HE excepteth against those words of mine to him, in a former Letter (of Jun. 24. which I have not here by me) that when his eyes are opened by the Lord he shall then acknowledge, that we oppose no Truths of the Lord, but hold forth what we have received from him.

To which he thus replyeth, Is Redemption by Christs blood no Truth of the Lords? Which he chargeth one of us in particular, and many others in general, with denying.

Answ. We are gathered into that, and abide in that, in which no Truth can be denyed: And are in him that leadeth into all Truth, and teacheth to deny no Truth that ever was held forth by the Spi­rit of the Lord. Some of us may not yet be grown up in under­standing into the mysteries of the Kingdom, which God hath re­vealed and made manifest to others: But yet we do not deny, but own one another in our several measures of knowledg, and sence of things, and in our several growths. And we own and acknow­ledge in Gods sight, the several Dispensations he hath brought forth, both before the Law, and under the Law and Prophets, and in the time of Ch [...]ists appearance in the flesh, and after when he sent his Spirit, and all the time the Church was in the Wilderness, and now she is coming forth again in the brightness and glory of the Father, looking forth as the Morning, fair as the Morning clear as the Sun, terrible as an Army with Banners. Nor do we [Page 2] disowne any thing that is of God in the Professors of this Age: But onely that which we know and are required by him to testifie against, as being not of him. O that they could weigh our words and Testimony in a right Spirit! For they would not then be so offended at, and speak so against us as now they do; And the Lord knoweth, we would do any thing that lieth in us to remove the stumbling blocks that lie before them: But it cannot be done to that Spirit in them, before which God Almighty hath laid the stumbling block, that it might stumble, and fall, and be snared, and broken, and taken. But if they could come into another Spirit, and feel unity with, and the birth of another Spirit, the birth of that pure Wisdom should find no stumbling block or offence in this pretious dispensation of Truth, wherewith God from on high hath visited us.

And as for denying Redemption by the blood of Christ, O how will he answer this charge to God, when none upon the earth (as the Lord God knoweth) are so taught, and do so truly, rightly and fully owne Redemption by the blood of Christ, as the Lord hath taught us to do! For we owne the blood of the Lord Jesus Christ both outwardly and inwardly, both as it was shed on the Cross, and as it is sprinkled in our Consciences, and know the cleansing virtue thereof in the everlasting Covenant, and in the Light which is eternal: Out of which Light men have but a notion thereof, but do not truly know nor own it. And let him consider, b fore the time of Antichr st, it was a great matter to know and own Christ outwardly, as he appeared in that body: But since the Antichristian Spirit hath got that, the distinguishing knowledge and owning of Christ, is to know and own him inwardly. The outward knowledge and confession now (as it is generally seperated from and held forth in way of distinction from the inward) is but the knowledge and confession of Babylon, and not the true living know­ledge and confession of Christ in and by the Spirit of the Father, which is the knowledge and confession of all the Children of the true and heavenly Mother, which is the Mother of all that are born of the Spirit.

He repeateth [...]hose words of mine, That we do not make any finite thing our Righteousness, but Christ of God is made into us Righteous­ness. This he saith, Is well spoken, a [...]d wisheth we may alwayes abide on this confession.

[Page 3] Answ. These words arose in me from an inward feeling of him who giveth Righteousness, and of the Righteousness given, and the Lord preserving me in that Life, I shall feel so for ever, and confess so for ever. And truly I can testifie of no other Righteous­ness: For blessed be the name of my God, I feel the Righteousness of his Son revealed in me dayly from Faith to Faith. In his name I have been gathered, in his name I live, and in him I feel Righteous­ness, and indeed there is nothing but Righteousness, Holyness, Truth, Life and Salvation (and the like) in him.

And he that is truly in him, is Righteous, and Holy in him; there being in him a new creating of all that are there, and a renew­ing into the holy and heavenly Image, which consists in the Righte­ousness and Holyness of Truth.

He desireth me to give a plain answer to this Question.

Is Christ of God made our Righteousness by faith in his blood, or in his Spirit?

Answ. A pretended Faith in Christs blood, without Faith in his Spirit, is but dead and notional. Except ye eat my flesh, and drink my blood, saith Christ, ye have no Life in you. It is the Spirit that quickeneth, the Flesh, saith he, profiteth nothing. Now the Faith must be in that which quickeneth: And the Faith in that which quickeneth, is Holy and Righteous; and the man who is found in it, is Justified, through that Faith in the quickening Power, in the sight of God. Thus Abraham was Justified in the sight of God, and thus are the Children of Abraham to be Justified, even through believing in that holy Power and Spirit which requireth obedience, and Justifieth the obedient, and condemneth the disobedient for ever, Rom. 4.24.

He saith, He fears a Snake in this green grass, when I say from his Life, Virtue and Power, revealed in us, is our conformity to him.

Answ. It were better and safer for him to fear at home: For the Snake is in his own grass, and many notional high soaring ex­pressions without true knowledge. But can there be any confor­mity to Christ without his Life, Vitrtue, and Power, inwardly revealed? what else can conform unto, and bring forth in the Im­age and likeness of Christ?

He saith, He feareth lest I make this Life and Virtue our Righte­ousness, which is indeed the fruits of it..

Answ. Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without [Page 4] knowledge, and runneth out from the Truth into his own imagina­tions? What was Christs Righteousness? Was it not the Life, the Virtue, the Spirit of the Father in him, he being one with it in the Faith of it, and in the obedience to it; And is not the Righteousness of the head and the body the same, communicated from the head to the body? Are they not all of one, and the Righte­ousness one and the same in both? So much of Christs Spirit, so much of his Righteousness: And out of his Spirit out of his Righte­ousness for evermore. For the Righteousness of the Son is revealed and communicated from Faith to Faith in his Spirit: And so Christ is indeed made Righteousness to them that are found in his Spirit; and they are covered with the garment of Righteousness and Sal­vation, who are covered with his Spirit.

He saith, Our Righteousness is before this.

Answ. What is our Righteousness before any of the Life, Vir­tue, and Power of Christ revealed in us. Is God a respecter of Per­sons? Doth he Justifie any out of the holy Covenant, before he hath made a change in him? How doth this man with his vain imaginations turn the whole way and councel of God upside down?

