A further discovery of M. Stubbe in a brief reply to his last pamphlet against Jos. Glanvill.

A further discovery of M. Stubbe in a brief reply to his last pamphlet against Jos. Glanvill.

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TO THE READER.

A LETTER TO M. STUBBE.

POST-SCRIPT.

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A FURTHER DISCOVERY OF M. Stubbe, IN A BRIEF REPLY TO HIS LAST PAMPHLET AGAINST JOS. GLANVILL.

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LONDON, Printed for H. Eversden, and are to be sold at his Shop under the Crown Tavern in Smithfield.

MDCLXXI.

TO THE READER.

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I Writ the following Letter in a present warmth, upon reading of M. Stubbe's last Pamphlet; but being called by my Occasions to Oxford, and London, I perceiv'd, that he is now known, and consequently, that my Work is at an end: For he hath proved, to the satisfaction of all sober Men, by his Talk, and by his Writings, that the harshest things I said of him were just, and true, and hath so managed Matters, as if he had design'd to save me further labour to expose him: Upon this Consideration, I resolved once, to have laid by these Papers, judging that it could not he expected that any Man in his w [...]ts should have more to do with such an Adversary; especially since all he hath said, or is like to say for ever, is already answer'd in my former Account of his Spirit, and Performances: But some Worthy Men (who yet have the Opinion of M. S. that [...]e deserves) advised, that since I had written, I should publish, and give him this other Blow, that so while he was staggering under the former, he might he laid flat by this. I have now complied with the Advice; but am inclined, for the future, to let the Impertinent talk alone: For I think a Man may with as much Reputation write against the Wits of Bedlam, as against this crackt Fop of W [...]rwick. 'Tis like I shall scarce take so much notice of him henceforth, as to read what he scribles further. I said indeed in my former Book (and have mentioned the same Designs in this) that I would examine his Quotations, and give another Account of the Ignorance and Impertinency of his [Page] Reasonings: But I find all sober Men are well satisfied already; and when I sate down to consider Matters closely, I saw, that though all he pretends were granted to be true, yet the Design and Substance of my first Book is sa [...]; and all I should have to do, would be to shew how he perverts the Sence of Authors, and how foolishly, and to no purpose he argues from them. Of both these I have already given proof enough, so that those that consider, and read my Books without prejudice, are convinced; and for those that do not, it would be to little purpose [...] amuse my self with them.

For this Answer, it will not take up much of his time, that hat [...] a mind to peruse it; and those that have not the humour to read, need not be concern'd; I writ it by the intervals of three days, which I mention not to boast my Expedition, but because I would not have it thought, I make dealing with this Prate-rost any part of my Bu [...]ness. The Printing was deferr'd till now, upon the account of my irresolution after I had written.

I have dealt somewhat plainly with him in some Places, to try whether down-right Chastisement will bring him to himself (if he be not most himself, when he is most extravagant) What is Railing when 'tis unmerited, is Honesty when ' [...] deserv'd, and needed; and if in any Case in the World, sharp Reproof is blameless, it ought to be allowed in this. It would be look'd upon as flatness, or fear, if I should d [...]l softly with such an Adversary, who, like the other Enemy of Mankind, goes up and down, seeking whom he may devour: I have therefore treated him with plainness of Reproof; and if any thing bite in my Expressions, 'tis their Truth. Those that know the Merits of M. Stubbe, will justifie this way of proceeding with Him; And those that judge without knowing the Cause, may conclude what they think fit.

London, Feb. 14.

J. GLANVILL.

A LETTER TO M. STUBBE.

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M. STUBBE,

I Have received two Letters from you, since the coming forth of my Book; but I gave them no Answer, because there was nothing in them to be answer'd, but the old Vertues, Falshood, Impudence, and Impertinence: And indeed I forbore for this Reason also, because it is dangerous, for a Man to trust himself with such a malicious Calumniator, in private: Since you make so little reckoning of traducing Publique Writings, what can be expected in your Accounts of Transactions, that are without Witness?

This day, Jan. 12. I received your last Pamphlet in which I am concern'd: How long it hath been abroad, I know not; it came to me by accident, out of the Countrey; But by some things, I guess, it hath been a pretty while extant. I mention this, that you may not brag, according to your fashion, that I have taken a great deal [Page] of time (forsooth) to answer you: Good Man! There needs no study, but to consider, whether 'tis prudent to have any more to do with such an hair-brain'd Impertinent, or not: And I must confess, I have been kept in some irresolution between Solomon's seeming contradictory Advices, of not answering, Prov. 26. 4. and answering, ver. 5. I determine now on the side where Charity to you lies, whatever prejudice I may do my self, by wrestling with one, whom a Man cannot touch without defilement.

When I writ my last Book, I foresaw what I must expect: If those Eminent Persons that never descended to provoke you, are branded with such infamous Scurrilities in your pestilent, inve [...]med Scribli [...]gs; What may I look for, that have so little of their Worth to secure me; and have done so much to exasperate your malice, and to provoke your most direful displeasure? If Dr. Wallis, Dr. Spratt, M. Henshaw, M. Evelyn, Dr. Merrett, and now Dr. More, with the ROYAL SOCIETY in Common, and all that dare to differ from your Opinion, are so often, and v [...]hemently stigmatized by you, for gross [...], Illiterate Fools, Prattle boxes, Liars, Contemptible Adversaries, Impostors, Catch▪Potterels Fops, Lories, Cheats, and poor Devils; And Cart-loads more of such Di [...]t, [...]e heaped upon THEM; what could I think would be my Portion, after I had so stung, and exposed you by my Reflections? I assure you, I look'd for the dregs of your Venom, and all the Names, and Epithets of [...]ility, and Reproach that are yet behind in your Dunghil-fat Invention. Accordingly, you take care not to disappoint my Expectations. By your foaming, and tearing, I perceive my Arrows stick in your Sides, and I look for more raging yet: All this is but moribundi animal [...]li indicium.

For your private Letters, I let them lie, because they were private; only I admonish you, when you write again, to endeavour to write Sence; For both your Letters abound with palpable Non-sence, and false English, though I had taken notice, and admonish'd you of several of those [...]lts in your Books. But I doubt you think your self too [Page] Learned to stoop to Common Se [...]ce, and will despise this Advice.

My present Business is with your last Preface against m [...] ▪ And pray, M. Praefacer, how many Praefaces do you intend? You quote a Praeface against Glanvil, in your Censure of the History of the Royal Society: The Animadversions on Plus Ultra area kind of Praeface, (though to no body [...]nows what) In your Letter to Dr. Merrett you threaten a Praeface again against Glanvil, and the Rest, when that against him is publish'd; And here's a Praeface too. Prith [...], Harry, which of the Praefaces is this? Distinguish them, that we may know when we have all, and then tell us, where are the Houses, for these large Gates.

YOU begin these ignorant, and foul Papers with a Charge against my Method of dealing with you: And if you had Answer'd what I say to render such a Procedure fit and necessary, in my PRAeFACE, your Complaint might have signified more; but now 'tis idle, and precarious.

I [...] did not, you say, beseem a Christian, much less a Divine of the Church of England, [p. 34.] We have seen too much of the Genius of your Case-Divinity, Good Sir, to believe you without Proof [see my Praeface] Why, I pray, was such a Course misbecoming such Relations? If a Christian, and a Divine of the Church of England, be assaulted with publique Slanders and Reproaches, may he not endeavour, in his ow [...] defence, to weaken the Credit of the Slanderer, by letting the World see, how foul a Mouth he hath, and how little his Cal [...] are to be regarded? If such an infantous P [...]son set himself to rail at, and disgrace a Great Body of Worthy and Ingenious Men, and so to beget enmity between Them, and other Venerable, and Learned Societies, If he shall causelesly reproach them with Designs destructive to the Government in Church and State, and of fatal Tendency to the Famous Fountains of Learning, the Universitie [...] of the Kingdom; May not a Christian, and a Divine of the Church of England, endeavour to prevent the mischief such bold Falshoods may do, by representing, that those Charges are malicious, and that the Libeller hath been ever a [Page] spightful Inveigher against all the most Sacred Interests, and hath publickly, and fiercely endeavoured the destruction of all those Things, for which he now pretends so zealous, and concern'd a Kindness? If a Boutesew, or Common Barreter attempt to set all where he comes together by the Ears, and to beget hatred, and animosities between those, that were Friends, and at Peace; may not one that knows his Practices, though a Christian, and a Divine of the Church of England, warn his Neighbours to beware that they heed him not, and tell them (to hinder the Storms that he might raise) what his Temper is, and what Pranks he hath plaid in other Places, and Times? If any of the Sheep should fawn upon the Wolf in Sheeps clothing, and follow him where he leads; may not a good Shepherd pluck of the Disguise, and shew the Flock what he is? What think you, M. Casuist, May a Christian, and Divine lawfully do thus, or not? If so, I am justified; I have done no more; and I proceeded that way with you, for those ends: But if you say not, produce your Proof.

