Loidoromastix: that is, A scourge for a rayler containing a full and sufficient answer vnto the vnchristian raylings, slaunders, vntruths, and other iniurious imputations, vented of late by one Richard Parkes master of Arts, against the author of Limbomastix. VVherein three hundred raylings, errors, contradictions, falsifications of fathers, corruptions of Scripture, with other grosse ouersights, are obserued out of the said vncharitable discourse, by Andrevv Willet Professor of Diuinitie. Willet, Andrew, 1562-1621. 1607 Approx. 553 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 120 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images. Text Creation Partnership, Ann Arbor, MI ; Oxford (UK) : 2005-03 (EEBO-TCP Phase 1). A15419 STC 25693 ESTC S120028 99855231 99855231 20712

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Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A15419) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 20712) Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1475-1640 ; 724:3) Loidoromastix: that is, A scourge for a rayler containing a full and sufficient answer vnto the vnchristian raylings, slaunders, vntruths, and other iniurious imputations, vented of late by one Richard Parkes master of Arts, against the author of Limbomastix. VVherein three hundred raylings, errors, contradictions, falsifications of fathers, corruptions of Scripture, with other grosse ouersights, are obserued out of the said vncharitable discourse, by Andrevv Willet Professor of Diuinitie. Willet, Andrew, 1562-1621. [40], 195, [5] p. Printed by Cantrell Legge, printer to the Vniversitie of Cambridge. 1607. And are to be sold in Pauls Churchyard [, London,] by Richard Bankevvorth at the signe of the Sunne, [Cambridge] : [1607] A reply to: Parkes, Richard. An apologie: of three testimonies of holy Scripture, concerning the article of our Creed, (he descended into hell.). The last leaf is blank. Reproduction of the original in the Henry E. Huntington Library and Art Gallery.

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eng Parkes, Richard, b. 1558 or 9. -- Apologie: of three testimonies of holy Scripture, concerning the article of our Creed, (he descended into hell.) -- Controversial literature -- Early works to 1800. Jesus Christ -- Descent into hell -- Early works to 1800. 2004-10 Assigned for keying and markup 2004-11 Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2004-12 Sampled and proofread 2004-12 Text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-01 Batch review (QC) and XML conversion

Loidoromastix: THAT IS, A SCOVRGE FOR A RAYLER; CONTAINING A FVLL AND SVFFICIENT ANSWER VNTO the Vnchristian raylings, slaunders, vntruths, and other iniurious Imputations, vented of late by one RICHARD PARKES master of Arts, against the author of LIMBOMASTIX.

Wherein three hundred raylings, errors, contradictions, falsifications of Fathers, corruptions of Scripture, with other grosse ouersights, are obserued out of the said vncharitable discourse, by ANDREVV WILLET Professor of Diuinitie.

Iob 31. 35, 36.

Though mine aduersarie should write a booke against me, would I not take it vpon my shoulder, and binde it as a crowne vnto me?

August cont. Petilian. lit. lib. 3. c. 8.

Nec malam conscientiam sanat praeconium laudantis, nec bonam vulnerat convitiantis opprobrium:

Neither doth the commendation of the praiser heale an euill conscience, nor the reproach of a Reviler wound a good.

Printed by CANTRELL LEGGE, Printer to the Vniversitie of CAMBRIDGE. 1607.

And are to be sold in Pauls Churchyard by RICHARD BANKEVVORTH at the signe of the Sunne.

TO THE MOST REVEREND FATHER IN GOD, RICHARD, by the Diuine prouidence Archbish. of CANTERBVRIE, Primate and Metropolitan of all England: and of his Maiesties most Honourable priuie Counsell.

AVgustine (Right Reuerend Father) when a certaine young man of no good fame,Epist. 1 •• had accused one Bonifacius, a Minister or Presbyter, of a great crime (they both beeing of his owne Colledge and societie) though he gaue more credit vnto the Presbyter,Quamvis magis Presbytero redidissem. yet the matter hanging in suspense and doubt, he sent them both for the more full manifestation of the truth, vnto the tombe of Felix the Martyr: for they had a great opinion of such places in those daies. My case at this time in some things is not much vnlike: who hauing beene a Minister and Presbyter of this Church, and a poore Preacher and writer of the same now these twentie yeares, am at the last, by one of obscure fame and name,See Imput. 1. recrimin. accused before your Grace, of heresie, blasphemie, and charged with the deniall of an Article of the faith. In which accusation, as I doubt not, but that your Gr. opinion is as indifferent toward me (whose Parents, education, studies, and trauailes, you haue knowne these many yeares) as Augustines was toward Bonifacius; yet herein my case is better, that I doe referre my selfe to the iudgement of a Reuerend Prelate liuing, and am not sent to the triall of the dead.

Archidamus, Plutarch. inter Laconica apothegmata. not much vnlike to the former exampl •• beeing chosen an arbitrator betweene two that were at variance, brought them into the Temple of Minerva, and hauing first bound them with an oath to stand to his sentence, decreed, that they should not depart thence, before they had compounded the controuersie. Crates Thebanus is said to haue vsed to resort vnto fa ••• lies that disagreed, and with perswasions of peace to haue adiudged their strifes. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . So your (Honour) not so much by choice an arbitrator, as by office and place a Iudge in these causes, will bring vs both (I trust) into the Temple of GOD, there to be tried by the Scriptures: And as Crates endeauour was to pacifie families, so I hope, your Gr. care is, to settle this Church in peace: approouing that godly saying of Basilius; 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 Basil.) 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , that nothing is so proper to a (Bishop) as to be a peacemaker.

Mine aduersarie hath had the prioritie of complaint, and first filled your eares (though not possessed them) with his vntrue surmises: for I doubt not, but as Alexander, when one of his familiar friends was traduced before him, stopped one of his eares, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . as reseruing it for him that was absent: so your Gr. hath one eare left for me: according to that rule of Seneca, Vtrique parti actiones dares, dares tempus, Lib. 2. de ira. non semel audires: magis enim veritas elucet, quo saepius ad manum venit: to giue vnto both parties their action, and to graunt them time, to heare more then once: for the oftner the truth cometh to hand (to be scanned) the more the light thereof appeareth. Cicero against Antonie said:Cicer. Philip. 2. quid mihi plenius, quid vberius, quam mihi, & pro me, & contra Antonium, dicere: But I may adde the third; that it contenteth me, that I may speake not onely for my selfe, and against such an one, but before your Gr. As for his accusations, I feare them not, mine owne conscience testifying with me: I will (as Iob saith) take them vpon my shoulder, Iob 31. 36. and bind them as a crowne vnto me. For, as Cyprian well saith,de baptism. Christ. but vpon an other occasion; nequaquā sub hoc onere lassitudinem, sed quietem inventuri: vnder this burthen I shall not finde wearines, but rest. As Augustine also saith:Lib. 3. contra Petil. c. 7. qui volens detrahit famae meae, nolens addit mercedi: he that willingly detracteth from my fame, doth against his will adde to my reward.

But two things I doe not a little, wonder at, that he durst abuse your Gr. eares, with such vntrue and vncharitable invectures in his Epistle, and the Reader, with such grosse and absurd ouersights in his booke.

In the first,Epist. Dedicat. he chargeth me with a prophane and irreligious fact in denying p. 3. an Article of the Christian faith: p. 6. with errors, or heresies rather in ppugning the doctrine of the Church: p. 6. striking at some maine points of faith, shaking the foundation it selfe, and calling in question, heauen and hell, the diuinitie and humanitie, yea the very soule, and saluation of Christ our Sauiour himselfe: p. 7. so bard ed in error that they neither she contrition of heart to repentance, nor confession of mouth to obedience: p. 10. that neither Rhemist nor Romanist, could lightly haue more disgraced the discipline and doctrine of the Church in diuers points To these iniurious slaunders,Imput. 2. recriminat. 3. 5. 7. my particular answer afterward followeth, which were needlesse to be inserted here. Thus much concerning my selfe I say in generall in Hieromes words:Lib. 3. adv. Pel. Egone haereticus, quare ergo me haeretics non amant: am I an heretike, wherefore then doe not heretikes loue me?Apologicall epistle, written as is supposed by one Phillips a Iesuite: and in the Retection by Woodeward an other of that faction. which in their rayling pamphlets and libells haue made me a marke to shoote at. But that saying of Cyprian doth giue 〈…〉 Scias hoc semper opus esse diaboli, vt servos dei 〈…〉 laceret, vt qui conscientiae suae luce clarescunt, alienis rumoribus sordidentur: Know this to be alwaies the worke of the deuill,Lib. 4. epist. 2. to vexe the seruants of God with lies, that they which are cleare in the light of their conscience, should be blemished with other mens reports. Now, though he tooke vnto himselfe this libertie, in this vnfriendly manner to disgrace me, yet he might haue shewed more modestie, then to outface me with such vntruths, in your Gr. presence. It is said, that the actors of those wanton playes, called Floralia: Catone praesente agere recusarūt: refused to play in Catoes presence: and he might haue forborne to haue vttered his forged calumniations before so graue a personage. But I trust it will fall out here, as sometime in the like case with Augustine: Experti dicimus, Tom. 10. ser. 49. nam non crederemus, multi à nobis mala consilia petunt, consilia mentiendi, consilia circumveniendi, sed in nomine Christi nullus talis nos tentavit: I speak (saith he) by experience, otherwise I would not haue beleeued, many doe aske of vs euill counsell, counsell to lie, counsell to circumvent; but in the name of Christ, none such hath tempted vs. Neither (I hope) hereafter, your wisdome will giue passage or licence to such mens intemperate pennes, to wound and gall their brethren: yet had hee staied here onely, in censuring the liuing, and not proceeded to taxe the memorie of the dead, it had been more tolerable: that godly learned man Doctor Reynolds, who is now at rest in the Lord, is thus iniuriously handled by him, and that since his Christian departure; whereby grace may so happily worke in their hearts, Epist. dedi. p. 11. that where the truth hath beene heretofore frowardly excluded, &c. as though that worthy mā, were either voide of grace, or did frowardly exclude the truth: nay he spareth not to charge him, as guiltie of profane, See Impu. 1. recrim. irreligious, hereticall, sacrilegious opinions, of grosnes, sophistrie, profanenesse, &c. It is said of Themistocles, that in his returne from battell, seeing a dead body lying with iewels of gold, hee thus spake to one that was with him, Take thou away these things, Plutarch. praecept. de regend. republic. for thou art not Themistocles: neither would this man, if he had beene, (I say not of an heroicall spirit, as Themistocles) but of a sober and charitable spirit, as euery good Christian, haue stripped the dead of his well deserued ornaments: in seeking to impaire his credit, he doth but blemish and obscure his owne; and sheweth himselfe to bee of those, who as Hierome saith, Hippocratis fomentis magis, quam monitis nostris indigent: had need rather of Hippocrates medicine, then our admonition.

Now may it please your (Reuerend Fatherhood) to giue me leaue, to offer vnto your view some of the principall contents of his booke: by the tast whereof, it will appeare, what relish the rest haue; & by the smell of some of his flowers,Dixit se foetor e eius ferre non posse, non sentis (inquit) putorem teterrimum, & in cicere foetere avaritiam. Hieron. vit. Hilar. one may guesse, what herbs grow in his garden: as Hilarion said to Hesychius, when a bunch of small pulse was brought them out of a Churles garden, that hee could not abide the stinch thereof: Doe you not feele (saith he) a filthy sauour, and euen his couetousnesse to smell in the pulse? So by this handfull, which I shall gather out of his booke, the euill sauour will be found of the rest.

1. Hee much forgetting himselfe, thus breaketh out beyond the limits of modestie,1. Impu. recrim. charging me with folly, hypocrisie, falshood, lying, infidelitie, impudency, sawcinesse, Machiauell sme, Atheisme, Heresie; as particular instance is giuen, in more then 80. railing speeches vsed against me, and others:Contr. Sallust. so that I may say vnto him in Tullies words, Neque qui tam illoto sermone vtitur, vita honestior est: It is not like that he which vseth such vncleane spech, can be much honester in life.

2. I haue obserued 22. slaunderous imputations, wherof some are these: that I would transforme the order of the Church into anImp. 2. Slan. . Anarchie: that their heads plot, and their handsSlaund. 9. practise Babylonicall warre:Slaund. 11. that he defendeth diuers things contrary to the truth of the Gospell:Slaund. 17. that he iustifieth pestilent & blasphemous heretiks, against the learned, and holy Fathers:Slaund. 18. that he holdeth the flames of hell to be temporall:Slaund. 22. that he called the blessed rootes of the Christian faith cursed rootes: with such like.

3. Instance is giuen of 34. vntruthes vttered by him: 3. Imp. vntr. 6. As that he beleeueth, I was one of those, which writ the Letter to Master Hooker; the writers whereof, I knowe not to this day: 9. vntr. that I borrowe diuers things from Carlils booke; which I neuer sawe: vnt. 11. that I fasten all the torments of hell, vpon the blessed soule of Christ; which I neuer thought: truth denied that there is not one word through his booke, that insinuateth any suspition of Limbus patrum: whereas, in the preface following, the contrary is prooued directly, in 20. seuerall places out of his booke.

4. Among the errors which he is charged with, to the number of 14. these specially are noted:Imp. 6. recr. 2. he iustifieth the Latine text, against the originall Greeke in the newe Testament: error. 2. hee calleth the booke of Ecclesiasticus the word of God, which the Church of England holdeth for one of the Apocryphall bookes: artic. 6.error 11. that the baptisme of infants is not to be found in Scripture, by any expresse mention; whereas the Church of England holdeth it to be most agreeable to the institution of Christ: artic. 27. He calleth these sound positions,imp. 2. scla. 15. that the Scriptures alone are not compleate vnto saluation: that mans will is naturally apt without grace, to beleeue: that mens naturall workes are acceptable to God: which are directly opposite to the doctrine of the Church of England, which holdeth the contrary: that the holy Scripture containeth all things necessary to saluation: artic. 6. that man of his owne natural strength cannot turne and prepare himselfe to faith: artic. 10. that workes done before the grace of Christ, are not pleasant to God: artic. 13.

5. Diuers harsh and vnsauorie speeches are laid vnto his charge; as that hee applyeth those words of Christ to himselfe, imp. 7. recr. 1. de bono opere lapidor: I am stoned for a good worke:ibid. recrim. 3. that Christs conquest vpon the crosse was openly an ouerthrow, and therefore no triumph: if it were, it was a triumph before victory:recrim. 6. that there is a most plaine distinction betweene the holy Ghost and Christ, not in person onely, but in his diuine nature. These and the like assertions, (which he would haue tearmed blasphemies) to the number of tenne, are obserued out of his booke.

6. Diuers points of arrogancy, and vaine ostentation are obserued, to the number of 13. whereof this is one, that hee maketh his boast, that my Lord of Winchester hath in his last booke much altered his iudgement concerning the place of Peter,Imp. 8. recr. 10. mooued by the reasons laid downe by me (saith he) and none but me: wheras it is not true, that that Reuerend learned father, hath therein altered his iudgemēt: at the lest, it becam not him so to brag: It might haue better beseemed the other, if any such thing were, to haue acknowledged it: As August. thus modestly writeth to Petrus, De orig. ani lib 2. tom. . a Bishop to a Presbyter: Vellem rescriptis tuis, quid te docuerit me docere: absit enim vt erubescam à presbytero discere, si tu non erubuisti à laico: I would haue thee by thy rescript to teach me, what taught you: farre be it, that I should be ashamed to learne of a Presbyter, if you were not ashamed to learne of a lay man.

Further he chargeth the great English Bible,Imput. 8. recrim. 6. which is authorised to be read in our Curches, with error in the translation, and with blasphemie in the annotations.

7. Concerning the allegation of the Fathers, I haue shewed partly his ignorance, in mistaking and misquoting them, partly his vnfaithfulnes in vntrue alleadging them, in 30. seuerall places: as namely his ignorance inImput. 1 iustif. 2. 2. Cyril, ibid. iustif. 3. and recrim. 1. 4. Hierome, recrim. 7. 3. and 4. Augustine: ibid. recr. 2. 3 Tertullian also is strangely produced, contrarie to his owne iudgement: thus he dealeth also with the new writers, as with Calvine, Beza.

8. Neither can the Scripture escape his vncleane fingers: as instance is giuen in 26. places: as loc. 17. the Scripture saith, He shall not preserue the vngodly, Iob 36. 5. he readeth, thou wilt not preserue: loc. 19. S. Iames saith, which hath conuerted, &c. and shall saue a soule, Iam. 5. 20. he readeth, which conuerteth, in the present: and shall saue his soule: adding (his:) and he maketh as bolde with many places beside.

This it is for one to deale out of his element, and to meddle beyond his skill, for a professor of Grammer, to take vpon him to teach Diuinitie. He must needes stumble that walketh in darkenes, and he can not be without error, that is corrupt in iudgement. Now is verified that saying of the wise man, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ,Prov. 13. 7. There is that maketh himselfe rich, and hath nothing: As this man maketh himselfe skilfull in the tongues, in the Scriptures, in the Fathers, and in what not, in all these proclayming his ignorance: Hierome spake it modestly of himselfe:Perorat in Orig. ad Roman. Fateor, frater Heracli, dum tui, desiderijs satisfacere cupio, oblitus sum pene mandati, quo praecipitur, onus supra vires tuas ne levaveris: I confesse (brother Heraclius) while I satisfie thy desire, that I had almost forgotten the commandement that biddeth, Take not vp a burthen beyond thy strength. But it is most true of him: who hath (vnbidden) thrust his shoulders vnder a burthen, that is like to crush him. As Cleon was vnfit to lead an armie, and Philopoimen to guide a navie, Plutarch. praecept. de Repub. regend. and Hannibal to play the Orator: so is this Grammarian to meddle with Diuinitie. Euripides saying may well be applied to such: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : a Carpenter thou art, and yet dost not deale with carpenters worke. Seneca well said, Necesse est, vt opprimant onera, quae ferente maiora sunt, Lib. 1. de vit. tranq. &c. nec accedendum eo, vnde non sit liber regressuo. Those burthens must needes presse to the ground, which are greater then the bearer: And it is not safe going thither, whence there is no returne. And so it falleth out to such according to the saying of Hierome: Qui scribunt, non quod inveniunt, Hier. ad Lucin. sed quod intelligunt, & dum alienos errores emendare nituntur, ostendunt suos: They write, not what they finde, but what they vnderstand, and while they goe about to correct the errors of others, they bewray their owne.

Now let me craue a little further leaue to adde some what concerning the former booke, which is by him impugned, and this written in defense thereof. The first, entituled (Limbomastix) I acknowledge to be mine; and am not ashamed of any matter therein handled, though for the manner it might haue beene more exact, I confesse. And for the publishing thereof, this is my excuse, or rather defense: first, that I was thereunto prouoked in particular: againe, I saw in his pamphlet maintained that Popish opinion of Limbus patrum, which suspition the author can not auoide, as it is at large declared in the Preface following: who if he be sound in other points of Protestants doctrine, it is well: but then is he much wronged both in the opinion, and reports of them that know him: further, that booke passed vnder the censure of a graue and learned writer of our Church:D Sutcliff. and yet it was printed without my priuitie.

As touching mine opinion of CHRISTS Descension, handled in that booke, I will freely deliuer what I thinke: first, I beleeue the Article of the Descension, to be a necessarie part of our faith:Lib Instit. 2. c. 16. sect. 8. and say with Calvine, In the descent of Christ to hell, there is no small force to the effect of our Redemption, &c. and it auaileth so much vnto the (cheife) summe of our redemption, that it beeing pretermitted, much will be lost of the fruit of Christs death: thus much for the substance of the Article. Secondly, concerning the manner of Christs descension, I doe hold and beleeue whatsoeuer can be prooued out of Scripture, and truly collected from thence. Thirdly, yet I affirme, that out of those three places, Act. 2. 27. 1. Pet. 3. 19. Eph. 4. 9. the locall descension of Christs soule to hell, can not necessarily be concluded. And herein I affirme no more, then other graue and learned writers of our Church haue done before me.Confut. of the Rhem. annot. D. Fulke saith, that the article of Christs descension, is not grounded vpon the first text:2. Act. 3. Bish. Bilson resigneth the second place:B. Bils. Survey. 676. and D. Fulke out of Theodoret sheweth,Confut. Rhem. ann. Eph. 4. 1. that the third maketh not for the passing of Christ from place to place, and so consequently belongeth not to his locall descension. Fourthly, I say notwithstanding, and professe in the same words, which I set downe before: They which hold not the locall descent of Christs soule to hell, Limbom. p. 5. should not condemne the other, as Popish and superstitious men, that are so perswaded: They which affirme it, ought not to account them as enemies, or aduersaries to the truth, that dissent from them therein. He that thus writeth, is farre from either hauing his head plotting, or his hands practising Babylonicall warres: as I am slaundered, as I haue shewed before. Fiftly, I hold the Article of Christs descension, as the Church of England propoundeth it:Articl. 3. As Christ died for vs, and was buried: so also it is to be beleeued that he went downe to hell: in which words the Article of the descension is commended in generall to be held, without any the determination of the sense: asM. Rogers in his booke of the Catholike doctrine of the Church of England, printed at Cambr. ann. 607. he that lately hath learnedlyI would he had written as soundly in some points, as namely concerning the doctrine of the Sabbaoth. p. 163. 195. 192. and in other places. written (dedicating his booke to your Gr.) vpon the Articles of Religion, by publike authoritie, hauing deliuered diuers senses of this Article, and especially these three: 1. some hold that Christ descended as God onely not as man, &c. powerfully and effectually, not personally: 2. some as man onely, either in bodie onely, &c. to the graue, or in soule onely, when he went to the place of the reprobate, &c. 3. as God and man in one person, &c. that he went, as it were into hell, when vpon the crosse, and els where, he suffered the torments, &c. Then he inferreth thus: But till we know the natiue and vndoubted sense of this Article, and mysterie of religion, persist we aduersaries to them which say, that Christ descended not into hell at all, &c.

This was the summe of my first booke, which beeing written without gall and bitternesse; as he saith, Ego sine iracundia dico, Cicer. Philip. 8. vt omnia, tamen non sine dolore: I speake it without anger, though not without griefe: and the party being not knowne, which was the author of that Pamphlet, and so no man beeing personally touched: as Hierome saith, d Nepotian. Nullum laesi nullius nomen mea scriptura designatum est: I hurt no man, no mans name is in my writing decyphered: He might in silence haue corrected this error, as Ambrose saith, 〈◊〉 Luk. Et si nostra voce non proditur, vel su tamen crubescat affectu: though he bee not by my voice bewraied, yet hee might in his owne opinion haue beene ashamed: Yet could he not containe himselfe, but must set pen to paper, and publish his owne shame, by his vnchristian and intemperate rayling: according to that saying of Hierome to Helvidius: 〈…〉 . Arbitror te veritate superatum, ad maledicta conuerti: I thinke, you beeing ouercome with the truth, did turne to rayling. I haue felt before this, the whip of popish tongues, and haue tasted of their virulent pennes; but the badge of heresie, impiety, profanenes, blasphemy, atheisme, was neuer set vpon my sleeue before; himselfe, that there pin ed it, beeing more worthy to weare it in his forehead: hee hath nothing almost in his mouth, but lying, falshood, hypocrisie, corruption of Scriptures, contradictions, falsification of Fathers: which things, if he could fasten vpon me, as he neuer shall, yet it would nothing helpe his cause;Apolog. 3. adv. Ruffin. as Hierome saith Quid vulneribus tuis prodest, si ego fuero vulneratus? what doth it helpe your wounds, if I likewi e be wounded? and againe, Quid refert, si causa cadis, & crimine superes? what doth it auaile, if you faile in the cause, and bee superiour in obiecting of crimes? I feare not what he can lay to my charge, for I haue read, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : that neither a weake mans blowes, nor an vnwise mans threats are to be feared.

Now in this other booke, I haue framed a briefe answere vnto his calumnious accusations, not medling at all with the argument and matter it selfe, both because it remaineth by him vnanswered, and for that I will not crosse the iudgement of some Reuerend learned men of our Church, but content my selfe with that, which I haue formerly written thereof: I haue onely answered his vncharitable slaunders, and returned them with aduantage vpon his owne head. I haue obserued of raylings, slaunders, vntruths, contradictions, falsification of Fathers, corruption of Scriptures, with such other ouersights, not fewer then 300. his errors beeing more then the leaues, and almost equall to the pages of his booke: if hee had had the like aduantage against me, he would not haue doubted to vse that sentence of Hierom against me;Lib. 1. conr. Iovin. Proponam aduersarij sententias, & de tenebrosis libris eius, quasi de foueis serpentes protraham, neque sinam venenosum caput spiris maculosi corporis protegi: I will propound the aduersaries sentence, and out of his darke bookes I will drawe the serpents, as out of their holes; neither will I suffer his venemous head to lie lurking within the windes of his speckled body. But I will forbeare him; yet I must confesse, that in returning this answer, I wanted the patience of Ioseph, of whom Ambrose saith,Epist. 44. Mal it falsum •• rimen subire, quam verum referre that he had rather vndergoe a false crime, then report a true: or as Hierom writeth of Blesilla, Blesilla nostra rid •• it, es dignabitur loquacium ranarum audire convitia that shee would smile,ad Marcel. nor vouchsafing to heare the raylings of the clamorous frogges For my ease is diuers, who beeing charged with her esie, blasphemy, atheisme, must either by silence confesse the crime, or by a iust Apologie wipe it away: So indeed, I was driuen to a great straite,Hieron. Pammach. Ocean. as Hierome againe saith; Hoc mihi praestiterunt vt si tacuero, re s, si respondero, inimicus iudicer, d ra vtraque conditio fed è duobus eligam quod leuius est: simultas redintegrari patest, blasphemia veniam non meretur They haue brought mee to this, that if I hold my peace, I shall be held to be guiltie; if I answer, I shall be iudged an enemie: an hard condition of each side: but of the two, I will choose the easier: a priuie grudge may (well) bee renewed, but blasphemy cannot be pardoned: which as it seemeth, was imputed vnto Hierome, as now vnto mee. Now then, he may thanke himselfe, that began the quarrell, if he be well beaten for his labour, that might haue slept in a whole skin: and if he cannot fence off that blow, which is comming toward him, let him afterward learne to play with his matches. For as Origen well saith, writing vpō those words in the Gospel;tract. 35. in Math. Omnes belli concitatores, in eo bello per bunt, quod concitant: all that take the sword, shall perish with the sword: all the raisers of warre, shall perish in that warre, which they haue raised.

Now vnto your Gr. wise and graue censure, I present this my iustification; of whome I might craue iustice against this defamer and slaunderer, who hath obiected capitall crimes of blasphemie, and heresie, against a Minister of the Church, contrary to theatrocem tibi iniuriam esse factam manifestum est, si tibi illata est, cum esses in sacerdotio. Cod. lib. 9. tit. 35. leg. 4. Valerian. Gale. lawe: which by imperiall constitution deseruethsi minime haec vera ostenderit capitali poeua plectetur. Cod. lib. 9. tit. 36. l. 1. Valentin. capitall punishment, if he cannot prooue the things obiected to bee true: by the Canons it was censured, byqui in alterius famam publice scripturam confinx erit, flagelletur. Caus. 2. q. 5. c. 1. Hadrian. whipping, or by beeingqui inuenti fuerint famosos libellos in Ecclesia ponere, anathematizentur. Caus. 2. q. 5. c. 3. concil. Elib. excommunicate and anathematized. But I craue no such reuenge of him but onely pray; touching himselfe, that hee may become an honest man hereafter: and that your Gr. would be pleased, that as I haue beene publikely defamed and traduced by him, so it may be lawful for me publikely to defend my selfe: that according to theCod. lib 9 tit. 36. l g. 1. lawe, hu us odi libellus alterius opinionem non ledat, such an infamous libell doe, not hurt the op •• on of another: which cannot be preuented, vnlesse some publike satisfaction should be made: for asLib. de bon. viduitat. cap. 22. Augustine saith well, nobis necessaria est vita nostra, alijs fama nostra: as our life is necessarie to our selues, so our fame is 〈…〉

Now lastly 〈◊〉 prayethEpist ded. p. 11. that my bookes as abortiue brats be not suffered to see the sunne, whose light they seeke to obscure; I am content to stand herein to your iudgment also, whether of bu wri •• ngs are more worthy to come into the sunne light: as for mine, (whereof some are extant in your Gr. name, which may deliuerme from his iniurious accusation, as beeing as enemie vnto that eminent place and calling) if they were no more meete then his, to be admitted vnto the publike view of men, I could wish them not onely out of the sunne light, but in the fire light also. But which be the abortiue brats, I referre me to the midwiues that brought them out, I meane the Stationers that printed them: I thinke some of them may wish, that his beggerly brats had beene yet vnborne.