He brings a Scripture to prove this, The Spirit is life for righte­ousness sake.

Answ. That Scripture (which is, Rom. 8.10.) speaks of those in whom Christ is and dwels: And there indeed, The Body is dead because of sin, and the Spiritis Life because of Righteousness. This is plainly spoken, and plainly felt, and known as it is spoken. O that he had the true sence and understanding of it, as it is in Jesus.

He saith, Righteousness is in order of nature before Sanctification.

Answ. That which is holy is Righteous. There is nothing Righteous in the eyes of the pure God, but that which is holy. The Head was really holy and Righteous; and they that are in him p [...]rtakes of his Holyness and Righteousness, and are really Holy and Righteous in him: And Faith which purifies the heart, and through which Sanctification is, must needs be in order of nature be­fore the Justification which is by it; for God Justifieth no unbeliev­ers, but believers only. Yea the wicked must forsake his way and the unrighteous man his thoughts and turn unto the Lord, which can­not possibly be without some degree of Sanctification, before the Lord will have mercy and pardon the Soul its sins. Isa. 55.7. and chap. 1.16, 17, 18.

[Page 5]He saith Justification is an act of Grace passed upon us by God freely, without respect to us as Godly, nay properly reflecting on us in that moment as ungodly.

Answ. I charge this in the sight of God, for absolutely false Doctrine and contrary to the Gospel. For God Justifieth no man as ungodly, but calleth upon men to repent and turn from their ungodlyness, and he will have mercy upon them, Justifie and save them. Now m [...]n are not ungodly in turning from their ungodly­ness, but changed: And so their state is in some measure changed, before Justified. If Abraham was ungodly when God called him, Yet in forsaking his own Country, and following the Lord, and offering up his Son, he was obedient, and not ungodly, and in that obedience he was Justified. A man may have notions of Justifi­cation in his mind, and accordingly take himself to be Justified, when he is not: But there is no man Justified by the Lord till he be changed, translated into him in whom God Justifieth, out of the place of condemnation, into the place of Justification. For till men are changed by the Spirit and Power of the Lord, they are but darkness and in the darkness, where no Justification is. It is the Believing, the Obedient, the Children of Light, that are Justified by the Lord.

He saith, Were we godly before or at that time, it were no act of Grace to pronounce us Righteous.

Answ. He that witnesseth Salvation in Christ Jesus, witnesseth it to be a continued act of Grace. Grace appears to the Soul, Grace teacheth, Grace enableth, Grace maketh a change from the ungra­tiousness of the heart and state, and then Grace (or God by his Grace in and through Christ Jesus) forgiveth the sins that were committed before. For though the Lord visit me with Life, quick­en me thereby, make a change in my heart and state, yet it is his Mercy to acccept me, and to pass by for his name sake my former debts and trespasses against him. Alas the new Covenant is wholly a Covenant of Grace and Mercy; and the giving of Christ draw­ing the mind to him, accepting and Justifying in him, are works of Grace and Mercy towards this: So the Spiritual Israel may well sing this Song in the Land of Holyness and Redemption, O praise the Lord for he is good, for his mercy endureth for ever. I can truly set my Seal to this thing, that the more Holy and Righteous the Lord maketh me in his Son, the more sensible am I of his Love, [Page 6] Grace and Mercy in Justifying of me: And it is pretious to me to witness Justification and acceptance with him in and through his Son.

He saith further, But this is the Bounty, the Freeness, the Muni­ficence, the Richness of the Grace of God, to call things that are not as though they were.

Answ. Take heed of abusing that Scripture. God sent Christ to Renew, to Redeem, to Change, to make Holy and Righteous, to make people such as the Father might be pleased with, accept and Justifie: And as Christ maketh them so, the Father receiveth and accepteth them as such. But God doth distinguish and call things as they are. He doth not call an ungodly man, an holy man, a justified man. But when he hath changed him, new created him in Christ Jesus, took him out of his old stock and planted him into the new, then he accounteth and calleth him so, and not before. It were better for men to wait upon God, to understand what his Spirit meant in what he spake, then to put formed meanings of their own upon his words.

He wrests my words, charging and reproving me, as if I said, The Love of God was a bare thing.

Answ. Those were not my words, nor did my words so signi­fie; but my words were, that it is not by bare Loving (or meer Loving, or only Loving) that God makes a man Righteous, which is very true & manifest: For there is besides his Love (in and through that Love) the sending of his Son, and revealing of his Son, drawing to and Transplanting into his Son, to make Holy and Righteous in him. For Holyness though it may be distinguished, yet it cannot be devided from Righteousness; nor can a man posi­bly be Righteous in Gods sight, unless he be also Holy in some measure. His reflecting words hereupon I pass by, though very un­justly and unchristianly cast upon me (without any just occasion given him by my words) which I desire the Lord may make him sensible of, that he may be forgiven it.

He blameth me for saying, we make no finite thing our Righte­ousness, and yet he saith, We make the measure of the Spirit (which each member of Christ receives) our Righteousness.

Answ. A measure hath the same nature with the fulness: A measure of the Spirit and Life, of the Grace and Truth which comes from Jesus Christ, hath the same nature that the fulness ha [...]h. [Page 7] All the Life, all the new Creation that comes from him and dwels in him is Righteous and found Righteous where ever it is found. Yet I do not remember that we have thus expressed it, that that measure is our Righteousness, but it is he who is the fulness, who is revealed in that measure, and it is he, who is our Righteousness, our Wisdom, our Sanctification, our Redemption: But it is in the holy pure measure of the heavenly gift that he is made thus of God to us, not out of it.

He saith, The Lord our Righteousness Redeems us, not properly by the Life and Spirit of his Godhead, though that was in the work sup­porting, enabling him and carrying him up, in that great undertake­ing, but by the death and sufferings of his manhood.

Answ. This is strange Doctrine, to make the manhood the main Redeemer, and the Life and Spirit of the Godhead, but the supporter, and the carrier up of the man in the work of Redemp­tion: Whereas it was the Word which Created all, which also Redeemed, he that left his Glory and made himself of no reputa­tion, but came in the form of a servant to do the will. It was the Spirit and Life of the Father (even the Eternal Son) which took up that body, appeared in that body, offered it up a pure and accep­table Sacrifice to the Father, finishing the work therein, which the Father gave him to do, Joh. 17.4, 5.