But you intimate further, [ib.] That I have viola [...]d the Act of Indempnity. If you think so in earnest, the Law is open, take your Course. It is the Common Method of the Enemies of the Government to clamour against those that mind them of their Villanies, and the Miseries of the late Times (though with a pious Design, to prevent the like for the future) as Violaters of the Act of Indempnity. They would fain have all that is past, be forgotten, that they [...]ight do the same Things, and promote the same Designs again. We must by no means acquaint the growing Generation with the base Tricks, and barbarous Actions of the Patrons of the Cause, that the Nation may forget how, and by whose [...]ans the Deluge of Ruine came upon us; and so may be induced to hearken to the same Pretences, and to be led into new Miseries by the same Spirit, and Practices. 'Tis become an usual thing to upbraid Ministers with the breach of the Act of Indempnity, when upon the▪ Thirtieth of January They warn the People of the danger of Re [...]ellion, and those Pretences that lead to it, by the Example of the late Times, [Page] and the Villanies of the Projectors, and Maintainers of the Horrid War: And just after this manner have I broken the Act of Indempnity. The sence of what I have writ as to [...]his matter, is, Hearken not to M. Stubbe's Pretences for Monarchy, the Church, Universities, and Learning; His Kindness is to be suspected of Hypocrisie, and Falshood: For see what he hath done against Them, in the Times of their Distress and Ruines!

For your other Pretences against my way of dealing with you, they are equally frivolous. It may (say you) raise discontents, and jealousie in others, whose Crimes transcended yours. If you judge modestly, you need not fear that; 'Tis to be hoped there are scarce any such on this side Charing-Cross, Tyburn, and Tower-Hill: But if there be, and they have the impudence to promote turbulent and seditious Designs, under a pretext of a great Zeal, and concern for the King, and Church; 'Twill be fit that those, who are in danger of being abused by them, should be made acquainted with their former good Inclinations, and Practices, when their Pretences were as specious, as now. For others that hav [...] offended, and demean themselves modestly, as becomes Pe [...]tents, they have no reason to apprehend any thing from such a Course taken with you, who are so infinitely distant from modesty, and all things else, that beseem a Convert.

But 'twas strange, you say, to find as it were St. Paul upbraided with what he did, at the death of St. Stephen [ib.] The just exposing you, is, as it were, an upbraiding of St. Paul: Strange indeed! I am glad you have so good an opinion of St. Paul, as to compare your self with him. Pray how long hath the Apostle been so much in your favour? Bu [...] in earnest, Is what I have done like upbraiding St. Paul? Have you such Evidences to shew for your Conversion? Have you given such proofs of it? or rather, Have you afforded any Demonstration of your Repentance, besides the Repetition of your Crimes? Read my Pr [...]face, good St. Harry, and be silent for ever after, as to this matter.

You proceed, [To aggravate the malignity of my Temper, 'tis mad [...] my fault that I defend M. H. in some Grammatical [Page] Questions, against a Member of the Royal Society, p. 35.] The malignity of your Temper is not inferr'd from your Defence of M. H. but from your malicious, scurrilous opposition of so Learned a Man as Dr. Wallis, and the vile Names of contempt you fasten on him, as is evident, p. 31. & 32. of my Praefatory Answer, where some of the foul, slanderous stuff is exposed to view: So that this Period is a gross [...]alshood; And 'tis impossible for you to make any shew of Defence, bu [...] by taking refuge in Lying, and Impertinence. This you do again, in the immediate next words [I am revil'd with opposing M. B. in his Holy Commonwealth, and Key for Catholicks.] This is an untruth also: 'Tis not the opposing M. B. that is the thing objected; but your scurrilities towards him, are mentioned as another Instance of your Civility. Look again into my Book, p. 33. and (if possible) blush at this lying, and palpable impudence. But, as if you could not speak a word without falsifying, you add [And to shew how bar [...]arous my demeanour was towards him, after the Elogies of Reverend, Learned, and Ingenious, he is said to be a Person worthy of great respect; and our Eccholius adds, that he can scarce forbear affirming concerning him, as a Learned Doctor of our Church did, That he was the only Man that spoke Sence in an Age of Non-sence.]

M. Stubbe, have you forsworn to speak Truth? and will you give your self the trouble to prove further, what [...]very one believes of you already? Did I, to shew the Bar [...]arousness of your Demeanour, give M. B. the Elogies of Lea [...]ned, and Ingenious, and add the other Passage you mention, to that purpose? Pray borrow a pair of double Spectacles from your Friend M. Cross, and look again into my Book, where I represent your Demeanour; if you find those Elogies there, or the other Passage, I'le be bound to believe you, yea even when you Romance about Jamaica. What you cite, is in my PHILOSOPHIA PIA, which was written before any thing against you, and when you were not at all in my thoughts: How is it then, you have the impudence to publish, that those Passages were to shew the barbarousness of your demeanour to M. B? What an obnoxious Falsifier are you?

[Page]In the next Period you say [I shall not recriminate upon M. Glanvil; There is Disloyalty which extends beyond Writing; It may be found in Praying, Preaching, and Communicating with Rebellious Schismaticks.] Do you mean to vent two or three gross Untruths more in this place? or do you only write at your usual rate of impertinence? If you mean, that I am guilty of any Disloyalty in Preaching, Praying, and Communicating with Schisntaticks, or ever were, 'tis a s [...]andalous, shameless Falshood, as many hundreds can witness. How disloyal my Preaching is, you may see, if you please, in my Sermon on the [...]gs Murder, printed two or three years ago; and how quite contrary the truth is, to what you would maliciously insinuate, both in this, and the other Particulars, all Men that ever knew me since I Preach'd, can attest. And I never was in a Pulpit above four or five times till the Return of the King, though I was Master of Arts some Years before. So silly a Romancer are you; or if you will not own it here, you must confess that you meant nothing to the purpose by your Words.

In the following Sentence [p. 37.] You phancy you may have the advantage of the Excuse of Education, and being bred in ill Times, as well as I: But, my Friend, There is di [...]rence between a Negative Loyalty, and Active Ui [...] lany, between only living, and breathing in a bad Air, and endeavouring to spread the infection of it further, and to make it more Pestilential, and Fatal. I say no more; You understand me.

Well! Thus I aggravated the malignity of your Temper, and thus you have Answer'd. But what's become of all the other Instances of your ridiculous Boastings, abominable S [...]urrilities, Treasonable Invectives, impious Endeavours to destroy Laws, Religion, and Learning? You think 'tis the best way to cover them with Silence, and to insinuate to those that have not read my Book, that when I talk of the malignity of your Temper, I mean only, That you writ a Defence of M. H. in some Grammatical Questions, and opposed M. B. in his Holy Commonwealth, and Key for Catholicks. Cunning Shu [...]er! But when you mention these Instances, why don't [Page] you add, what mighty things you boasted of your self, and what vile Names you call'd Dr. W. in your Defence of M. H? And why don't you tell your Reader, that when you opposed M. B. in his Holy Commonwealth, and Key for Catholicks, it was only in those things in which he opposed Sir H. V. and the most extravagant Phantasticks? But this was not for your purpose, and therefore Mum. You opposed M. B's Holy Commonwealth, you say; and some, you phancy, may think, that you writ against the Errors of that recanted Book: So that hereby you would in [...]uate a good Opinion of your self, and a bad one of me, as making your writing against such a Discourse, an Instance of the malignity of your Temper. You have no other way to defend your self, but by either downright Falshood, or such Tricks of Legerdemain, and Cousenage.

To go on with you; You tell your Reader [ib.] That I give no Reparation to the Physician [...] for my injurious words [Plus Ultra, pa. 7. 8.] Had I spoken any there about Physicians, or, did I think that any one Physician, that doth not want Physick himself, understands me to have as much as meant any thing to their prejudice, I should give them what Reparation they can expect: But all that you have objected about the Cut-Finger, and the Injury done your Faculty, I have proved to be meer impertinent Malice, that longed to pick a Quarrel. And I shall now give you a further Account of that whole Paragraph you have transcribed, and raised such Clamours against.

If in Discoursing of it I can shew, that the substance of those Periods, and the most obnoxious Passage there, is to be found largely, and often insisted on by so Great, Learned, and Wise a Man as my LORD BACON, I hope I may be excused for having spoken after so profound, and celebrated a Philosopher, that was no Enemy to Physicians, or any sort of Learned Men.