Con •• ning 〈…〉 I am not ashamed to say with Hierom: Ad Cresiphon. Multi anni sunt, quibus ab adolescentia, vs que ad hanc aetatem, diuer sa scripsiopuscula, &c. prouoco aduersaries vt 〈…〉 •• artulas exintegro discutiant, & si quid in meo ingeniolo vitij repererint, proferant in medium, confitebor errorem, malens emendare, quam perseuerare in prauitate sententiae: There are many years, wherein since my youth, vnto this age, I haue written diuers works: I do prouoke mine aduersaries, to examine all my writings afresh, and if they finde any fault in my small wit (and vnderstanding) let them bring it forth. I will confesse mine error, willing rathr to amende it, then to perseuere in a wrong sentence. And concerning such slaunderous libels, and immodest inuectiues, as his are, I say vnto your Gr. as Bernard wrote sometimes to Eugenius: De consid. lib. 1. Miror, quomodo religiosae aures tuae, audire sustinent huiusmodi pugnas verborum, que magis ad subversionem, quam inventionem proficiunt veritatis: corrige pravum morem, & pra ide linguas vaniloquas; &c. flagellum tenes, timea t nu ••• ularij ne fidant nūmis: I maruel, how your religious eares can endure to heare such strife of wordes, which auaile more for the subuersion, then finding out of the truth: correct this euill vse, and stay such vaine tongues, &c. you hold the whip, let the money chaungers feare to trust to their (counterfeit) coyne. And so I ende with that salutation of the same Father, Plenum vos dierum suscipiat dies vna illu melior in atrijs Domini super millia, Venerabilis pat r Epist. 61.

Your Gr. readie to be commanded in the Lord Iesus, ANDREVV WILLETT.
THE PREFACE TO THE Christian-Reader.

WHen Rezin King of Aram, and Pekah King of Israel had conspited against Iudah, and fought against Ierusalem: the Prophet was sent with this comfortable messages Feare not, Isa. 7. 4. neither be faint hearted, for the two tayles of those smoaking firebrands, Woodward the Iesuite as it is thought, in his Detection. &c. two such suming, rather then fiering brands, haue raised of late a smoake against me:R. Parkes. some foure yeares since a Popish Aramite and now of late an English Israelite: But as the flames of the first were soone quenched, so I doubt not but the irefull heate, and vaine smoake of the other will quickly be laide. It were somewhat too hard to say of these two aduersaries, as Tulke did of his two enemies D labella and Antonie: Philippi . 11. Duo haec capita nata sunt post homines natos tet rrima 〈…〉 quorum alter effecit, quod pt abat, de altero p tefactum est, quod cogitaret: these two heads are sprung vp the worst and most dishonest of all men aliue; the one whereof hath effected, what he desired. the other hath discouered what he thought: for neither will I thinke so vncharitably of them, though they thinke and speake most basely and vilely of me: neither hath either of them had his pleasure of me, but in seeking to disgrace me, haue defamed themselues: and haue rather bewraied what they thought, then effected, what they intended.

Dy nisius when he heard of two young men, that railed vpon him, and perceiued that the one spake in drinke, but the other seemed to be sober, and yet reuiled: he dismissed the one as a drunken and foolish person, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . but punished the other 〈…〉 Antagonists. The one beeing 〈…〉 Babylons cuppe, and hauing wrung out the very dregges of Romish superstition, writ his pleasure of me in his madd and drunken fittes: the other, professing himselfe a sober Protestant, (but let him take heede, if all be trueô si & mihi liceret dicere, quae multi clamitant, iam & nos intelligeres scire, quae omnes sciunt, & me quoque audire, quae nullus ignorat Hieron. ad Theoph. I heare, least that one cuppe of (nimis) more, make him not as drunke as the other) hath in his pretended 〈…〉 •••• ded the raging fittes of the other lightbraine. But I passe very little, neither doe I regard their rayling speech, comforting my selfe with that saying of the Apostle, If ye be rayled vpon for the name of Christ, blessed 〈◊〉 ye: a all they are,1. Pet. 4. 14. which are maligned for the defense of the 〈◊〉 : and here I may fitly vse those words of Augustine: go volo te esse sanum, Serm. 164. quare tu furis in me sicut insanus; I would haue thee to be found and whole and you rage against me, as one vnsound or madde. If they are become mine enemies for the Gospel and the truths sake, I will therein glorie. The one of them shooteth his darts at me, because I strike at the very bodie of Poperie: the other arpeth, because I prune off one of the branches thereof, that superstitious opinion of Limbus patrum, as euen now shall be s ewed.Dialog. 1. adv. Pelagian. But I say here with Hierome, Bre iter respon eo, nunquam me haereticis pepero •• sse, & omni eg sse studio, vt hostes Ecclesiae, mei quoque hostes fiero •• : I answer briefely, that I neuer spared heretikes; and haue endeauoured with all my studie, that the enemies of the Church should also be enemies vnto me. Let them diuide this sentence betweene them: let the first take the first part, and the other, that which remaineth: for this I speake bordly, and confidently, that I know no enemies of mine in matter of religion (some difference in opinion there may be among friends and wel illers, whome yet I count no enemies) but they are also enemies (I dare say to the Church of God, and religion: that I may here truly v e the Orators words; Quonam meo fat fieri dicam vt nemo his annis viginti Reipu •• hostis fuerat, quinon bellum eonam tempore, mihi quoque indixerit: I can not tell by what fatall destinie it happeneth, that there hath not beene these twentie yeares an enemie to the Commonwealth (and so to the Church also) which hath not the same time bid battell vnto me.

Now I come to shew, that this mungrell Protestant, directly holdeth, that Christ descended in soule to hell, to deliuer some from thence, that were there, and so consequently maintaineth the Popish opinion of Limbus patrum: where they imagined the soules of the Patriarks to be till the comming of Christ thither.

1. Place.P. 9. of the former booke. edit. 1. and p. 1 . edit. 2. These are his owne words: S. Peter mentioneth sorrowes, which Christ loosed at his resurrection, which could not be in the sepulchre, where his bodie lay dead, and senselesse:P. 12. 1. b. edit. 1. and p. 14. edit. 2. and 2. b. p. 37. and in an other place: he affirmeth they were the sorrowes of hell which Christ loosed: out of which words this argument is pressed: The sorrowes of hell which Christ loosed, he loosed for himselfe, or for others ther. deteined: but not for himselfe: Ergo for others. To this he answeareth: 1. in graunting all this to be true, and yet it will not follow that the Fathers were deliuered out of Lambus:2. b. p. 37. vnlesse by bell, you vnderstand Limbus patrum, and the persons there deteined the Patriarks, then you will fall into the same ditch your selfe, &c.

Contra. 1. It followeth well, if the conclusion be graunted, that Christ loosed the sorrowes of bell for others: for either they must be the Fathers which were deliuered out of Limbus, which the Papists make a member of hell: or els he falleth into a worse heresie, that some of the damned deteined in hell, were thence deliuered. 2. Is he so blind and absurd, that he seeth not how this conclusion is enforced against him, and not out of the Replyers iudgement: doth the opponents conclusion force the disputer, I pray you, or the answearer: the conclusion is, Ergo be deliuered the Fathers out of Limbas: doth he inferre this to confirme his owne opinion, or to confute yours? The Replyer therefore will keepe himselfe well enough out of the ditch, while he himselfe sticketh fast in the mire.

Ans. 2. He denieth the assumption, affirming with Augustine,Epist. 99. that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell for himselfe.

Contra. 1. In deede one of Augustines expositions in that place is, that Christ may be said to haue loosed the sorrowes of hell for himselfe, quemadmodum solvi possunt laquei venantium, &c. as the snares of hunters may be loosed, least they should hold, not because they did hold: but this exposition can not serue his turne: for he saith, these sorrowes were loosed at Christs resurrection: they were not then loosed before, till then: so it followeth that Christ was in them: which Augustine there denieth; neque coperat in eis esse tanquam in vinoulis: he beganne not at all to be in those sorrowes, as in bandes. 2. Againe, he saith, these sorrowes were not in the graue, because the bodie was senslesse, and so felt them not: therefore by the same reason, those sorrowes were in hell, because Christ soule was full of sense, and consequently felt them. Thus, will hee, 〈◊〉 hee, either hee must confesse, that some other were deliuered out of the sorrowes of hell by Christs descending thither, or that he himselfe felt the sorrowes of hell.

2. The second place that encreaseth this suspition is, because he striueth mightily,1. b. p. 36. 1. edit. that we must read, 1. Pet. 3. 19. the spirits, which were in prison, not which are: whereupon it followeth,2. b. p. 39. that he thinketh, some were in the prison of hell, but are not, or els he striueth about words.

Ans. It followeth not, because I say it should be translaeted, (which were) &c. not, (which are) that they therefore were in hell, but are not: no more then it followeth, the Angels were in heauen at Christs as ension, but are not.2. b. p. 39.

Contr. 1. Hee omitteth the other part of the disiun tion, that either that must follow, or els he striueth about words. 2. The instance of the Angels therefore is impertinent: for the Replyer doth not reason thus; they were in hell, Ergo they are not: but thus, either they were in hell, and are not, or else he striueth for words. 3. Yet this cō tending about the reading of were for are, giueth strong suspicion, that hee so thinketh, that some were in hell, and are not; because his great Master; vpon the aduantage of that word,Bellar. lib. 4. de Christ. anim. cap. 13. inferreth the same conclusion, thus writing: All the Latines, & Greekes, whom we haue cited, expound (were) not (are;) because they will haue them deliuered out of hell by Christ but it could not bee said truely of those spirits in the time of Peter, that they were then in the prison.

3. The third place is this: In that Christ personally descended into hell, it doth more amplifie and set forth his goodnesse toward mank •• de,1. b. p. 52. 1. edit. p. 55. 2. edit. &c. for so much, as the more vile, and loath some the dungeon is, the greater is the loue of the Prince,2. b. p. 40. who to enfranchise and set at libertie the captiues there enthralled, dis •• ineth not to enter into it, in his owne person.

Hence it is inferred, that these captiues in hell, which were enfranchised by Christ descending thither, could be no other, then the fathers in Limbo patrum: for out of the nethermost hell of the damned, none can be deliuered.

Ans. 1. The argument is denied, Christ went to set at libertie captiues in hell: Ergo, the fathers in Limbo.

Cont. The argument standeth thus; the captiues in hel set at liberty, were either in Limbo, or in the nethermost hell.

But they were not in the nethermost hell, for thence none can be deliuered.

Ergo: the captiues in hell set at liberty, were those in Limbo.

The reason cannot be denied, beeing a true syllogisme: the Replyer is not then a 〈◊〉 in making such reasons: but the Confuter a brables in denying them.

Ans. 2. You must first prooue that the Fathers were in Limbo patrum and that hell, the place of eternall captiuity was all one with it, which yet your selfe affirme, is no part of hell: and therefore I inferre it is no place of thraldome.

Cont. 1. Now this ignorant Confuter sheweth himselfe a trifler indeed, and a silly Logician, to denie the conclusion, that the Fathers were not in Limbe, which is the conclusion of the former argument.

2. How absurd is this fellow, that seeing a manifest disiunction in the proposition, betweene Limbus patrum, and the nethermost hell; yet saith, it must be prooued that they are all one.

3. The Replyer in his owne opinion taketh Limbus, to be neither a part of hell nor any where else; but disputeth ex concessis, according to their conceit, that so imagine. But this trifling Confuter is caught in his owne wordes; for in confessing that Limbus is no place of thraldome, he granteth, that such a Limbus there is, but not a place of that qualitie: for according to his owne rule, the forme must first be granted, (namely, that there is a Limbus) before you can dispute of the latter: whether it be a place of thraldome,2. b. p. 3. or not; and thus to giue him his owne words againe you whip your selfe with your owne scourge, whose lashes if you feel not. I say you are very senslesse: and to vse Tullies words,Secund. Philip. haec te si vllam partem habes sensus laceret, haec cruētat oratio: this saying, if you haue any part of sense, tareth and woundeth you.

Answ. 3. But the Confuter not insisting vpon any of these answers, which are very simple; findeth our another: that these captiues, enfranchised by Christ, was all mankind, which by Ad •• s sinne were made guilty of eternall death, and so made his captiues, that had power ouer death, that is the diuell, vnder whom wee were held in most slauish thraldome, &c. vntill such time, as it pleased our most gratious king to enfranchise vs.2. b. p. 143. 2. b. p. 143.

Cont. 1. This answer is not to the purpose, for the question out of his former words obiected, is not of captiues to hell and the diuell, but of captiues in hell. 2. b. p. 40. and there detained. p. 37. and enthralled there; to enfranchise whom our prince descended thither. p. 40. We were indeede all captiues by sinne to the diuell, subiect to death, hell, & damnation, but not captiues and enthralled in hell; this is but a simple euasion.

2. Our deliuerance and enfranchising was procured & purchased by the death of Christ,The Coufuters inconstancy & vncertaintie. as the Apostle saith, that he might destroy through death, him that had power ouer death, that is the diuell, and that he might deliuer, &c. for that ende therefore Christ needed not to descend to hell.

3. See how inconstant this new doginatist is: one while he saith, that Christ descended to hell, that the Redemption of mankind now performed, might bee manifested euen vnto the dead. 2. b. p. 72. sometime, to denounce retention in sinne to the obstinate: and so consequently, in euerlasting death and damnation; for so hee expoundeth that preaching to the spirits in Peter: 2. b. p. 77. And now it was, as hee saith, to enfranchise, and set at libertie. And thus hee is one of those, of whome the Apostle speaketh,1. Timoth. 1. 7. They would be Doctors of the Law, and yet vnder stād not what they speake, nor whereof they affirme. I may apply against him the Orators words, quam miserum est id negare non posse, quod 〈◊〉 est conf er : how miserable a thing is it, Philipp. 2. not to be able to deny that, which it is a •• rame to confesse. He is ashamed to confesse he holdeth Limbus patrum, and yet beeing pressed with his owne words, he can not denie it.

4. Pla. What honour is greater then his, who entreth by force into his enemies pallace, 〈◊〉 him of his power, disfurnisheth him of his treasure;Lib. 3. p. 5. and returneth victorious, &c.In lib. 5. ep. ad. Rom. cap. 6. and what he meaneth by his treasure, hee referreth vs to a place of Origen, where he saith thus; hic alligato forti, &c. the strong man beeing here bound vpon the crosse, hee went forward into his house, into the house of death, into hell, and tooke thence his goods, that is, the soules, which he held.

5. Pla. Ambrose is cited in these words, lib. 3. p. 22. beeing free among the dead loosing the power of death, he gaue release to those which were in 〈◊〉 and what he meaneth hereby, Lib. de incarnat. Domin. sacram. c. 5. the words following shew, (omitted by him) hee shed the light of life vpon those which were placed in hell, &c.

6. Pla. 3. b. p. 72. He saith that Christ euangelized, or deliuered the glad tidings of the gospel to the dead: but to whom else could the preaching of the Gospel be glad tidings, but to those, which had comfort and deliuerance by it? And so he must be driuen to say with his great friend,Bellarm. l. 4. de Christ. anim. . 13. Pradicationem Christi, &c. that the preaching of Christ in hell, was only for the annuntiation of that great ioy (of their deliuerance) to the godly soules.

7. Pl. You must first prooue,3. b. p. 79. that they erred in holding that opinion of the deliuery of the Fathers: but if he himselfe hold that to bee an error, what needed any further proofe thereof?

8. Pl.3. b. p. 122. Hierom is cited, who should say, that Christ descended to hell, vt vinctos de carcere dimitteret: that hee might dismisse them which were bound, out of prison.

9. Pl. Likewise,3. b. p. 123. Cyril is brought in, speaking to the same purpose: that Christ appeared to the spirits in hell, and said to those which were in bonds, come forth, To what purpose should he alleadge these testimonies, if he consented not with them herein? for men doe not vse to produce witnesses against themselues.

10. Pl. He confesseth Limbus patrum, but denieth it to be any part of hell: to let passe (saith hee) your falshood, (beeing the falsarie himselfe) and absurditie, 3. b. p. 142. in confounding (Limbus patrum) with locus damnatorum, the one being no part of hell, as your selfe euery where preach, But this is his owne preaching or rather prating for the Replyer in those places,Limb. 43. 44. speaketh onely of Abrahams bosome not a word of Limbus. If then, in his opinion, there was a Limbus patrum, then either the fathers were deliuered thence, or else they are in Limbe still; for heauen or paradise, I hope he will not take to be Limbus, which the masters of that tearme the Romanists, take for a prison and dungeon of darknes.

11. Pl. Cassiodorus is brought in thus witnessing for the deliuerie of the Fathers out of hell: 3. b. p. 144. Christ hauing bound the devill, brought out those prisoners which he held in captiuitie.

12. Hierome againe is thus alleadged: Christ descended not into the whale,3. b. p. 169. but into hell, to the ende, that those which were in hell, might be loosed from perpetuall bonds.

13. Augustine also is brought to the same purpose: I see no reason,3. b. p. 194. why we should beleeue, that our Sauiour came thither, but to saue some from the sorrowes and paines thereof.

14. So also Origene is produced: the onely begotten sonne (of God) descended into hell for the saluation of the world,3. b. p. 194. and thence brought backe againe the first man Adam.

15. For the enfranchising and setting at libertie the captiues in hell, he alleadgeth Ruffinus, referring vs onely in generall to his exposition of the Creede: in the which he directly affirmeth in these words, Redijt victor à mortuis, 1. b. p. 55. 2. edit. inferni spolia, &c. he returned a conquerour from the dead, and carying with him the spoile of hell, brought out those which were held of death. So it seemeth that therein he concurreth with Ruffinus, for the bringing out of some out of hell.

16. Whereas the Article of the descension was thus set downe in K. Edwards time, in the Synode held ann. 1552. As Christ died for vs, and was buried, so it is to be beleeued, that he descended into hell: for his bodie lay in the graue till the Resurrection, his spirit beeing sent forth from him, was with the spirits which were detained in prison, or in hell, and preached vnto them, as testifieth Peter: the last clause whereof was left out by the Reuerend Fathers of this Church in their Synode, ann. 1562. and so remaineth still. Now this man commeth, and would expound the meaning of that clause omitted:2. b. p. 4 . saying, that their application of those words of Peter vnto Christs descension into hell, is no other then all the auncient Fathers haue made on that place, as may appeare by holy Athanasius, &c. But Athanasius saith, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . he preached the Gospel or glad tidings to those which were in hell:D al. 4. de sanct. T •• it. so he vnderstandeth S. Peters 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . So likewise Iustinus and Ireneus say, descendit ad eos evangelizare salutem:D alog. cum T phon. he descended vnto them to evangelize, or bring the glad tidings of saluation,I ea. l. 3. c. 23. as they cite the Prophet Isai: wherefore, if he vnderstand it according to their exposition, he must hold, that saluation and deliuerance was preached by Christ to some in hell.

17. Place. The harrowing of hell, &c. if you will beleeue an old ploughman in your haruest,3. b. p. 110. is no such matter, as you take it for,Northbrokes confes . c. 4. fol. 11. but such as ought to be beleeued of all Christians, as containing a deepe mysterie: he would father his conceit vpon an other, that he expoundeth that phrase of the harrowing of ell, of the victorie obtained by Christs death ouer hell: not of his personall descending thither, as he oth. fauoureth it not: but indeede he cunningly hereby conueieth his owne opinion, as fit to be beleeued of all Christians.

18. His opinion is that Iob was in hell: for that place, Iob 17. 13. he readeth thus: hell shall be my house, and I shall make my bed in the darke. And further he addeth: for so much as Iob was a perfect figure of Christ, in many things, the word (bed) taken in the better part, doth very truely agree vnto him: 3. b. p. 153. because, though hell be a place of restlesse disquiet to the wicked, yet was it to him a place of quiet rest. In which words, beside that in right construction the whole sentence runneth vpon Iob, he beeing a figure of Christs beeing in hell, as he maketh him, must first be there himselfe. But to the hell of the damned he will not thrust him, where els was he then in Limbo?

19. But he doth not more apparantly discouer himselfe, then in these two places following: the first is, 3. b. p. 170. Vnto these I will also adde a propheticall saying,3. b. p. 1 0. (as it seemeth to me) which I finde reported out of two of the most famous Doctors among the auncient Hebrewes: . Hoc eo dosti. . R. Simeon a •• d Galatinum. (the latter Iewes shall kill their Messias, then shall his soule descend to hell, . b. 8. c. 21. where it shall abide three daies, that it may bring from thence all the soules of the Fathers, and of the Iust, and lead them with him into Paradise, and heauenly glorie:) If this be a propheticall saying, then it must haue his accomplishment; and so in his iudgement the soules of the Fathers and the iust men, were brought out of hell by Christs descending thither.

20. The other place is, 3. b. p. 174. The ende of this redeeming visitation he maketh to haue beene,3. b. p. 1 •• (the illumination of those, which sate in darknes, and in the shadow of death,) which words S. Damascene and Ruffinus applie to Christs descension in hell: And in truth the words of (visiting and redeeming) doe necessarily implie a freedome to men in captiuitie, which to denie to haue beene in hell, as you doe in your second assumption, is to derogate from the blessed death, and passion of Christ. Now my second assumption (as he calleth it) was, But Christ redeemed none in hell. This assumption, seeing he denieth, what els can be his opinion, but that Christ redeemed and deliuered some in hell by his descending thither? and therein agreeth with Damascene and Ruffinus.

I appeale now to all iudicious men and vnderstanding Readers, whether this counterfeit Confuter, be not apparantly conuinced to be an euident maintainer of Limbus Patrum: therefore how voide of all truth and modestie that speach is, 2. b. p. 5. who seeth not? there is no cause, nor colour of cause in the world (saith he) why you should accuse that mine answear, as any way enclining to that opinion: for what one word is there thorough the whole booke, which doth so much as insinuate any suspition thereof? But what neede this circumloquution of words, when the thing it selfe is apparant: according to that saying, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ; when the matter is conspicuous, the prolixitie of speech is superfluous. These places obiected doe giue such euidence of his opinion, that he can not with modestie denie it: Philippi . as the Orator saith, Respondebisne d haec, aut omnino hiscere audebis: can you answer any thing to this, or dare you once open your mouth? and so I say with Hierome:Apolog 3. cont. Ruffin. si non illud scripsisses, vtcun que de luto evaderes, If you had not thus written, &c. you might haue wrastled out of the mire.

But in defence of this his opinion, of the deliuering the Fathers out of Limbus, antiquity will bee alleadged: for this goeth for currant among the Fathers: whereunto I answere; That the auncient writers of the Church, in some things might bee ouerseene, and that this error might be both generall, and continue long also: as the Patriarkes long remained in that error of Bygamie, and Polygamie, and corrected it not. Augustine answered Hierome well, who hauing alleadged diuers places, said, Patere me errare cum talibus: Aug. ep. 19. suffer me to erre with such: quis est (saith he) qui se velit cum quolibet errare? who is there that would willingly erre with any? The Orator saith well, quae malum est haec ratio, semper optimis causis veteranorum nomen opponere, Philip. 10. &c. quos quidem libertatis adiutores complecti debetis, seruitutis authores sequi non debetis: What reason is this, alwaies in good causes to oppose the name of the auncients, whom you ought to embrace as helpers of your liberty, not to follow, as authors of your seruitude. The like may be said of the auncient Fathers, that we ought to follow them, when they stand for the truth, not to be lead by them, when they incline to error. And herein the intent of the Fathers is rather to be respected, then the content of their speech: their meaning was, that euen the Fathers of the olde Testament, though beeing at rest in Abrahams bosome, yet had an accession of ioy, the Redemption of mankind beeing accomplished by Christ: (like as the Saints now shall haue the like encrease of ioy at the resurrection, and consociation of their bodies with their soules) though they failed in the particular apprehension and application of this mysterie. And so I end this point, with that worthy saying also of the Orator,Philip . 9. Non exempla aierum quarenda sunt, sed consilium est eorum, à quo exempla nata sunt, explicandum: The examples of the Elders, are not (so much) to bee sought into, as their intent, and counsell, from the which the examples are sprung, is to be expounded.

Thus much for the matter of his booke in generall, now concerning the manner: First, he faileth in charitie, in confuting publikely, that which was written first priuatly; and bringing into open view to the world, that which was sent in secret to a gentleman: I speake of the originall occasion of his first booke, wherein, he beeing a Christian, saw not so much, as Tullie perceiued by the light of nature; who thus reprooueth Antonie for the very like, for making his letters publike, which he sent vnto him in priuat: Quis vnquam, qui paulum medo bonorum consuetudinem nosset, Philipp 2. literas ad se ab amico missas, offensione aliquâ interposita, in medium protulit? quid hoc est aliud, quam tollere è vita vitae societatem: quam multa ioca solent esse in Epistelis, quae prolata si sint, inep a videntur? quam multa seria, neque tamen divulgenda? Who euer, that was but euen a little acquainted with the custome of good men, brought forth letters sent to him from a friend, some offence comming betweene? what is this 〈◊〉 , but to take out of this life, the societie of the liuing? how many merriments vse to bee in letters, which seeme foolish, if they bee vttered? how many serious things, that are no waies to bee published?

Secondly, he faileth in modestie, in persecuting the Replyer with rayling speech: you shall finde fewe pages of his booke,Impu. 1. which are not pestred with the imputation of lying, forgerie, falsie e, heresie, blaspemie, atheisme, Machiauellisme, and such like. Thus hee bestirreth him as another Shimei, or Rabshekah: which I may well requite with round and smart speech, but will not with like railing: for as he saith,Cicer. Philip. 8. vehementer me agere fateor, i acunde nego: I confesse I deale earnestly, but not angerly: and I consider that it is much better, according to that saying, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : to heare euill, then to speake euill.

Thirdly, he forgetteth common honestie, in loading the Replyer with slaunders and vntruths;Imput. 2. 3. God forgiue him this wrong:Iohn 8. 44. he knoweth who is called the father of lies, & the accuser of the brethren: Apocal. 12. 10. farre be it from me to repay him in the like. I say with the Orator, Ego dabo operam, vt & pro me minimo cum fastidio respondeam, icer. contra Sallust. & in hunc minime mentitus esse videar: I will doe my indeauour, that I may both answer for my selfe, with the least irkesomnesse, and without lying of him.

Fourthly, his discretion might haue beene better, then euery where vntruely to obiect those things, whereof hee is guilty himselfe; as throughout this my defence appeareth, not remembring the saying of our blessed Sauiour: why seest thou the mote that is in thy brothers eie, Math 7. 3. and perceiuest not the beame that is in thine owne eie? And so Hierome saith, eg l. Monach. Perdit authoritatem docendi, cuius sermo opere destruitur, vt bene Tullius, caput artis est docere, quod facis: Hee looseth the authoritie of teaching, whose saying is controlled by his owne doing, as Tully saith, it is the chiefe thing in arte, to teach that which thou doest thy selfe.