He saith, Shall we think to answer the Law by our obedience?

Answ. We do not look upon the Law of Moses, which was given to the Jew outward, to be the dispensation of the new Cove­nant, or to be the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus. But those who are in the new Covenant, and have Gods Law writ in their hearts, and his fear put there, which preserveth from depart­ing from him, and his Spirit put within them, to cause them to walk in his wayes and to keep his Statutes and Judgments and do them, and who live in the Spirit and walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit, the Righteousness of the Law is fulfilled in these. Yet they do not magnifie and cry up their own obedience (nor call it their Righteousness) but him from whom their obedience comes. For in the measure of his Grace and living Truth, the Soul is one with him; and all that he is and all that he hath done is theirs, and it is he himself that is the Righteousness of all that are in him: And they that abide in him par [...]ake of his Righteousness from day to day, which floweth in like a stream upon them.

[Page 8]I wish he could consider in what Spirit it is, that he calls the white Stone a Ticket for the Righteousness. Doth he know the white Stone with the new name? It is no less then the Foundation Stone, then the Righteousness it self: And what doth he talk of bringing that as a Ticket for the Righteousness?

He seemeth to pass by some things (which I spake in tender love and weightiness of Spirit to him) as the Judgment of man in his day: but let him take heed, least when be comes to appear be­fore God, he then find it was the Judgment of Gods Spirit, in the Light of his day: Which day is inward and Spiritual, which believers are to hasten to, and which approacheth in every heart, as the night spendeth and passeth away. And all true Christians and Believers ought to wait for the passing away of the night, and the dawning of this day, and the arising of the day Star in their hearts.

He saith, Christ is now ready to be revealed.

Answ. I believe he is to be revealed fu [...]ther and in fuller glory: But he is truly already revealed as the Saviour, Shepheard, and Bi­shop of the Soul, and many are gathered home to their resting place in him, which while they were scattered up and down upon the bar­ren Mountains (before the Shepherd appeared and made himself manifest) they could not find.

He seems to strike at the peace and joy which is of God, and to give it a dash, Because minds estranged from the Enlightenings and Convictions of God, have much peace in their wayes, and such are under delusions.

Answ. We do not tell men of the peace and joy we have in our God boastingly, but in a faithful way of Testimony concerning, and invitation to, what we once wanted, but now have found under the leadings of the true Shepherd. And the peace and joy which he gives, is an evidence and assurance in the hearts of those to whom it is given by him. And they that have been greatly distressed for want of the Lord and his powerful Arm of Salvation, having met with it, it riseth up from Life in them to testifie and say to others, Lo this is our God we have waited for him, and we will be glad and rejoyce in his Salvation. And O that [...]e also were stripped of this dead, notional, comprehensive knowledge concerning the Saviour; that ye might meet with the Saviour himself, and receive that knowledge from him which is Life Eternal. And this, with [Page 9] the true peace and joy thereof from him, ye would find no delusion.

He speaketh, Of suffering loss and of phrases and expressions, better (saith he) to suffer loss in these then themselves to be destroyed.

Answ. Let him apply this home. O that he saw how those phrases and expressions, and imaginary knowledge, which he hath brought forth in this Letter, stands in his way to hinder the true knowledge, and that he cannot possibly receive the true knowledge, without being emptyed of these, and parting wi [...]h them, for the excellency of the knowledge of the Truth as it is in Jesus: And without the true knowledge of Jesus, men cannot but perish and be overtaken with destruction.

Then for being helpful to establish Persons in Grace.

Answ. Such kind of Doctrines as these do not tend thereto.

They may establish men in such a notion of Grace as he hath for­med: But they neither tend to lead to, nor establish in the Grace it selfe, but keep men from it. Nay I can truly say it, from him that is true, that he himself cannot receive the Grace, the thing it self, till he part with these notions. And O that he might know the Stone cut out of the Mountaine without hands, to dash his Image, that the living one (who gives Life) might be received by him, in that measure of Grace and Truth, which he inwardly dispences to all that travel out of the darkness of their own imaginations and conceivings upon the Scriptures, into his pure Light.

The maine reason he giveth why he is not satisfied with that which I sent him, concerning the sum and substance of the true Re­ligion is, because it fights with his notions, even a stating of our Righteousness with God, according to his imagination, which is absolutly a meer dream, which he hath dreamt of in the night, and not seen in the Light of the day. For the cry of the Spirit of the Lord is in the Gospel day, Open ye the gates that the Righteous nati­on which keepeth the Truth may enter in. This is the Truth, as God ha [...]h revealed by his own Spirit, in this our day: But to say, this speaks of our state in him, without witnessing it in our selves, is but a meer dream: And men cannot bring forth fruit to God, nor be lovely and pleasing in his eyes, but as their fallow Ground is ploughed up, the Thornes, Thist [...]es, Bryers, and that which is unclean and unholy removed.

Christ, he saith, Is the heavenly man and mansion in whom we are [Page 10] thus blessed, and in whom we sit down in a state of Rest and Riconcilli­ation, Heavenly and Divine, before and without the consideration of any works of Righteousness which we have wrought, &c.

Answ. If he means this concerning the full sitting down in Rest; it is directly contrary to Scripture. For none sit down in that full Rest, before and without consideration of Works of Righteousness wrought by them. For that great Judgment, is a time of rendering to every man according to his works. Rest is the Reward of the Traveller: And his Travels are not despised, but considered in his Reward. Mark, every one that improved the Talent, had a re­ward from his Lord. And come ye blessed of my Father inherit the Kingdom prepared for you: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat, &c. Math. 25. And the Apostle is of the same mind with Christ, when he saith, It is a Righteous thing with God, to recom­pence tribulation to them that trouble you, and to you rest, &c. 2 Thes. 1.6, 7. So that Persons do not sit downe in eternal blessedness in Christ, before or without consideration of any works wrought by them.