I repeat my Periods as you have cited them: [The Modern Experimenters think that the Philosophers of elder Times, though their Wits were excellent, yet the Way they took was not like to bring much advantage to Knowledge, or any of the Uses [Page] of Humane Life, being for the most part that of Notion and Dispute, which still runs round in the Labyrinth of Talk, but advanceth nothing. Plus ult. p. 7.]

I say, the Experimenters think, and undertake to represent the Sence of some of those Philosophers, as I apprehended it. My Thoughts were chiefly on my Lord Bacon. Let us see now whether that Great Man hath not declared what I say the Experimenters think.

[Antiquis Au [...]horibus suus constat honos, atque adeo omnibus; quia non ingeniorum, aut Facultatum inducitur comparatio, sed viae, Nov. Organ. Aph. 32.] Again, Aph. 61. [Nihil illis (sc. Antiquis) detrahitur, quum de via omnino quaesti [...] est.] Thus you see, without detracting from the Wits of the Ancients, he questions the WAY they took, for the Advancement of Knowledge; and that he thought it to be unfr [...]ful, appears further from almost his whole Book; [...], from the Praef. p. 2. De utilitate dieendum est, sapientia [...] istam, quam à Grae [...] po [...]issimùm hausimus, PUERITIAM quandam scientiae vid [...]ri, atque habere quod proprium est PUERORUM; ut ad garriendum prompta, ad generandum invalida, & immatura [...]it; controverst [...]rum ferax, operum eff [...]ta est:] And so he goes on comparing that State o [...] Learning to the Fable of Scylla. Again, Aph. 71. Scientiae quas habem [...] ferè à Graecis fluxerunt, erat autem scientia Graecorum professoria, & in disputationibus e [...]usa; quod genus inquisitioni veritatis adversissimum est;] and he proceeds to the same purpose. Thus you see, that that Famous Experimenter thought, that the WAY of the Ancients, was not like to bring much advantage to Knowledge, being that of Notion, and Dispute.

And that This runs round in a Labyrinth of Talk, advancing nothing, The same Great Author saith, [Si—id minimè eventurum fuisset, quod per Annos his mille jam fieri videmus: Nempe, ut scientiae suis hereant vestigiis, & in eodem fere statu maneant, neque augmentum aliquod memorabile sumpserunt; quin potius, in primo Authore maximè floru [...]rint, & [...] declinaverint. Aph. 74.] And Aph. 94. he encourageth Philosophical Hope with this Consideration, [Page] That the little progress that is made in Knowledge, is not from the difficulty of the Thing, so much, as from the error of the Way. Thus that great Philosopher justifies the former part of the recited Paragraph to a Tittle, and you see I had reason, when I writ, that the Experimenters thought as I said.

But you quote me further: [And the unfruitfulness of those Methods of Science, which in so many Centuries, never [...]ought the World so much practical beneficial Knowledge [...] would help to cure a Cut Finger, is a palpable Argument, that there were Fundamental Mistakes, and that the Way was not right.] My Lord Bacon makes this the grea [...] sign of the Error of the Ancient WAYS, Aph. 74. and in divers other places; They produced DISPUTES, but not WORKS, Praef. p. 2. Aph. 71. And he gives the reason of their [...]; [...] enim [...] habem [...]s, [...] al [...]d sunt qu [...]m [...] inventarum, non modi [...] de [...]gnationes [...] operum, Aph. 8.] How much less is this, than what I said? And upon the supposition of these things, I might well add,

[If the Moderns cannot shew more of the Works of their Philosophy in six Years, than the Aristot [...]lians can produce of theirs, in thrice so many hundr [...]d, let th [...]m [...]e loaded with all the contempt, which is usually the reward of vai [...]; and u [...]profitable Projectors.] It is apparent, and I have shewn, that the WAY by Experiments hath produced Works; But my Lord [...]acon, and the reason of the thing say, the WAY of [...]otion can produce none.

And now, M. Caviller, did you ever read my Lord [...]acon, or did you not? If not, for all your boasts of great reading, You are not acquainted with some of the Authors of greatest note; And 'tis a shame for you to write against the Experimental Philosophers, and not to have read the Founder and one of the Chiefest Men of that Way. If you have read him, you know he said all this that I write the Experimenters thought; and why did you pass it by in Him, who was the Author; and insisted so largely upon it, and so malici [...]usly censure it in me, that spoke after him in two, or three [Page] tran [...]ent Passages? If these Periods in my Book were th [...] oc [...]asion of the Quarrel, as you say, why was not the Quarrel begun before? Are the Physicia [...]s more injur'd by my writing those things, than by my Lord Baeon's? Is my saying what he thought, a greater Affront to the Ancients, than his declaring to the World the same himself? No, no, M. Stubbe, 'tis evident from hence, That this was not the reason of your writing, but the occasion that you made; You knew that your cavilling could not injure my Lord Bacon, but thought it might expose me, and other Friends of the Experimental Way, to the displeasure of the ignorant, envious, and misinform'd; 'Twas not any concern for the Honour of the Ancients, and your Faculty, that ingaged You; For then you would have end [...]avoured their Vindication against my Lord Bacon, (if you had thought them so injured by those Sayings) But 'twas a malevolent, envious humour against the Royal Society, and its Friends, was the cause of your impudent Assaults.

And 'tis further apparent, that what you pretend was not the reason of your beginning this War; For no Man alive, but you, can perceive any the least Reflection upon the Physicians in those Periods. I speak of the Ancient Methods of Philosophising in Physiology, and with the excellent Ver [...]lam, complain, that they were notional, and unfruitful: So that I meant the particular Hypotheses, and not the more general Principles, and Rules, of which you speak, which were raised from Observation, and Experiment: These, no doubt, all the Ancient Physicians used, and with happy success; and 'tis the very method of the Modern Experimental Men; So that I could not be supposed to mean this. I spake of the Natural Philosophers, and their Methods, which were made up of Notion, and ministred to everlasting Disputes.

But you pretend to have demonstrated, that even this way was much more advantageous, than I allow it, [p. 38.] I wish you would tell us, where we might find the Demonstrations against those Complaints of my Lord Bacon. You talk of the Doctrine of the E;e, emts being the occasion of [Page] Plaisters, of Galen's regulating of Mixtures, and Discoveries by those Principles, [p. 38. 40.] and of Druggists explaining the Use of Medicaments according to this Doctrine, [Animad. on Plus Ult. pag. 159.] These, forsooth, you have demonstrated; That is to say, Physicians have chosen the Materials of their Compositions, hot, or dry, cold, or moist, as they found them for their purpose, according to this degree, or another; and have used these common Words of Elements, Qualities, and Degrees, to express themselves by: Therefore the Hypotheseis of naked Materia prima, Substantial [...]orms, and Real Qualities is not unprofitable: Who can chuse but take such Arguments, for Demonstrations? Well! The Conclusion follows [p. 39.] From whence it is Demonstrated, that since not only Cut Fingers, but even all Diseases were cured by them, (viz. Galenical Physicians) 'tis unjust, and intolerable for us to be upbraided with the sterility of that Philosophy—] Who ever denied that Diseases were cured by these Physicians using Reason, Experience, and General Rules? But when do you prove, that the Doctrine of First Matter, and Forms did directly, and of it self lead to any Discovery, by which they were assisted in their Cures? This, I told you, was my meaning in the Words, which you force to the sence which best fits your malicious purpose; And to what end then, do you keep such a vapouring, and impertinent ad [...] about the Peripateticks, that have been Inventors, and the Galenists, to whom we have been obliged? But you have a mind to find your self work, though it be but to pick Straws.

You recite my Answer to your clamorous, and impertinent Opposition of the fore-quoted Paragraph; viz. that I [...]oké not of the Methods of Physick, or Chirurgery, or any Practical Arts; but of the way of Notion and Dispute, which, I said, produced no practical, beneficial Knowledge, by its own proper, native virtue; I said, I denied not, that the Peripatetical, and other Notional Philosophers had Practical Knowledge, or were Discoverers; but that they learnt their Knowledge, or made their Discoveries by the disputing Methods of Physiology; These were the things I denied. I quot [...] my Lord Bacon for my Negative; and I have proved it from the [Page] nature of those Principles; in my Answer to Dr. Mer. Causubon, and elsewhere: I now confirm it from the Authority I cited; Thus then that Philosopher speaks [Nov. Organ. Aph. 8.] Opera quae jam inventa sunt, casui debentur, & experientiae, magis quam Scientiis.] And if that Illustrious Man be to be believed in what he saith of the Aristotelian Philosophy, No Works can be expected from it. Aristotelis Philosophia, postquam caeteras Philosophias (more Ottomanorum erga [...]res suos) pugnacibus confutationihus contrucidasset; de singulis pronunciavit; & ipse rursus quaestiones, ex [...]bitrio suo subornat, deinde conficit, ut omnia certa sint & de [...]ta. [Aph. 76.] and elsewhere, the speaks thus of Aristotle,: Philosophiam Naturalem Dial [...]ctocâ sua corrupit magis uhique sollicitus quomodo quis respondendo se explicet, & aliquid reddatur in verbis positivum, qu [...]m de in [...]ernâ rerum veri [...]e, [Aph. 63.] I suppose I need not spend time to shew how little fruit we can reasonably expect from a Philosophy so temper'd: And when you, M. Stubbe, have proved, that the Peripatetick Hypotheseis of Materia, Forma, Privatio, &c. have any direct tendency towards the making useful Discoveries, you may have leave to vapour, as much as you please, without controul.