Fiftly, his answere is insufficient; for neither doth hee cleare himselfe of the suspicion of beeing a fauourer of Limbus patrum: neither hath hee answered the arguments proposed by the Replyer,Limbom. p. 11. Ans. 1. 9. lines omitted: p. 37. argum. 3. 17. lines omitted: to obiect. 2. p. 40. 2. whole l aues omitted, from arg. 5. to arg. 9. p. 53. ob. 6. 20. lines omitted. omitting many of them of purpose, as I haue here obserued, as finding no colour o answere vnto them: leauing therefore, the argument of the booke as yet vnanswered, I onely haue collected 1 2. seuerall imputations, by him imposed vpon the Replyer; in euery of them, first setting downe the accusation, then th iustification, lastly, the recrimination: wherein, the Confuter is discouered to haue writtē neither diuine-like, scholler-like, nor Christian-like; so that the Prouerbe which Hierome vsed against Heluidius homely dispute is verefied vpon him, Camelum vidimus saltitantem, we haue seene a Camel dauncing.

Now one word I will adde more concerning my selfe, mine aduersarie, and to the indifferent Reader: As for my selfe, I had thought at the first to haue said nothing; nor to haue regarded vaine words; as the Preacher saith,Eccles 7. 23. Gine not thine heart to all the words that men speake: and Aristippus said well, when flying away from one that reuiled, beeing asked why he did so, made this answere, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : thou hast power to speake euill, and I not to heare: and that saying also of Demosthenes came vnto my minde, who when one rayled vpon him, answered; 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : I will not enter into that combate, where he that is conquered (indeed and in truth) is superiour (in words) to him that conquereth. But further considering with my selfe, that by his audacious & brauing speech, (if it went currant without checke) some might bee carried away; I thought it not amisse, though not very needfull, to frame him some answer: and here I say with Hier Hieron. August. tom. 2. Si in defensionē mei aliquid scripsero •• te culpa sit qu prouocasti, non in me, qui respond •• compulsus sum: If I write any thing in my •• erence, the fault is in you, that prouoked me, not in me which am compelled to answer.

And touching him, I haue small hope to reclaime the man to a peaceable mind, considering his insolent kind of writing, and his hawty spirit, who proudly refused to haue any conference with me, when his booke was offered to the Presse, though I earnestly desired it, (which he calleth in his Preface indirect dealing, for other can hee charge mee with none) beeing with childe, as it were, till this his mishapen and deformed monster came forth: so that I may say with the Orator,4. Philippie. Non est mihi cum eo hoste certamen, cum quo aliqua pacis conditio esse possit: I haue not to doe with such an enemie, as with whom there can be any condition of peace. And I may say with Diogenes, who admonishing a lewd man, beeing asked what he did, said, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : I doe wash a blacke-a-moore to make him white: yet I will not cease to aduise him, that if he haue any grace, he may returne to a better minde; that seeing he hath once done euill, hee may leaue off, and doe so no more. Seneca said well, Optima ciuilis belli defensio, obliuio: The best defence of ciuill discord, is to forget it. And Tullie said well, Liceat semel impune peccare: Philippie. 12. sit erranti medicina confessio: It may be born with, once to offend without punishment: let confession bee a medicine of error.Homil. 6. in Exod. And Origen also saith, Possibile est; vt si forte resipiscat, qui devoratus est, rursus possit evomi, sicut Ionas: it is possible, that he which is deuoured, if he repent, may be cast vp with Ionas: So he may vomit vp those bitter pilles againe, which he hath swallowed, if his stomake be not still sicke. But if he be auerse from wholesome counsell, and so shew himselfe vnworthie of peace, which is offered,Matth. 10. 13. it shall, as our Sauiour saith, returne to vs againe.

Now last of all to the Christian Readers I turne me in a word, not doubting of their godly equitie in comparing his calumniations, and my defence together, that I shall not need to say with Simonides the Musician, who thus answered to one that said e heard euill of him; 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : and when will you leaue to hurt my fame with your eares. But I say vnto them in Augustines words:Contra lit. Petilian. 3. 11. Obsecro vos deponet paulisper studia partium, & inter me & Petilianum cum aliqua aequitate indicate: I praey you lay aside a little all partialitie, and iudge betweene me, and mine (aduersarie) with equitie. And so I commend you all to the grace of God, who in his mercie graunt, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . that we may follow the truth in loue: And as many as walke according to this rule, Eph. 4. 15. peace (shall be) vpon them, and mercie, Galat. 6. 16. and vpon the Israel of God.

Further aduertisments to the Reader, containing a briefe answer to a certaine Popish pamphlet, intituled, The first part of Protestants proofes, &c.

AFter that I had finished this answer, which was readie for the Presse in September last, but staied onely the Printers leisure, till he had dispatched an other worke vpon the first of Samuel, which in all reason was to be preferred; there came to mine hand a certaine Popish pamphlet, intituled, The first part of Protestants proofes for Catholike religion and Recusancie: wherein I found, that among other late writers of our Church, the author of that pamphlet had abused and traduced me, and some of my writings: and had made speciall vse of this Aduersaries testimonie against me: I will therefore briefly take a suruey of his fraudulent and corrupt dealing herein, that by the euill measure which he hath offered vnto mee, it may appeare how he hath handled others.

In this Romanists spitefull collections, three things I obserue, absurditie, falsitie, impertinencie: as the cheife pillers and proppes of his rude and ragged building.

First his absurditie herein appeareth, that he alleadgeth this Cauillous Accusers testimonie, more then twentie seuerall times against me: as p. 5, 6. & most of all, p. 35. that I condemne all the ancient Fathers for dreamers: that I condemne all learned & godly Divines: that I falsly corrupt, translate, iniuriously handle, abuse the Fathers: that I straungely pervert, belie, depraue, abuse the Scriptures: and all this he taketh for truth vpon an aduersarie, and euill willers report. All which slaunderous accusations are, I trust, sufficiently answered in this defense, vnto the which, the Table annexed in the ende of the booke, may direct the Reader, that desireth further to be satisfied. He might haue thought of the common saying, Euill will neuer said true: and if that vsual by-word sound to harsh in his eares, aske my fellow, if I be a theefe: yet I may vse Hieromes words, 〈…〉 . 3. possem credere, si vnus assereret, nunc aut duo mentiuntur, aut omnes: if one (honest man) said it, I could beleeue it, but now either both lie, or all: as wel he that receiueth a false report and carieth it, as he that first coined it, is counted a gloser.

His falsitie he bewraieth, in misreporting, and peruerting diuers places by him produced: as that I call the rules and principles of Religion, which his Maiestie approoueth, a foolish conceit, and imagination, p. 6. quoting Eccles. triumph. p. 40. and again p. 31. he harpeth vpon the same harsh string, that I call the Kings sentence, that (the Romane Church is our mother Church) a foolish conceit, and imagination: whereas I affirme no such thing, see mine answer, p. 17. of this booke. p. 10. he saith, I speak of his Maiesties mother, applying that saying of one to Augustines mother, the child of such prayers and teares can not possibly fall away: pref. to Antilog. whereas I speake onely of his Maiesties prayers and teares, making no mention at all of his mother. So, p. 21. he chargeth me to say, that all scriptures haue beene doubted of by one Church or other, Synops. p. 2. in which place, no such thing is affirmed, but onely diuers heretiks are rehearsed, by whom one or other, most of the Scriptures haue beene doubted of: p. 27. that I should say, that Vigilantius was condemned of heresie, for denying Reliques to bee reuerenced: Antilog. p. 13. whereas my words in that place, are these: Some of these, as they are imputed to Protestants, wee denie to be heresies at all; as that of Vigilantius, that Reliques are not to bee adored. Here no such thing is affirmed, that Vigilantius was herein condemned of heresie.

P. 30. that I account the Councel of Florence, a generall Councell: Synops. cont. 1. qu. 7. whereas I there vrge it onely against the Romanists, as in their opinion generall: for otherwise else-where I haue prooued, that indeed it could not be a generall Councell, the great Synode at Basil beeing at the same time assembled. Antilog. p. 61.

P. 31. that I call the primitiue Councel of Neocaesarea, Toletane, the first, and the sixt generall Councels, the papal Church, poperie, &c. Antil. p. 88. 89. whereas I onely shew in that place, that diuers errors decreed in all these Councels, (the first onely excepted, whereof I make no mention at all there) are allowed in the popish church: see the place. Such deprauing and wresting of sentences, sheweth a badde cause, and a worse mind in those that vse such beggerly shifts: the truth neede not to be so defended; and such false and deceitfull dealing, will fall of it selfe, without any confutation: as Hierome saith; non necesse habet convinci, quod sua statim professione (apud Hieron. blasphemum legitur. falsum) est: That need not to be conuinced, which at the first is discouered of falshood.

Thirdly, his impertinent allegations are these; p. 10. to prooue by our owne testimonies, that they which liue and die in the Romane Church may bee saued: he vrgeth these words of mine, that many renowned Kings and Queenes (which professed the Romane faith) are Saints in heauen. Antilog. p. 144. as if he should reason thus; many ignorantly misled in those daies of darkenesse, yet holding the foundation, might through Gods mercy be saued: therefore they which now wilfully resist the truth in the Romane Church, in these daies of knowledge, and erring in some fundamentall points, may be also saued.

P. 24. to prooue by our confession, that there is no true, lawfull, and iudiciall exposition of Scripture among the Protestants, hee presseth these words; that the reformation of religion, belongeth to the iudgement and redresse of the Prince: and yet he is not priuiledged from error. Antilog. p. 120. The argument followeth not; for we neither referre the exposition of Scripture vnto the Prince, nor hang religion absolutely vpon his iudgement, but according to the word: and wee interpret Scripture by Scripture, which is the most lawfull, sure, and certaine way of expounding.

P. 30. propounding to himselfe to prooue by Protestants writings, that the testimonie of the auncient Fathers, is for the doctrine of the Church of Rome; he alleadgeth this sentenee of mine, quite contrary: Antilog. p. 263. the same faith and religion, which I defend, is taught and confirmed in the more substantiall points, by the Historians, Gouncels, Fathers, that liued within fiue or sixe hundred years after Christ. Who but this lawlesse disputer would inferre hereupon, that euen by the Protestants own testimonie, the Fathers and Councels make for the Romish religion?

Thus absurdly, falsely, & impertinently, this Popes penne-man wresteth and depraueth my writings; and the like measure he offereth to the rest: whose chiefe strength lieth in the weapons of a false brother at home. And such is the fruite that commeth of these domesticall contentions, that thereby we put a sword into the aduersaries hand: whereas I could haue wished rather, that al these vnnecessarie brabbles at home had beene staied,2. Sam. 1. 2 . according to that saying of Dauid, Tell it not in Gath, nor publish it in the streets of Askelon, lest the daughters of the Philistims reioyce: for by these vnbrotherly dissentions, we giue occasions to the enemies of God to reioyce, & mispend our time, which might more profitably be imployed. And as for mine owne part, I say with Hierome; Opto, sifieri potest, Hierom. aduers. L ciferian. & si aduersarij siverint, commentarios potius scripturarum, quam Demosthenis & Tullij s ribere: I wish, if it may bee, and if mine enemies would permit, to write rather commentaries of Scripture (which course I am now entred into) then Demosthenes or Tullies Philippices. And as for any thing, which mine aduersaries at home or abroad can obiect, I passe not much, but comfort my selfe in that saying of the Prophet;Mi ah. 7 8. Reioyce not against me, O mine enemie, though I fall, I shall arise, when I shall sit in darkenesse, the Lord shall bee a light vnto me.

ERRATA.

In the Preface, p. 13. l. 17. read divulganda, for divulgenda. p. 21. l. 4. r. Erasmus Sarcerius, for Erasmus, Sarcerius. p. 26. l. 13. r. denieth not, f. deemeth not. p. 27. l. 8. r. in as many syllables. p. 30. l. last. r. so much, f. so must. p. 32. l. 10. in domo sua. p. 33. l. 18. r. practicall knowledge, for practised, &c. p. 34. l. 33. r. nakednes, f. wickednes. p. 45. in the marg. r. insertum Chalced. f. infestum. ibid. l. 23. paid tenne, p. 40. l. 7. r. to signifie hell, and the soule. p. 53. l. 11. r. challengeth. p. 74. l. 26. r. vesica. p. 80. l. 8. r. retalion. p. 89. l. 3. r. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . p. 91. l. 7. supplie in the margen: ad Oceanum. & l. 19. ad Rusticum. p. 102. l. 24. r. instance. p. 111. l. 29. r. obiecteth. p. 116. l. 26. r. keber, for avad, and, Psal. 88. 12. f. 88. 10. p. 129. r. left in bonds. p. 146. l. 26. r. proofe, f. praise. p. 147. l. 1. r. Marcella, f. Marcellus. p. 174. r. in the marg cont. Crescon.

A iust, true, and sober answer vnto the slaunderous accusations, vntrue surmises, and vncharitable rayling of RICHARD PARKES, writing himselfe master of Artes of Brasen-nose Colledge in Oxford, which he hath of late with a more brasen and bold face, vented vnto the world, against the author of Limbomastix. *⁎*

AGainst the vniust and false accusations of men, and their bitter and vnsauourie reuilings, the seruants of Christ are to oppose that heauenly encouragement of our blessed Sauiour: Math. 5. 11, 12. Blessed are ye when men reuile you, and persecute you, and speake all manner of euill against you for my sake, falsely: reioyce and be glad, for great is your reward in heauen.Lib. 1. offic. c. 5. Ambrose saith well, Ne quis aestimet plus ponderis esse in alieno convitio, quam in testimonio suo: let not any thinke, that there is more weight in an others obloquie, then in his owne testimonie. And, (as the same father well resembleth it) sicut milites Gedeon in hydrijs suis faces habentes non timuerunt hostes,lib. 1. de spir. c. 15. &c. Like as Gedeons souldiers hauing lampes burning in their pitchers feared not their enemies, so our bodies being as pitchers formed of clay, are void of feare, si gratia spirituali ignescant, if the grace of Gods spirit be kindled in them. Whereas then this rayling aduersarie hath raked together a dunghill of slaunderous vntruths, I will set against his calumniations, conscience; against his vaine surmises, truth; against his malice, charitie. I am before God and in my conscience cleare of these his malitious imputations, as shall appeare in this discouerie. Let him and others like minded, goe on if they will, in this their iniurious course, to their owne shame now, and griefe afterward, if they haue any grace: in the meane time the Replier will content himselfe, and resolue with Hierome,Hieron. ad Celantiam. Nos modo id agamus, vt male de nobis loqui sine mendacio nemo possit: let vs indeauour that no man can speake euill of vs, vnlesse he lie: for according to the wise saying of Plato, If a man haue done no such thing, for the which he is reuiled, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . let him take the reproach to be but as smoake; which will vanish away of it selfe.

Now at the first comming forth of this rayling Inuectiue, I somewhat paused with my selfe, as vncertaine, whether it were not better in silence altogether to passe ouer such friuolous and malitious cauills, which seemed to some not worthie of any answer: as Hierome staied a while from writing against Helvidius, vpon the same reason: Non quia difficile erat eum convincere, Hier. adv. Helv. sed ne respondendo dignus fieret, qui vinceretur: Not because it was hard to conuince him, but least in answearing, he might seeme worthie to be ouercome. Beside, I considered, that in some mens opinion a rayler could not handsomely be answered, but in his owne kinde:Prov. 26. 4. but therein the wise man giueth counsell, not to answer such according to their foolishnes, least we should be like them: and Ambrose saith, Si referas contumeliam, dicetur, ambo convitiati sunt, vter que condemnatur, Lib. 1. offic. c. 5. nemo absolvitur: If thou returne (the like) contumelie, it will be said, they both haue (equally) reuiled: each is condemned, neither is cleared: yet seeing the wise man saith againe, Answer a foole according to his foolishnes, least he be wise in his owne eyes: Prov. 36. 5. if in silence all those disgraces and contumelies should be passed ouer, which haue fallen out of his blacke and filthie penne, it might be both an occasion of fleshing & heartning to the Rayler, and to those which applaud him, of insulting. The Preacher saith, there is a time to keepe silence, Ecclesiast. 3. 7. and a time to speake: vpon the which words Ambrose well saith,1. Imputation. Si pro otioso verbo reddemus rationem, Offic. lib. 1 c. 3. videamus ne reddamus pro otioso silentio: if we shall render an account for an idle word, s e if we shall not also for slouthfull silence: therefore as Hierome also saith, Huc vsque silentium modestiae fuit, non malae conscientiae: Advers. Ruffin. hitherto my silence hath beene of modestie, not of an euill conscience. But now I will giue the onset vpon this raging, if not rauing Aduersarie.

The 1. imputation of rayling.
The Accusation.

FIrst, the Rayler chargeth the Replier with rayling: thus complaining: he rayleth on me without reason, calling me a secret Censor, a masking Mummer, a new Rabbine, a Limbist, a disgracer of the Gospel: pref. pag. 2. and againe: your foure cautions are nothing els but so many calumniations full of rayling without reason, &c. a secret Censor, a disgracer of the Gospel, a partaker with the wicked, a louer of Gods enemies, an aduersarie to Protestants, and a fighter against them with the weapons of Papists. 2. b. p. 48. and againe, although you thinke no tearmes disgracefull enough towards me. 2. testim. sect. 7. because the Replier had said, these are but ridiculous obiections: and yet further he saith, with what conscience or honestie, can you condemne me for a most shamelesse and impudent man. 3. b. p. 196.

The satisfaction.

1. Some of these tearmes the Replier vseth not, but the other imagineth: he calleth him not a disgracer of the Gospel, but onely saith thus, what came in his minde to ioyne with the common aduersarie, in disgracing the defence of the Gospel, by one vndertaken in Synopsis. Limbom. p. 3. the other words, a partaker with the wicked, a louer of Gods enemies, an aduersarie to Protestants, are the Raylers owne collections, not the Repliers direct applications: for he speaketh in that place in Hieromes wordes, and not his owne: neither doth he call him, a most shamelesse and impudent man: but onely writeth thus, with what face can the answearer affirme, &c. It seemeth his owne conscience condemned him, finding himselfe inwardly guiltie of all this, which he imagined outwardly to be imputed: as Ambrose well saith,Ambros. l. 3. offic. c. 4. Quod severius iudicium, quam domesticum, quo vnusquis que sibi est reus? what iudgement is more seuere, then the domesticall, wherein euery one is guiltie to himselfe?

2. The most of the titles and epithites are truly imposed, and therefore they containe no vniust calumniation, but a due castigation or reprehension: is not he a secret Censor, that censureth other mens priuate writings, and bringeth them to publike view? a maintainer of imbus I haue prooued him before in the Preface, and therefore a masking Mummer he is, that hideth his face, and ratleth his boxe full of counters, in stead of siluer and gold, winding in an errour and counterfeit opinion for sound doctrine. He therefore that speaketh the truth, reuileth not, as Hierome well saith,Hieron. oburgat Sabini n. vsing those words of the Apostle: inimicus factus sum tibi vera dicens? Am I become your enemie speaking the truth?

3. All this beeing vttered in generall, no person beeing named, nor discouered, not so much, as the man in the moone, sheweth that he doth but barke at his owne shadow: for a generall and indefinite reprehension is no defamation; as that Imperiall law saith, Verba generalia vt quis vitam reformet, God. lib. 2. tit. 12. leg. 19. non infamant: generall wordes that one should reforme his life, doe not defame. But what doe I tell him of Imperiall laws, whose element and trade reacheth no further, then to giue lawes to petites and schoole-boies.

The Recrimination.

Now this vntrue imputation of rayling, is iustly returned vpon his owne head, who for his gracelesse facilitie that waies, is worthie to carrie the bell, of all scurrilous writers (not the Popish Iudasites and Seminarie sectaries excepted) that haue abused their penne that way. Thus therefore he barketh and belcheth out his stinking and indigested stuffe.

1. Like a madde dogge he snatcheth. pref. p. 5. 2. I cannot but condemne your prauitie in so wilfull peruerting it, euen contrarie to your owne conscience. 2. b. p. 4. 3. You adde malice to falshood. p. 5. 4. It argueth meere malice without matter. p. 6. 5. His malecontented impatience. p. 17. 6. he counteth the author of Limbomastix, both a foole, p. 27. and a goose. p. 28. 7. rather Ismaelites in faction, then Israelits in faith. p. 18. 8. in this Calender of Saint-seeming Nocents Limbomastix hath canonized himselfe. p. 19. 9. he vseth the like parasiticall preoccupation to currie fauour. p. 24. 10. there is neither truth nor modesty in your words. p. 34 11. he calleth him a lier: applying these words, mendax raro memor. p. 38. that he properly belieth him. 3. b. 127. 12. no Sophister but your selfe. p. 39. 13. it is but the suggestion of malice. p. 40. 14. prooueth nothing els but presumptuous boldnes. p. 44. 15. which for want of true knowledge, you reiect with malice. p. 47. 16. past the bounds of modestie. p. 53. 17. he obiecteth also impudencie. ibid. 18. where veritie is banished, modestie is expulsed. p. 56. 19. as in pretending charity, you should defame all Christianitie. p. 64. 20. he obiecteth vnchristian, if not Machivellian policie. p. 79. 21. Thus Machivellian dissimulation is Christian policie with you. p. 82. 22. it is little better then infidelitie. p. 86. Falshood attended with contradiction and absurditie. p. 3. 23. as you beganne with falshoode you meane to continue. p. 32. 24. it is both false and calumnious. p. 87. 25. you would falsly insinuate. ibid. 26. doth notably discouer his hypocrisie. p. 19. 27. letting hypocrisie passe this once, as if it were humilitie. p. 27. 28. you most hypocritically pretend. p. 44. 29. As you beganne your preface with falshood and malice. p. 105. 30. to the ende neither falshood should want absurditie, nor follie contrarietie. p. 126. 31. you beginne with falshood and slaunder. p. 139. 32. fraude and falshoode are euery where your strongest forts. p. 143. 33. your falshood mixt with absurditie. p. 144. 34. falsification is growne into such an habite with you. p. 162. 35. falshood is your surest fortresse. p. 186. 36. as you delight in contrarietie, so it best pleaseth you to adde falsitie to it. p. 195. 37. fallacie mixed with falshood. p. 197. 38. would God you would once leaue your falshood. 1. test. s. 17. p. 2. 39. from these you proceede to the shamefull falsification, &c. 1. test. sect. 23. p. 2. 40. you seeke after nothing but falshood. 3. test. s. 7. p. 1. 41. your prophane contentions. p. 103. 42. diabolicall presumption. ibid. 43. hauing neuer a good thought of your owne. 2. b. 106 44. what is this els but to roote out Christianitie, and plant infidelitie. 2. b. 146. 45. it shewes your spitefulnes. p. 155. 46. it is your owne follie. ibid. 47. which shewes you neither regard rules of diuinitie, nor yet of humanitie. p. 158. 48. as you shew neither veritie nor modestie, so you incurre thereby absurditie and impietie. p. 161. 49. your malice shall not extinguish my charitie. p. 165. 50. the Euangelists are sufficient witnesses to conuince your incredulitie. p. 179. 51. which insolent vanitie. p. 175. 52. what peruersenes or rather impiety is it. 2. test. s. 9. p. 4. 53. if malice had not miscaried you. 2. test. s. 14. p. 3. 54. what arrogant presumption is this. 2. test. s. 17. p. 1. 55. thus imperiously, if not saucily. ibid. thus he raileth and rageth, because the original is preferred. 56. with what conscience or honestie. 3. test. sect. 16. p. 5. 57. your selfe in that respect worse then the Arrians themselues. p. 178. 58. you still feede your Reader with falshood in stead of truth. p. 179. 59. you doe exceede the limits of all modestie & shamefastnes. p. 181. 60. if your darknes will receiue it. p. 193. 61. you prooue your selfe to be a various impostor. 1. test. sect. 17. p. 2. 62. what dishonest dealing is this in you. 1. test. s. 23. p. 2. 63. you had no colour of belying me. 2. test. s. 1. p. 3. 64. while you bolster out impietie with blasphemie. 1. test. s. 3. p. 2. 65. such malepart saucines. 1. test. s. 14. p. 3. 66. whosoeuer denieth the article, (he meaneth, in his sense) is an Atheist. 3. test. s. 6. p. 3. 67. And to fill vp the measure of this his poisoned cuppe of reuiling words, he chargeth him with grosse errour, or rather heresie directly tending to Atheisme. pref. to the first booke.

Thus this vncharitable fellow goeth on in his pitifull rage, laying on load, charging the Replier, with follie, hypocrisie, falshood, infidelitie, impudencie, Machiavellisme, Atheisme, heresie: who in the sight of God, and of all good Christians, will by Gods grace approoue himselfe as farre from the imputation of these, as the Rayler wil shew himselfe (if he goe on in this course) from the reputation of an honest man. Little did he remember, when he suffered his penne thus to rage, that all raylers by the sentence of the Apostle,1. Cor. 6. 10. are excluded out of Gods inheritāce: what blindnes is this, to obiect rayling to an other, giuing him selfe tenne words of reproach for one, and that not reproachfull neither. Hieromes complaint is here most iust: Quid possumus facere, Hieron. advers. Ruffin. si vnusquisque iuste putat se facere, quod facit, & videtur sibi remorderi potius, quam mordere: what should we doe, if euery man thinketh he well doeth, that which he doth, and that he himselfe is bitten, when he biteth others.

But the Replier for his part grieueth not to heare this intemperate mate, thus to reuile the liuing: for, as Hierome saith, Scillaeos canes obdurata aure transibo: I will passe by the Scillean dogges, Hier. ad Celant. and stoppe mine eares: seeing that he spareth not the dead, but emptieth his vncleane stomacke, casting vp gall and all by his vnbridled tongue vpon them. Of reuerend Beza, he thus vnreuerently speaketh: All the figge leaues you can filch, R. Parkes his rayling vpon the dead. will not couer his nakednes herein. 2. testim. sect. 17. p. 3. of that learned man D. Fulke, he is not ashamed to say, that he was in such an error, as could not be defended without blasphemie. 3. testim. sect. 17. p. 2. graue M. Gilbie is charged with swelling pride, and seducing hypocrisie. 2. b. p. 9. Carlile, a Protestant, neither Papist, nor heretike, is burdened with hereticall dealing in deprauing Scripture. 1. testim. sect. 1. p. 2. But among all other, that are at rest in the Lord, this wretched man rageth not more against any, then against worthie Doctor Reynolds: D. Reynolds reuiled after his death. whome he is not ignorant to be the author of the obiections, which he taketh vpon him to confute in the first booke: for he in two seuerall places, 2. b. p. 6. and p. 76. nameth him in the Margen. In this manner doth he handle that learned Defender of the truth against the Popish Synagogue: calling his fact, in so obiecting and impugning, prophane and irreligious: epist. dedicat. p. 3. and the effect thereof heathenish & pernicious. ibid. their dissenting in this question of the locall discension, he blasphemously tearmeth, hereticall and sacrilegious. ib d. p. 6. he saith further, whereby grace may happily worke in their hearts. epist. p. 11. as though that godly man, had beene voide of grace: he in the same place further chargeth him, frowardly to haue excluded the truth: he includeth him, among the prophane Anaxagorists of this age. pref. p. 2. one of the iuuenters of Noueltie, and Masters of error. ibid. he dealeth with him, as an aduersarie of the truth. ibid. p. 3. he affirmeth, that he standes peremptorily vpon the deniall of this article. ibid. he meaneth an article of the faith: as thoroughout the whole booke is euident. And further he he saith: both which foule imperfections you grossely discouer, &c. 1. b. p. 3. it argueth more cunning and subtilty, then simple and plaine dealing. p. 4. vnlesse perhaps you thinke, the confession of the truth to be an indignitie vnto you: who, as it seemeth, haue vowed the contrarie in this question. p. 7. in the same place he chargeth him, with grosse absurditie, or rather impietie: with prophane speeches. p. 18. with grosse error ioyned with impietie: he calleth him captious sophister. p. 24. he challengeth him, that he wresteth the Scriptures, and maketh the spirit of veritie, the spirit of error and absurditie. p. 26. you deale, as you did in the former, that is corruptly, and so falsely in both. p. 33. this Nemesis still pursueth falshood. 33. resting in hope, that where the loue of veritie can not draw you, the very loathsomnes of absurditie will driue you to renounce it. p. 43. And thus he persecuteth the blessed memorie of that renowned Diuine in his former booke: which although it was first printed, while that worthie man was yet liuing, and not knowne to be the author of those obiections; yet it is euident, that he, whome this Reviler and false accuser of his brethren now knoweth to haue first written those obiections, had then finished his daies in peace, before this filthie sinke and chanell was the second time let goe, and this slaunderous Inuectiue reprinted. And no better dealeth he with him in the second booke: D. Reynolds in his opinion was none of the writers of our Church: for thus he writeth, I say and prooue that it is directed against no writer of our Church at all: 2. b. p. 7. l. 9. wheras he writeth directly against D. Reynolds. And this motion beeing made, that it had beene better priuately to haue conferred with him (that is, D. Reynolds) then publikely to haue censured him, this answer is made out of Ecclesiasticus: Aske no counsell of religion of him; who is without all religiō himselfe. 1. b. p. 74. but falsly noted 57. Againe, he saith, in this point (that is, of the locall discension) euery good Christian is fully satisfied. p. 76. So by his vncharitable censure, D. Reynolds was without all religion, and no good Christian.