And then for sitting down in an heavenly divine state of Righ­teousness, Rest and Peace in him here; It is a glorious State to be travelled to. The [...]e must be a translating out of the Kingdom of darkness, into the Kingdom of the dear Son first. The Kingdom must first be come, and the Soul prepared to enter into it, at the Gate which the Spirit opens to him in the way of the Gospel. For it is one thing to know somewhat of Christ, and to begin to be­come a Disciple; and another thing to learn of him so to deny a mars own Wisdom, and will, as to come to receive and be born of that which is true and living of him, and to learn to wait aright for the opening of the gate, and entering into the Kingdom and Land of Life, and to be prepared to sit down with him.

For their is a state of Discipleship, wherein a man hardly know­eth a settlement, so much as how to watch with Christ rightly and constantly: But it is a great matter to be able to dwell and abide with him. None can do this; But he that can dwell with devo [...] ­ering fire and everlasting burnings: For the pure Word of Life is a fire, and he that sits down in the heavenly place in him, must sit down in that fire.

This he Reckons the firm stable state which indeed is no state at all. There is not a state in Christ without being in Christ: And [Page 11] then the state is according to the Souls being in Christ: For then the Work of Regeneration, the Work of Sanctification, the Work of Justifying, &c. goeth on and a man is with God, according as he is framed and new created in Christ, and not otherwise. So that the Life and Power of the Lord Jesus Christ, is found Judging and Condemning whatever is not of God; and Justifying onely what is of God in him. For the Soul then comes into the new Cove­nant which requireth and Justifieth that which is new, all that is wrought in God; and condemneth all that is wrought out of him. And so here is the true sence and knowledg of sin, by the new, and pure Law of the new Covenant, and the Advocate known and Repentance given by him upon all occasions, to those that wait upon him, and the Sprinkling of the Blood, and Remission upon Repentance. This is the new and Living Way of the Lord Jesus Christ, which he hath consecrated for all his (made known in the d [...]monstration of his Spirit) which will stand for ever: Whereas mens aprehensions about those things which they have gathered and comprehended of themselves out of the Scriptures (in the supposed Light of their natural Reason and Understanding) are but Dreams and will vanish even in their own hearts, if ever the true Light arise the e.

He saith, This state can never fall nor be finally fallen from.

Answ. There is a way of coming to Christ, and there is a way of preservation in Christ. For there is a Power that Redeems; and men are preserved by that Power in subjection to it. And so every one, That thinketh he standeth is to fear, and take heed lest he fall: And not to boast and say, I am in a state of Justifycation, which is firme and cannot be moved; and it cannot fall, nor be finally fallen from, For ye are kept by the power of God, through Faith, unto Salva­tion, Keep to the Power which preserves; Hold that fast which thou hast, let no man take thy Crown. Keep the faith, make not ship­wrack of it, and of a good Conscience. O that men knew the right Doctrine, and way of coming to Christ! (which they cannot do, till they are taught of the Father, Joh. 6.45.) and the right Doctrine and Way of standing and abiding in him. For truly mens professed coming to Christ, believing and standing at this day, is generally notional, outward, without; but not in the inward Life and Power it self, without which no man can come to him, nor stand and abide in him.

[Page 12]He chargeth us, With setting up a Covenant of Works; alwayes doing and never done; a Covenant to be performed by us, for our selves, not by Christ for us.

Answ. I would he saw in the true Light how unjust and untrue this charge is. For the Lord God of Life knoweth that he himself hath taught us the new Covenant, and thereby taught us to wait upon himself in his Son, to work all our works in us and for us: And this we dayly experience, that we can work nothing, but as he works in us. Therefore our whole course is a waiting on him in stilness, to witness him appearing and doing all in us: And bles­sed be his Name, we do not wait in vain. But if he think all works are excluded out of the new Covenant, he greatly erreth: For the Works of Gods Spirit are required and have a place therein: And God and Christ (the King and Shepherd) is the Judge of his People in the new Covenant, and justifieth or condemneth according to the Law thereof. In the faith and obedience he justifieth: In the unbeliefe and disobedience he condemns, without respect of Persons.

And it is a pretious thing in the Gosple Ministration to come to God the Judge of all, and to witness true judgment set up by God in a mans own heart, that by the ministration of the pure judgment there the Soul may come to learn Righteousness, of the holy Teacher and Shepheard, even the Lord Jesus Christ, who is just and faithful under his Fath [...]r, in the impartial Ministration of the new Covenant.

Hereupon several charges he brings against us, through his own mistakes and misapprehensions of us.

As First, That our Doctrine imployes Free Will and power in the creature.

Answ. We have never experienced Free Will nor Power as of our selves, but as we have bin turned to Gods Power and received it from him; nor did we ever testifie to others, that they could receive and embrace Truth in their own will & by their own power. O that this Person had true discerning of, and were severed from that Spirit which thus chargeth us! For whoever receives this Testimony concerning the inward Light of our Lord Jesus Christ, shall never find himself able to do any thing therein by his own will and power: But there witnesseth Gods begetting him out of his own will, by the Life and Power of Truth.

Secondly, He chargeth it, That it maketh the Election of God altoge [...]her frustranious.

[Page 13] Answ. Election of the Seed, in the Seed, it doth not at all make frustranious: But mens wrong apprehensions concerning Election out of the Seed, the true Doctrine of Election doth not con [...] with. He hath chosen us in him; so that in him, to wit, in Christ the choice is; and he that will make his Election sure, must make the Seed sure to him; growing in the nature thereof, wherein the Elec­tion is to the truely obedient.

He saith, Our Righteousness with God is the Foundation.

Answ. But is there not somewhat which is the Foundation of our Righteousness with God? And can we be Righteous with God, til we come to that Foundation, and be made Righteous by it? Must we not first believe in him? And is not faith a gift, which comes from the holy Root, and maketh a change in them in whom this gift is found? Doth not Faith make a difference between them that believe, and them that believe not? So that so soon as ever there is true faith, and it thus works, the State is changed: And there is no Justification before faith. For in the unbelief is the con­demnation for ever. He that believeth not is condemned already: And what, is he justified there too at the same time? Was Abraham our Father, justified in the unbelief and disobedience? Or in be­lieving and obeying God? for what saith the Scripture? Abraham believed God and it was counted to him for Righteousness.

That which I spoke of, he saith, Is but the fruit and super­structure.