But my Defence, you say, is false, and you endeavour'd to prove it by the same impertinent Allegations, which I cited from you before. You add, 'Tis strange, that I declare I spoke not of the Methods of Physick and Chirurgery, or any Practical Art, since the Aristotelians and Galenists did not act as pure Empericks, but as Men guided by a Series of Principles, and a Theory which they deem'd Scientifical [p. 41.] They proceeded, no doubt, by General Rules, drawn from Observations in their Art, and therefore acted not as pure Empericks; p [...]ricks that the Scientifical Theory they were directed by, was any Hy [...]eseis in Philosophy, you must prove; Till then, I shall be unconcern'd in your goodly Demonstrations.

At the end of your long Impertinence about my affronting the Physicians, You say, 'tis not possible for you to divine what I mean by Notion, [p. 42.] when I speak of the way [Page] of Notion, and Dispute. Are you in earnest, M. Stubbe, and is it impossible for you to Divine? I perceive then you are no C [...]rer: For I told you as plainly, as I could speak, what I meant; and you recite my words [p. 40.] in which I told it you. Have you been all this while disputing against wh [...] I said, and y [...] say at last, that you do not know what I m [...]? You demur, whether it were Peripatetick Physiology, or Logical, or Metaphysical Disputes; after you have recited my words, where I tell you I meant the disputing Methods of Physiology, you dispute against this meaning, and when you have done, say, 'tis impossible for you to divine. If you had looked but a Leaf back in your own Book, you need not have been put to the trouble of d [...]ning: But your hot-head hath not the patience to consider any thing.

Thus have you endeavour'd to render me odi [...] to Physici [...], b [...] with so little sueces [...], that I never heard of any P [...] els [...], that thought his Faculty concern'd in the P [...]agraph on which you fasten.

YOur next At [...]mpt is to confirm your Slander of my di [...]ction to the UNIVERSITIES; than which, nothing is More unjust, and false. For what have I ever said, or done that can be ground for such a C [...]? Did I ever endeavour to expose the [...] to the [...]ry of wild P [...]sticks in the days of their danger? Did I ever write against THEM, Their Degrees, Habits, and L [...]arning, as Popi [...], and A [...]tichristian? Did I ever Print [...] for the overthrow of their A [...] Con [...]s? If I had done any of this (as you know who did) there had been some colour for the Imputation. But on the contrary, I always esteemed Them, as one of the greatest Blessings our p [...]ous Ancestors had bequeathed to us; as the Lights of the Kingdom, and the great Instruments of Some of the happiest Priviledges we enjoy above the [...]arbarous Nations; I have always heartily prayed for their Prosperity, and depre [...] their Mu [...]es; I have expressed my Affections in publick Pr [...]ons, and in private good Wishes: Now what could I have done more to testifie my Respects, Duty, and [Page] G [...]titude to the Universities? And what have I done to deserve so foul, and odious a Character, as that of an Enemy to those Illustrious Nurseries of Knowledge? All that You, that is, Malice it self, do, or can pretend, is, That I have writ against the Perip [...]cal Philosophy, and given a d [...] or two against affected, and insignificant Terms of Art; and that I think meanly of those Notional Studies, in comparison of the Practical, Experimental Philosophy: This is the sum of the Paragraph you quote out of my Plus Ultra, In which I endeavour to secure the University-Establishments from Diminution, and confess the usefulness even of those Studies to some purposes, among the Acade [...]ick Youth. Hence you conclude, according to your usual Logick, [p. 45.] That I take the Universities for Assemblies of an ignorant, and stupid sort of Men, that were to be amused, and deceived by Equivocations. Why so, I pray you? Because I profess an Esteem for the Venerable [...], [ibid.] You fancy, I perceive, I meant the [...]enches: A pre [...]ty Equi [...] indeed▪ And I style them Fountains of Learning, but tell not what those Words import; You ask me, Whether it was not, because the New Philosophy was so much promoted, and the Royal Society as it were [...] there? I thought there had not been need of my explaining, what I meant by Learning, when I styled the Universities the Fountains of it. For your satisfaction, Sor [...]pulous Sir, I tell you now, that I meant Moral Philosophy, Anatomy, Mathematicks, Languages, History, and Divinity, of all which parts of Learning there are Publique Professors there; and all which are studied by many Worthy Members of those Venerable Bodies, which from time to time [...]e and do send abroad Men famous in those useful sorts of Knowledge. These Studies I esteem as I ought, and honour the Universities highly on the account of the Advantages they afford for the attainment of those profitable and excellent kinds of Learning. As for the Natural Philosophy, and Metaphysicks that are taught the Junior Students, my thoughts of them, I confess, are di [...]erent; but yet I say they are not to be thrown off, [Letter con [...]. Arist. p. 2.] Because the Statutes require Exercises in them, and [Page] [...] are dangerous. On this you comment, and intimate, that I make them useless as to all other purposes; which is false, and injurious. In my Letter concerning Arist. [p. 2.] I have acknowledged other Uses of those first Studies: I here transcribe some of those Periods. [I should never have been so disingenuous, and undutiful as to form a Project so inconvenient, and hazardous in the event, as to discourage young Students from a Method of Studies, the Constitutions of the Place they live in, hath enjoyn'd them; which indeed, considering the Circumstances wherein things stand, 'tis in [...] they should be verst in, since that Philosophy is [...]rought into the [...] Theology of Europe; which therefore could not be comprehended, without an insight into those Hypo [...]eseis: Nor can a Man make a reasonable choice of his [...]rin-ciples: [...] he have some knowledge of all that offer themselves Candida [...] for his favour [...] and a [...] Mans Belief i [...] not Ch [...]nce, [...] Ele [...]on; besides which, it enlargeth, and e [...]nobles the Minds of Men, to furnish them with variety of Conception, and takes them off from doating on the beloved Conclusions of their private and narrow Principles. [Answ. to White, p. 18.] You see, M. Prater, that I have declared my approbation of those pr [...]inary Studies as to other purposes, besides compliance with Statutes; and therefore your Malice is toothless. I gave those Studies their due, though I did not allow them useful, either for the giving an account of Nature, or promoting any Works for the Uses of Life. Aud when I considered, that these ought to be the Ends of the Real [...]hilosophy, I diverted from the Notional, about which my first thoughts had been imployed.

This is the sum, and sence of these Passages you quote from me to render odious, [p. 44.] You force from them several vile Consequences which you kindly bestow on me, as if they justified those that discouraged Gentlemen from the Universities, and intended to overthrow the ancient, and necessary Education of this Island, [p. 47.] Which things, how well they follow, I leave to any Man to consider, that will judge impartially of what I have said. Is there nothing (think you) to be done at Oxford, or Cambridge, as you [Page] quaery, [p. 46.] if Peripatetick Philosophy be useless as to Discoveries, and Inventions? Doth it signifie nothing to capable, and ingenious Youth, to have their Minds exercised in a way of Reasoning, though about things, that will not signifie in the World of Business? Is there nought else to be learnt in the Universities, besides the niceties about [...], and Forma, and dependent Notions? Will it do young Gentlemon any hurt to be instructed in Morality, History, Mathematicks, and other such useful matters? And are not these worth their going to Oxford, and Cambridge, though they should not receive much benefit for their Purposes from the Peripatetick Philosophy? For shame, M. Stubbe, leave this course of malicious cavilling; and consider whether by such Suggestions, which speak as if there was nothing to be learnt in the Universities, but a few Notions about Ens, and Materia prima, you do Them not more disparagement, than you can prove any Virtuoso ever did, or intended. And let me ask you, Whether you think in earnest, that whoever judgeth the Peripatetick Principles Notional, and useless in the sence I have declared, ought ipso facto to be reputed an Enemy to the Universities, and their Learning? If so, what think you of my Lord Bacon? Either acquit the Virtuost with him, or condemn him with the Virtuosi. The things that follow under this Head are contemptible, and are either answer'd already, or deserve no answer.