Thus this good man is traduced by the Raylers vncharitable penne, as guiltie of prophane, irreligious, hereticall, sacrilegious opinions, of grossenes, absurditie, sophistrie, prophanenes, and what not: So that, to vse his owne phrase,1. b. p. 29. What could the greatest Seminarie or Iesuite haue spoken more to the discredit, or defamation of this worthie Confessour: whose memoriall shall be blessed, when the name of such as he is shall rott: according to the saying of the wise man in the Prouerbs.Prov. 10. 7. Nay, I verily thinke, the most grosse and rayling Romanist would haue beene ashamed, thus to haue reuiled the seruant of God: who blusheth not, and is not ashamed that such stuffe should come out in print: as Augustine saith, miror, si habet in corpore sanguinem, Epist. 164. qui ad haec verba non erubescit: I wonder, if he haue any blood in his bodie, that doth not blush at these words. I may say vnto him in Tullies words to Antonie: Philipp. 2. quam me pudet nequitiae tuae, cuius teipsum non pudet: how am I ashamed of your lewdnes, whereof you are not ashamed your selfe. To scourge good men liuing with the whip of the tongue, is iniurious, but to rage against the name and memorie of the righteous departed, is impious,Hieron. As l •• . and sacrilegious. Hierome saith well: prava dixisse de rectis, non facilis venia: to speake euill of the righteous, is not so easily pardoned. Plato resembleth such, as rage against the dead, vnto dogges, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ;Lib. 5. de 〈◊〉 which are angrie with the stones which are cast, not touching him that cast them: such are they, which vnchristianly, and currishly too (according to his owne phrase, 2. b. pag. 199.) barke against the dead, carping at their memorie and name, who themselues are without his reach. The Replyer therefore neede not to be grieued, that he is marked with such a blacke coale: seeing such reuerend men as M. Beza, D. Fulke, D. Reynolds can not goe vnbranded: where he may say with Cicero, Philipp. 2. In huius concilij societatē, tanquam in equum Tr ianum includi non recusabo: I will not refuse to be included in this companie, as in a Trojane horse. But in the meane time, while he would obscure others mens fame, he staineth his owne, and besprinkleth his owne face with that filthie dirt, which he casteth vpon others. Let him goe on still, if he will in his madde fittes, he will purchase thereby eternall infamie vnto himselfe: as the Orator againe saith,Philipp. 12. Pergit in me maledicta congerere, quasi vero ei pulcherrime priora processerint, quem ego inustum verissimis maledictorum notis, tradam memoriae hominum sempiternae: he proceedeth still to speake euill of me, as though he had sped so well in the former: whome branded with the true notes of disgrace, I will deliuer ouer to the euerlasting memorie of men.

The 2. imputation of slaunders.2. Imputation.
The accusation.

1. The Replyer is noted as a slaunderer, because he chargeth the Antagonist, to vnderstand directly by Christs death, hell. 2. b. p. 36.2. b. p. 36.

2. He calleth it a slaunder, that he is charged by the Replyer, to maintaine Limbus patrum. 2. b. p. 40.2. b. p. 40.

The satisfaction, or iustification.

1. THe slaunderer himselfe mistaketh the Replyers wordes, which are these; he directly by his death vnderstandeth hell: where this word his, should by the Compositor haue beene made this: which missing of a letter in the word this, is an ouersight of the Printer, as may be seene in other places of the ReplyersAs Hexapl. p. 217. l. 24. this chiefe fault, for his cheife fault: and, p. 356. l. 25. this Patriarchal dignitie, for his Patriarchal. So Synops. p. 978. l. 28. this soule, for, his soule. workes: the Printer therefore, setteth his death; the Author wrote, this death: neither of them hath Christs death, as he misreporteth: he is therefore the slaunderer himselfe.

2. Whether he be not without any slaunder or false imputation, directly a Limbist, it hath beene sufficiently prooued before in the preface.

The recrimination.

That eloquent declamer said well, Carere debet omni vitio, Cicer. respons. ad Salust. qui in alterum paratus est dicere: he should himselfe be voide of blame, that speaketh against an other: with what face then could the Accuser impute that to others, which he falleth into himselfe? and wracke himselfe vpon that rocke, which he imagineth others to runne against: for here followeth a rabble of his slaunderous accusations.

1. Limbomastix, is become Symbolomastix: that is, a scourger of the Creede. epist. dedic. p. 10.ep. ded. p. 10. you cunningly went about to casheere an article of the Creede. 2 b. p. 166.2. b. p. 166. you still labour to discreede this Article of our faith. 3. b. p. 3. 179.3. b. p. 179. you still labour not onely to discredit it, but to discreede it also. 3. b. p. 198.3. b. p. 198. And in diuers other places he laieth this grieuous imputation: whereas the Replyer directly saith, Who denieth the article of Christs discension? 3. b. p. 197.

2. That he conueyeth an appeale frō his Maiestie, and the Clergie, vnto the Parlament: epist. p. 10.epist. p. 10. whereas the Epistle Dedicatorie to the Parlament house, is directly intituled to the Lords spirituall and temporall.

3. That in Synopsis he striketh at some maine points of faith, shaking the foundation it selfe, and calling in question heauen and hell, the diuinitie and humanitie: yea, the very soule and saluation of Christ himselfe. epist. p. 6.epist. p. 6. all which are meere slaunders: the author of Synopsis holdeth all these points more soundly, then this slaunderous carper: neither shal he be able to fasten any such imputation vpon that booke, and therefore he glaunceth ouer with this generall fiction, descending to no particular.

4. That the Replyer holdeth this blasphemous paradox, that Christ our Sauiour suffered in his sacred soule, the hellish horror and paines of the damned. epist. p. 10.epist. p. 10. whereas, he misliketh this phrase of speech, that Christ suffered the paines of the damned, and wisheth it to be forborne. Synops. p. 974. err. 7.

5. That he maintaineth, impious and hereticall paradoxes: pref. p. 2.pref. p. 2. seeketh to bring in a new Puritane heresie. p. 43.2. b. p. 43. that neither Rhemist nor Romanist could lightly haue more disgraced the discipline and doctrine of the Church. epist. dedic. p. 10. how falsly he hath herein slaundered the Replyer, his writings alreadie extant can giue sufficient testimonie both to this age present, and to posteritie: that he is as farre from all heresie, and popish doctrine, as this Reviler is from a sober and modest man.

6. That he falleth to scourging the guides and gouernors of the Church: 2. b. p. 2.2. b. p. 2. transformeth the order thereof into an Anarchie: p. 29.p. 29. that he reiecteth Ecclesiasticall authoritie,2. b. p. 110. euer repining at that gouernment whereby you should be ruled. p. 110. But what a reuerent opinion the Replyer hath of the calling of Bishops, it appeareth both by his iudgement deliuered, Synops. p. 241. l. 3. wherein he confesseth in the calling of Bishops in the reformed Churches, (such as the Church of England is) somewhat no doubt to be diuine and Apostolicall: and Antilog. pref. to the King, p. 9. where he esteemeth the calling it selfe of Bishops, as one of the profitable parts of the Church. As also by his practise, who hath dedicated diuerse bookes vnto certaine reuerend Bishops and Prelates: more, I thinke, then any one writer of the Church in this age hath done beside: which he hath done onely of dutie and loue toward them, not beeing mooued thereunto by any present fruition, or future hope, of any preferment either receiued at their hands, or expected.

7. As for personall inueighing against the writers of our Church, there is none that hath more peremptorily directed his penne, or more presumptuously emploied his paines, then your selfe. 2. b. p. 7.2. b. p. 7. There is none among all the impugners of the locall discent of Christs soule to hell, who hath in more disgracefull manner reproached some of the best Preachers and writers of this English Church, then you haue done. 2. b. p. 81.2. b. p. 81. he falsly and slaunderously condemneth the doctrine and teachers of the Church, for Popish, vnsound, corrupt, erroneous, yea hereticall. 2. b. p. 29.2. b. p. 29. you affirme some Popish bookes to haue beene written by Protestants. 2. b. p. 54.2. b. p. 54. All these are vncharitable slaunders: 1. for he can not name one writer of the Church, that the Replyer hath personally inueighed or directed his penne against. 2. of like truth is it, that he hath vsed reproachfull tearmes against some of the best preachers: what are those reproachfull words, where, and when vttered? 3. it is as true, that he chargeth the doctrine and teachers of the Church, with hereticall opinions, and writing of Popish books: he saith that some bookes (set forth) doe maintaine doctrine too much declining to Poperie, which can not be denied of any of sound iudgement: if these and the like positions, that the Scriptures alone are not compleate to euerlasting felicitie: that mans will naturally is apt without grace to beleeue: that mens naturall workes are acceptable vnto God: that there are workes of supererogation: that to be preserued from all sinne in this life, is not vnpossible: and such like, as they are noted els where, Eccles. triumph. p. 91. be not doctrines too much declining to Poperie: then it must be confessed the Replyer is ouerseene, The Confuter holdeth positions contrarie to the articles of religion established. if they be, then the wrongfull Accuser is prooued a slaunderer. Doth he count these the doctrines of the Church, which are directly opposite to the articles of religion established? which thus affirme, that the holy Scripture containeth all things necessarie to saluation: artic. 6. that man of his owne naturall strength, can not turne and prepare himselfe to faith: artic. 10. that workes done before the grace of Christ, are not pleasant to God: artic. 13. workes of supererogation, can not be taught without arrogancie and impietie: artic. 14. they are to be cōdemned, which say they can no more sunne, as long as they liue here. artic. 16. The Slaunderer then himselfe, and his adherents, are those that condemne the doctrine of the Church.

8. He chargeth the Replyer, with heresie tending to Atheisme: pref. p. 5.pref. p. 5. it is to be feared least in time you become as bad members to the Church of England, as they, that is, the Anabaptists, were to the Church of Germanie. 2. b. p. 8.2. b. p. 8. there were certaine omnifidians, &c. who held the like opinion, as you doe, of which number was one Appelles, who affirmed, that it was needelesse to discusse the particulars of faith. 2. b. p. 90.2. b. p. 90. he calleth his exposition of some places of Scripture (which he tearmeth misconstruction) hereticall. 2. b. p. 91. blasphemous, p. 92.2. b. p. 91. 92 These imputations of heresie, blasphemie, Anabaptisme, are most vile and pestilent slanders: so is this, that the Replyer is burthened, to hold an implicite faith, p. 91. and that it is needelesse to discusse the particulars of faith: whereas he directly holdeth the contrarie, condemning els where the Popish implicite, and simple faith:S nops. p. 874. he onely wisheth, that seeing we all hold the foundation, the peace of the Church be not broken, in contending about the manner of Christs discension. Limbom. p. 5.

9. Slaunder. That he bitterly exclaimeth against the whole state of the Church: 1. b. p. 10.1. b. p. 10. reuiueth clamorous inuectiues: their heads plotting, and their hands practising Babylonian warres: they can not auoide the name of dissemblers in the Church of England, nor yet disturbers of it. p. 18.1. b. p. 18. his petition and complaint, are in plaine English nothing els but a bitter inuectiue against the doctrine and discipline of the Church, glossed with flatterie, and gilded with hypocrisie. 2. b. p. 19.2. b. p. 19. that they thought his Maiestie would erect the Genevian Consistorie, or Scottish Presbyterie, p. 23.p. 23. and change the state of religion. ibid. the picture of a discontented, if not turbulent spirit. p. 29.p. 29. 31. he rebelleth against the Church. p. 31. those whome you call reuerend Fathers, you vouchsafe them no sonne-like obedience. p. 68.p. 68. All these are most vntruly obiected: 1. to complaine of some abuses of the Church, is not to exclaime against the Church: the late Canons and Constitutions of the Church doe shew, that many things had neede of amendment and reformation in the Church: 2. what reuerent opinion the Replyer hath of the Gouernours of the Church, is before shewed, slaund. 6. 3. how farre he is from a turbulent spirit, God he knoweth: and some of the greatest place in the Church can tell, how his courses haue tended to a pacification in the Church. A more vile slaunderous tongue, I think hath seldome beene heard to speake.

10. Slaund. The Kings most excellent Maiestie can not escape the Taint of his intemperate tongue: for whereas his grace saith, that he acknowledgeth the Romane Church to be our mother Church: it is (saith Limbomastix) a foolish conceit and imagination: he maketh him a very nouice in the faith. 2. b. p. 28.2. b. p. 28.

In these foule slaunders, he doth bewray nothing else but (to vse his owne tearmes) falshood and malice. 1. Is it like that the Replyer had the least imagination to crosse his Maiesties speech, when as the booke, which the slaunderer quoteth,Eccles. triumph. was published ann. 1603. about the time of his Maiesties coronation in the moneth of Iulie, and the Kings oration followed aboue sixe moneths after,Anno 1603. in the moneth of March:Mart. 19. what an absurd collection is this? 2. But this slanderous obiecter doth his Maiestie the wrong, to suppose that he is contrarie to himselfe: for his Maiestie holdeth the Pope to be Antichrist, and to be the head of a false and hypocriticall Church:Meditat. in Revel. 20. par. 2. is he so shamelesse to imagine, that his Maiestie thinketh a false and hypocriticall Church to be our mother? it is cleare then, that the King in acknowledging the Romane Church to be our mother, meaneth not the Popish Church, as it now standeth: but that sometime while it stood in the integritie, it was our mother Church: that is, a principall and chiefe church, where the Patriarchall seat was of the Occidentall parts: for these are his Maiesties owne words, I acknowledge the Romane Church to be our mother Church, although defiled with some infirmities and corruptions, as the Iewes were, when they crucified Christ. The Church of Rome is no otherwise then our mother Church, then the Church of the Iewes was of our Sauiour Christ and the Apostles. 3. Neither yet is it in the place giuen in instance called a foolish conceit to say, that the Romane Church is our mother, (which in the Kings sense being admitted, yet as he blindly taketh it, will be denied) but that Rome should be the mother Church and nurserie of all the world: the Accuser then himselfe is found to be a falsifier, and slaunderer. 4. Yea, it is his owne intemperate tongue, the taint whereof his Maiestie can not escape: whereas he calleth diuers points of doctrine true and sound positions, 2. b. p. 20.2. b. p. 20. some of which are before set downe, slaund. 7. which his Maiestie in his iudgement condemneth: the King affirmeth, that all, which is necessarie to saluation, is contained in the Scripture: R. Parks opposeth himselfe in diuerspoints of doctrine to his Maiesties iudgment. that no man is able to keepe the law, or any part thereof: that we are saued by beleeuing, not by doing: that whatsoeuer is not of faith, is sinne: that we can not thinke any thing of our selues, and consequently that we are not apt of our selues to beleeue: the contrarie positions to all these, with others, this cauillous aduersarie calleth sound and true positions: as that the Scriptures of themselues are not compleat to saluation: that it is not impossible in this life to be preserued from all sinne, and so consequently to keepe the law: that our workes (and so not onely faith and beleeuing) are meanes to blot out sinne: that naturall workes are acceptable to God, euen such as are without faith: that mans will is apt to take or refuse any particular obiect: and consequently to beleeue. Then in this slaunderous excepters opinion, the King holdeth vnsound and vntrue positions: the contrarie whereof he calleth sound and true positions: and thus he thwarteth not onely the doctrine of the Church in the articles of religion, as is before shewed, 7. slaund. but his Maiesties iudgement also: see more of this, pref. to Antilog. p. 4.

5. But the other obiection is friuolous and childish, that the Replyer maketh him a Novice in the faith: affording his Highnes onely a liuely feeling and inward touch thereof: Sense and feeling of religion the perfection thereof: against R. Parks ignorant position. for, 1. he addeth (onely) deceitfully of his owne: the Replyers wordes are these, as God hath endued his princely heart with a liuely feeling, and inward touch of true religion. 2. he bewraieth his carnall and grosse ignorance, in making the liuely sense and feeling of religion onely to appertaine to a Novice, which is the very perfection of true knowledge, and religion: for a liuely sense presupposeth knowledge: one may haue the knowledge and shew of religion, and yet feele not the power thereof, as the Apostle saith,2. Tim. 3. 5. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . hauing a forme of religion, but haue denied the power thereof: in which number (I feare me) this enuious aduersarie is one. But there can not be a liuely sense of religion,Philip. 1. 9. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . without knowledge preceding: as S. Paul againe saith, I pray that your loue may abound, yet more and more in all knowledge and sense.

11. Slaund. That the Replyer defendeth many things in that booke that is contrarie to the Gospel. 2. b. p. 50.2. b. p. 50. you conuince your selfe to be no Protestant, in calling me an adversarie to Protestants. p. 52.p. 52. they haue neither friend, nor faith left them. p. 53.p. 53. that some of his friends denie the Pater noster. p. 76.p. 76. if we must receiue no article of the Creede, vnlesse it be expounded according to your sense of the Scriptures, and your conceit of the Analogie of faith, we may in time haue neither Creede, nor Christianitie left vs. 2. b. p. 180.2. b. p. 180. that he followeth prophane errour in hatred of the truth. 3. b. p. 203.3. b. p. 203.

Vnlesse this shamelesse man were possessed with the spirit of lying and slaunder, he would neuer haue laid vnto the Replyers charge, to defend things contrarie to the Gospel, to be no Protestant, to haue no faith, no Christianitie, to hate the truth: whose bookes, if they had not more true diuinitie in one leafe, then his rayling bundle in the whole packe, and the author more faith and Christianitie in his serious meditations, then the other in his deepest studies, he would neuer set penne to paper againe, nor looke any man in the face hereafter. But I must here excuse my selfe with Tullie, Philippic. 12. Iniuriae dolor facit me praeter morem gloriosum: the sense of my wrong maketh me boast beside my wont.

12. Slaund. Your seldome excursions abroad against the common aduersarie, can not excuse your often incursions at home against your brethren: 2. b. p. 58.2. b. p. 58. what will not a slaunderous tongue forge? The Replyer calleth God and men to witnesse for the clearing of him in this point: that he hath neither vsed often nor seldome incursions against his brethren; making any challenge by name to any of them. This whole Church can testifie with him, that the most, if not Synops. Tetrastylon. Catholicon. the Retect. the Antilog. Hexapla on Genesis. all of his writings (certaine explanations of Scripture onely excepted) haue beene directed against the common aduersarie: of like truth is the marginal glaunce in the same place: that two petitions were exhibited to the King, the one with a 1000. hands, the other with 1500. whereas I haue beene certenly informed, and I doe verily beleeue, that neither of them were subscribed with any hands at all. Of the same credit is the next obiection, p. 60.2. b. p. 60. that the Replyer with others doe think themselues persecuted for the profession of the Gospel: whereas (leauing other mens complaints) he most heartily thanketh God for that sweete peace, which he hath enioyed in his ministerie, which by Gods gracious assistance hath brought forth such fruits in the vse of his penne, as he needeth not be ashamed of.

13. Slaund. Your words doe necessarily implie all the auncient fathers, and all sound writers since, together with all good Christians throughout the whole world, to be popish and superstitious men, &c. for all these doe firmely hold the locall discent of Christs soule into hell. 2. b. p. 82.2. b. p. 82. Contra. 1. The Replyers wordes doe implie no such thing, but the contrarie: for these they are, They which hold not the locall discent of Christs soule to hell should not condemne the other as prophane & superstitious that are so perswaded. Limbom. p. 5. is not then he ashamed to inferre the contrarie, that the Replyers words implie they are popish? 2. The fathers opinion touching the local discent of Christs soule, is farre different from his: and in these fowre substantiall and materiall points: 1. in respect of the place, they hold he went not downe to the hell of the damned, but to that part of hell, where the fathers were: 2. in respect of their persons; that he descended not to the damned, but to preach deliuerance to the fathers there detained: 3. the ende is also diuerse: they hold he went to deliuer: 4. in the effect they differ: for their opinion is, that hell was emptied at Christs going downe thither, and that returning from thence, he brought an innumerable companie of captiues with him:Bell. de Christ anim. l. 4. c. 14. to this purpose Bellarmine alleadgeth aboue twentie Greeke and Latine fathers beside Councells. 3. And are all sound writers, and good Christians of his opinion? thenin Act 2. v. 27. institut. lib. 2. c. 16. sect 9. 8. Calvine, in Math. c. 27. Bucer, in Act. 2. 27. Beza, Act. 2. v. 27. Erasmus, Sarcerius, in Eph. 4. 9. Marlorate, in Eph. 4. 9. Gasper Megander, in Symbol. Oleviane, Act. 2 sect. 11. D. Fulke, D. Reynolds, cont. Monach. Burdegal. p. 176. Sadeel, Medull. de Ignat. c. 3. p. 448 Scultetus, super hunc articulum. Vrsinus, Bucanus, with diuers others, were in his blind opinion neither sound writers, nor good Christians, all which held the contrarie.

14. Slaund. That the Replyer was one of those that contradicted, what reuerend2. b. p. 95. B. Bilson taught concerning our redemption by the death of Christ: p. 95. that he holdeth that the article of Christs descention2. b. p. 96. is to be reiected out of the Creede as a new addition, lately foisted into the Creede. 2. b. p. 96. Contra. What will not now this malitious Accuser dare to say, obiecting things as contrarie to truth, as darknes is to light? he might as well say, that the Replyer holdeth, there is no Christ, nor God, as accuse him to denie the redemption of mankind by the death of Christ, and the article of the discension: his prophane heart knew, that his dissembling lippes, wandring hand, and erring penne, consented here to make a lie.

15. Slaund. The fourth fault is horrible impietie, in that you hereby condemne the soule of the Prophet Dauid, to the very place of the damned. 3. b. p. 41. Whereas, 1. the Replyer saith in very direct words, his, that is, Dauids soule was not at all in hell, Limbom. p. 24. how then is not the slaunderer ashamed thus to obiect: 2. because the Replyer saith, the not beeing or leauing of the soule in hell, was as well performed in Dauid as in Christ: Limbom. p. 24. hence he doth inferre thus: Dauids soule was not left in hell, Ergo it was in hell: whereas it is cleare, that the Replyer, by not leauing, vnderstandeth the not beeing: so our Sauiour saith to his Apostles, Ioh. 14. 18. I will not leaue you comfortlesse: will he hereupon conclude, that they were comfortlesse, but not so left: 3. It is the accuser himselfe, that is guiltie of this impietie, that Dauids soule was, if not in hell,Dauids soule affirmed by the aduersarie, to be almost in hell. yet neare vnto hell: for in these words of Dauid, if the Lord had not holpen me, my soule had well-nie dwelt in silence, Psal. 94. 17. by silence, he vnderstandeth2. b. p. 159. hell: in his sentence then Dauids soule was almost in hell, and by the like collection it was there, though it dwelt not, or continued there.

16. Slaund. The Replyer is charged with Iudaisme, for that none but Iewes did euer applie this prophesie to any but to our Sauiour Christ. 3. b. p. 41. Contra. 1. It is not Iudaisme to applie the propheticall saying of Dauid concerning Christ, in some sense, vnto Dauid, but to vnderstand them onely of Dauid, and not at all of Christ: as, if his memorie had serued him, he might haue turned backe to 2. b. p. 1362. b. p. 136. where he himselfe citeth Hierome vpon the 71. Psalm. v. 20. Thou wilt take me from the depth of the earth: Iudaei hunc psalmum in solum Davidem convenire volunt, &c. the Iewes will haue this psalme to agree vnto Dauid onely: and 3. b. p. 47.3. b. p. 47. he alleadgeth out of Mollerus, that D. Kimchi interpreteth the 16. Psal. of the Prophet Dauid: and wil not haue these words meant of the resurrection of Christ. 2. If they sauour of Iudaisme, which applie the propheticall sayings concerning Messiah in the Psalmes to Dauid, then is Basil guiltie that way, who vpon these words in the 48. Psal. The Lord shall deliuer my soule from the hand of hell, Basilan Psal. 48. thus writeth: Manifeste vaticinatur Domini ad inferos descensum, qui cum alijs etiam ipsius animam redimat, ne remaneat ibi: he manifestly prophesieth of the Lords descension to hell, which with others should also redeeme his soule that it remaine not there: he applieth this text both concerning Christs descension to hell, and Dauids deliuerance from thence. So Augustine indifferently expoundeth those words, Psal. 86. v. 13. Thou hast deliuered my soule from the lowest hell: Aug. in Psal 86. either of Christ, or of some of his members. Ergo aut ipsius vox est hic, eruisti &c. wherefore it is either his voice (that is, Christs) or our voice by Christ our Lord, which to that ende came thither. 3. Then doth he himselfe Iudaize, who thus confesseth of that place, Psal. 68. 18. He ascended vp on high, and led captiuitie captiue, which is as properly by S. Paul fitted to the ascension of Christ, Eph. 4. 8. as the other place, Psal. 16. is by S. Peter to our Sauiours resurrection: alluding (saith this obiecter) to the place of the Psalme, Psal. 68 18. where it is literally spoken of King Dauid himselfe, The slaunderer taken in his owne trap. to whome God gaue victorie and triumph ouer all his enemies, but prophetically meant of Christ our Sauiour, 1. b. p. 57. of whome Dauid was a type and figure. Thus it falleth out according to the saying of the wise man,Prov. 26. 27. he that diggeth a pit, shall fall therein, and he that rolleth a stone, it shall returne vnto him: this accusation of Iudaisme, which as a stone he cast at the Replyer, recoyling againe, hath broken his owne pate.

17. Slaunder. According to your sense, all that will follow Christ, must suffer the death of the soule, 3. b. p. 63.3. b. p. 63. You deliuer for sound doctrine, that Christ suffered that death which was threatened to Adam. 3. b. p. 66.3. b. p. 66. Your blasphemous paradox of the death of Christs soule. 3. b. p. 83.3. b. p. 83. Whereas the Replier doth directly affirme, that Christ died not the death of the soule, either by sinne, or damnation. Synops. p. 977. which are the two kinds onely of the proper dying of the soule. And, though a kinde of death may after some sort be affirmed of Christs soule, in respect of the great anguish and torment which hee endured in his soule; yet he wisheth that kinde of phrase, as beeing not vsed in Scripture, to be forborne and discontinued. Synops. p. 978. The Replier here then, is as farre from blasphemie, as the Accuser is from honestie, in charging him with such an apparant vntruth.

18. Slaunder. That he doth call againe out of hel, Arrius, Eunomius, Apollinaris, Lucianus, to ioyne hands with you against Athanasius, Epiphanius, Fulgentius: that he doth iustifie so pestilent and blasphemous heretiks, against so reuerend, so learned, and holy fathers. 3. b. p. 74.3. b. p. 74. You reiected Athanasius before for a misconstruer of Scripture, an establisher of error; yea little better then a blasphemer: euen because he proued against the Arrians, that the word Spirit in this place of Peter, signifieth the humane soule of Christ. 3. b. 125. 1.3. b. p. 125.