Answ. When Christ directs men to the Seed of the Kingdome, doth he direct unto the fruit and superstructure? I spoke there of the Seed, of the Light, of the holy Spirit, of the quickening Virtue; Is that the superstructure? Or is that the fruit of mens being made Righteous? Nay must they not turn to that, receive that, be­lieve in that, even in the Light of Gods Spirit (for they are the true and right believers) before a man can come to be made Righ­teous, or accounted Righteous in the eyes of the Lord? For none are Righteous but in him: And all are out of him, till they be ga­thered into him.

He instanceth in one passage of mine (in a Book entituled, The Sum or substance of our Religion, who are called Quakers) the words are these. This is the sume of all, even to know and experience what is to be brought down into death, and kept in death; what to be brought up out of the grave, to live to God, and Reign in his Dominion, and [Page 14] what to be kept in subjection and obedience to him who is to Reign. Now to experience it thus done in the heart, the flesh brought down, the Seed of Life raised, and the Soul subject to the pure heavenly power, whose right it is to Reign in the heart, in and by the Seed, this is a blessed state indeed. For here the work is done, &c. these were my words. Now mind, God is the Teacher in the new Covenant. Now he that hath learned this of him, hath he not learned the true Religion? And is not this a full sum and substance of Religion? Wh [...]n the Apostle saith, Pure Religion and undefiled before God, is to visit the fatherless, &c. Alass, might this Spirit have said against the blessed Apostle, that is not the pure Religion, (not the sum or substance of pure and undefiled Religion) that is but a fruit or superstructure. O that men had true sence and understanding! That they might favour the words that come from Gods Spirit, and the words that come from their own Spirit; and might not be offended at that which is true, pure and living of him.

But having disliked this sum, he giveth one of his own, in these words following. I say the sum, and that which first and mainly im­ports us to know, as the Lord hath taught me; is that the old man is crucified with Christ, and brought down into his grave, and that we are risen together with him, by the faith of the opperation of God, and from this faith to be work ng with God, to mortifie our members that are on the earth.

Answ. Doth not Christ send his Apostles to preach the Gospel, and give them this m [...]ssage, that God is Light, and to turn their minds to the true Light, that they might be enlightened by it? Doth it not import men first to know that, whereby they might be Crucified, before they can know themselves Crucified th [...]reby? So that Christ did judge this as the first thing necessary to be known in the preaching of the Gospel, and bid men p each the Light, and turn men to the Light, and to the inward appearance and voice of Gods Word in their hearts: And what are men risen together with him by the faith of the opperation of God, while they are yet in their sins, in their ungodly state. And how can any witn [...]ss the faith of the opperation of God in this state? Now it had been better he had forborn affirming that the Lord taught him thus. For truly the Lord never taught any thus. This is not truth from God, nor will it be owned by the Lord as his Truth, when he comes to appear before him: And he should have took it to himself, and not [Page 15] have put the Name of the Lord to it.

But against this his own Doctrin he raiseth an objection, in these words. Shall we mortifie that which is mortified already?

His Answer is, The old man which is crucified together with Christ, is the state of the flesh and of enmity. This is past away, and in this is the Concern of our Righteousness and Justification properly.

That which remains to be mortified, are our members upon earth, which are the fruits of that evil state, and in the mortifying of these, is the concern of our Sanctification. The will of God is done in heaven, &c.

Answ. Paul speaks of the Law of sin in his members; and he also speaks of the body of death, and cries out against that, O wretch­ed man that I am, saith he, who shall deliver me from the body of this death? He felt somewhat that nuorished and gave strength to the Law of sin in his members, and looked upon himself as wretched, ti [...]l he could meet with deliverance there-from. Now some are of opinion that there is no being delivered from the body of sin, while in this Life. Dost thou look upon it to be done in Christ for us without us but never to be don by Christ in us? Let me tell thee, if ever thou come to witness the pure, eternal Light of the Lord Jesus Christ revealed in thee, that will not find out some members on earth onely, but the very body thereof and shew thee the neces­sity of the puting off that body from thee, and that circumcision whereby it is to be done, which is the circumcision of Christ. Mark, the promise of the new Covenant; I will circumcise thine heart and the heart of thy seed to love the Lord thy God with all thine heart that thou mayest live. Is not this the circumciosin of Christ? Doth not this cut off the body of the sins of the flesh in the particular, where this is witnessed? This is the Truth as it is in Jesus, even To put off the old man with his deeds. It doth not say, the body is put off in Christ without us, and men must onely put off the members or deeds; but, they must put off the body, and come to witness in themselves the very Nature, Spirit, Root and Principle, from whence they proceed; cut down and destroyed in them. They must feel the Axe laid to the root of the corrupt Tree; and it cut down in them (not think it enough to say it is done in Christ for them) yea, they must also witness the Lord arising to shake teribly the earth, in which the Tree grew, that so the place of Dragons, and Serpents (where each lay in times past) may hence forward be­come [Page 16] the place of holyness, where grass may grow, and the new plants and flowers of the Paradise of God. And how is the will of God done in heaven? Is it done in heaven after this manner? Have Mercy and Righteousness the Preheminence the leading of the Van (they are his own words) and said to go before and look down from heaven after this manner (the body of sin being put off in Christ there) are there not those here on earth who dwel in heaven? Whose conversation is in heaven, even the Witnesses to Gods holy Truth, who are ascended up above the Spirit of this world, and dwell in Gods holy Spirit, and who walk in the Light, as God is in the Light. Hell is not far from the wicked; nor is Heaven far from them, who are renewed in the Spirits of their minds and who witness the passing away of the old things, and the new Creation in Christ. O that he could look back (in a true sence) and see how he hath wrested those Scriptures! Psal. 85.9, 10, 11. Isa. 4.2. and Ephes. 2.6. afer his own imaginations: And indeed in this Spi­rit men cannot but turn the pretious Truth of God into a lye, that is, as to themselves, as to their own knowledge of it. It is known, how the Branch of the Lord is beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the earth excellent and comely, and in what day it is so; which day is, When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daugh­ters of Sion, and shall have purged the blood, &c. by the Spirit of judgment and by the Spirit of burning, Isa. 4.4. Then every one that is left shall be called holy, and the Branch of the Lord shall be glorious in the midst of them, and the fruits of the earth excellent and comely for them. And then they that are thus purged, shall sit with Christ in the heavenly places, there being an abundant enterance ministered to them into the everlasting Kingdom, 2 Pet. 1.11.