I have sufficiently shewn in the beginning of my Praeface, that the Account I gave of you out of your Writings was no Digression, as you term it, [p. 48.] but most necessary to be done as an Introduction to an Answer: What becomes me to do more, I have promised at my first convenient leisure. You might, methinks, content your self with the morsel I have already given you; but the rest shall follow. My Sallies against M. Cross, which you object to me [ib.] were very requisite; For you are the Squire to that Knight of the Sp [...]acles.

You say 'tis a Year and half since I began to collect your Books. Perhaps so; But I could not procure them all till after your Animadversions were extant. I received that [Page] Book of yours against me in June, as I take it; and the Month following my Answer was in the Press (though the Praeface and Post-script were written after) It could not be finish'd before the end of the Term, and so it slept all the long Vacation; and the beginning of next Term it had some stops put to its finishing, by some extraordinary Occasions of my Printer. So that it was not the Work of so much time, and labour as you pretend, M. Tell-troth: And when you say, [ib.] That I omitted to Preach at Bath for many Weeks, excusing my self by the pretext of writing against you. I reply, that I never omitted Preaching twice a week, when I was at home, (besides very frequent occasional Sermons) ever since I was a Publick Minister, except when I have been sick, or lent my Pulpit to a Friend: I never excused my self from preaching, by my writing, or any other Business whatsoever; Nor did I ever decline it in [...] own Parishes, when any accidental Occasion required my Labours in that kind. 'Tis true, I did not preach at Bath during the time of my writing against you; but 'twas because Bath was not then the Place of my residence, but my other Pari [...], and I divide my time between them: [...] was then in my Course at Froome; but never omitted preaching: as many hundreds can witness. So that what you say here, is either a down-right falshood, or a silly, impertinent Equivocation. What hard fortune have I, to be sorced to deal with an Adversary, whose whole strength is in cavilling, and lying▪

But it follows, that after all, I understood not the State of the Question, [ib.] I understood, Impertinent, that the first Q [...]estion between M. Cross, and me, was, Whether the Moderns had not gr [...]atly advanced Knowledge, since the days of Aristotle? I gave accounts in my Plus Ultra of Modern Improvem [...]nts; In a C [...]llection of remarkable Instances. You fall foul upon that Book, but say nothing to the Question; only you carp at Errors of the Press, and voluminously oppose some accidental Passages, catching at a word here, and another there, and fight against the Shadows of your own Imagination, the malicious Interpretations which you make but [Page] my [...] will not afford; so that in the whole menage, you have prov'd your self a pr [...]tling I [...]pertinent: This I have shewn by Instances in my Praefatory Answer. And whatever was the Question between M. Cross, and my self (of that I have given Accounts elsewhere) The Question between You and I is, Whether you are not Impertinent in all you have said against Plus Ultra? This I affirm, and have beg [...] the Proof: For the particular things you mention, I engaged to give in my Accounts of them in due time; But this I must tell you, Let them be determined, which way they will, The first, and main Question about Modern Improvements, will not be concern'd in the Decision; For if Antiquity was not so shy of, and altogether unacquainted with Anatomy; If the Graecians, and Followers of Aristotle did know Chymistry; If the Ancient A [...]otelian Philosophy hath advanced some Practical Knowledge; If the Inventions attributed to the Virtuosi belong not to them; If the Moderns cannot shew [...]ore Fruits of their Philosophy in a short time, than the Aristotelians of theirs in so many hundred years, which you say are the Questions, [p. 48, 49.] I say, If these fall as you would have them, yet it follows not, that Anatomy, and Chymistry have not been much improved in latter Ages; It follows not, that the Aristotelian Philosophy is as operative, and useful as the Experimental; It follows not, that the Virtuosi have been no Inventors, nor Improvers; In fine, it follows not, that Knowledge is not highly advanced beyond its Ancient Stature; and so consequently, upon the whole, it follows not, that M. Stubbe is not a Cavilling Impertinent; or that I am bound to follow him in all his Wild-Goose Chases.

So that, Gentle Sir, I have not mistaken in my beginning with you, but stand upon my old Ground, that That useful Knowledge is much advanc'd, in the Instances I have produced, and by the Persons I have mentioned; and that we may probably expect greater [...]mprovements of it from the Royal Society, and other Experimental Philosophers. Except you disprove me in these Particulars, my Main Cause is safe, and you will shew your self but a Caviller, though you write as long as your Head is hot.

[Page]You say, All the Learning I flourish with, is but the Remains of a treacherous Memory, which some Years ago studied something, [p. 49.] Though my Memory, M. Stubbe, be not so good as yours, yet I am contented, since I have not so much need of a good Memory, as you. And I had much rather have my Learning in my Judgment, than in my Memory. Flourishing with Quotations, where they are not necessary, I always looked upon as a piece of Pedantry, and vain Ostentation.

But you fall severely on two Passages in my new Book. The first is, my making FUST, or GOTHENBERG to have found out Printing; whereas, you say, I might have learn'd out of Hadrianus Junius, that it was found out by another at Harlem, [p. 49.] But I am inform'd by Polydore Virgil, That the Author was Jo. G [...]tenberg of Mentz, to whom Dr. Hackwell adds the Authorities of Palmerius, Melchior Guilandrinus, Chasaneus, Veigni [...]r, Bibliander, Arnoldus, and Munster: But Peter Ramus, and others ascribe it to Jo Fust of Mentz also; And why might not I mention these as the Authors of Printing, after such Authorities? And why must I be bound to believe Hadrianus Junius concerning the Man of Harlem, before those other Famous Writers? This is one of your cavilling Tricks, when I affirm any thing, though f [...]om never so good Authors, if you can find any one to speak otherwise, His is presently made the infallible Authority, and I am upbraided with Illiterateness, and want of Reading. By the same course I could prove you as illiterate an [...], as ever spoild Paper.

The second Passage, from whence I am concluded very illiterate, is my mentioning of Flavius Goia, as the Discoverer of the Compass. This is an Error of the Press▪ It should have been Flavius, or Goia. I am confident it was so in my Copy: For I was sensible of the mistake committed about it elsewhere. And you confess some ascribe it to one, and some to the other.

Now you tell your Reader [p. 50.] that you have added [...] to satisfie all men, that I am not at all acquainted with Books. Whether I am so, or no, I will not dispute; but [Page] whether this ca [...] be inferr'd from the Premises, let the Reader judge. Illiterateness▪ and unacquaintance with Books, are the Imputations of course against all, that you call the Virtuosi. You design, no doubt, by the Charg [...], to insinuate, that You are the only Man of Reading, and that no Man may pretend to Learning, but your self. We must always premis [...], when we speak before such wise men [...]s you, [A [...] a Fool may say] This you say is for the benefit of ordinary Conversation; and 'twould be equally beneficial, for you to premise when you quote Authors, [A [...] I learn'd from such an Index] And when you Reason, [A [...] a Madman may discourse.]

But the great Exploit is behind, and you thus express your self, [p. 51.] That I may give the World an Instance of that Impudence, with which M. Glanvil demeans himself in this Effort of a desperate Ignorance, I shall set down what he replies to me about the Deceitfulness of Telescopes.] You gave Instances just now about the Authors of Printing, and the Compass, to satisfie all men of my unacquaintance with Books: And now you intend to give a great one of my Ignorance, and Impudence: But see to it, that i [...] hold good, or else the Instance will be an undeniable one of your own.

You said then, as you repeat here▪ That if M. Cross was in an Error, about the deceitfulness of Telescopes, you were sure, M. Boyle [...] in the same.

The Error that I object to M. Cross, as to this matter, which you attempt to vindicate, is set down [p. 65. of my R [...]us Ultra] and it was▪ That Dioptrick Glasser were all fal [...] ▪ and deceitful, presenting us with Objects that were not▪ Now if it can be inferr'd from M. Boyle's Discourse, that He aff [...]rmed All Telescopes to be thus deceitful, you have reason for saying, he was in the same Error with M. Cross: If this cannot be proved, you must seek another Instance to shew my Ignorance and Impudence, and to justifie your own Modesty and Knowledge.

Let us briefly examine the matter then: Your reason of M. Boyle's being in M. Cross's Error, is in short this; He sought the Maculae and Faculae Solares, but could not discover them in many months, though some other Astronomers that [...]it [Page] before him, did pr [...]nd to see them every day; and yet he wan [...]ed not excellent Telescopes, nor omitted any requisite Circumstance. This is the sum of what you repeat, [p. 52.]