Contra. 1. What an absurd collection is this? Athanasius, Epiphanius, did censure the Apollinarists out of this place of Peter, proouing thence, that Christ had an humane soule: you therefore refusing their interpretation and collection out of this place, condemne them, and iustifie those hereticks. 2. Augustine and Ambrose doe prooue the eternitie of Christ, and coexistence with his father, against the Arrians out of that place, Ioh. 8. 2. which they read thus according to the vulgar latine; the beginning, who spake vnto you: which reading, indeed by the authoritie of these Fathers, the Rhemists follow in their translation: whereas, the true reading according to the originall is, Euen the same thing which I said vnto you from the beginning. Doth it follow, that they which refuse this their interpretation and application of this text against the Arrians, doe therefore iustifie the Arrians against these godly Fathers? 3. The Replier no where ascribeth blasphemie vnto Athanasius; the slaunderer blasphemeth rather in so saying: error he is not free from, seeing he is cited by Bellarmine, De Christ. anim. lib. 4. c. 14. to prooue Christs descent to Limbus patrum, which all Protestants hold to be an error, howsoeuer this Antagonist staggereth at it.

19. Slaunder. That the flames and torments of hell fire are temporall: Synops. p. 1010. 1014. and that eternall continuance in them, is not of the essence and nature of hell torments. 3. b. p. 77.3. b. p. 77. If this (false fellow) had not hardened his face as the Adamant, hee would not for shame haue thus obiected: for, the Replier in the first place quoted in the margen, speaketh onely of the hell sorrows and torments, which Christ suffered in his soule, which were not eternall, because of the dignitie of his person: for, these are the words concerning hell flames; First, in that they are not eternall in Christ, the digniti of his person obtained: for his temporall enduring of hell sorrow, was as effectuall and meritorious, as if they had beene perpetuall. Here is no one word of the torments of hell in generall. Againe, in the other place these are the words: The inseperable adiuncts, and necessarie members of hell, are these; 1. the Place, which is infernall: 2. the Time, which is perpetual: 3. darkenes vnspeakable. What fault can this quarrel-picker finde with these words? what meane Logician knoweth not, that the continuance of time, is not of the essence of a thing, but a necessarie adiacent or adiunct? Yea, these are his very owne words in an other place; whose inseperable adiuncts (speaking of hell) are vtter darkenesse, and endlesse paines. 1. b. p. 3.1. b. p. 3. Is he not now a wise man, that reprooueth another for speaking in his owne words?

20. Slaunder. By which wicked and intolerable speech, you send to hell, not onely those, which were at that time thorough the world, but euen Noahs owne familie also, which were together with him in the Arke. 3. b. p. 104.3. b. p. 104. But more wicked and intolerable is this shamelesse creature, that dare thus open his mouth to reuile: for, whereas the words which he quarrelleth at, stand thus in the booke; In so much, that the Lord vpheld him in all his preaching, and profession, against all the (professors) of the old world, condemning them, Li bomast. p. 41. and sauing him: but that his malice blinded him, he might haue turned to the Errata in the beginning of the booke, where he should haue found, that professors by the Printer was here taken for prophane persons. If hee knew this escape to bee so corrected, and yet would traduce the Replier, it bewraieth malice: if hee knew it not, it argueth his ignorance and rashnesse, that would make no further search.

21. Slaunder. You place hell in the aire. 3. b. p. 153.3. b. p. 153. 1. What shamefull dealing is this,Synops. p. 1018. thus without any conscience to detort and depraue the Repliers words? He in that place speaketh onely of the place whither the deui s are now cast downe, which is into hell (as S. Peter saith) where God hath deliuered them to chaines of darkenesse;2. Pet. 2. 4. whom yet S. Paul saith, to rule in the aire, Eph. 2. 2. To reconcile these two Apostles, it must be confessed, that the aire is the diuels present hell: and so Augustine taketh it. Poenaliter hunc infernum, id est, De natur. bon. c. 32. caligino sum aerem tanqua carcerem acceperunt: They haue receiued this infernall and darke aire for their prison. That therefore, which is spoken secundum quid, in part, and after such a sort, he wresteth, as beeing spoken simpliciter, simply and absolutely: inferring thus; The diuels present hell is in the aire: ergo, there shall be no hell but in the aire. 2 And concerning the site of hell, the Replier else-where deemeth not, but that it may be in the earth, Synops. p. 1056. or where else it pleaseth God: and consisteth specially vpon this position, That the place of hell causeth not the torment, but the wrath and curse of God: which, this caueller shall neuer be able to disprooue.

22. Slaunder. Hexap. 9. 28. 15. 9. &c. That he vtterly condemneth allegories. 3. b. p. 166.3. b. p. 166. Here this endlesse wrangler committeth the same fault which hee fell into before, to presse that as generally spoken against all allegories, which is intended only against such allegories, as are of mens deuising, and haue no warrant in Scripture: as the words thus stand in the first place there noted, I hold it not safe wading without a bottome, and therefore I omit these allegorical applications, as mens fansies. Is this vtterly to condemne allegories? he that so doeth, alloweth none, and so euen the allegories vsed by S. Paul, Gal. 4. and in other places of Scripture, should also be excluded. Euery man may see what paltrie dealing this is, and such is his lewd vaine throughout this whole Satyricall discourse. Many other slaunderous accusations are foisted in euery where, which it were lost labour to examine. If I should altogether busie my selfe in raking in this filthy dunghill, I might be thought as vaine and beastly, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , qui tercora colligit. as this Coprologus himselfe: yet I will adde one slaunder more.

23. Slaunder. That the Replier calleth the blessed roots of the Christian faith, cursed rootes. 2. b. p. 84.2. b. p. 84. A vile slaunder: for the Replier only repeateth the Confutors words, which are these; That he chargeth his brethren irreligiously and vnchristianly to call the maine grounds and principles of our faith into question. Saying further, To plant by writing, or water by speaking the cursed rootes thereof. These are his owne wordes in many syllables: now this word thereof, which he meaneth of Atheisme, hee with a cavillous spirit retorteth vpon the Replier, as spoken of faith in the precedent sentence; which is apparantly seperated and suspended from the next clause, by these words interlaced in other caracters (and saying) which this slie iugler concealeth, that his fraud appeare not.

I would he had grace to consider, how grieuously hee hath offended, in persecuting his brother with such vncharitable slaunders, and had remembred that sentence of the Apostle,1. Ioh. 3. 15. that he which hateth his brother is a man-slaier: yea, as Cyprian saith, Multo malum leuius & periculum minus est, cum membra gladio vulnerantur: facilior cura, vbi plaga perspicua, &c. zeli vulnera abstrusa sunt & occulta. Serm. de Liuore. It is a lighter euill, and lesse danger, when the members are wounded with a sword: the cure is easier, where the wound is in sight; the wounds of enuie are close and secret.

Theocritus being demanded which were the most cruell beasts, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . made this answer; Truely in the hilles, the Beares and Lyons; but in Cities, sycophants and slaunderers. The wise man hath expressed it better,Prou. 17. 12. That a Beare might rather meete with a man, then a foole in his folly. But, because a word once spoken cannot bee called in; the next way to make amends for this grosse ouer-sight, is to take heed of the like slip afterward:Prou. 3. 32. and to follow the wise mans counsell; If thou hast beene foolish in lifting thy selfe vp, and if thou hast thought wickedly, lay thy hand vpon thy mouth. Let him heare Cyprian againe; Venena fellis euome, purgetur mens quam serpentinus livor infecerat, 3. Imputation. amaritudo omnis quae intus insiderat, Cyprian. de livore. Christi dulcedine leniatur. Vomite vp thy poisoned gall: let the minde be purged which serpentine enuie hath infected: let all bitternes, which festred within, be allaied by the sweetnes of Christ.

The 3. imputation of vntruths.
The accusation.

Next after his vncharitable slaunders, followeth the imputation of vntruths. In the front of Limbomastix he findeth no fewer then sixe vntruths.

1. He taketh exception to the title Limbomastix, which he would haue to signifie, a scourge of the hem or border of a garment: and so he chargeth the Replyer in his rude discourse (as he more rude himselfe calleth it) to cut a sunder the hem of the precious garment of Christ, the doctrine and discipline of the Church: he saith also that it is a new found name: and it should haue beene entituled Limbopatrum mastix, the word patrum should haue beene added to limit the generall signification. 2. b. p. 2.2. b. p. 2.

2. Vntr th. That he forgeth a new matter neuer questioned in this Church, whether Christ descended into hell to deliuer the Patriarkes. ibid. p. 3.2. b. p. 3.

3. Vntruth. That the Replyer ac useth his answer as enclining to that opinion (of Limbus patrum:) for what one word (saith he) thorough the whole booke doth insinuate so much as any suspition thereof? p. 5.2. b. p. 5.

4. Vntruth. The abuse and misapplication of Saint Pauls words, Phil. 3. 15. Let vs, as many as be perfect, be thus minded. p. 8. for the Apostle speaketh not this of doctrine, but of perfection of life, if you will credit S. Chrysostome. p. 10.2. b. p. 10.

5. Vntruth. You abuse that auncient and godly father S. Augustine in peruerting his words. p. 12.2. b. p. 12.

6. Vntruth. That he maketh the ignorant beleeue that the defenders of this article of Christs descension into hell, ioyne hands with none but with Bellarmine and other Papist. 2. b. p. 33.2. b. p. 33.

The iustification.

1. FIrst, if the Replyer had missed somewhat in the title and inscription of his booke, had that beene so great a fault, as to deserue to be counted an vntruth? Cicero was more equall toward his deadly enemie Antonie: who saith,Philippic. 10. Te verbi inopia lapsum putarem: I would haue thought, that you were ouerseene for want of a word. 2. What though Limbus originally signifie the purle, hem, or gard of a womans garment: yet seeing the Romanists haue appropriated that word, to signifie that place which is in the brimme and skirts of hell, where they imagine the fathers to haue beene, we must vnderstand it according to the vsuall sense: as Hierome saith in the like: non possumus quae dicuntur, Hieron. de v •• te sacerdotal. nisi consuetis vocibus intelligere: we can not vnderstand what is said, but by the accustomed words. 3. That the Replyer scourgeth the doctrine and discipline of the Church (which is as the hemme of Christs garment) is a meere slaunder, as is before shewed, slaund. 6. but the Replyer is beholding to this forger of vntruths, that he maketh him but a scourger of the hemme of Christs garment, which commeth not neare the flesh and bodie: as the saying is, neare is my shirt, but nearer is my skinne whereas he himselfe hath whipped the very members and parts of Christs bodie, holding his brethren, because they dissent from him about the locall discent, no better then dissemblers, schismatikes, yea heretikes, and maintainers of blasphemous paradoxes: as hath beene before declared, in the two former imputations of rayling, and slaunders: so that I may iustly returne vpon him Augustines words against the Donatists: Venit persecutor, & non fregit crura Christi, venit Donatus, & diripuit Ecclesiam Christi: integrum corpus Christi in cruce inter manus persecutorum est, & inter manus Christianorum, non est integrum corpus Ecclesiae: In Psalm. 33. 2. The persecutor came and brake not the legges of Christ: Donatus came, and spoiled the Church of Christ: the bodie of Christ is whole amid the hands of the persecutors; but in the hands of Christians, the bodie of the Church is not whole.

Secondly, though Limbomastix may seeme a new name for the application, yet in respect of the manner of deriuation and composition, it is not new: as the vsuall words, Homeromastix, Rhetoromastix, doe shew. Againe, if Limbomastix be a new found name, what is his Symbolomastix, and Cleromastix, epist. dedid. p. 10. and that new tearme of discreeding, wherein he glorieth beeing vsed thoroughout his, not onely rude, but rauing and rayling writing: whereof I may say, as Tullie doth of a certaine straunge word in the Latine tongue, which Antonie vsed: quod verbum in lingua (Anglicana) nullum est, id tu novum propter diuinam tuam pietatem inducis: Latinae Cicero Phil. 13. that word which is not at all in (the English) tongue, you take vp new, because of your diuine pietie.

Thirdly, whereas he would haue it entituled rather, Limbopatrum mastix: 1. what neede the word patrum be inserted, seeing vse hath obtained among the Romanists (who are masters both of the word, and error therein implied) that Limbus, without any addition should signifie that place and part of hell, where they imagined the fathers to be imprisoned: as his ringleader could haue told him, after whose pipe he might haue daunced here, as well as in other places. 2. And if he would needes haue formed a word,Bellar. illuminauit sanctos patres, qui erāt in limbo, &c. Durandus dicit eos fuisse in limbo. lib. 4. de Christi anim. c. 15. to his owne fashion, he that is so cunning in declining and inflecting of nounes (as his daily exercise with his grammer boyes doth make him perfect) should rather haue said, Limbopatrimastix, to auoide the concurrence of a double (m) euphoniae gratia, then Limbopatrummastix. 3. And why els doth he so must striue for this sesquipedale verbum, Limbopatrummastix, but to obtrude, as Hierome, saith,Hieron. ad Theodor. magis portenta, quam nomina, monstrous tearmes, rather then names: simplices quos que terrens sono, vt quod non intelligant, plus mirentur: terrifying the simple, with straunge sounds, that what they vnderstand not, they may wonder at, as Hierome saith of Basilides.

2. The question in deede concerning Limbus patrum, was neuer controuerted among sound Protestants: and therefore while he falleth vpon that rocke (as is discouered in the preface) he bringeth his Protestants faith into strong suspition, as not holding a straite course by the direction of the true compasse of Euangelicall truth: he wresteth here against the Replyer a sentence out of Augustine: as though he could have had nothing to say, vnlesse he had imagined an aduersarie to raile vpon. But the truth is, that if this brasen face, I would say, brasen-nose master of art, had left out his rayling, slaunders, vntruths, errours, absurdities, and such like: he should neither haue found what, nor against whome to haue written. And Augustine shall be returned againe vpon himselfe, who may vse his words in his owne person:de natur. & grat. lib. 1. c. 25. Procliviores sumus quaerere potius, quid contra ea respondeamus, quae nostro obijciuntur errori, quam intendere, quam sunt salubria, vt carcamus errore: we are more readie to seeke rather, what we may answer to those things, which are obiected against our error, then to consider, how wholesome they are, that we may be without error.

3 How vntrue it is, that there is not one word through his whole booke, that doth insinuate any suspicion of holding Limbus patrum, let the Preface be witnesse, wherein this Popes liuerie is fitted so close to his backe, as if hee himselfe had of purpose put it out to making. Therefore, the title of Lambomastix misseth not an haires breadth, (in that respect) of that marke which hee aimeth at in his first booke. Indeed, his leaues are fronted throughout with false and presumptuous inscriptions; the defence of 3. testimonies of scripture. For, what a vile slaunder is this, that any of those against whom he speaketh, and carpeth (according to his name) should denie any testimony of Scripture? and what presumption is it, to take vpon him, & professe to be a defender of Scripture; wheras, both the truth, and whosoeuer professeth the truth, is by it defended: the Scripture should be driuen to a great straight, if it needed his poore defence. Here therefore, Augustines sentence fitteth him well; Haeretici ad defensionem possessionis suae, Christi titulos ponunt, sicut nonnulli faciunt in doma sua: ne domum suam inuadat aliquis potens, ponit ibi titulos potentis, In Psal. 21. titulos mendaces, ipse vult possessor esse domus, & frontem domus suae titulo alieno vult muniri. Heretiks for the defence of their possessiō, do set vp the titles of Christ, as many doe in their house: least some mightie man should inuade his house, hee setteth vp the title of some great man, but a false title: hee would be the owner of the house, but the front of his house he would haue priuiledged by another mans title. Wee will pardon him the first name of heretiks, though we might as iustly returne it vpon him, as he sendeth it to vs: but all the rest most kindly agreeth vnto him. For, he vnder colour of defending certaine testimonies of Scripture, obtrudeth his owne priuate sense of scripture.

4 First, some Fathers also vnderstand that place of the perfection of knowledge;Orig. l. 10. in epist. ad Roman. as Origen vpon those wordes, Rom. 15. 14. filled with all knowledge, alluding vnto this place, thus expoūdeth the one by the other; Paulus, & si qui sunt tales, ad comparationem caeterorum perfecti dicuntur, &c. Paul, and if there be any such, are said to be perfect by way of comparison with others; ad illam summam scientiam, quae est in coelestibus ordinibus, &c. in respect of that high knowledge, which is in the heauenly orders, none among mortall men can be called perfect. Likewise, Augustine thus interpreteth the 13. verse, of the which, this other place dependeth:de divers. ser. 13. Ergo non arbitror meipsum apprehendisse, id est, qualis sit Deus: I doe not thinke, that I haue apprehended it, that is, what manner of one God is. 2 Yea Chrysostome himselfe, in the same place addeth these words, which are not truely alleadged by the Carper: Et ne putent seipsos perfectos esse: that they should not thinke themselues to be perfect. Quisquis putat se totum esse assequntum, nihil habet: He that thinketh he hath attained the whole, hath nothing. And a little before he saith, Non dixit, Deus inducet, sed reuelabit, vt res ista videatur magis esse ignorantiae: He said not, God will induce, but reueale, that all this matter may seeme to be ignorance. Where then, there is opinion on the one side, and ignorance of the other; there the matter treated of, belongeth to knowledge, not to practise or perfection of life onely. Chrysostoms meaning then is, that the Apostle speaketh not, de dogmatibus of (speculatiue) doctrines, for that must be his meaning, vnlesse he wil make him contrarie to himselfe; but of practised knowledge, which belongeth to the practise of life. That no man should thinke, that he hath any other perfection or righteousnesse, but onely by faith in Christ; for, that is the principall argument handled in this place, as appeareth verse 9. And further, what Chrysostoms meaning is, appeareth by his interpretation of the very like place, 1. Cor. 2. 6. Wee speake wisdome among those which are perfect: Sapientiam autem praedicationem, & salutis modum, hoc est, per crucem salutem, perfectos vero credentes appellat, &c. Wisdome he calleth preaching, and the manner of saluation; that is, by the crosse, and beleeuers he calleth the perfect. Here it is cleare, that he vnderstandeth not the perfection of life, but of faith. 3 There is no sense vrged of the Apostles words, but onely the sentence produced; and therefore this exception of the Apostles meaning is superfluous and impertinent. 4 Concerning that false charge of dissembling the Apostles wordes following, Neuerthelesse, whereunto we haue attained, let vs proceed by one rule, that we may be of one accord. First, if he dissembleth, which citing a place of Scripture, omitteth either the verse before going, or following; he will make S. Paul a dissembler, who vseth euery where, as chap. 3. to the Romans, and chap. 10. throughout those chapters, only to alleadge that part of the sentence, and testimonie of Scripture, which was to his purpose, leauing the rest. Secondly, the Replyer also, euen produceth this sentence afterward, where he had cause to vse it,epi. d d. p. 5. 2. b. p. 12. and this the Cauiller himselfe confesseth: how then was he not ashamed, to charge him herein with dissimulation?

5 Neither is Augustine abused, or his words peruerted; for, the Replyer writing in other characters, erraueris, and tibi, did insinuate that those words were otherwise in Augustine: and hee followed rather his sense, then vrged the sentence. Could he make no difference betweene a Rhetoricall imitation of an authors sentence, and a logicall allegation of his testimonie? the one beeing vsed for illustration onely, the other for probation: the one following the ense, the other tied to the words. As Hieroms alleadgeth Cicero to haue done the like: Non conuerti vt interpres, sed vt Orator: I did not turne and translate him (meaning Demosthenes) as an interpreter; but as an Orator. And Hierome further addeth:Hieron. Pammac. de optimo genere interpret. Non me ea annumerare lectori debere putaui, sed tanquam appendere: I thought I was not bound to deliuer the wordes by number, but by waight.

6 In the sixt vntruth obiected, he committeth two vntruths: for neither doth the Replyer make mention of other defenders of the locall descension, but of the immodest pamphleter onely: neither saith he that he ioyneth hands onely with Bellarmine: but that the places first vrged by Bellarmine to that purpose, were seconded by him. But thus cunningly to couer his owne wickednesse, he would haue the lappe of an others garment cast vpon him: and where his owne credit serueth not, he would be maintained by other mens fame. And to make the Replyer more odious, and himselfe more popular: he seeketh to iustifie himselfe, by extending the accusation to others. So that saying of Hierome may very well be applied against him:Hierom. Ocean tom. 3. Indecens est vnum tueri, vt plures accusare videaris, & qu m ratione non possis, societate peccantium defendere: It is an vnmeete thing, so to iustifie one, that you seeme to accuse many: & whom with reason you cannot, to defend with number of offenders. This was an olde tricke of the peruerse dogmatizers in times past,Ephesin. 2. in ostum Cha •• e nens. as Dioscorus cried out in the 2. Ephesine Synode: Ego cum patribus eijcior: Ego defendo patrum dogmata: I am cast out with the fathers: I defend the opinion of the fathers.

The Recrimination. Vntruths boldly affirmed and falsely forged in theAnapologist, that is, a defender without defence. Anapologists Reioynder.

It may seeme strange that a man should be so besotted with his owne conceit, and blinded with enuie, that hee should obiect error and vntruth to another, not knowing to tread one right foote himselfe: and to cauill at anothers tripping, when he stumbleth and falleth downe right. For any one vntruth surmised by him, he shall be apaied tenne for one. It may truely bee said, if a diligent examination were had, that he hath not so many leaues in his booke, as leasings; nor so many numbers, as errors: a dogge trotteth not so fast, as his pen droppeth forgeries (as the common saying is:) for plainely to giue him the lie, the Replyer wil forbeare, as this sophisticall forger for want of manners doth more then once, beeing ten times more worthy the whetstone himselfe. Archidamus said of an olde man of Chius, that beeing sent of an Embassage to the Lacedemonians, had coloured his graie haires, before he deliuered his message: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : what truth is to be expected from this man, which carieth about a lie not onely in his heart, but in his head. And if this Chian coyner doe so forge with his hand and penne, who can iudge his heart to be cleare. But I will now open this pedlars packe, and bring to view his sophisticate wares.

1. Vntr. I doe maruell to see an Article of our Creede in so ill credit with Christians: epist. dedicat. p. 9.epi. ded. p. 9. he laboureth in what he may to discreede my Christian and necessarie defence of this article of our Creede. pref. p. 5.pref. p. 5. 3. Vntruths. Here are three vntruths couched together: for what Christian denieth any article of the Creede? his defence is neither Christian, beeing full of vncharitable rayling, and slaunders: nor yet necessarie: as though both other learned men had not written better of that argument, and as if there were not many that could handle their penne with more wit and learning, if he had held his peace.

2. Vntr. In the propheticall testimonie of Dauid you will needes haue the word (soule) to signifie the humanitie of Christ, and here (that is, in this place of Peter) you will needes haue it to signifie the diuinitie. 1. b. p. 24.1. b. p. 24. Whereas in that place of Peter, there is no mention made of the soule of Christ, but of the spirit.

3. Vntr. Bellarmine most truly defendeth with me against you, &c. that Christ after his death descended in soule to those places of hell, where dolours and torments were; and where the soules of sinners wont to be tortured. 1. b. p. 35. where fowre vntruths are wrapped vp together. 1. b. p. 35. 4. Vntruths. 1. Bellarmine saith onely, probabile est, &c. it was probable, that Christ descended to all the places of hell; whereas this fellow defendeth it to be an article of the Creede so to beleeue, and consequently of necessitie: therefore his Ringleader and ghostly father therein agreeth not with him. 2. Those first are not Bellarmines, but Augustines words: dicit Augustinus, Christum descendisse, &c. Augustine saith, that Christ descended to those places of hell, &c. where dolours and torments were. 3. These torments Bellarmine vnderstandeth to haue beene spoken of the purgatorie paines, and not of the torments of hell: restat, vt loquatur de animabus quae adhuc luebant poenas purgatorias: it remaineth that he (Augustine) speaketh of the soules which suffered purgatorie paines. in fin. capitis. 4.Bellar. lib. 4 de Christ. anim. c. 14. The other words, vbi solebant peccatorum animae torqueri, where the soules of sinners were wont to be tortured, are not Bellarmines but Fulgentius his words: see the place.

4. Vntr. Howsoeuer you bestirre your selues first to kill and crucifie the blessed soule of our Sauiour vpon the crosse. 2. b. p. 35.2. b. p. 35. A great slaunder, with vntruth: the Replyer is farre from that blasphemie, to say that the soule of Christ can be killed.

5. Vntr. H. I. Whose arguments are euery where seconded, vrged, and intruded by you: 2. b. p. 44.2. b. p. 44. whome with a scurrilous tearme, he calleth one of his chiefest captaines, and greatest masters: p. 51.p. 51. and euery where he calleth him, the Replyers Patriarke, 3. b. p. 3.3. b. p. 3. and in diuers other places: whereas the Replyer professeth ex animo, that he knoweth not what arguments are vrged by him (whome this forger noteth) as hauing not read his defence:Synops. p. 1049, 1050, 1051. and beside, the Replyer did first els where write somewhat of this matter, and therefore he was rather seconded by the other, then did second him. And how absurd and inconsequent a speech it is, who seeth not, to nickname him a Patriarke, whome his cauilling spirit euery where inueigheth against as an impugner of the reuerend calling of Bishops.

6. Vntr. 2 Vntruthes. That he verily beleeueth the Replyer to be one of those, which writ the vnchristian letter to M. Hooker: p. 49.2. b. p. 49. whereas the Replyer knoweth not to this day, who were the writers of that letter: which he that calleth vnchristian, beeing for the manner modest, and for the points of doctrine there maintained sound, seemeth rather himselfe to haue small Christianitie. If his beleefe of Christs soule discent into hell, be of no more certentie with him, then this his beleefe, (as it may be thought verily it is not with him, howsoeuer it is with others) his faith and beleefe is very weake.

7. Vntr. 2. Vntruthes. The auncient fathers doe interpret it of a mortall sinne, not secretly but openly committed against others: 2. b. p. 67.2. b. p. 67. he meaneth that place, Matth. 18. 15. If thy brother trespasse against thee, &c. In this indefinite speech, he seemeth to meane all the auncient fathers, whereas he alleadgeth not one to prooue this his assertion to be true. But in deede in this his bold speech, he bewraieth his ignorance mixed with vntruth: for the first he is to be borne withall: for his schoolemasters skill can not be supposed to be able to attaine vnto any great reading in the fathers. But his other fault is not to be excused:The blind Confuters ignorāce in the fathers. his ignorance in the fathers should haue made him doubtfull and scrupulous, not bold and presumptuous: but in him the prouerb is verified, who so bold, as blind bayard: for here he hath with one breath vttered two vntruths: first, that the auncient fathers doe interpret this place of mortall sinne: Origene I hope (in his calender) is one of the auncient fathers, yet he expoundeth the place of light and small offences: Qui in peccato levi correptus ter, Tractat. 6. in Matth. &c. non se emendat, nos quidem sic eum debemus habere tanquam publicanum, &c. He that in a light sinne beeing thrice reprooued, &c. doth not amend himselfe, we must so hold him as a publicane.

Secondly, that the fathers doe expound it of sinnes openly committed; and therefore to be openly and publikly censured, is an other vntruth. For the author of the Homilies vpon Mathew, fathered vpon Chrysostom, writeth thus vpon this place;Homil. 61. in 18. cap. Math. Inter duos solummodo redargutionem fieri iubet, &c. He biddeth that the reprehension should be made betweene two alone, lest by the testimony of the multitude, &c. he should shew himselfe more hard to bee corrected. Likewise I suppose, that Augustine will bee allowed for one of the Fathers, but he giueth this interpretation;Serm. 16. de verb. Dom. caus. 2. qu. 1. c. 19. Quid est (in te peccauit) tu scis, quia peccauit, quia enim secretum fuit, quando in te peccauit, secretum quaere cum corrigis, quod in te peccauit: What is this, hath sinned against thee? thou knowest that he hath sinned, because therefore it was secret, when he sinned against thee, seeke him in secret, when thou doest correct that, which he hath sinned against thee. Now then, his owne words may bee returned vpon his owne head;2. b. p. 68. it was either great ignorance, or grosse ouersight in you, to say, the ancient Fathers doe interpret it of mortall sinne openly committed.