Thirdly, He chargeth it with making the obedience and suffering of Christ superfluous, except onely as a pattern.

Ans. Christ came to do the Fathers will, [...]o obey, to suffer, Totast death for every man; to fight with and overcome the devil, to offer an holy, spotless Sacrifice for all mankind that through him they might witness atonement and acceptance▪ And the Lord saw the use of this, and we witness the use of this, and find every thing in its proper place and service in him, who is Gods Covenant of Life and Peace in us and to us. But the work of this day, is not to Preach up a notional knowledge of these things (the Christian World so called, hath been drowned and dead in them long enough) but to [Page 17] bring to that measure of the Spirit, to that sence of Grace and Truth, which is by Jesus Christ, wherein the benefit of these things is truly reaped and injoyed: And indeed that is the work committed unto us from the Lord, who gave us this Testimony to bear, whatever men may think or speak of us.

And whereas he speaks of our laying hold of passages, in his Printed Sermons to favour our Cause.

Answ. That is his mistake, as to me. It was for his sake I men­tioned it. There was indeed at that time somewhat stirring in him, which would have gathered him, had he known and obeyed its voice, and not run out into lofty notions concerning it. He had some sence then of a Glory aproaching, which he might have from the true Prophet: Though even then he ran out in his imaginations concerning it, and did not rightly apprehend, nor know how and when it appeared.

He hath further charges against us, Of crying up Works against the workman, mans grace and righteousness against Gods, Conformity to Christ, against Christ; Yea to make a Christ of our righteousness, a Saviour of our Conformity.

Answ. O what will this man do, when the Lord shall shew unto him, that he hath charged not so much us, as the Spirit and Power, and pretious appea [...]ance of the Lord Jesus Christ with these things! We cry up works no otherwise then we are taught of God, and as the Apostles and Prophets have cried them up. Faith is necessary, and Works are necessary in their places: And the Justi­fication of each follow them. And he that receiveth the Spirit of the Son, and therein doth Righteousness, is therein est [...]emed of God Righteous, as the Son [...] righteous. 1 Joh. 3.7. God Justifieth us in his Son, and loveth his holy Seed to therein, and the Faith that comes from him, and all the Works that are wrought in him; and out of this holy Root of Life and Power is no man, nor his Faith, nor his Works Justified.

Then for mans Grace and Righteousness. Where doth he hear us speak of mans Grace? O what doth he mean? Will he misrepre­sent the cause of his neighbour or brother to make it bad? And for mans Righteousness, we do not cry it up or put it on; but testifie men must be uncloathed of it: And we our selves were fain to part with it, and put it off before we could be cloathed with Gods Righteousness. But the Works of Life, the Works of Gods Spirit, [Page 18] the Works of the new creature, the Works of the new Covenant; these are not mans Works, nor unrighteous Works, condemned by God, but Justified in and through him that works them. The Works wrought in us are truely acceptable, and we in him who Works them, who is our Righteousness. And concerning this Peop e (these Children of the new Covenant) which the Lord hath Be­gotten and brought forth in this our day, that Scripture is fulfilled in them and upon them Their righteousness is of me saith the Lord. Isa. 54.17. Well as long as the Lord saith so, we matter [...]ot though others say that our Righteousness is of our selves, and that it is our own Righteousness, being assured that Gods Testimony in our hearts (as to this thing) will stand.

He aggravateth this charge thus. And this to be done by those that have been so far enlightened, and that account all the Relig on and Profession in the world below them as carnal.

Answ. Indeed we magnify Truth, Life, the Anointing, the Spiritual, the inward appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ, to which we have been turned, and in it made Spiritual: And all other Knowledge, Faith, Profession, Religion (which hath not its rise here) we cannot but call carnal. For the enlightning Spirit of the Lord hath given us this Testimony to bear, against all the dead, notional Professors of this Age, who build from the Letter (or rather their apprehensions of the Letter) out of the Life, all which cry up names of the Foundation and corner Stone, but refuse, reject, d [...]ny and turn fr [...]m the corner Stone himself, and have neither skill nor patience to try what he is, in this his Pure, Pretious, Living, Powerful and Glorious Appearance, in the Spiritual Light of his inward day, after the long thick Darkness of the foregoing night. And wo would be unto us, if we did not thus testify. For, for this cause we were b [...]rn and brought into the world, to testify to the present appearance of our God, and of his Christ in this our day; Glory to him who hath called and chosen us to, and (in a true and pretious m [...]asure and degree of his own pure Life) made us faith­ful therein.

This (saith he) is so far from giving us a list nearer heaven, that I cannot more properly resemble it, then to the coming forth of Amal [...]ck, who met Israel by the way when they were come forth out of Egypt, and smot the hindmost of them, &c.

Answ. Do not talk of having a list nearer heaven, O learn the [Page 19] Way, the holy Way, the living Way wherein no dead, unclean thing can walk. Learn to know Gods Spirit in your selves from that which opposeth his Spirit. Ye have been long learning, af­ter your old conceivings and apprehensions of the Letter, O at length come to learn the Truth as it is in Jesus, which discovers sin and death, and the body of it, and crucifies and puts it off, and makes room in the heart for him that is true and pure. And then for Amalecks smiting Israel, O how greatly are ye mistaken; ye take your selves for Israel, and us for Amaleck, whereas if your eyes were annointed, ye would see that we have been begotten and born of Gods Spirit, through the Word of Life which was from the beginning, wherein we have been Circumcised with the Cir­cumcision made without hands, that we might worship God in his own pure Spirit, and in his living Truth; and that our God hath inwardly appeared to us, and led us out of Egypts Land, and out of Babylon also, and all the Lands whereinto we have been scatter­ed in the cloudy and da [...]k day: And that this is Amalecks spirit in you several sorts of Professors (through your dark imagina [...]i­ons and conceivings about the Letter) which riseth up against us, and this Spirit in you feareth not that God who hath appeared, and by his own holy Arm of Power hath led, and is leading us. So that we may take up the complaint of the Prophet in this day, Who hath believed our Report, and to whom is the Arm of the Lord Re­vealed? For though we speak what we have heard, seen, and felt of the Life which is Eternal, and of the Word which was in the be­ginning, yet ye are so far from the Witness of God in your own hearts, that ye cannot receive our Testimony, but oppose it with your dead, dry, notional, conceited, imaginary knowledge, which will stand you in no stead at all when ye come to appear before God.