Hence you would argue (if you intend sence) That All Telescopes are deceitful; otherwise you cannot prove by it, that M. B. was in M. Cross's Error. To this I reply [p. 176, 177. of my Pref. Answ.] to this purpose, M. Boyle saith nothing, in the Place quoted by you, that tends to the proving the deceitfulness of Telescopes; or that he believes them Fallacious (I spoke indefinitely, and meant of all Telescopes) For that was the Error of M▪ C. which I mentioned [Plus [...]tra p. 65.] and which you undertook to justifie. To prove this, I say, That he imputes it not [...]o the Glasses, that he could not see those Macul [...] and [...], but seems a little to blame those [...], that [...] so [...]itten of them, as to make their Readers presum [...] that some of them are always to be seen [...]. But M. B. I said, [...] not [...] many months discover [...], [...] they appear'd so much seldomer then, it s [...]ems, [...]han they did before. These are his Words, [Phys. E [...]ays, p. 103.] which is a ridiculous Argume [...]t to prove the deceitfulness of Telesc [...].

This is [...] sum of my [...] ▪ which you repeat [...], to the [...], you tell us, that the Solidi [...]y of yours [...]ay appear. You cite M. Boyle's Words [...], to the [...] [...]tis to be supposed. I study brevity, and 'twould be too long to recite it [...]fter you; In short, he saith,

That even Mathematicians do sometimes deliver [...]bservations that do not hold [...], [...]. when they are without the bounds of purely Mathematical Discipline. And he suggests two Reasons of their failing, viz. the Nature of the [...], Matter, and its Affections; and the necessary imper [...]ion of the Instrument [...] they use. Under the first Head he delivers the Instance of his missing the [...] and Faculae in the Sun, as 'tis evident [p. 103.] Those Objects [...] inconstant; They appear'd, he saith, It seems seldomer than they did before; They were not there, at least in tha [...] degree, the one sort of lightsomness, the other of darkness, as when others had sought them: For this Reason he [...] [Page] them; and not because his Glasses did deceive him, as I answered before. And that he imputed this to the Objects, not the Instrument, 'tis apparent: for he mentions the difference in Observations that ariseth from Their imperfections, after he had done with this Instance, and evidently supposeth what he said of the Maculae, and Faculae to appertain to the first Head, in these words,

And as the Nature of the Material Object wherewith the Mathematician is conversant, may thus deceive the expectations grounded on what he delivers, so may the like happen by the reason of the imperfection of the Instruments—ib.]

'Tis most apparent [...]rom hence, that my Answer to your Impertinency was solid, and invincible. The reason M. Boyle could not see those Spots and Brightnesses, was because their appearance was inconstant; they were not in the Sun when he look'd after them, or not so considerable as to be visible; and not because his Telescopes were d [...]ceitful.

So that, my Friend, you are i [...]verably lost; and what you add, [p. 55.] after the Period repeated out of M. Boyle, is lamentably impertinent.

'Tis evident, you say, out of his Discourse, that he believes, that Mathematicians, when they consider Matter with its Figure, Quantity, and other Affections; are not so accurate, as in those other parts of pure Mathematicks. Here first you evidently misrepresent M. Boyle; he saith [p. 102.] that they are not so accurate when they deliver Observations, concerning such things, wherein 'tis not only Quantity, and Figure, but Matter, and its other Affections, that must be considered: You say, 'tis evident M. Boyle believes the Mathematicians no [...] so accurate, when they consider Matter with its Figure, Quantity, and other Affections, [p. 55.]

But (2.) They are not so certain indeed when they deal in Matter, and its Affections▪ for These are variable, and uncertain: And to this M. Boyle refers his Discourse of the Maculae and Faculae, as I have proved.

But you argue, that M. Boyle confesses, that Observations taken by Telescopes cannot but be subject to many Imperfections, upon the account of their being made by Instruments, [Page] that ar [...] framed by the Hands, and Tools of Men; And therefore, he did not believe such a certainty in Telescopes, as exemp [...]s from F [...]llacy, [ib.]

This is a New Argument, and not that you undertake to defend; and whatever is like to become, of it, the other is [...], and de [...]perate. But to this also I say, First, When I affirm Telescopes are not so deceitful as the Spectacle-Philosopher phancled, I mean, that the [...]est, and most perfect are not▪ and I hope you will give me leave to use that Logical Rule (as your self does elsewhere) Analogum pe [...] se positum, stat pro famosiori [...]gnificato. (2.) When I said, that [...]elescopes do not deceive, I meant, That they do not [...] ably imp [...]se upon us in [...]epresenting Objects which are not. This was the Error I apprehended in M. Cross's Discourse, who would not allow the modern Discoveries in the Heavens, upon the account of the pretended Deceitfulness of Telescopes. And he seemed to suggest, that those Tubes shew us things, that were no where, but in the Glass, when they represent the new Phaenomena we talk of, such for instance, as the Satellites of Jupiter, the Ring about Saturn, and the Spo [...]s in the S [...]. And now will the Argument you bring from M. Boyle, from the Imperfection of material Instruments, in [...]er such a [...] in Telescopes, or argue that that excellent Philosopher thought them so fallacious? If not, as certainly even you have not the Impudence to affirm, Then you have not yet proved, that M. Boyle was in the same Err [...]r with M. Cross.

But you return again to the old Argument; M. Boyle doth not say, They, viz. the Spots, and Brightnesses, were not there; but that he could not see them of a long time. Indeed, M. Harry, either your Eyes are as defective, as you pretend M. Boyle's Telescopes to have been; or you think it not fit to report after Them: For M. Boyle doth say, They were not there; his Words are, as I have often cited them, which have, during many months at least, appeared so much sol [...]mer, than it seems they did before. When I read this Period, as 'tis quoted by you, I was surprised; For you recite it thus, [I could not detect any of those Solar Spots which [Page] having dured many months at least, appeared so much seldemer, than it seems they did before, [p. 53.] At the former part of the Words, [which having dured many Months at least] I was startled; for they had the appearance of something in your favour, which I had not observed, and I could not imagine, how M. Boyle should know they had dured for many Months, if they did not appear. I turn'd therefore to the Passage in M. Boyle's own Book, and there I found you had falsified his Words, and that the Saying which made me wonder, was not his, but yours.

Was there now ever such a piece of Impudence as this, in quoting Authors? You undertake to give the World an Instance of that Impudence with which, you say, I demean my self in the effort of a Desperate Ignorance, and that the World may see the Solidity of your Answer, as you brag; You cite my Words, and a long Discourse from M. Boyle, in which is the thing in controversie between us, [p. 52.] You say, 'Tis not your Intention to abuse the Reader with false Citations, or amuse him with a great Confidence, grounded upon an Author that he hath not at hand, [p. 53.] Thus you Praeface to your Citations from M. Boyle, and conclude it thus, I have set down the Passage faithfully, without changing an Expression, [p. 56.] And after all this, would not any one think, you do it faithfully? Could it be supposed that You would misquote your Author's Words to make him speak to your purpose, after your having called the World to observe how you would order me here, and shew my Ignorance, and Impudence; After such Pretences of fair dealing; After you had pr [...] fessed against false Citations, and twitted your Adversaries for accusing you with such Dealing? Could it, I say, be imagined that You should falsifie so known an Author as M. Boyle, and when you cite a long Discourse from him, and have an Adversary concern'd that is not quite stupid? I protest, Though I know you, yet I did not imagine you could be so frontless, a [...]d therefore pored upon the Passage in your Citation a good while, before I could suspect you so much, as to turn to the Original. Well Let this stand for a most remarkable Instance of your Faithfulness in quoting [Page] Authors; And henceforth be not so imp [...]dent, as to pretend, that the Virtuosi abuse you in the Charge of falsifying in Quotations.

But I return to your Arguments: You ask, to what purpose was the Discourse about the deceivableness of Op [...]ioks, if M. Boyle supposed his Glasses true, and that the Spots were absent at that time, [p. 56.]

Here you again impose upon your Reader, and in [...]nuate another falshood, viz. that M. Boyle was discoursing about the deceivableness of Opticks, when it is nothing so; This was not his design here, He is only shewing that Math [...]aticians may be deceived in their Observations about material Objects, upon the account of the Nature of the Things, and the imperfection of the Instruments he useth; as 'tis evident, [p. 102.] And the Instance under debate is produced to shew the former, as I have proved. Thus are you unfortunate in all your Attempts to vindicate your self from the Charge of Impertinence.

And now let the Reader judge, whose Ignorance and Impudence you have discovered, mine, or your own. Let this be an Instance, how you can reason, and how well you are able to understand and use the Authors you cite. I see how I am like to be An [...]wer'd, where I discover your other Imper [...] cies, and Fo [...]es. This you pitch'd upon as a thing, wherein you could shame me, as you phancied: In the other Instances you were not sure to make the matter so evident, and give such clear proof of your advantages; and therefore this is chosen; with your Performances here, You will stand, or fall.