8. Vntruth. That the Replyer presseth Carliles very reasons, &c. and acknowledgeth him for a sound interpreter. p. 92.2. b. p. 92. & that he borroweth diuers things of him. p. 125.p. 125. whereas the Replyer doth protest, that he neuer yet read, or so much as sawe Carliles booke: but what will not euill will imagine?

9. Vntruth. 3. Vntruths. That Bellarmine agreeth with all antiquitie, in taking the Hebrew and Greeke words, sheol, and 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , that they signified onely soule and hell. 2. b. p. 119.2. b. p. 119. Here are three notable vntruths; for neither antiquitie, nor yet Bellarmine, nor any learned interpreter, euer tooke these two words sheol, and hades, to signifie the soule and hell: for neither of them was euer taken by any to signifie the soule. Secondly, not all the auncient interpreters tooke sheol, Cyprian. seu Ruff. in Symbolum. translated infernus, onely to signifie hell; for Cyprian vpon the Creed, which is also ascribed to Ruffinus, doeth take it for the graue, in these words: Sciendum est, quod in Ecclesiae Romanae symbolo non habetur additum descendit ad infernos, &c. We must knowe, that in the Romane Church it is not found added in the Creed, he descended to hell, &c. Vis tamen verbi eadem videtur esse in eo, quod sepultus dicitur: but the same force of the word seemeth to be in that he is said to be buried. And Chrysostome also concurreth: Descendit ad infernum, vt ibi à miraculo non vacaret, &c. He descēded to hell, that he should not there be without miracle;See more of Augustines iudgement. Imp. 11. Recrim. for many of the bodies of the Saints rose with Christ, and died againe, hom. 2. in Symbol. Here by infernus, hell, hee seemeth to vnderstand that place, from whence Christ raised the bodies of the dead, that came out of their graues; which is none other, but the place of buriall,August. loc. 5. and the graue. And Augustine expoundeth that place, Psalm. 88. 3. My life draweth neere to hell, by these words of Christ, My soule is heauy vnto death. Thirdly, neither doth Bellarmine take the wordes sheol and nephesh, onely to signifie hell: for the first, hee saith,Lib. 4. de Christ. aenim. c. 10. Ordinariè accipitur, &c. it is taken ordinarily for the place of soules vnder the earth: & vel raro, vel nunquā pro sepulchro: or seldome, or neuer for the graue. He simply denieth not, but that it sometime signifieth the graue, though not ordinarily. For the other word, thus he saith; Nephesh est generalissim vox, Bellar ibid. c. 12. &c. Nephesh is a generall word, and signifieth without any trope, as well the soule, as the liuing creature; yea the body. Hee may be ashamed therefore thus to belie his ring-leader, and grand captaine; with whom, he saith he is beholding to the Replyer for ioyning him, being a learned Papist. p. 119.2. b. p. 119.

10. Vntruth. That hee doeth fasten all the torments of hell vpon the blessed soule of our Sauiour. 2. b. p. 154.2. b. p. 154. wheras the Replyer simply denieth against the false charge of Feuardentius,Synops. p. 1814. That Christ suffered in his soule the whole paines of the damned in hell.

11. Vntruth. 4. Vntruths. That you expound in the former testimonie, soule, that is, body; hell, that is graue: and here, spirits, that is, men; dead, that is liuing. 3. b. p. 71.3. b. p. 71. Here are foure vntruths fardelled vp together. 1. Neither doth the Replier by soule vnderstand body; but either the person, or life. 2. Neither by hell, the graue; but only sheweth that the hebrew word sheol, which signifieth hell, is sometime taken for the graue. 3. Nor yet doth he expound spirits, that is men; but that they are called now spirits, with S. Peter, which sometime were men. 4. And they which are now dead, were sometime liuing.

12. Vntruth. Onely Beza may seeme to fauour you, that is,2. b. p. 118. in taking soule for life. 2. b. p. 118. What boldnesse is this, to set downe such peremptorie negatiues, as though he had himselfe runne ouer all writers, both new & olde? What a great vntruth is it to say, onely Beza, when as Caluine directly affirmeth the same:In Act. 2. 27. Neque enim anima tam spiritum immortalis essentiae significat, quam vitam ipsam: for the soule doth not so much signifie the immortall essence of the spirit, as the life it selfe. Is Caluin in his base opinion no bodie?

13. It turneth Christs euerliuing soule into a dead bodie: 3. Vntruths. it siteth hell in the superficies of the earth: maketh hell a place of corruption, and there burieth the blessed soule of our Sauiour. 2. b. p. 164. 2. b. p. 164. All these impieties and absurdities he chargeth the Replyer with for so vnderstanding that place, Act. 2. 27. that Christs life seemed to be raked vp in the graue: for here he hath vttered three vntruths: 1. the soule beeing taken for the life, turneth not the soule of Christ into the bodie, but maketh the life onely to be as laid vp in the graue: 2. they which take sheol here for the graue, which also signifieth hell, denie not, but that beside this sheol in the graue, there is an other also in hell: sheol taken for the graue is a place of corruption, not sheol when it signifieth hell: 4. he is the man, that burieth and shutteth vp Christs soule in hell, holding and affirming, that it was there three daies.

14. That Durand held an opinion contrarie to all the rest of the Romanists, that Christs soule descended not to hell in substance, 2. b. p. 190. but by certaine effects: Thom. 3. p. q. 52. art. 2. p. 190. whereas Thomas Aquinas held the same in effect: that Christ onely descended per realem praesentiam, by his reall presence to Limbus patrum: to all the other places of hell, per effectum, by effects:Bellar. de Chr. anim. c. 16. and thus Bellarmine himselfe citeth him: take away that conceit of Limbus patrum, which to all Protestants is but a dreame, and in the rest these two agree.

15. Neither Protestant, 2. b. p. 190. nor yet Papist (of any account) will take your part: for the Papists, they are fitter mates for him: but diuers Protestants of great account are in this question of the Replyers iudgement: as instance is giuen in twelue of them before, 13. slaund. therefore, it is great vnshamefastnes in this brabler, to vtter so vnreasonable and improbable a speech.

16. He calleth A. Humes his first instructer,1. b. p. 195. p. 195. whereas he shall finde that the partie giuen in instance in his Reioynder, Synops. hath reference vnto some of the Replyers works, euen in this argument.

17. Vntr. In this sense the word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 is vsed euery where throughout the Bible, that is, is meant for the soule. 3. b. p. 57.3. b. p. 57. A most audacious speech, and full of vntruth: for the word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , spirit, is as often taken for the diuine spirit of God, as for the soule of man: as is euident in these places, Ioh. 4. 24. God is a spirit. Rom. 1. 4. declared mightily to be the sonne of God touching the spirit of sanctification. 1. Tim. 3. 16. iustified in the spirit. 1. Tim. 4. 1. the spirit speaketh euidently: and many other such places might be produced: he sheweth how shamelesse a man he is therefore, that dare vent forth such a great vntruth, that this word spirit, euery where is taken for the soule of man.

18. He saith, that sixteene of the fathers cited by Bellarmine, make no mention of the deliuerie of the fathers, by Christs descending to hell: 3. b. p. 79. 3. b. p. 79. whereas there are fiue of that number wanting: for Bellarmine citeth in all 36. Councills and fathers, of the which 25. doe either directly, or by necessarie consequent affirme, that Christ descended to hell to deliuer the soules of the fathers: so that to make vp the full number, there remaine onely an eleuen, which make mention onely of Christs descending to hell, and speake not of the deliuerie of the fathers, and these they are: Lateranens. Concil. Irenaeus, Clemens, Gregor. Nyssen. Chrysostome, Theodoret, Augustine, Leo, Fulgentius, Vigilius, Arator subdiaconus: all which notwithstanding, or most of them, if not in those places, produced by Bellarmine, yet els where in their workes, doe giue testimonie with the rest for Limbus patrum.

19. Vntr. Synops. p. 1000. You flatly denie this distinction of the soules death by sinne or damnation, as insufficient: 3. b. p. 84.3. b. p. 84. whereas the Replyer directly saith, we approoue that sentence of Augustine, which maketh mention onely of those two kinds of the death of the soule: speaking properly: though in a more generall sense, the deepe perplexitie and terrour of the soule, may be said to be a kind of death of the soule: where the Replyer further addeth in direct tearmes, I will forbeare to vse this phrase of Christs dying in soule. ibid.

20. Vntr. He calleth the Replyers exposition of that place of S. Peter, new fancies, hauing the approbation of Augustine for the most part, and of Bede more fully: whereupon the Replyer inferreth, that this exposition is not newly deuised. Limbom. p. 45.

21. Vntr. The word descending, is neuer spoken of the graue: 3. b. p. 139.3. b. p. 139. whereas Dauid saith thus to Salomon concerning Ioab: thou shalt not suffer his hoare head to descend into the graue in peace: where the word iaradh is vsed, which signifieth to descend: and the other word sheol beside the consent of the interpreters, Pag. Mont. Tremell. Vatab. and the Chalde translatour, and both our English translations, which all read or vnderstand, the graue; the circumstance of the place giueth it so to be taken, because he speaketh of his gray haires, which goe not downe to hell, but to the graue.

22. He saith that all Latine interpreters turne sheol, infernum, 3. b. p. 151. hell: Psal. 139. 8. p. 151. 3. b. when as Iunius readeth, stratum ponerem in sepulchro, if I should make my bed in the graue: and so Vatablus, though he reteine the word infernum, in the text yet in his annotations he vnderstandeth it of sepulchrum the graue. An other vntruth it is, that all translatours and interpreters are condemned of falshood by Limbomastix: when as the Replyer saith onely thus; neither doe some of the best interpreters read hell, but the graue. ibid. 3. b. p. 151. in marg.

Manifest truths denied.

Vnto these vntruths vnshamfastly affirmed, shall bee added also diuers truths as immodestly denied.

1. That there is not one word through his whole booke, which doth insinuate so much as any suspition of Limbus patrum. 2. b. p. 5.2. b. p. 5. How vntrue this is, the Preface doth evidently shewe, wherein the imputation of this opinion is iustified by twenty seuerall places out of this hell-harrowers bookes.

2. He saith, he censureth no man at all. 2. b. p. 87.2. b. p. 87. How false this is, see before his bitter railings against Doct. Reynolds, and others.

3. That Bellarmine findeth not fault with Beza for trā slating 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , cadauer, in that place of Gen. 37. but in this place of the Acts, p. 123.2. b. p. 123. Yet Bellarmine directly affirmeth,Bellar. lib. 4. de Christ. anim. c. 12. res. 4. 14. ad 1. ration. animam nunquam accipi pro cadauere: that the soule is neuer taken for the carkasse: and therefore consequently he findeth fault, whosoeuer shall any where take anima, for the carkasse or flesh; and yet himselfe so taketh it, Gen. 37. 21. and therefore he is contrary to himselfe.

4. To say I confesse the word sheol, Psal. 6. 4, 5. doth properly signifie the graue, when I plainly confute it, is properly to belie me. 2. b. p. 127.2. b. p. 127. Who euer heard such a forgetfull and wilfull man? for whereas he whome he confuteth, readeth that place thus; In hell, who shall praise thee? This cavillous and friuolous obiecter, sheweth, it should bee read rather thus; who shall giue thee thanks in the pit? where the word in the hebrew is sheol. besheol. And h further addeth, by which last word, all our late interpreters, both Latine and English, doe with one consent vnderstand the graue, as beeing the ordinarie sequel of temporall death, both of the good and bad; but yet can extend no further, then to their dead bodies onely. 1. b. p. 12.1. b. p. 12. Doth he not manifestly affirme, that sheol is here taken for the graue, and therefore findeth fault with his aduersarie, for there reading hell? If any then be here a lier (to returne his owne vnmannerly tearme) he hath made a lie of himselfe.

5. He denieth that more goe to the graue then to hell. 2. b. p. 128.2. b. p. 128. And yet all, both good and bad, goe vnto the graue, Sheol pro quo in scripturis nos fere (infernus) legimus, sepulchrum significat, quod nunquam saturatur. Bucer in Math. c. 27. the place of corruption: where he obiecteth, that many wicked men want the honour of buriall, so doe many of the godly also; yet they all haue a place of rest in the earth, where there bodie corrupteth. Therefore, it is a maruell with what face hee could denie a thing so apparant, that more goe to the graue then to hell,See Pet. Marlinus in cap. 30. seeing it is called in Iob, Iob. the house appointed for all the liuing, cap. 30. v. 23.

6. He denieth that he censureth any interpreter at all, or that he calleth them wranglers, which take sheol for the graue in the olde testament; but saith, that the Replyer is rather an immodest wrangler in so saying. 2. b. p. 151.2. b. p. 151. And yet these are his owne words, Howsoeuer some curious linguists may wrangle with the hebrew word sheol in the olde testament, &c. 1. b. p. 14.1. b. p. 14. What now will this vaine man be ashamed to denie?

7. Because it (that is hades) is all one with Abyssus, which I confirme not by the wordes of S. Luke, as you vntruely affirme, but by the words of Beza himselfe vpon this place. 2. b. p. 155.2. b. p. 155. Now let vs see his owne words in his former booke, which are these; The truth whereof doth more euidently appeare,Luk. 8. 31 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . in that the same Greeke word is by the same Euangelist rendred in another place, by another Greeke word, as Beza himselfe doth interpret it, &c. 1. b. p. 14. Is it not now apparant, that hee first confirmeth that point by the words of Saint Luke, which he indeede further explaneth by the wordes of Beza: but first he citeth the Euangelist.

8. No English translators turne (sheol, graue) in this place, but pit: Psal. 6. 5. 3. b. p. 26.3. b. p. 26. whereas the Geneua translators read thus; in the graue who shall praise thee?

9. To say that nothing is said in scripture to be quickened, which is not apt to die, containes both falshood and impietie. 3. b. p. 90.3. b. p. 90. But when this railing companion shall be able to produce any instance in scripture to the contrary; he shall be discharged of falshood & impiety, for this matter: which till he can perform, they doe cleaue as a proper badge and cognisance to his sleeue, that it may be known what master he serueth: for he bringeth no place to any purpose, but that Ezech. 13. 18. where the prophet speaketh as well of killing soules, as preseruing soules aliue.

10. It is false, when you say, that if I hold those disobedient spirits to haue beene in hell at the time of that preaching vnto them, 3. b. p. 119. 3. but now are not; I agree with the Papists, that Christ descended to emptie Limbus patrum, for they hold onely the holy Patriarks and Prophets, &c. to haue beene in that place, to whom that sinne of disobedience cannot be imputed. Who would denie this consequent but he? for if any were deliuered out of hell, either they were the righteous there holden captiue, or the damned: but of those there is no deliuerance. He therefore so holding, must also with the Papists hold Limbus patrum, or maintaine a more grosse error, or heresie rather, that the damned in hell may be deliuered thence. As for the reason taken from the sin of disobedience, his ring-leader and grand master might haue satisfied him therein;Bellar. lib 4. de Christ. anim. cap. 13. that the Apostle speaketh of such incredulous persons, qui in fine vitae poenitentiam egerint, which repented in the ende of their life.

11. He denieth that Beda is any whit more pregnant for him then the rest. 3. b. p. 126.3. b. p. 126. Concerning the exposition of that place, 1. Pet. 3. 19. whereas Beda in these three maine points approoueth that exposition. 1. by the spirit he vnderstandeth not the soule of Christ, but his diuine spirit. 2. by the preaching in the spirit, his beeing by his holy spirit in Noe, and other holy men: and by the incredulous, those which in the daies of Noe liued carnally.

12. And in these three very points, Augustine also concurreth with him: and yet hee is not ashamed to say, that hee is clearly against you. 3. b. p. 127.3. b. p. 127. The exceptions which hee taketh to auoide these cleare expositions of these two fathers, are friuolous and impertinent. 1. That Beda speaketh of preaching by conuersation, Saint Peter of a ministeriall action of the word: but this is not the question, what manner of preaching it was; but by whom performed, whether by Christ, as man in his soule; or as God, by his diuine spirit. 2. Beda speaketh of preaching before the flood: So also doth Saint Peter, or else he beggeth the thing in question; which is, when this preaching was. 3. Augustine vnderstandeth not by prison, hell. p. 127.3. b. p. 127. This is none of the three points, wherein we lay claime to Augustine. 4. He taketh flesh for the body onely; So doth the Replyer here, howsoeuer hee thinketh it may in other places be more largely taken. 5. Augustine readeth, which were in prison, not which are: This beeing graunted, yet hee in those three maine points before alleadged, confirmeth the Replyers exposition. 6. Both Augustine and Beda, by the spirit here vnderstand the holy Ghost. Ans. As though Christ also in his deitie by nature is not a spirit; or as though the workes of the Trinitie are inseperable, but that which one doth, the other doe also? All this cannot excuse him of vnshamefast boldnesse, that dare denie the exposition of these two fathers to make for the Replyer.

Thus the vntruths which hee obiected to the Replyer, are repaied home vpon himselfe, and in his owne net are his feet caught: the fraud and craft whereby he subtilly fought to vndermine an other, hath supplanted himselfe: it had beene good for him, if he had remembred that saying of Menander: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : that no lier can any long time be hid. Did he thinke, that his vntrue surmises and fraudulent accusations would neuer come to be examined? He obiecteth often to the Replyer, that falshood is growen into an habite with him: But whosoeuer will take the paines to lay together all his sophisticate stuffe,4. Imputation. and immodest leasings, can thinke no other but that he hath made a couenant with deceit and fraud: the saying is, vse bringeth perfectnes: and he hath vsed so much to speake vntruly, that he is growne to such a facultie and dexteritie therein, as that he can doe little els: and while he maketh no conscience in deuising tales, he sinneth still and staieth not, because he seeth it not: according to that excellent saying of Cyprian, Serm. de Livore. Dum peccatum existimatur leve & modicum, non timetur, dum non timetur, contemnitur, dum contemnitur, non facile vitatur, & fit coeca & occulta pernicies: while sinne is thought but a light and slender thing, it is not feared, while it is not feared, it is contemned, while it is contemned, it is not shunned, and so the mischiefe is secret and hidde.

The fourth imputation of grosse ouersights.
The accusation.

1. That it be lawfull for none to maintaine or defend, those doctrines, wherein the Protestants of England consent with other reformed Churches. Here he crieth out: when he set downe this petition, sure it is either he was much distracted, or not soberly minded. 2. b. p. 25.2. b. p. 25.

2. Because the Replyer hath as it is printed, Augustine saith well to Hierome, whereas it was Hierome that so writ to Augustin in his 13. epist. he exclaimeth, you vnlearnedly mistake. 2. b. p. 101.2. b. p. 101.

3. Because his Linx eye findeth applicate printed for explicate. 3. b. p. 6.3. b. p. 6.

4. Because Limbom. hath, if the Apostle had treated of Christs descensiō, before his resurrection: is this such a foule error? whereas he should haue said, if the Apostle had treated of Christs resurrection, before his ascension: he proclaimeth grosse ouersight. p. 54.2. b. p. 54.

5. Because Limbom. 3. b. p. 89. readeth 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , where it should be 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 .

6. Limbom. saith, The Lord vpheld Noe in all his preaching and profession against all the professors of the old world, condemning them, and sauing him: whereupon he crieth out: a wicked and intolerable speech. 3. b. p. 104.3. b. p. 104.

7. Amiddes the vncircumcised (not circumcised) as you falsely call them. p. 137.3. b. p. 137.

8. Limbom. But there came an other descention betweene, which immediately went before his descending to death and the graue: whereupon this peeuish prier would inferre, that the Replyer bringeth in a third descension, which should immediately goe before his descending to death and the graue. 3. b. p. 158.3. b. p. 158.

The iustificatim, or satisfaction.

1. THis curious ouerseer of others, might haue considered, that this one monosyllable (but) should haue beene inserted, and so the wordes to be read thus: (but) those doctrines, wherein the Protestants, &c. And thinketh he, that so small a word, might not easily escape the compositor in the authors absence: who neither knew of the printing of that booke, no was present at it? seeing that in other of his workes the like scapes haue beene made: sometimes by the adding of a word too much, sometime by leauing out: asHexapl. p. 8. l. 45. were not, is put for were: p. 65. l. 31. for the, in stead of, for that the: p. 283. l. 21. had yet reuealed, for, had not yet reuealed. And as (but) is here omitted, so is it there superfluously added, as,p. 193. l. 37. but though, for though.

2. The Replyer himselfe in an other place,In the Latine Epistle to the Archbish. of Canter. before the first Cent. in Synops. p. 4. citing the very same wordes, saith, vt bene Hieronymus Augustino, as Hierome saith well to Augustine: therefore this partiall Censurer, who otherwise is quicke sighted enough to espie motes in the authors eye in Synopsis, might haue compared that place with his censure: but his vncharitable partialitie blinded him. The Replyer therefore is cleared from this ouersight, who soeuers els it was. And whereas Hierome writ but 10. epistles to Augustine, and this is found in the sixt of them, he committeth a double ouersight, saying it is in the 13.

3. As though the Replyer himselfe hath not corrected that word among the errata before Limbom. shewing that explicate should be read for applicate: he had small reason therefore to take this slender exception.

4. He that taketh this transposing of the words, whether in the writer or the setter (an vsuall ouersight in compositors) for so great a fault, might haue remembred, that it is a grosser fault to mistake one word for another, especially of a contrarie sense, as ascending for descending, as he doth in these words: there is no word of ascending ioyned with it, as in all places, where it signifieth hell. 3. b. p. 184.3. b. p. 184. he should haue said, no word of descending: for to ascend to hell was neuer read And againe, he might hal e eene (if he had not beene willfully blind) that the Replyer in setting downe the obiection, placed the words in their right order: the transposing then of them afterward, by all likelihood was not his fault.

5. The word corrected by the Caviller, was before so amended by the Replyer in the errata, which his wilfull blindnes would not suffer him to see.

6. Likewise, professors in that place, should be read, prophane persons, as the Replyer himselfe hath noted it among the errata to Limbom.

7. The Replyer himselfe thus readeth in the one place not many lines before: they are gone downe with the vncircumcised: and therefore this friuolous fault finder might haue knowne, that the Replyer could read no otherwise in the other place: whose ouersight so euer it was.

8. Here this captious Controller picketh this quarrell for want of a small comma in parenthesis: for the words should be read thus: there came an other descension betweene, which went immediatly before,) his descending to death and the graue: that is, namely his descending &c. so there must be a pause betweene, before, and descending, and then there is no place left for this cauill.

The Recrimination.

1. He saith, he will take the paines to peruerse his pamphlet once againe, pref. p. 5.Pref. p. 5. he meaneth the Replyers book: but this may be well taken for a willing or wilfull scape: for in deede this spitefull spie fault, or rather make fault, doth nothing els but peruert, and, in his owne tearme, peruerse the Replyers pamphlet: his penne did here hit righter then he was aware.

2. There wanted no good will in you, but courage in a good cause: 2. b. p. 44. he would haue said, bad cause: but his penne is ouerruled to write the truth against his owne minde.

3. Now to proceede to your militiaes, p. 57.2. b. p. 57. he would haue said militaries: so, 3. b. p. 150.3. b. p. 150. here is a plaine exposition (of ascending and descending) he would haue saide opposition.

4. Touching the signification of the Hebrew & Greeke words, sheol and hades, vsed by Dauid, and Peter in this place, all religious diuines and learned Doctors, &c. which for a thousand fiue hundred yeares together flourished in the Church of God, alwaies taught, and the Christian world beleeued, that they signified onely soule and hell. 2. b. p. 119.2. b. p. 119. I pray you (Sir Controller) which of these two words in your Grammer learning signifieth soule? sheol, or hades?

5. Hee citeth Synops. p. 1218. p. 124.2. b. p. 124. in the margen, whereas that booke hath in all but pages 1114. Will not any man thinke that he was well ouerseene here?

6. Dauids perdiction. 2. b. p. 116.2. b. p. 116. It may be hee would haue said Dauids prediction. So 3. b. p. 78. auncient Nathers, for fathers. 3. b. p. 60.3. b. p. 60. in spirituae sancto for spiritu.

7. As for the auncients, Irenaeus, Athanasius, &c. and for late interpreters, Caluin, Bullinger, &c. as the reader may see in my former booke, it is also confirmed by the text it selfe, &c. 3. b. p. 72.3. b. p. 72. I thinke no man liuing can make any sense or construction of this inconsequent speech.

8. 3. b. p. 193.3. b. p. 193. he saith, S. Chrysostome, and S. Augustine, are both here named by your selfe among those, which agreed in that opinion: he should haue said, agreed not: for the Replyer propoundeth it negatiuely: neither did all the fathers agree in iudgement, that Christ descended into hell; to redeeme, &c. and then Chrysostome and Augustine are produced, as not agreeing with the rest therein.

9. So, 3. b. p. 184.3. b. p. 184. he putteth acending for descending, as is noted before, iustificat. 8. I omit many other literall scapes: as keek iustice, for keepe, and convertite, for convert, with such other slippes vsuall in his booke: which his trippings should not haue beene spoken of, but that he is so quicke sighted to note the least scapes in others. Let now the indifferent Reader iudge what he hath gained by obiecting grosse ouersights.

Thus it falleth out according to that saying of Chrysostome, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : that dishonestie is easily taken, and euery where intangled by it selfe. And I send him withall Hieromes posie: Suadeas homini,Hieron. Magno. ne vescentium dentibus edentulus invideat, & oculos caprearum talpa contemnat: let not this toothlesse gentleman enuie at the feeders teeth, nor the moule scorne the goates eyes: his moulish blindnes was ouerseene to carpe at them, which are sharper sighted then himselfe.

The 5. imputation of ignorance.
The accusation.

1. Because the Replyer translateth those wordes of Augustine: apud inferos custodiae mancipari: to be kept in hell: this Reuiler saith, euery Grammarian knoweth to be false, and that the true translation is, to be kept in bondage, or held captiue in hell: and further for this signification of the word, he alleadgeth Tullie, Lucretius, and Plautus. 3. b. p. 3.3. b. p. 3.

2. Because the Replyer translateth out of Hierom,5. Imputation. caprearum oculos, Goates eies; he thus layeth about him: doe you make no difference betweene capra and caprea, a Goate and a Roe-bucke? that you mistranslate. Hieroms words, euery boy may see. 3. b. p. 99.3. b. p. 99.

3. Thus this profound Grecian bestirreth him. p. 107.3. b. p. 107. And for the verbe 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , whereon you ground your whole fancie, the meanest Grecian knoweth it is not an actiue, but a passiue: and therefore most vnlearnedly translated by you, preacheth.

4. Againe, he according to his great skill chanllengeth also the Replier, for writing false Hebrew, as cheber for keber, 3. b. p. 136. a graue.

The iustification.

1. THough the Replyer hath not spent so much time in teaching of Grammer, as this perke Pedantius hath done; yet he knew what the proper signification of the verbe mancipo was, before the other knew how to decline a noune, or coniugate a verbe: for, though mancipo put absolutely, signifie to deliuer into bondage, or possession; yet the other word custodiae beeing put vnto it, doth somewhat alter the signification: So that mancipari custodiae, signifieth to bee committed or deliuered vp to keeping. And what is this else (Sir Grammarian) but in a shorter phrase, to be kept? And will he needs haue it englished, kept in bondage? then it will follow vpon Augustines words (Shall we thinke any to bee so impious, that dare say that the soule of our Sauiour, &c. was three daies held captiue in hell) that Christs soule was held captiue in hell, though not three daies. But I thinke hee is not so absurd, as to graunt, that it was there held captiue at all. These three latine Authors are impertinently alleadged: Lucretius, for the vse of the word mancipium: Plautus, for the word manceps: and Tullie, for the word mancipo: whereas he should haue produced them concerning this phrase, mancipari custodiae.