Then he proceedeth, complaining against us thus: Ah Sir! In stead of clapping us on the back, and ministring to us in our journey, you clog our March, and fall upon our Rear; In stead of serving the Kingdom of Christ, which the Church is now in Travel of, you deny the first Principles of the Gospel and wholly d [...]own the hope of Christs second Appearing and Kingdom, knowing or acknowledging, as no o­ther Saviour, so no oth [...]r Kingdom, but a Principle or a Light in your selves.

Answ. God is Light, and in him is no darkness at all, And this is the message of the Gospel, 1 John 1.5.

[Page 20]And Christ, who is one with the Father, he is one and the same Light with him, and we confess we look not for another besides him, nor for another Kingdom besides the Kingdom which is re­vealed in him; for the Kingdom which is revealed and manifest­ed in and by him, is the Spiritual, Eternal, Everlasting Kingdom, and there is not another. We do not say the Fulness, or that the full Glory of the Kingdom is now revealed or enjoyed, (nay, we con­fess we have but the earnest, in comparison but a mea ure, a pro­portion) but this is the same in nature and kind with the Fulness it self. And all that is of Christ, of his Spirit, of his Nature is sa­ving; the least measure of his Grace that appeareth in any heart, bringeth Salvation with it, the least touch of his Finger hath pure Life and saving Virtue in it: Yet this is not distinct nor s [...]parate from the Fulness, and so it is not another, though it be not the Ful­ness.

But whereas thou complainest of our not ministering to you in your Journey, but clogging it: Oh that ye knew what your Journey is, and whither ye are marching and traveling in that pre­sent spirit wherein ye act. We acknowledge it Gods great Love and Mercy to us, to deliver us from that spirit, and from that way of Knowledge, Religion, and Worship, wherein ye still abide. And what we have seen and known from the Lord, that are we required of him to testifie to you; and if your eyes were opened, (by the Principle of Light from him) in the holy Anointing, ye would bow to the Testimony: But judging of it in a contrary wisdom and spirit, ye not only turn from it, but fight against it, and reproach and slander us, for our faithfulness to the Lord and good will to you, which the Lord make you sensible of, and for­give you, that at length ye may know and receive him (who is the desire of all Nations) in his pure, living, inward and spiritual appearance.

And as for denying the first Principles, that belongs to your selves: for do ye not deny that Light which is the foundation of all, and wherein and whereby all the misteries of Gods Kingdome are seen: and instead thereof set up a notional, comprehensive knowledge of your own conceiving, comprehending and gathering from the letter: whereas no man can understand the letter, but as he comes into the abid [...]s in the Light. This we have experienced in our selves formerly: for we were but guessing at, and imagining [Page 21] concerning the Letter, until and further then we were turned to, and our minds gathered into, and comprehended in the Light of Gods Spirit. And as for disowning the hopes of Christs Kingdom, the Lord knoweth that is far from us: for we our selves bless him for what of his Kingdom is already appeared; and wait and hope for the further and fuller appearance thereof. But this we confess, another Spirit, another Christ, another Light, another Life, ano­ther Power, another Kingdom, besides him who hath already ap­peared, we do not expect. For he is our King and Kingdom both: and the least proportion of his Life and Spirit received, (bought with the loss of all, and so purchased and possessed,) is no less then a Pearl of great price, and an heavenly Kingdom to him that enjoy­eth it.

He addeth further, If Christ be but a Principle, then we are no other, and onely Principles shall be saved, and no Persons. Is this your Gospel?

Answ. Christ is the promised Seed, to which all the promises are, in which Seed all the families of the Earth are Blessed, as they are gathered unto, and grafted into Him. But he is not only the Seed, but the seeds-man also; who soweth of his Life, of his Na­ture, of his Spirit, of his heavenly Image in the hearts of the Chil­dren of men. He giveth a measure of the Grace and Truth unto them, the fulness whereof he hath received of his Father. Now this measure of the Light Eternal is very pretious, and is that wherein he appears and manifests himselfe: Yea indeed glorious things are both spoken, and witnessed of the Seed of Life, of the Seed of the Kingdom, of the Grace and Truth which comes by Jesus Christ. But we never said that this Seed, or Measure of Life, is the Fulness it selfe, but that which the Fulness imparts to us, and brings Salvation home to our doors by. And if any man will receive Ch [...]ist, he must receive that from Christ wherein he mani­fests himselfe. There is a difference between the Light which en­lighteneth (the fulness of Light, which giveth the measure of Light, the measure of annoynting to us) and the measure or pro­portion which is given: the one is Christ himselfe, the other is his gift: yet his gift is of the same Nature with himselfe, and lea­vens those that receive it and abide in it, into the same Nature so that not onely the gift is one with him, but we also are one with him in the gift. Come be not thus wise after the flesh, nor do not [Page 22] strive so (in thy wisdome and knowledge out of the Truth) to Triumph over the Truth, and Truths Testimony, in this the day of Gods great Love, and glorious Arm of Salvation, revealed in the midst of his People, which he hath gathered out of Babylon, and the dark knowledg thereof, into the Light and Kingdom of his own dear Son; where he giveth them Eternal Life, and of the fruits of the Good and Heavenly Land.

He addeth; I firmly believe, and so have all the Saints that have gone before, that Christ is a Person, and his Spirit is a living Prin­ciple in the hearts of all the faithful, but it is not the Spirit or Princi­ple in us that did redeem us, but the man Christ Jesus.