And now, Go thy ways, pratling Impertinen [...], and n [...]ver pretend to Reason more; Swagger on, and call Names, and boast great Performances, and quote seraps by Indexes, and pervert Authors: But take care of coming to close arguing, or of pretending any more to speak to purpose; Thes [...] ar [...] not suitable to the abilities of whi [...]ing Scriblers, and Red-hot Heads.

The things you talk to have demonstrated about Telescopes [p. 56.] I have demonstrated already to be Impertinent; [Page] and I am no ways concern'd in Them: I never denied, but that there was great difference in the Representations o [...] Objects made by Telescopes, as they are longer, or shorter, of purer, or of darker Metals, &c. And there is no doubt, but a great reason of the difference between Astronomers about the celestial Phaenomena, ariseth from the difference between the Telescopes they imploy. I never said, that they were All perfect and infallible in minute Particulars; But that all were not deceitful, and did not present to us meer Phantastical Objects, that had nothing Real: So that in all your Argumentations here, you have spent your Strength upon Shadows. Let the Reader compare, as you would have him, and judge.

I Have done with your Argumentative part. That which follows is very pretty. You desired me, you say, That I would not multiply Lies. Indeed! But don't you remember, M. Stubbe, when I upbraided you to your face at Bath, in the presence of Dr. C. with sundry gross Falshoods you had Printed, of the Bishops Reprimand; of the Uirtuost's contributing to my Book; and o [...] Their, or some other Correctors, sending it home to me blotted, and altered, &c. Do not you remember how little you could say for your self, and how unable you were to justifie those Reports? Don't you remember the Guinny You paid me for one of your Tales, which I disprov'd after a Wager? These things you know well, and cannot defend your self; and therefore endeavour to divert Mens Eyes from your own Faults, by impudently charging me with them. I never said any thing of you, that I will not justifie to a tittle; and I have enough behind unsaid, to shame any Man in the World, but You.

But I'le consider a little, how you make good your charge: You have demonstrated, you say, to the Royal Society, under a Notaries hand, That your Head is not Red, though I say it. Did I so? I pray where? If I never said this, as you relate it, Pray who is the Liar then? I said in my Praeface, that your Head was Red hot; Is there no difference between Colour, and Degree of Heat? You writ me, that [Page] you had convicted me to my Lord Brounker for a Lyar in this Instance, and made your self ridiculous at Oxford, by plucking off your Periwig, and shewing your Head to every Freshman, to demonstrate your charge of lying against me: But you were so much mistaken, that thereby you demonstrated what I said true; For every one took it for an Evidence that your Head was Red-hot. You convey'd (as I hear) Locks of [...]lair into divers Parts, to convince the World by Experiment of the Lies of the Virtuosi; You sent it, You say, by a Publick Notary to the Royal Society. If any one else had told me this, but your self, I should have thought he had abused you. Did ever a crackt-brain'd Noddy do any thing more ridiculous than this? Have you not demonstrated, how fit you are for Bedlam by it? Did you not perceive how every one laugh'd you to scorn for your Demonstration? I protest, I pity you, and am afraid that some will thin [...], that I am not well in my Wits, because I seriously answer such a Lom of Bedlam. And having said this, I must expect next to be branded for a Liar, for the Expression; and you will, 'tis like, send the Royal Society a Certificate from the Clerk of the Parish where you were Christned, that your Name is not [...]om. This will be as necessary to clear you, as the Lock of Hair, with the Hand of the Publick Notary: And I can look for no less from such an Hair-brain'd Impertinent. But, mischief on't, I'm fallen again under your Correction, and must expect you should demonstrate to the next Coffee-house, that I told a Lie, when I gave you the Epithet of Hairbrain'd, by shewing your almost Bald Pate; And what pity it is, that you can't send your Head to the Royal Society by the next Carrier, to convince them! They will at least expect a Certificate from the Barbers of Warwick. But after all your Demonstrations, If I had said your Head was Red, I had not been such a Liar neither; it was direct Carrot, last time I saw it: but perhaps Jamaica, and a Periwig have metamorphos'd your Noddle since. Well! This is one Instance of my Falsifying, which you triumph in much, as a sensible Confutation of the Virtuosi.

Another Instance is, my abusing you for styling your [Page] self Physician for his Majesty in the Island of Jamaica, [ib.] In a Letter to me you insist much on this; You tell me what Stipend the King gave you; That you had his Majesti [...]s Warrant; And that, my Lord This Body, and Sir That Body, knows; You write me, you'l Print the Warrant, and inform me where it is to be seen. Pray in the next Letter tell me who gave you the Licence to sell Chocolate in Jamaica; and by all means Print the Warrant: For without that, the World will never be convinc'd that my Raillery [Praef. p. 9.] is Lying.

Well! These are the great Instances to prove that neither my Duty to God, nor regard to the Ministry could restrain me from the Exorbitances of Lying, [p. 57.] You have, you say, collected more Instances, though they are not such great ones, it seems, as these; And call upon me vehemently in your last Letter, to know where I will be convicted: You have one Lie you tell me notorious to be proved; and you will cause Oath to be made, That you were never entertain'd with dear Welcom at M. Cross's House. Alas! That's pity: You were there, you say; and will any one swear that you were not welcom? I hope your Friend told you, you were welcom; and will any swear the contrary? Take heed of producing that Affidavit, Good Sir, for it will prove M. Cross a Liar, as well as the Virtuoso.

But to return to your Praeface: One Lie, you say, you must take notice of briefly, and 'tis this; That M. Cross did hire you to oppose Ecebolius, [p. 58.] What Ecebolius was that, who said so? I writ no such Words: I insinuated what I thought, and had heard in other terms; and if I Lied, it was in thinking, and hearing, and giving some hints of what was reported, and was likely enough to be believ'd.

But you say, you never call'd him Old; and yet confess, you said you would in part rescue the poor old man: How much different is this, pray, in substance from my Report? I writ, that you said, M. Cross had been asleep these forty years, and knew not what the World bad been doing: But you [...]em to insinuate that I spoke falsly here; for you said, He had been as it were asleep, or buried for these thirty or forty years,— [Page] and knew not the Transactions of the Learned World, [p. 58.] What a strict Casuist are you? The altering of a Word in the report of a Saying, though the Sence be retain'd, is a Lie. 'Tis to be suppos'd you have another Case-Divinity for your self, and your Friends: But remember, you confess you said M. Cross hath been as it were asleep these thirty or forty years: And was he not as it were asleep, when he neglected to bid you Welcom at his House? If your Witness will swear that you took him napping, it may signifie something to prove that you were not entertain'd with dear welcom. What follows in this Page is to inform the Reader, that M. Cross gave you but Village-entertainment at his House, only a Bottle or two of Wine at Bath; and did never make you a Present. I thought there was somewhat in't, that you now publish him for a Seven Sleeper, that knows not the Transactions of the Learned World, and one that needs you to res [...]ue him. However it falls out, 'Tis like you thought he would be more grateful, when you began in his Quarrel, and when the first kind Intercourse of Letters past between you.

But no more of this. You nibble at the sincerity of the Witne [...]es to my Relation; They are both Scholars, Masters of Arts, and Persons whose Veracity hath never yet been call'd into question: So that you cannot prejudice the Reputation of their Truth with those that know them. And if two capable, and ingenuous Persons, who were attentive to a Conference, cannot tell, when the main Particulars of it are recited to them, whether they were so, or not, their Memories must be very bad: And if they shall attest known Falshoods, their Inclinations must be worse. But the Testimony needs no more Words to confirm it.

The Remainder of your Praeface is after your old rate of Impudence, and Folly, and requires only to be laugh'd at; and indeed the whole needed not any other Answer from

Froome, Jan. 16.

Your Friend to chastise you, J. G.

POST-SCRIPT.

[Page]

I Had almost forgot to take notice of your Kindness, in styling me Chaplain to M. Rous, a Member of the Rump-Parliament.] To shew the feebleness of your Malice, I add a little concerning this.