2. And euery Grammer or dictionarie boy could haue told him, that caprea as well signifieth a wildSee Adrianus, Iunius, and Dictionar. Thomasij. goate, as a Roe-bucke: Gesner saith, that caprae, eaedem & capreae, that the same are called by both names: which are wilde goates, whom the Grecians of their seeing call (dorcas) they stay in the mountaines, Gesn r de capris syluestr. and (though afarre off) see those which are comming, &c. He also sheweth out of Martial, that hee taketh caprea for rupicapra, for the wilde goate, or rocke goate. Gesner de caprea. And Gesner himselfe confesseth; that the (caprea) is de genere caprarum syluestrium, of the kind of wild goats. And he alleadgeth out of Aristotle, that the caprea is the smallest of all horned beasts: and therefore commeth neerer the nature of a goate, then of a bucke.

3. But our cracking Grecian goeth on to shewe his skill in the Greeke tongue, as he hath done in the latine. Indeed he is a very mean Grecian, that knoweth not that 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 may as well bee of the meane voice, as of the passiue, and so may be translated as well actiuely, preacheth; as passiuely, preached. And is it indeede vnlearnedly translated preacheth? Then were the Septuagints vnlearned, that so interpret the actiue in the Hebrew, tikra; for they were not so ignorant, as to expresse an actiue by a passiue. Likewise, they in the same place interpret another actiue in the Hebrew, taronah, by a verbe of the meane voice, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ; which both the Latine translater, Montanus, and Pagnine expresse by the actiue, praedicat, preacheth. All these also must goe for vnlearned translaters in the blind iudgement of this new Grammarian, who taketh vpon him to teach Diuines, when hee seemeth scarce able to teach boyes their Grammer.

4. But his Hebrew Rabbinicall science, will helpe out his small intelligence in the Greeke: forsooth a letter is mistaken, cheth is put for coph: a great matter. But is hee sure the author mistooke it? I thinke not: for hee might haue found else-where, that this word is written with coph: Synops. p. 1050. which corner hee had sought before to finde dust, but hee sawe not the besome, that would haue serued to sweepe it away.

The Recrimination.

1. As hee challenged the Replyer (but beside his booke) for the signification of the word caprea, 2. b. p. 107. what beast it should betoken; so hee shall first be apposed with the like question: what kinde of beast pardus is? a Leopard it is not, for that is called Leopardus, a Leopard, or Libbard. Then was this Etymologist ouerseene, in translating out of Origen, pardum cum haed , the Leopard and the Kidde.Gesner de Panthera. Gesner sheweth, that the Leopard is a diuers beast from the Pardus, as he alleadgeth out of Isidorus, Ex adulterio Pardi & Le nae, Leopardus nascitur The Leopard is ingendred by the adulterous commixtion of the Pard and the Lionesse. The Leopard he thinketh to be the same, which the English men call the Cat a mountaine. It is true that both our English translations doe read Leopard in that place of Isay, chap. 11. v. 6. but in so translating, they expresse not the word pardus in the Latine; but the Hebrew word namer, which serueth both for Pardus and Leopardus. But we pardon him this small ouersight, and will not insist vpon it.

2. But his Latine scapes are not so many, for it were a starke shame for a man to mis e in his ordinary trade: it would pi tie a man to see how he 〈◊〉 in the Greeke. 2. b. p. 178.2. b. p. 178. He translateth, Iob. 38. 17. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , the gates of hell: whereas both the interpreter of the Septuag. the Latine translator, with Vatablus and others, read the gates of death.

3. 3. b. p. 82.3. b. p. 82. Twice he setting downe the Replyers words, readeth 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , wheras the word is 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , as Limbomastix hath it. p. 32. 33. This error falling out twice within 10. lines, may argue ignorance rather in the penman, then ouersight in the Printer.

4. So in another place, hee writeth 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 for 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , to saue aliue. 1. b. p. 29.1. b. p. 29. in the margen; and that his ignorance may appeare, he still retaineth the same word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . 3. b. p. 86.3. b. p. 86. and 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , for viuificare, to reuiue, or saue: whereas, there is no such word at all in the Greeke,The confuter detected to bee no Grecian. much lesse in that sense. For the Greeke word which signifieth to saue, is 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , which maketh in the future 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : the other word, which beginneth with 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 is 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , which maketh 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 in the future, which signifieth to liue: and this for a tast of his greeke.

5. As vnsauery a relish hath his hebrew smattering: for in stead of the hebrew word carah to liue, 1. b. p. 30. he writeth caia, with aleph in stead of he, there being no such hebrew word. And lest he might excuse it by ouersight, he writeth the same word againe after the same manner. 2. b. p. 159.2. b. p. 159. and the third time so likewise. 3. b. p. 86.3. b. p. 86.

6. The hebrew word keber, hee according to his skill will haue taken for hell,3. b. p. 28. Psal. 88. 10. whereas all interpreters, doe there read and vnderstand the graue: the Septuag. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : the vulgar latine, Vatabl. Montan. Pagnin. in sepulchro, in the graue. And so our English also.

7. Further, in the very same place, that his hebrew profunditie may sufficiently be testified to all men, he noteth another word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , perdition, in the same verse: can any man tell what this word is?The Confuter discouered to haue no skill in the hebrew. the Hebrew word there vsed is 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , abaddon: where he leaueth out the letter vaf with the vowell cholem. What a shame is it for a man so vtterly ignorant in the languages, to take vpon him to controll others, beeing more blameable himselfe? By this viewe of his grosse slips in Greeke and Hebrewe, I am induced to thinke that report to be true, which hath beene giuen out by some that knewe him in Oxford; that what ostentation soeuer hee maketh now, hee was thought to haue no great skill either in Hebrew or Greeke then.

Now it falleth out vpon him, according to that saying of a Greeke Father,Gregor. Nysser. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : nothing maketh a man so vnshamefast (he would haue translated impudent) as a bad conscience. 6. Imputation. So this talkatiue tasker of others, hauing a bad conscience, not caring what he said or obiected to others, though neuer so vntrue, is without measure bold and bragging. I may say of him, as Hierom of his aduersarie, that professed generall skill in whatsoeuer:Apolog. 3. ad vers. Ruffin. tu, fella publice posita, Hermagoram nobis, & Gorgiam exhibes Leontinum: you (your chaire beeing set aloft) doe offer your selfe as another Hermagoras, and Gorgias; which tooke vpon them to dispute of any matter propounded vnto them. So this Crazy Craker would make himselfe a professed linguist in all the learned tongues, beeing nothing else then a wrangling verbalist.

The 6. imputaton of errors.
The accusation.

1. That Christ hath two kingdoms belonging vnto him, one as God, an other as God and man: and that his kingdome as hee is God, is incommunicable to any. 2. b. p. 201.2. b. p. 201.

2. That the Godhead is inuisible, incomprehensible: ibid. He counteth these paradoxes, contrary to the holy scriptures, and wondreth how they could fall from the Replyers pen.

3. Augustine taketh the spirit, 1. Pet. 3. 19. not for the diuine nature of Christ, but for the operation of the holy Ghost: which two you most erroneously confound, saith this error finder. 3. b. p. 127.3. b. p. 127.

4. He calleth it a strange position, that the true ioyes of heauen are in this world. 2. b. p. 207.2. b. p. 207.

The iustification.

1. THis Erring Censor, at the first erreth in misreporting the Replyers words, which are these; that kingdome, whereof Christ promiseth to make the theefe partaker, is not that kingdome, which belonged to him as God (for that is not communicable to any creature) but which is due to him, as Messiah. Limbomast. p. 18. It is not affirmed here, that Christ hath two kingdomes, but that it beeing one and the same kingdome, yet hath a diuers respect, one as it belongeth to Christ as God, an other as he is the Messiah, both God and man.

And that this diuers relation and respect of the kingdome of Christ, is not contrarie to the Scripture, (as this ignorant scripturian saith) but most consonant and agreeable to the same: it appeareth euidently by that diuine testimonie of S. Paul, 1. Cor. 15. 24. Then shall the ende be when he hath deliuered vp the kingdome to God, euen the father, when he hath put downe all rule, and all authoritie and power: v. 25. for he must raigne till he hath put all his enemies vnder his feete: v. 28. and when all things shall be subdued vnto him, then shall the Sonne also himselfe be subiect vnto him, that did subdue all things vnder him, that God may be all in all.

But because the deciding of this question,Diuers expositions brought of that place, 1. Cor. 15. 24. Then shall the Sonne himselfe be subiect. consisteth in the right vnderstanding of this Scripture, I will deliuer diuers expositions thereof, and approoue the best: I finde eight seuerall interpretations of these words: then shall the Sonne himselfe also be subiect.

1. The Sabellians, which denied the distinction of the three persons of the glorious Trinitie, and the Marcionites ioyning with them, did thus vnderstand it: Ista filij subiectio futura est; cum in patrē filius refundetur: this subiection of the sonne shal then be, when the sonne shal be resolued into the father: meaning that the person of the sonne, shall runne into the person of the father.Ambr. l. 5. de fid. •• . But Ambrose confuteth this wicked opinion, by this reason: Tum omnia, quae filio subiecta erunt, in filium & patrem resolventur: Then all those things, which were subiect to the sonne, shall also be resolued into the sonne and the father: as they say the sonne shall be resolued into the father: which were absurd to say: which was one of those grosse errors, imputed to Origene: that vpon those words of S. Paul, that God may be all in all, groundeth this erronious fancie:Hieron. ad Avitum. vniuersa creatura redigetur in eam substantiam, quae omnibus melior est, divinam scilicet: that euery creature shall be brought to that substance, which is the best of all, that is, the diuine.

2. An other exposition as bad as this, was, that the humane nature of Christ should be conuerted into his diuine, & penitus absorbendā à divinitate, and should be wholly swallowed vp of his deitie:Lib. 1. de Trin. c. 8. & 10. so Augustine reporteth. But this hereticall sense is ouerthrowne by the Apostles direct words: for in that the sonne is said to be subiect, it sheweth, that there remaineth somewhat to be subiect, otherwise there could be no subiection.

3. Some referre it to the bodie of Christ the Church, and vnderstand it of his faithfull members, in whom there yet remaineth some sinnes and imperfections: which till they be subdued vnto God, Christ in his members is not subdued:Orig. hom. 7. in Levit. c. 10. so Origene: donec ego non sum subditus patri, nec ipse dicitur patri esse subiectus: while I am not subdued to the father, neither is he said to be subiect to the father.

4. Others take it to be vnderstood of vnbeleeuers, not yet conuerted to the faith, which are not yet subiect: so that pars membrorum eius non est subiecta fidei, part of his members is not subiect to the faith: but in the ende, when as they also acknowledge the kingdome of Christ, then Christ with his whole bodie, shall be subiect vnto God: so Hierome. Hieron. Amando. tom. 4. But both these expositions are taken away by the Apostles words: for he is made subiect vnto the father, to whome he subdued all things, but to the sonne are all things subdued, therefore he speaketh of the subiection of the person of the sonne.

5. Some take this subiection to be spoken of the person of Christ, that thereby is meant nothing els, but that the sonne had his beginning and was begotten of the father: so Theophylact and Oecumenius vpon this place: and Ambrose to the same effect saith,Ambr. in 1. Cor. c. 11. Deus caput Christi dicitur, quia ab eo genitus, that God is said to be Christs head, because he was begotten of him. But there can be no subiection in the godhead: seeing the father and sonne are of the same nature in the Godhead; so one can not be said to be subiect to an other.

6. Others doe vnderstand this subiection, in respect of Christs humane nature,Ambr. l. 5. de fid. c. 7. as Ambrose: fecundum humanae naturae assumptionem erit illa subiectio: according to the assumption of the humane nature shall be that subiection. But then why should Christ be saide to be subiect now more, then in the daies of his flesh: if it be answeared, that it may appeare, that the man Christ, euen beeing glorified; is subiect vnto God: yet this doth not satisfie, for euen now Christ is entred into his glorie, and yet this time of the subiection of the sonne is not come.

7. There remaine then two expositions of Augustines the first is, that Christ is saide to deliuer vp the kingdome to his father,qu. 63. lib. 83. quest. non quod tunc incipiet, sed cognosci incipiet: not that then it beginneth to be, but beginneth to be acknowledged: now also the father raigneth, but then the kingdome of the father shall be made manifest. But neither doth this explanation fully satisfie: for neither now is the kingdome of Christ made manifest to all the world, but then shall appeare vnto all at his comming: if then the manifestation of the kingdome of the father, be the deliuering of it vp vnto him; then also the manifestation of the kingdome of the sonne, in that day, should also be the deliuering of it vnto him: and so in effect, he should be said to deliuer it vp, when it is (in that sense) deliuered to him.

8. The last therefore and best exposition is: that the Apostle speaketh of surrendring vp and resigning that kingdome of Christ vnto his father,How the sonne shall be subiect to his father. which was giuen him, as he was manifested in the flesh, vntill all his enemies be subdued:Calvin. in 1. Cor. 15. v. 25. as Calvine very well saith, Pater eum hac conditione ad dextram suam collocavit, &c. The father placed him vpon this condition at his right hand, that he should not leaue the gouernment, which he had receiued, before his enemies were brought vnder.Iun. annotat. in hunc locum. Likewise, learned Iunius Illud puta 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , quod filio imposuit pater, nam illud divmum, &c. He shall deliuer vp his Oeconomicall kingdome, which the father hath laide vpon his sonne, not that diuine and eternall (kingdome) common to the father, the sonne, and the holy Ghost: which was neuer laide downe by any person of the Trinitie, no not for a moment.

This diuers respect of the kingdome of Christ,Chrysost. in 1. Cor. 15. Chrysostome long since touched, in these wordes: Regna Dei Scriptura duo novit, alterū adoptionis & familiaritatis, alterum creationis, &c. The Scripture acknowledgeth two kingdomes of Christ, the one of adoption and familiar (care,) the other of creation: he is therefore by the law of workemanship and creation the King, of Iewes, Ethnikes, Deuills, and aduersaries; but of the faithfull, and such as willingly commit and subiect themselues, by familiar care. This kingdome also is said to haue a beginning: for of this it is spoken in the second Psalme, Aske of me, and I will giue thee the nations for thine inheritance. And he himselfe said to his Disciples: all power is giuen vnto me of my father: referring all as receiued of his father: not because he was not sufficient, but shewing that he was the sonne, and not vnbegotten: this (kingdome) therefore he will deliuer, that is, restore.

Here this learned father maketh two kingdomes of Christ (which are rather diuers respects or relations of one and the same kingdome) Christ is king ouer all creatures, as God and creator: and hee is king of his Church, as redeemer. This respectiue kingdome hee shall render vnto God.

Augustine treadeth in the same steps:Augustin. vbi prius. that as Christ ruleth the creatures, he shall raigne for euer: vt autem militat, &c. See Augustine further hereof. Imp. 11. recrim. 7. August. 7. but as he warreth against the diuell, there shall be an ende of his kingdome. And this is agreeable to the Apostle, Hee must raigne till hee hath put all his enemies vnder his feete. How Christs kingdome shall haue no end, & yet be deliuered vp. This is that kingdome which was giuen vnto Christ, as the Messiah. But it will be obiected, that the kingdome of the Messiah shall be euerlasting, as the angel said to Marie, Of his kingdome shall be no ende, Luk. 1. 33. The answere is, that the kingdome of the Messiah, in respect of the glorie and power thereof is euerlasting, the humanitie of Christ beeing by an euerlasting & inseperable vnion ioyned to his godhead in one person: but in regard of the manner and execution it shall determine:in 1. Cor. 15. 28. as Caluin excellently toucheth this point, Deum quidem agnoscimus rectorem, sed in facie hominis Christi, &c. Now we acknowledge God to be the ruler, but in the face of the man Christ: but then Christ shall restore the kingdome which he receiued, that we may perfectly adhere vnto God: neither by this meanes shall hee abdicate his kingdome, but shall drawe it after a manner from his humanitie to his diuinitie. And againe, then the vaile beeing remooued, wee shall manifestly see God raigning in his Maiestie. Neque amplius media erit Christi humanitas: neither shall Christs humanitie neede to come betweene (or to be a meane) &c. His meaning is, that in the kingdome of God, when Christ hath brought vs to his glory, there shal not then be such vse of the mediation and intercession of Christ, for remission of sinnes, for the subduing of our enemies, and such like,August. vbi prius. because then, as Augustine saith, fides cessabit, & pleno aspectu Deum intuebimur: faith shal cease, and we shall behold God with full sight. Now then, if this place of the Apostle be well waighed, where he speaketh of Christs kingdome, which shall bee deliuered vp vnto God: a kingdome wherein he that gaue it shall put down all things vnder him: a kingdome that is but vntill all his enemies be put vnder his feete:The Confuter ignorant in the principles of di inity. a kingdome, the gouernor whereof, shall himselfe be subiect to his father: no man can without blasphemy vnderstand this of the euerlasting kingdome of God, which hee neither receiued of any, neither shall it haue end, neither is hee himself subiect to any. It is therefore grosse error, and foppish ignorance in this new fangled nouice, to denie that the kingdome of Christ is to bee respected one way, as it belongeth vnto him as God; and another, as it is giuen him, as the Messiah.

2. As grosly ignorant doth hee shew himselfe in deciphering of the next error: in that the Replyer holdeth the deitie of God to be inuisible and incomprehensible: which this deepe diuine in his newe Theologie counteth paradoxes. And hereupon insulting, hee goeth on, flying from the point in question,The question discussed, whether the godhead be visible and comprehensible. whether the deitie shall bee, or can be of the creature comprehended. He busieth himselfe to prooue, that though not in this mortall and s nnefull life, yet in the next, we shall behold the glory of God. To this purpose he alleadgeth scriptures, that we shall see him as he is, 1. Ioh. 3. 2. of Fathers, as of Augustine, that the blessed Trinitie can no waies bee seene with humane eies, but with those eies, &c. of Ambrose, that wee shall then see with vncouered face the glorie of God. 2. b. p. 203.2. b. p. 203. He telleth vs of certaine heretiks that helde, that they which awake at the last day, shall not see God at all in his diuine essence and nature. Of which opinion was one Abailardus, against whom Bernard writeth. p. 207.2. b. p. 207. And thus hee fighteth with his shaddow, leauing the point in controuersie, whether the Godhead may be comprehended.

Briefly therefore to open this point, I finde that there haue beene two principall opinions concerning the vision of God, and the one contrary to the other. It is noted as one of Origens errors by Hierom, ad Avitum. that hee should thinke the Godhead of the father to bee so invisible, as that it could not be comprehended of the sonne. As this opinion maketh the Godhead altogether inuisible in one extreame; so some were so grosse and carnall, as that they held, Verbi Dei naturam, non solum mutabilem, sed etiam visibilem: that the nature of the word of God, was not onely mutable,August. lib. 2. de Trinit. cap. 8. & 9. but visible; as Augustine reporteth their opinion: vnto these the heretiks Anomoei came neere, of the which sort, Eunomius was a principall, who helde, se naturam Dei comprehendisse, that hee comprehended the nature of God:Theoph. in 3. Ephes. as Theophylact testifieth.

Now out of this question of the Comprehending of the Deitie, Christ, euen as touching his humane nature is to be excepted: of whom the diuine nature, because of that hypostaticall vnion, was fully seene and comprehended. Yea, Gennadius in his catalogue maketh mention of one Servus which writ against those who denied Christ when he liued here in the flesh, Deum carneis oculis vidisse, to haue haue seene God with the eies of his flesh.

Concerning then this point, a distinction is here to be receiued, touching the knowledge of the Godhead: there is cognitio simplex, & comprehensiua, a simple (that is absolute) and comprehensiue knowledge: & cognitio pro modulo & apprehensiua, and a knowledge in a certaine measure, and apprehensiue (onely.) This latter way God may bee seene and knowne:August. lib. 1. de Trin c. 6. But vpon these two conditions, as Augustine well obserueth, Humano visu nullo modo potest, &c. That first God can not be seene by any humane sight, but with that whereby they that see, are no men, but beyond men. Secondly, nemo vidit per seipsum, &c. No man hath seene by himselfe, that is, by his flesh and blood, but by the reuealing of the father, and enarration of the sonne. As the Euangelist saith, No man hath seene God at any time, the onely begotten sonne hath declared him. Thus God may and hath beene seene and knowne of the Saints in this life, as of Moses and Paul; but more fully in the next, whē we shall see the sight of God as he is.August. lib. 12. de Genes. ad liter. c. 10. But (as Augustine in another place) quantum eum capere creatura rationalis & ctualis potest) as much as a reasonable and intellectuall creature is capable of.

But touching the other kinde of knowledge, though God be cognoscibilis ex gratia, Espens. ex Aquinat. in 1. Tim. 6. to bee knowne by grace, comprehensibilis tamen a nemine quam seipso, yet hee is comprehended of none but himselfe. The reason is, because the deitle is infinite, the creature finite: so that which is of a finite nature, cannot comprehend that which is infinite. Augustine saith, si sanctis Angelis iam equales essemus, de Genes. ad Lit. lib. 4. c. 6. non vtique ita nota esset nobis diuina essentia, sicut ipsa sibi: if we were equall to the Angels, the diuine substance should not bee so knowne to vs, as it is to himselfe.

But here commeth in this quaint distinguisher with this glosse; God is not called incomprehensible, as if there were any thing of his, He speaketh contradictions. which his Saints shall not see, but because they see him not so perfectly, as hee is visible of himselfe. 2. b. p. 204.2. b. p. 204. Wherein he speaketh contradictions; for if God cannot be seene of vs, as he is of himself, then there is somewhat in the Godhead which we cannot see, which himselfe seeth. Then by grace apprehend him wee may, but comprehend him we cannot:August. epist. 50. ad Elpidium. Plenitudinem diuinitatis nemo de coelestibus etiam virtutibus conspexit: The fulnesse of the diuinitie none of the celestiall powers hath seene: but if there be nothing of his, which the Saints shall not see, then they should see his fulnesse.

Now then it is euident, which of the twaine holdeth a paradox: the Replyer, that saith the deitie of Christ is incomprehensible, or the erroneous Reprehender, which enclineth to the contrarie. He saith further, that the Replyers peremptorie words seeme to encline to those Errors, or rather heresies, of certaine Armenians, which denied that the Saints in the next world should see God at all in his diuine essence. p. 207.2. b. p. 207. But as the Replyer detesteth from his heart that erroneous opinion: so let this newfangled Dogmatist take heede, least in his comprehensiue fancie, he apprehend not and lay hold of the heresie of the Anomaeans before spoken of, that affirmed, they comprehended the essence of God.

3. As good successe hath this trifler in the third pretended error: for first, he misconceiueth (himselfe would here haue said, after his vnmannerly phrase, belieth) Augustine, that he taketh not the word spirit, for the diuine nature of Christ, but for the operation of the holy ghost: for Augustines words are these:Epist. 99. saepe antea veniebat in spiritu ad quos volebat, he came often before (that is, his incarnation) in the spirit to whome he would: doth he speake, I pray you, of the operation of the spirit here, and not of the spirit himselfe: to confound the spirit, and the operation of the spirit, is both great error and ignorance. Againe an other vntruth is, that Augustine by the word spirit, taketh not the diuine nature of Christ. If Augustine may be credited, he himselfe saith otherwise: Et ipse quidem filius in substantia deitatis spiritus est;& quid facit silius sine spiritu sancto vel sine patre, Epist. 99. cum inseperabilia sunt opera trinitatis? Both the Sonne himselfe is a spirit in the substance of the deitie: and what doth the Sonne without the holy Ghost, or without the Father, seeing the workes of the Trinitie are inseperable? Doth it not now appeare that Augustine indifferently taketh the spirit here, either for the diuine nature of Christ; or for the holy Ghost? say also then that Augustine doth ignorantly confound them.

Further, doth not the Scripture indifferently sometime ascribe the same worke to Christ, sometime to the holy Ghost: as our Sauiour saith, The spirit of my father speaketh in you, Math. 10. 20. which Marke nameth the holy Ghost, Mark. 13. 11. and S. Paul saith, Seeing ye seeke experiment of Christ, that speaketh in me, 2. Cor. 13. 3. So the Apostle saith, that Christ offered himselfe, Hebr. 7. 17. and thorough the eternall spirit he offered himselfe: chap. 9. 14. which Ambrose vnderstandeth of the holy Ghost.Lib. 1. de spir. c. 8. Say also that the Apostles ignorantly confound the diuine nature of Christ, and the holy Ghost.

But that it may fully appeare, who is both the ignorant, and errant too, (to vse his owne words) what a dangerous and suspitious speach is this, taking the word spirit, for soule, I might haue diuided Christ, and his spirit, without all suspition of ignorance, and his imputation of error: 3. b. p. 97.3. b. p. 97. yea,The ignorant Confuter diuideth Christ and his spirit. and dare any presumptuous spirit diuide that, which God hath inseperably vnited, the deitie, and humanitie, (to the which belongeth the soule 〈◊〉 spirit) in one person in Christ. Our Sauiour said vpon an other occasion, Let none put asunder that which God hath coupled together, Math. 19. 6. which rule holdeth in generall, that it is no lesse presumption, to diuide the humane soule from the person of Christ, which is hypostatically vnited for euer: I may here say with Hierome, Hieron. ad Damasum. Nescio quid veneni in syllabis latet: I can not tell what poison lieth hid vnder these syllables. But to returne his owne words, it may be that these things haue slipt from you, thorough heate of contention, rather then perswasion of heart: 2. b. p. 207.2. b. p. 207. yet I say againe with Hierome, Non bonae suspicionis est, cum in eodem sensu verba dissentiunt: it is no good suspition, when in the sa e sense the words doe dissent. If he hold the hypostaticall vnion of Christs soule and bodie with his Godhead, why doth he in words diuide them?

4. Concerning the fourth position, which he calleth straunge, the words of the Replyer are these: the ioyes of heauen may be truly, though not fully felt in this life: whosoeuer counteth this position strange, sheweth himselfe indeede a straunge fellow, and a straunger from such true feeling of heauenly ioyes. What thinketh he of those three,Svnops. p. 1013. Ambr. epist. 11. Peter, Stephen, and Paul, whome Ambrose giueth in instance: Petrus in monte Domini aspiciens gloriam Christi: noluit descendere, Stephanus cum Iesum vidit, lapidari non formidabat: Paulus raptus in Paradisum, vsum proprij non sentiebat corporis: Peter in the mount of the Lord beholding the glorie of Christ, would not descend: Stephen, when he sawe Iesus, feared not to be stoned: Paul, being rapt into Paradise did not perceiue the vse of his owne body. Thinketh hee, that they euen in earth felt not the true ioyes of heauen, though not so fully as they enioy it now? Yea this wrangler himselfe confesseth vpon these words of Peter with our eies we saw his maiestie: 2. Pet. 1. 16. that they enioyed the sight of his glorious maiestie in this life. 2. b. p. 205. Could he then be so forgetfull, as to call it a straunge position, that the true ioy 〈◊〉 heauen may be felt in this life: is it not a true heauenly ioy to see the Maiestie of God? how say you, (Sir Medler) speake out, is it not? your owne mouth doth condemne you:Coelum (inquit Deus) mihi sedes est, anima ergo iusti coelum est. in Psal. 121. What if the Replyer had said with Augustine, that heauen may be in this life, in the soule of the righteous: or with Ambrose, that the spirit of grace maketh the regenerate heauenly and celestiall: he would also haue thought in his vnheauenly blindnes,Cum coelestem faciat gratia spiritualis, multo magis terrenum creavit, Ambr. l. 2. de spir. c. 9. that he had spoken straungely also: for where heauen is, and men are become heauenly, what should let them, but to haue a feeling also of heauenly ioyes.

The Recrimination.

Now let vs turne aside a little to take a view of his blinde errors.

1. He holdeth, that the originall text of the Scriptures is corrupt, in these words; And say we must goe to the originals: I will runne with you to those fountaines, whose pure waters if the foule feete, and vncleane hands of some had not corrupted, &c. there could neuer be so many grosse and filthie errors drawne and deriued thence. 1. b. p. 26.1. b. p. 26.