Ans. If he mean by the man Christ Jesus, The second Adam, the quickening Spirit, the heavenly Man, the Lord from heaven, he who is one with the Father, the Word which was in the beginning, which created all things, I grant him to be the Redeemer; for it was he who laid down his glory, wherewith he was glorified before the World was, and made himselfe of no reputation, but took upon him the form of a servant, and came as a servant, in the fashion of a man, to do the will. But if he distinguish Christ from this Word and Spirit, and make the Mans Nature, the Saviour, and the God-head only assistant to him (as he seemed to word it before, and as these his words seems to imply) that I utterly deny. For so testifieth the Scripture, I am the Lord, and besides me there is no Saviour. I am a just God and a Saviour, &c. So that Christ is the Saviour, as he is one with God. It was Gods Arm and Power (revealed in him) that effects Salvation. Yea if I may so speak, his obedience was of vallue, as it came from the Spirit, and it was the offering it up through the Eternal Spirit, that made it so acceptable to God. So that we must not attribute Redemption originally to him as a man, but as he came from God, and brings the honor all back to the Spring and Fountain, from whence he had all, that God may be all in all, and the very Kingdom of Christ may endure and abide for ever, in the Root of Life from whence it came.

And so he is not a Foundation, or the Corner-stone distinct from God: He as the Foundation, was and is the Rock of Ages: the Spiritual Rock, both before and since he took upon him the body prepared for him. It is the Spirit, the Life which was revea­led in that Man (by which he did his Fathers will) which was and is the Foundation whereupon all the living Stones are built. There [Page 23] is a Foundation of Death; and thats the wicked Spirit. There is a Foundation of Life, and thats the holy Spirit, by which Christ himselfe was led and guided (in that his appearance in the flesh,) which descended upon him, and he was annoynted with, and all his are to be annoynted with, and live in the same Spirit. And he that knows Christ in this Spirit, he hath the true and abiding knowledg of him, and no otherwise: And though the names, Messiah, Jesus, Christ, Saviour, Annoynted, &c. were given to him as in the flesh, or as man, they most properly and originally belong to him with re­spect to the Divine Life and Birth in him as the sent one, And only Begotten, Proceeding from the Father, the Brightness of his Glory, &c. for he as the Eternal Son of God was the Spiritual Rock, be­fore he took upon him that Body which was prepared for him, which expresly was called, the Body of Jesus, and which he called This Temple, and distinctly he being called Jesus Christ come in the flesh, which every Spirit that confesseth not, is not of God, but is that Spirit of Antichrist, 1. Joh. 4.3.

He speaketh of sitting on the Throne of David.

Ans. It is a great matter to know that Throne, which Davids Throne signified, and Christ sitting thereon. His Kingdom, his Throne are not of this outward worldly nature; but inward and spiritual: and his Throne is in his Kingdom and Temple, where he reigns and is worshiped. He that knoweth Sathan disthroned and cast out, knoweth also Christ come in, and sitting on his Throne. O that men did give over their dreaming about the heavenly Glory, and come thither in the leadings of Gods Spirit where it is revealed.

Was that Scripture written in vain, concerning the glorious state of the Gospel? But we all with open face beholding as in a Glass, the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same Image, from glory to glory, as by the Spirit of the Lord, 2 Cor. 3.18.

He putteth up a prayer for us, That the Lord would awaken us, and make us do our first works, and return to our first Love.

Answ. Ah poor man how is he blinded, not discerning how the Lord hath don this for us and much more: but it is he himselfe that hath lost his first love, and doth not do his first works, but is found short of that tenderness, quickness and savour that once was in him. O that he might see it, and return to him whose quickening virtue restores and heales.

[Page 24]He concludeth with the words of the Prophet Jer. Chap. 13. ver. 15, 16, 17. Hear ye and give ear, be not proud for the Lord hath spoken. Give glory to the Lord your God, before he cause darkness, and before your feet stumble upon the dark Mountains, and while ye look for Light, he turn it into the shaddow of death, and make it gross darkness. But if ye will not hear it my Soul shall weep in secret places for your pride, and mine Eyes shall weep sore, and run down with Tears, because the Lords Flock is carried away Captive.

Answ. How doth this man mistake in his sight and applyca­tion of Scriptures? Seeing, and applying in a wrong Spirit. It is true, the Lord hath spoken, but he himselfe and many such as he is have not given eare, And what is the reason, but because they are exalted above the pure Principle of Life in their own hearts? And are not such proud? Hath not he brought forth these weapons, the e false charges and reasonings in this paper against the heritage of God in the pride of his heart? As for us the Lord God hath humbled us, and taught us, who have learned, and dayly learn of him in the humility; and in humility and fear do we give forth our testimony, though also in the Authority and Majesty of our Mast­ers Name, whose Name stands over, and is exalted above every Name, and his Mountain and gathering is (in the pure Authority and Power of his Spirit) above all other Mountains and gather­ings whatsoever. And as for Gods causing darkness, let him and such as he is look to it, for God doth not, nor will cause dark­ness to them whom he hath gathered into the Light of his Spirit, but saith to them, Arise, shine, for thy Light is come, and the glory of the Lord is risen upon thee, O City and dwelling place of the liv­ing God. But those that know not, or turn against his appearance, and cry up former dispensations of the same Life and Power, but re­proacheth and blasphemeth the present, on them doth he cause the gross darkness to fall, and cover them. And this which he thret­neth us with, is already fallen upon himselfe, for his feet are fallen upon the dark mountains; and whilst he looks for Light he ha h lost that which once he had, and his very Light, as (he esteems it) is become obscurity and gross darkness, as this dark paper of his (from the dark Spirit and Principle) makes manifest to all that shall read it in any measure of true sence or discerning. And truly my oul doth weep in secret for his pride, and height of Spirit in opposing the Lord, his Truth and People. And for this cause shall [Page 25] those, who have looked upon themselves as the Children of the Kingdom, and flock of God, be laid wast, and know, that as it was a dreadful thing to oppose Christ Jesus the Lord, in his appearance in flesh, so it is also dreadful to oppose his appearance in his Spirit and Power: wherein he is arisen to set up his Kingdom, and to throw down Babilon, which is built in the likness of Sion, but by and in another Spirit. Those in whom there is any tenderness to­wards God (and true breathings after him left) the Lord give them the sence and true understanding of this inward spiritual ap­pearance of his Son, and of what they have been doing and are doing against it; that they may not continue to fight against the the Lord, and kick against that which is able to wound and prick, to their own hurt and eternal ruine. For there is not Salvation in any other name, then in that which is now revealed: Blessed are all they that trust therein; it being not another but the same that ever was.