Being not related to any Foundatio [...] in Oxford, but living there a Commoner, I resolved, as soon as I had taken my Degree of Master of Arts, to remove to London; Accordingly an opportunity was offered, and I was invited to live with M. Francis Rous, as his Chaplain: I accepted the Offer: But knew, and had heard no more of that Gentleman, but that he was a very grave and Learned Man, and Pro [...]ost of Eaton-College. In his House I lived somewhat above half a Year, in a private way of following my Studies, without being concern'd in any Publique Matters. That my Patron was a Member of the Rump-Parliament, I n [...]ver heard, but from you, and do not know how true it is yet. He died a good while before the Name of RumpP [...]rliament was started, and I believe was too honest and intelligent to have any active hand with those Men, in their destructive Projects. But in whatever he was concern'd as to the Publique, I was unacquainted with those Affairs, and was so young, as that I did not then understand the State of the Case between the King, and Parliament, and had been hitherto bred under such invin [...]ible [...], that without being miraculously inlightned, 'twas impossible I shoul [...] know the Villany of those, that had be [...]n in Rule ever since I could well remember; For at the time of my being with M. Rous, I was not above 22 Years of Age. And pray now, M. Rous, how am I obnoxious for living with M. Rous? Was this like serving Sir H. Vane in a Publique, malicious, impious, and treasonable Opposition of Monarchy, Ministry, Universities, Churches, and all things Civil, and Sacred? I tell you, M. Stubbe, I n [...]ver [Page] did any thing, and to my best remembrance never said any thing in the late times, in which I was a Child, that could need any favour from an Act of Indempnity; and I dare say, there is not a Man born since 1636. less obnoxious to the Church and Government: And therefore, my Friend, you shall not draw me into a Copartnership with you in your Guilt. And you might have spared calling me Rene [...]ado Presbyter, as you do [p. 34, the first of your Praefaces,] I never concern'd my self about the Disputes of Church-Gouernment, till the Year before the King's coming in, when, upon Inquiry into the matter, my Judgment voted for Episcopacy, and accordingly I suddenly took Orders upon His Majesties Return, from the Bishop of Lincoln; but never was in any before: So that you might with as much justice have call'd me Quaker (which another Huff did) as Presbyterian. But now I remember, you are not to mind what truth, or justice there is in the Imputations you bestow: If they signifie Reproach, 'tis sufficient for your purpose.

And that you regard nothing else in the Characters you bestow, 'tis further evident from your styling me Ecebolius, who was a shuffling Apostate, and one that I should say was like a Physician of Warwick, but that he repented. And why Ecebolius, I pray? I never joyn'd my self with any of the Sects; I never frequented their Meetings; I never espoused their Principles; I never received Sacrament, or Orders, or Preferment from them. On the contrary, I overcame the Prejudices of Education even in those times; and as soon as ever I had inquired, pleaded for the Constitutions of the Church of England, and declared against the Practices and Opinions of the Prevailing Parties, though it were against my Interest, and exposed me to the displeasure of those that could prefer or ruine me. This I did, when there were no hopes of better Times: And how come I then to be Ecebolius? But cry you mercy Sir, now I think on't, you are not to be ask'd a Reason for any thing you say, or do; Reason is too cold a thing for your temp [...]r of Head.

To shew that your Stock of Scurrilities was not out, [Page] notwithstanding all your vast Expences in this kind, You fall anew upon the Virtuosi, with the Titles of Lor [...]es, second sort of worthless Fanaticks, Alumbradoes in Religion, and all Sciences, [Reply, p. 21.] In a Letter to me, You say all your Adversaries are [...]enegadoes, and that the Royal Society understand neither History nor Sence. You write in that Letter, that you will tell Foreigners of their Cheats, and destroy their Repute; which is never to be saved but by timely submission—You have made them, you say, to disclaim their History, [Reply, p. 21.] And add, that you will make them, not only to disown the Book, but the Contents thereof, [ib.] Don't you think that every Man that shall read this, will look upon you as distracted? What do you mean to give me the advantage of so many new Arguments of your Madness, when I have abundantly too many already?

'Tis pretty to observe, how your wild rage vents it self against Dr. More. You represented him as one that had deserted the Royal Society, and commended him then: But when he disproved your falshood in that, and other Particulars, you recane your Commendations, and rail against him with all imaginable rancour, and vehemence. You had said; He was a Member heretofore of the Royal Soci [...]ty, but allows nothing to it now: And would not any one have interpreted the meaning of these Wor [...]s to have been, That he was not of it now? What else doth Peretofore signifie? This Dr. More disproved; and in his Letter to me, added the other Sence of the latter part of your Words, on which you now insist, viz. His allowing nothing to the Weekly Contributions; which indeed is a possible, but I thought a ridiculous meaning. Dr. More call'd it a skue and crooked Quibble, confess'd it to be true, but did not think it meant; And I avow, I was so far from believing this to be your Sence, that I thought it almost ridiculous to suppose it; and therefore I le [...]t out the whole Passage. This I answer to what you say to me for the omission, in one of your Letters.

M. Stubbe, I have almost done with you for the present; only give me leave to ask you a few Questions between you, and me. Your great Pretences are the Interests of Monarchy, [Page] and Religion; Pray do you remember what a certain Physician for His Majesty in Jamaica, advised Col. D. in that Island; and when he was slighted by that Loyal Gentleman, what he counsell'd my Lord M. in the same place? Do you remember who talk'd of several hundred Gospels that were of old, and made those we have to owe their Credit to Chance, in a Discourse to me and two others of Oxford? Can you call to mind who told me at Sir J. L's Table at Bath, That being sick, he prepar'd himself for Death with Lucretius, and Beregardus, and being ask'd, whether he had not the Bible to help prepare him, made a pish of it, and said, That he had not seen a BIBLE in seven Years before, and that it was good for nothing but to make Folks humorsom? Do you remember who affirm'd to me, in the Presence of Sir F. H. and other Gentlemen, That there was no more reason to believe there is a God, than to believe there is none; That he believ'd it, because he could not help it; and could not help it, because he was carried by an unaccountable impulse; That the Arguments to prove a Deity, drawn from that Wisdom, Beauty, Order, and Usefulness that is in the Frame of the Creation, signifie nothing, because We cannot tell what Is Wisdom, Beauty, or Order? Do you not know the Gentleman that discours'd thus? And have you not forgot the Letter that my Lord M. hath of the same Person's, and with what carnestness he beseech'd his Lordship not to let it be seen by the Virtuosi, for fear of his being ruined by it? Are you not acquainted with the Ecebolius that hath done, and said these things si [...]ce his Conversion, and Confirmation? If you are, advise him to talk no more for shame of his Zeal for Monarchy, and Religion. You see what I could say. Put these Passages into your Hint-box, or into your Snuff-box, if you think flt. I thought here to have left you, but I must add a Paragraph or two more.

In the Praeface of my last Answer I say, that your Ap [...]logy of Serving a Patron, would justifie Faux, Ravillac, and the Stubbes that were hang'd for Treason in former Reigns: And you seem very angry in your Letters, that I thus disgrac'd your Family, and challenge me to give an Instance [Page] of any Stubbes that were hang'd: I perceive by it, that you are not acquainted with your own Pedigree; I'le therefore inform you, that you are not the first of the Name who hath deserved well of Monarchy. In M. Heath's Chronicle of the Civil Wars of England, p. 856, 857. Edw. 2. you will find among divers others convicted of a Conspiracy against the King, Bishops, and Government, one Francis Stubbes, a Cheesemonger, was executed with his Accomplices, and Quarter'd as a Traytor. And another Name-sake of yours, John Stubbes, had his Right Hand cut off on a Scaffold erected in Palace-yard, for a Seditious Book, intituled Vorago, in which he vented abominable Reproaches against the Queen, and for that was so punish'd, as you may see in Cambden's Elizabeth. You may thank God, and a Gracious King, that you have had a better Fate than those others of your Name: I wish you may never meet with the Reward of your Deserts, as those other Stubbes did; but may repent, and be wise on this side the Place, where many Friends part.

FINIS.

Information about this book

Title statement

A further discovery of M. Stubbe in a brief reply to his last pamphlet against Jos. Glanvill.

Glanvill, Joseph, 1636-1680.

Edition statement

1671

Publication

Publisher

Text Creation Partnership,

Place of publication

Ann Arbor, MI ; Oxford (UK) :

Date

2003-01 (EEBO-TCP Phase 1).

ID [DLPS]

A42815

ID [STC]

Wing G811

ID [STC]

ESTC R23379

ID [EEBO-CITATION]

12068225

ID [OCLC]

ocm 12068225

ID [VID]

53421

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This keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the Early English Books Online Text Creation Partnership. This Phase I text is available for reuse, according to the terms of Creative Commons 0 1.0 Universal. The text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission.

Series

Early English books online.

Notes

(EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A42815)

Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 53421)

Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1641-1700 ; 70:8)

Source

— A further discovery of M. Stubbe in a brief reply to his last pamphlet against Jos. Glanvill., Glanvill, Joseph, 1636-1680., Stubbe, Henry, 1632-1676..

Extent

[4], 34 [i.e. 35] p.

Printed for H. Eversden ...,. London :: 1671.. ("To the reader" signed: J. Glanvill.) (Reproduction of original in British Library.)

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