear.
The Absurdities that unavoidably follow the Comparison of his Doctrine, with the sence of Scripture.
THat God is gracious to forgive, and yet impossible for unless the Debt be fully satisfied:
[Page 24] 2. That the finite and [...] [...]eature, is more capable of [...] tending Mercy and [...]orgiveness, than the Infinite and Omnipotent Creator.
3. That God so loved the World, he gave his onely Son to save it; and yet that God stood off in high displeasure, and Christ give himself to God as a comple [...]t satisfaction to his offended Justice; will many more such like gross Consequences that might be drawn:
Now I appeal to the candid reader whether D. L. had any ground in Truth to assert and maintain, as in his challenges he doth, that W. P. here called Christ, as Man, the finite and impotent Creature; For first, though he says those Priest's Doctrine compared with Scripture, that the finite impotent Creature is more capable of extending Mercy and forgiveness &c. Yet by those words [finite impotent Creature] it's clear he meant it of us that were enjoined to forgive one another; but not of Christ, as man, by the reference those words have to those Scriptures he had before produced about our forgiving Trespasses (who to be sure are finite impotent Creatures) to confute that Doctrine by: The sense of which Scriptures being compared with their Doctrine makes the absurdity; but he had no where mentioned any thing of Christ forgiving us, to occasion such a reference; but it was of our forgiving one another; Just as the words next before them, to with [that God is gracious to forgive] have a reference to the Scriptures he had there before mentioned to prove him so, as also. Just as the next words after to witt [that God so loved the World that he' gave his only Son to save it &c.] have a reference to those foregoing Scriptures he there produced to prove it.
Obj: Well, but D. L. saith, the only subject W. P. there treats on, is Jesus Christ, as he is the second person in the Trinity, whom he calls finite impotent Creature; and denies him to have satisfied the infinite Justice of the Father, for that very reason; and calls it an absurdity so to believe.
[Page 25] Ans: That's not the only subject W. P. there treats on, [...] before.
[...]: But what do those words [so to believe] signify of [...] late to?
Ans: They relate to the absurdity of any ones believing that the finite impotent Creature should satisfy, the infinite Justice of the Father.
Obj: But D. L. says That by finite impotent Creature W. Penn meant Christ, as Man.
Ans: That cannot be reasonably supposed.
Quest: Why so?
Ans: Because though both the Priests and William Penn did own that Christ as man was finite Yet the Absurdity there laid down by W. P. was the Priest's aforesaid Doctrine of satisfaction only compared with the Scripture.
Quest: What was the Priests Doctrine? was it not that Christ, as man did satisfy?
Ans: No, no, and this is Close to the point; for the Priests Doctrine was that Christ satisfied, as he was both God and Man, and not otherwise. As may be clearly seen by William Penn's then present opponent Thomas Vincent, who in his book called the Foundation of God &c. Says It was necessary that the Person that should make Satisfaction shoul [...] be man; because none but a Creature could Suffer: it was necessary he should be God otherwise the suffering and satisfaction would have been but finite; and in page 65 He says God, separately cannot satisfy; because he cannot suffer: And man separately cannot satisfy; because the Satisfaction would not be of infinite value; yet as God-man (saith he) he satisfied: Now from what hath been said it's plain, that W. P. did not place the absurdity from the Priests believing that Christ as man, did satisfy &c. For that was not the Priest's Doctrine; but the Priest's Doctrine was, that Christ the sacred Person in the Trinity satisfied, as he was both God and Man; [...] that unless W. P. had intended by what he then said, that [Page 26] Christ, not only as he was Man, but also he was God▪ was the finite impotent Creature; surely no man of understanding and charity can Judge that W. P. there intended the words [Finite, important Creature] to be meant of Christ in any respect: but in short, as the Priest's Doctrine was that God could not pardon without a full Satisfaction made by another, so the Scriptures brought by W. P. to prove that Doctrine absurd by, do clearly shew that the absurdity was, that we that are finite impotent Creatures, are, as by Scripture he proved, capable to extend Mercy and forgiveness more than God, who is the infinite, omnipotent Creator; because he could not (by their Doctrine forgive without a full satisfaction made as aforesaid: but as too much of D. L's business hath bee [...] to trava [...]l with iniquity; so the effect hath been in a great degree to conceive mischief, and bring forth falshood, but his mischief must return upon his own head: And pray observe, when all is done, had the charge against W. P. been True, as it is false; how much less is G. K. chargeable of the same thing? Who in his exact Narrative of his Meeting at Turners hall page 61 sticks not to own and defend, that he had called Christ, as man, Created; and then surely nothing Created can be either Infinite or Omnipotent: And so I shall leave this matter to the candid and impartial Reader to Judge. whether W. P. there called the Man Christ FINITE IMPOTENT CREATURE.
Postscript concerning the Strumpet-Author.
It may be well for all sorts of profest Christians to consider whether if any Atheist, Turk, Jew or other Person should [...] take example from this Strumpet-man, as to take up what [...] be collected of the miscarriages but of one Year among [...] profest Christians and communicants too; as he hath Coll [...] from among the Quakers of things done though not in less than above the space twenty Years; and should also pu [...] [Page 27] as many falshoods and abuses proportionable to the number [...] us and them; so many eminent men in particular, and the whole Societies in general, as this Strumpet Author hath done of the Quakers; and should the [...] by improve it with such aggravations, in order to make the whole body of Christians look black and odious in the eyes of all men, as he endeavors to make the Quakers look. I say, it may be well for all to consider, whether i [...] any person should go through with such a work, how exceeding black and odious, and now like a Cage of unclean birds (to use the Strumpets words) would the whole body of Christians seem to look in the eyes of Jews, Atheists and Infidels; and whether can any think, any more than we, that such a person would have the reward of well-doing for the [...]. And as for what he in his preface saith that in our answers to those heaps of confusion that Mr Leads quotes out of their books, they do not own one error, no, not one failing in all their friends books, infallibility must not give way in the least &c. To which I answer that he again insinuates, as it we held our selves infallible, which we deny; and as W. P. in his just rebuke to 21 divines page 22, sayes, we are horribly abused, in saying we pretend all our Ministers to be infallible; for we ascribe not (saith he) infallibility to men, but to the grace of God and to men so far as they are led by it: and who can say, that so far as men are so led, they are not so far infallible, without reflecting on the leadings of Gods grace? and so far we (as all men are) are infallible too; but there is too many so far from being led by it, that they have rejected it as an insufficient leader; and therein we greatly differe and as [...]e accuses us for not owning any one error that D. L. hath quoted out of our Friends books; so he hath not there [...] any one error quoted by him; and though in page 104 and [...]. of my book I have shewed how D. L. hath written [...] our Friends in 14 plain particulars; yet neither D. L. [...] have owned that he hath committed any one error [...] [Page 28] of those things; nor in any other part of his book: Methinks this they should do at [...]ast, before they [...] the Quakers of the contrary, and of standing upon the [...] above the levell of all the rest of mankind, as this Strumpet Author doth accuse [...]s.