2. The Syriake together with the Greeke he holdeth to be the originall tongues of the new Testament: ibid. whereas there can be but one originall tongue to the rest: if hee graunt the Greeke be the true originall, then the Syriake is not, which was translated out of the Greeke. So in an other place he reprooueth the Replyer for reiecting the Syriake,3. b. p. 57. as contrarie to the originall.

3. He preferreth the Latine text before the originall Greeke. Act. 2. 24. reading, the sorrowes of hell, for the sorrowes of death, as the originall Greeke hath: saying, I see no cause,3. b. p. 30. why I should not approoue the old Latine text: 3. b. p. 30. so also,Bellar. lib. 2. de verb. Dei. c. 10. 2. b. p. 154. shewing hereby of what house he commeth, and whose disciple he is, iustifying the Latine translation against the originall: of the which further, he thus vnreuerently writeth: As for that vulgar Greeke now extant, whether it be the true Authentike originall or no, is a question, because it is neither the most auncient, nor that which was most vsed in the Auncient Church: and beside that it is not free from corruption in diuers places. 3. b. p. 14.3. b. p. 14. What could be spoken more to the derogation of the authoritie of the Scriptures,The originall Greeke text of the new Testament disgraced. then thus to abase that originall, wherein the Apostles themselues did write. And in this prophane, and (little better) then Popish assertion, he hath vttered three great vntruths: that the Greeke originall, which we now haue, is not the most auncient; that it was not most vsed in former times; that it is in some places corrupt: none of these slaunders of the text, shall he euer be able to iustifie.

4. He calleth the booke of Ecclesiasticus, which the Church of England counteth among the Apocryphall bookes,Artic. 6. the word of God: 2. b. p. 70.2. b. p. 70. and in the next page before, he calleth it Scripture, I thinke it fit to ioyne Scripture with Scripture, making mention of Ecclesiasticus. And that we may see, he is no chaungeling; in an other place hauing alleadged a place out of Ecclesiasticus, he addeth, by which Scriptures it is plaine. 2. b. p. 136.2. b. p. 136. Such a diuine as he is, such is his Scripture: how audacious is this fellow, that contrarie to the iudgement and determination of this Church, dare make Ecclesiasticus a booke of Canonicall Scripture?

5. The question beeing demanded, why the soule may not be taken for his (that is Christs) whole person, as well as holy is vnderstood to be his flesh? answere is made, because cause it (that is, the soule) is no part at all of the whole person, while it remaineth seperated from the body: for of these two the whole person consisteth, when they are ioyned together liuing, &c. 2. b. p. 162.2. b. p. 162 Where, seeing the demaund is made concerning Christs soule, the answere containeth two manifest errors, or rather heresies: the one, that the soule seperated from the body, The confuter intangleth himselfe by his owne words, with an inclination to the heresies of the Apollinarists and Nestorians. was no part of Christs person: which sauoureth strongly of the heresie of the Apollinarists, that made the man Christ without a soule: the other, that the soule and body ioyned together (that is, in Christ, for of him the question is proposed) make his whole person; which inclineth to the heresie of the Nestorians, that made two persons of Christ; one, as he was the sonne of God; the other, as he was the sonne of man: which was the heresie also of Theodorus, condemned in the 5. Synod. ca. 12. I am right sorie, and it pitieth me for this poore man, that so windeth himselfe in his owne wordes, as that hee hath made a maze and labyrinth for himselfe, out of which he cannot get out. He, if he had met with the like aduantage, would haue cried out with open mouth (heresie, heresie) as he doth notwithstanding in diuers places vntruely obiect.Pref. to the 1. booke. p. 5. and 2. b. 43. But we forbeare him that tearme, as hauing slipped here rather of ignorance, and as one, to vse Hieroms words,Puritan heresie obiected. qui magis misericordia dignus, quam invidia: which had more neede to be pitied, then enuied.

6. Alleadging the corrupt translation of the Septuag. Iob. 38. 17.Dialog. 1. aduer. Pelagian. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , Did the porters of hell at the sight of thee shrinke for feare, or rather were astonished? whereas the true reading according to the originall is this: hast thou seene the gates of the shadow of death? he saith, they were here propheta verius, quam interpretes, Prophets more like then interpreters, and iustifieth their faulty translation against the original. 2. b. p. 178.2. b. p. 178.

7. He saith that Iehouah is the essentiall name of God, or rather the very essence it selfe, because his name and nature are all one. 2. b. p. 196. 2. b. p. 196. Who but this blinde archer would shoote such blinde bolts? if hee had said Iehouah signified the very essence of God, he had said wel; but that it is the very essence of God, is an absurd speech: for then the essence of God may be seene and vttered, as this word Iehouah can: then should it be lawfull to adore this name wheresoeuer we see it painted or written, if it were the very essence of God.

8. This is the guerdon laid vp for Gods children, 2. b. p. 202. to participate euen with his Godhead, for to this ende he tooke vpon him our humane nature, that we might be capable of his diuine substance: 2. Pet. 1. 4. and to this ende he alleadgeth Saint Peter, that by them we should be made partakers of the diuine nature. What strange speeches are these? that wee shall participate and be capable of the godhead and diuine nature, as Christ was of our humane? How much differeth he now from the Origenists error, that vniuersa creatura redigetur in diuinam naturam, that euery creature shall be resolued into the diuine nature; noted6. imputat. iustific. expos. 1. before: or frō the family of Loue, that say they are godded with God. It is held to be a great error in Osiander, that man is iustified by that iustice, not which Christ had as man, but whereby he was essentially iust as God: and this is well confuted by that Popish champion,Bellar. lib. 2. de iustificat. c. 5. both by scriptures and fathers: as Augustine expoundeth what this iustice is; qua nos eius gratia iusti sumus, &c. cum iuste viuimus, &c. non qua ipse iustus est, aeterna sua & incommutabili iustitia: wherby we are iust through his grace, when we liue iustly, &c. not by his eternall and immutable iustice, whereby he is iust himselfe. This error, this wandring discourser cannot bee free from, for if Gods children shall participate with the godhead and diuine substance, then also with the essentiall iustice, which is inherent in that diuine substance.

As for that place of Peter, it serueth not to prooue any such participation of the diuine substance, vnlesse hee will say, that euen in this life we are also capable of the godhead: for the Apostle speaketh of that conformitie to the diuine nature, which is in the Saints in this life; namely, in flying the corruptiōs of the world, as the next words shew, which doe serue to expound the former: so that (as a good interpreter saith) it is to be noted, that the name of nature here doth not signifie the substance, Marlor. in hunc locum. but the qualitie: yea, that great defender of the Pope-catholike faith (whom it may be he more respecteth,Bellar. ibid. then our Ecclesiasticall expositors) doth hit the right meaning of this place, expounding it by the like:Psal. 82. 6. and Ioh. 10. 32. as, I said ye are gods, and ye all are children of the most high: and, behold (saith the Apostle) what loue the father hath shewed on vs, 1. Ioh. 3. 1. that we should be called the sonnes of God: 1. Ioh. 4. 7. and, euery one that liueth i borne of God. This partaking then of the diuine nature, is not in the communication of his substance,vt conformes deo reddam r: id est, quasi deificari. but our conformation in holinesse and loue: so that we are as it were deified, in beeing made conformable to God: as M. Caluine speaketh, and long before him Bernard vsed the same phrase,Lib de diligend. deo. thus writing: Oportet nos in eundem affectum transire, vt quomodo Deus omnia propter seipsum esse voluit, sic & nos ipsos propter ipsum esse volumus: sic affici, deificari est. We must passe into the same affection with the creator, that as God would haue all things for himselfe, so that we be willing to bee our selues for him: so to be affected, is as it were to be deified. This our deifying, is not in passing into the same identitie of nature with God, but in imitating the diuine qualitie: not in beeing transformed into the same condition of substance, but in beeing chaunged into the like affection. It was the wicked opinion of the Manichees,ex Marlor. in hunc locum. that as wee were made out of Gods nature, so we should returne to it againe. Let this braine-sicke concluder take heed that hee fall not downe into this pit, standing so neere the brinke: saying, that we shall be partakers of the diuine substance & Godhead: in which sense also if hee vnderstand the blisfull fruition of the godhead, to be made partakers and capable of the diuine nature and godhead, as it seemeth his meaning is: it is also an erroneous speech, and neither agreeable to the scripture, nor antiquitie, as hath beene shewed: what that fruition of God shall be,In festiuit. sanctor. serm. 4. Bernard well sheweth: tripliciter in aeterna illa beatitudine fruemur Deo, &c. wee shall three waies enioy God in that eternall blessednesse, beholding him in the creatures, hauing him in our selues, and knowing the very Trinity in it selfe.

9. To descend, is a voluntarie action, whereas to suffer torments, is a violent passion. 3. b. p. 201.3. b. p. 201. In which vnaduised speech, he must either confesse, that Christ indured no torments for vs vpon the crosse, contrary to the Prophet; he was wounded for our transgressions, and broken for our iniquities: or that he suffered them violently, and so not voluntarily, Ioh. 10. 18. contrary to our Sauiours owne words: No man taketh it (that is, my life) from me, but I lay it down of my selfe.

10. He calleth certaine points of doctrine (exempli ied by the Replyer in another booke, for straunge and vnsound positions) most true and sound positions. 2. b. p. 20.2. b. p. 20. and yet afterward he confesseth, that the very first thereof, which is this,The ignorant confuter windeth himselfe by his owne words into suspicion of Arrianisme. that Christ is not originally God, is the most damnable heresie of Arrius, ibid. p. 21. Thus he ignorantly maketh himselfe an Arrian; for thus may his owne speeches be retorted against him: whosoeuer saith that Christ is not originally God, is an Arrian: this proposition is his owne: but so holdeth this confused confuter, in calling it a true and sound position: this also is his owne, for he calleth all those true and sound positions, there excepted against, whereof this is the first. Ergo: by his owne confession he draweth himself into suspiciō of Arrianisme. Indeede, this (heresie-mouther) that hath often in his mouth, heresie, heretike, obiecteth Arrianisme, but very simply to the Replyer, because alleadging the words of S. Paul of our Sauiour, iustified in the spirit, he by the spirit, vnderstandeth his diuine spirit and nature: as quickned, saith he, in your sense signifieth to be made aliue, so must iustified to be made iust, which is ranke Arrianisme: 3. b. p. 60.3. b. p. 60. poore silly fellow: and doth he know what Arrianisme meaneth: for though the Replyer medleth not here with the signification of the word iustified, but alleadgeth this sentence, for the vse of the word spirit: neither doth he take the word iustified, in the actiue signification, as we are said to be iustified: but passiuely, as when wisdome is saide to be iustified of her children, Math. 11. 19. that is, approoued and declared to be iust: yet if it be referred to Christs humanitie, it is no Arrianisme to say, that he as man was iustified, not from sinne, which he had not, but preserued by the inhabitation of the spirit from all sinne. If this be Arrianisme? then is Chrysostome an Arrian, who deliuereth these two expositions of this place:Chrysostom. in hunc locum. Sive hoc intelligi potest, &c. whether this may be vnderstood, because wisdome is iustified of her children, or because he did none deceit, as the Prophet testifieth, saying: Who did no sinne, neither was any guile found in his mouth: he vnderstandeth this iustification, of his preseruing from sinne. And what is it more, to say that Christ as man was iustified, or that he was sanctified: but our Sauiour saith of himselfe, whome the father sanctified, Ioh. 10. 36. if for Christ to be made iust, be Arrianisme; then also to be made holy? Then he seeth who is charged with Arrianisme in his sense, which once to thinke, were horrible blasphemie. I therefore say vnto him,Contra Pe il. l. 2. c. 101. concerning this imputation of Arrianisme, Vides ne quomodo ista non sententia, sed vescia, non solum mani sonitu, sed in capite vestro crepuerit: See you not, how this, not sentence, but bladder, not onely with a vaine cracke, but is broken vpon your owne head.

11. He affirmeth, that the baptisme of Infants, is not to be found in Scripture, by any (expresse) literall mention: 2. b. p. 170.2. b. p. 170. for though he leaue out that word expresse, yet he of whome he borroweth this opinion,The ignorant Confuter not sound, concerning the baptisme of Infants. vseth that terme: and he may put literall in his purse: his meaning is, that it is not expressely deliuered in Scripture: for there he impugneth that conclusion, that nothing is to be admitted, that is not expressely deliuered in Scripture. Now then that baptisme is expressely grounded vpon Scripture, and not vpon tradition: which must follow vpon the other, it is diuersly euident.Mark 10. 14. As because Christ commandeth little children,Eph. 5. 26. not to be forbidden to come vnto him: the Church is cleansed by the washing of water through the word: of which Church, infants are members: Christ commandeth to baptize all nations,Math. 28. 19. among the which children are counted. And seeing infants were circumcised, in stead whereof baptisme succeedeth,Coloss. 2. 1 . which the Apostle likeneth to circumcision: it is euident that the baptisme of infants is founded vpon Scripture: it is also the doctrine of our Church,Artic. 27. that the baptisme of infants is most agreeable with the institution of Christ: but where is the institution of Christ to be found, but in expresse Scripture: what shamelesse dealing then is this, to say that they which hold the contrarie, namely that the baptisme of infants is not expressely found in Scripture, doe maintaine the doctrine of the Church, when they directly impugne it. And this vncertaine and wandring opinion, giueth occasion to the wicked heresie of the Anabaptists: that affirme the baptisme of Infants to take beginning from theDisput. cont. Anabap. sub Egidio Hun. art. 77. Bishops of Rome, and not from the Apostles.

12. He further among those things, which are not expressely deliuered in Scripture, giueth in instance, our beleefe in the blessed Trinitie: 2. b. p. 170.2. b. p. 170. whereas the auncient Fathers of the Church, haue principally out of the Scripture prooued this Article concerning the Trinitie: as Origene vrged that place in the 51. Psal. where mention is made of three spirits:Homil. 5. in Ier. principalis spiritus pater, &c. the principall spirit is the father, the right spirit the sonne, and the free spirit the holy Ghost. But more pregnant is that place which Ambrose selecteth;1 Cor. 13. 13. the grace of our Lord Iesus Christ, the loue of God, and the communion of the holy Ghost, Ambr. in hunc locum. be with you all: Trinitatis hic complexio est, & vnitas potestatis: here is a coniunction of the Trinitie, and the vnitie of power. Augustine doth conclude the Trinitie from that heauenly vision in the baptisme of our Sauiour: Apparuit manifestissime Trinitas, Tract. 6. in Ioan. &c. The Trinitie appeared manifestly, the Father in the voice, the Sonne in man, the holy Ghost in the doue. But of all other those places are most full for the Trinitie: Math. 28. 20. Baptizing them in the name of the Father, and the Sonne, and the holy Ghost: and that other, 1. Ioh. 5. 7. There are three which beare record in heauen, the Father, the Word, and the holy Ghost: who of any iudgement reading these places, can denie for shame, but that the blessed Trinitie, is expressely deliuered in Scripture.

13. The coeternitie of the Sonne with the Father, is an other point obiected,2. b. p. 107. not expressely deliuered in Scripture: which is euident by the words of the Euangelist, that the word was in the beginning with God. Tract. 71. in Ioann. Augustine out of those words of our Sauiour, I and my father are one: concludeth his equalitie with God: & so consequently his coeternitie. Bernard inferreth it out of those words of the Prophet:Bernard. ser. 2. de nativit. Isa. 53. 8. Who shall declare his generation. And further he thus saith, Commendant nobis sacrae literae Christum ex patre, in patre, cū patre, &c. quod dicitur ex patre, ineffabilis est nativitas, quod in patre, consubstantialis vnitas, quod cum patre, equalitas maiestatis: 〈◊〉 verb. Isa. serm. 5. The sacred letters doe cōmend vnto vs Christ of his father, in his father, with his father: that which is said of his father, is his ineffable natiuitie, in his father, his consubstantiall vnitie, that with his father, the equalitie of his maiestie.

These fathers held, that these mysteries were not to be learned els where, then in the Scriptures, as most plainely therein expressed.

14. The proceeding of the holy Ghost, he thinketh also not to be expressely deliuered in Scripture: 2. b. p. 170.2. b. p. 170. whereas notwithstanding, our Sauiour saith directly, Whome I will send vnto you from the father:Ioh. 15. 26. and, whome the father will send in my name.Ioh. 14. 26. Augustine would prooue it out of those wordes in the Gospel, Mark. 5. 30. vertue went out of him: for it is cleare that the holy spirit is called vertue: but that other place is more euident, which Augustine vrgeth also: August. tract. 99. in Ioann. He shall not speake of himselfe: and, he shall receiue of mine:Ioh. 16. 13 14. Audire illi scire est, scire ess , à quo ergo illi essentia, ab eo scientia: to heare, is to him to know, to know, is to be: from whome his essence is, from him his science: seeing then he heareth and receiueth from the sonne, he also hath his essence and proceeding from the sonne.

These holy mysteries of the Trinitie, the coeternitie of the Sonne with the Father, the proceeding of the holy Ghost, the fathers take to be expressely set downe in Scripture, as Bernard, speaking of the mysterie of the Trinitie: Non potuit expressius commendari, Bern. serm 5. de verb. Isa. &c. It could not be more expressely commended, then it is necessarie to beleeue. To say therefore,The ignorant consuter giueth aduantage vnto the heretiks the Sabellians, Arrians, Macedonians. that these points of doctrine, are not expressely deliuered, is to giue way vnto those wicked heretikes, the Sabellians that denied the first, the Arrians the second, the Macedonians the third.

Beside these errors, adde as many more, which he calleth true and sound positions, beeing indeede vnsound and corrupt doctrines,Pref. to Antilog. Eccles. triumph. p. 90. 91. as is partly touched before: slaund. 10. and more at large els where: which I will not now repeate, because I am onely to deale here with this froward spirit, leauing to prouoke those of more modest cariage, though in some things otherwise minded.

Now, what hath this blind obiecter of error gained to himselfe, but his owne shame, who reckoneth that for errour and falsitie in others, which agreeth with truth and veritie; and seeth not his owne grosse and erring ignorance. He with a curious eye obserueth others slippes, and tripping (nor that neither) while himselfe stumbleth, and falleth downe flat: the Prophet saith, Woe vnto them that speake good of euill, Isa. 5. 20. and euill of good, which put darknesse for light, and light for darkenesse: I pray God he be not of that number. Ambrose saith well,Lib. offic. 2. c. 17. talis consiliarius sit, qui nihil nebulosum habeat: He that aduiseth others, must not bee (darkened) or ouercast with clouds himselfe.Ad Nepotian. And Hierom wel admonisheth, Non confundant opera sermonem tuum: Let not thy workes confound thy words. And this blinde guide, while he noteth other mens wandrings, should not haue gone himselfe out of the way: he telleth the Replyer most disdainefully, and withall vntruely, that hee hath neuer a good thought of his owne. 2. b. p. 106.2. b. p. 106. while his own heart is pestered with erroneous and malitious cogitations: and no maruell, for as Iosephus well saith, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : a temperate heart is the hauen of (good) meditations: while the heart therefore boyleth with intemperate enuie, the spring head being troubled, the waters issuing from thence cannot be cleane: I wish hee may haue grace to see his errors, and to confesse his ignorance. Tully hath a good saying,Philip. 12. Cuiusuis est hominis errare, nullius nisi insipientis perseuerare in errore: Any man may erre, but none but vnwise men continue in error. Let him not thinke it folly to reuerse with iudgement, what hee hath written with error: It is a wise mans part rather to amend what is amisse, and to straighten that which is crooked, & to rectifie by the line of truth, that which hath beene set downe against the rule of truth: and so againe I commend vnto him, that worthy sentence of Cicero, Optimus est portus poenitenti, Philip. 12. mutati. consilij: the best hauen to repentāce, is to change the (heart and) purpose.

The 7. imputation of Blasphemies.
The accusation.

1. The heauinesse which Christ felt in his soule, was not through the horrour of eternall death,Synops. 997. 1004. 1005. as you and others doe blaspheme, &c. 2. b. p. 193.2. b. p. 193.

2. Why doe you not exempt it (that is, the soule of Christ) from all kinde of death whatsoeuer, but then your blasphemous hell torments, which you make a third kinde of death of the soule, cannot stand. 2. b. p. 91.2. b. p. 91.

3. Let the godly iudge whether those your inward afflictions, reach not to the height of sinne and damnation, and so consequently proue your doctrine in this point to be blasphemous, euen by your owne confession. 3. b. p. 67.3. b. p. 67.

4. By this time, I trust euery well disposed Reader doth see, how this your exposition of this prophesie of Dauid, hardeneth the Iewes, encourageth Atheists, iustifieth old damned Heretiks, confirmeth Saduces and Epicures, which deny the immortalitie of the soule, &c. and finally openeth the way vnto blasphemie, paganisme, and all impietie. 3. b. p. 51.3. b. p. 51.

The iustification.

1. HOw iniuriously this belcher out of blasphemie dealeth with the Replyer, his owne conscience, if it be not seared with an hot yron, knoweth; & there neede no other iudge: for the Replyer in as plaine tearmes as hee could vtter it, denieth that there was in Christ any feare of eternall death,Synops. p. 997. in these words: Wee willingly graunt, that Christ feared not hell fire, nor euerlasting destruction: these authorities presse not vs, but rather helpe our cause; for Christ neither feared temporall, nor euerlasting death, as these fathers witnesse, and the Apostle saith he feared, Heb. 5. 7. what then remaineth, but that he feared the cup of Gods wrath mixed with death: Cyprian. serm. de passion . and as Cyprian saith, before cited, difficultatem extremi exitus, The difficultie or hardnesse of his last passage, that is, in respect of Gods wrath tempered with it. And in the other place quoted, these are the words;Synops. p. 1004. Though Christ neither felt, nor feared euerlasting death, yet he both felt and feared his fathers displeasure that causeth it. 7. Imputation. What impudencie is this,Great vnshamefastnes in the confuter to charge the Replyer to affirme that which he denieth. to vse his owne tearme (for I may call a spade a spade) to charge the Replyer to affirme that which he instantly denieth: let the charitable reader iudge of him in the rest, as he findeth his faithfull dealing here: when hee quoteth any place out of the Replyers bookes, not rehearsing the words, suspect the like fraud. This false charge then of blasphemie, returneth vpon his owne head, and by the lawe of retalian and equalitie, he should be censured as a blasphemer, for beeing a false witnesse therein against another.

2. The Replyer freeth Christs soule from all kinde of death of the soule, which is either by sinne, or damnation; though beside these, a kinde of death may be affirmed to haue beene suffered by Christ in his soule, Synops. p. 978. in respect of the inward afflictions and perplexitie which he indured, wrestling euen with the wrath of his father: yet hee wisheth this phrase of speech to bee forborne and discontinued; therefore hee freeth the soule of Christ in effect, from all kinde of death of the soule properly so called. Further, if it be blasphemous to say that Christ suffered some of the sorrowes and torments euen of hell in his soule, what thinketh he of that propheticall saying of Dauid, Psal. 18. 3. The sorrowes of hell haue compassed me: and Act. 2. 24. he loosed the sorrowes of hell: as the Latine interpreter readeth: doth he also say, that these are blasphemous speeches? nay doth it not come neerer blasphemie, to denie Christ to haue suffered in his soule for our soules, and so to rob him of the most glorious part of his passion?

3. And doth he count it also blasphemous, to say that Christ suffered the inward afflictions of his soule? then he most blasphemously must charge the Prophet Dauid with blaspemie,Psal. 88. 15. who saith in the person of Christ, Thy terrors haue I suffered from my youth: or as the Latine interpreter whom Augustine followeth, terrores tui conturbauerunt me, thy terrors haue troubled mee: For that diuers sayings in this Psalme are propheticall, as that vers. 5. free among the dead. Augustine confesseth, who saith also of this whole Psalme,in Psal. 87. Christi vocem, &c. Let vs heare the voice of Christ singing in the prophesie. Further, when the Prophet saith,Isa. 53. 11. he shall see of the trauaile of his soule: or, as the Latine interpreter, because his soule laboured: what other trauailes and labours of the soule were these, then the spirituall and internall? And is he not ashamed to say, that these inward afflictions are blasphemous, euen by the Replyers owne confession, as reaching to sinne and damnation: when as in direct words he freeth Christs soule from all sinne and damnation: but not from inward afflictions. Further, if all inward afflictions include sinne and damnation, then he wil fasten vpon S. Pauls soule sinne and damnation: who confesseth he had fightings without, and terrors within: and so was not voide of inward and spirituall afflictions. This then is the issue, vpon his owne words, either to denie, that Christ suffered the inward afflictions and terrors of the soule, which to him is inglorious, in denying the most honourable part of his sufferings, or if he did, that he incurred either sinne and damnation, which to thinke were blasphemous.

4. If to vnderstand by nephesh, the soule, that is, the life, in that prophesie of Dauid, Psal. 16. doe breede all those supposed inconueniences; then belike the Prophet Dauid, in saying,Psal. 88 3. My life draweth neere to hell, gaue way and occasion to Atheisme, impietie, blasphemie: for, he there calleth it life, not soule: if those absurdities follow vpon the construction of the one place, it can not be auoided in the other. Againe, what an absurd consequent is it, that the immortalitie of the soule should fall to ground, and so the Sadduces and Epicures be confirmed, if it be not prooued from this place? As though there be not many more places pregnant in Scripture, to prooue the immortalitie of the soule? And as for iustifying of olde damned heretikes, let him take heede, least by casting Christs soule into hell, the place of the damned, he make not a way for them himself:Treatise of Banisters errors. for two heresies there were, one that Christs soule descended into hell, there to suffer the paines and torments,August. haeres. 7 . which the damned spirits abide: an other, that Christ by descending into hell, deliuered all which were there in torment: to these heresies they come nearer, which affirme Christs locall de cent in soule to hell, then they which denie it.

Then to returne his owne words: by this time I trust, euery well disposed Reader doth see, how this your obiection of blasphemie reboundeth vpon your owne head, with shame enough: while he would set fire on an others tower, his owne braines are pasht out with Abimelech: and his serpentine obiections are deuoured of a contrarie serpent: His vncharitable charge, is discharged vpon himselfe: it no more hurteth the Replyer, then the viper, that leaped vpon Pauls hand: and as Diogenes wittily said of one, whome he heard to raile vpon him: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , let him also beate me beeing absent: so false calumniations shall no more fasten vpon the innocent, then blowes vpon him that is absent. And as for these so improbable and vnreasonable accusations of blasphemie, I may say with the Orator; •• cer. Phil. 14. Opinor eum non tam fuisse sceleratum qui fingeret, nec tam furio sum qui crederet: I did thinke he had not beene so leud to imagine them, nor so without wit to beleeue them.

The Recrimination.

I am loath to set vpon this (chafing Challenger) and to charge him in the same kinde: It is no small matter to lay vpon any the imputation of blasphemie; seeing the greatest sinne in the world is called by this name. But seeing he which prouoketh, is the beginner of the battell, and the defender doth but take the chalenge, I hope the fault is the lesse, if I shall answer him in his owne kinde, and beate him with the weapon, which he hath chosen. It was a good excuse, which Tullie vseth in answearing Salusts inuectiue: Si mihi forte offendimini, iustius huic quam mihi succensere debetis, qui initium introduxit: If ye perhaps be offended with me, ye ought to be more iustly incensed against him, then me, because he began the quarrell.

1. His presumptuous speeches, and some of them tending to blasphemie, in part are these: 2. b. p. 8.2. b. p. 8. I will comfort my selfe with that saying of our Sauiour: de bono opere lapidor, I am stoned for my good worke: what presumption is this, to compare himselfe a sinnefull man, with the holy person of Christ; and his intemperate, slaunderous, railing, and vncharitable writings, with Christs most heauenly sermons and miracles?

2. He confesseth that Christ loo ed the sorrows of hell for himselfe: 2. b. p. 37.2. b. p. 37. then it must follow, that he was in the sorrows of hell before he loosed them, whether he saith in soule he descended: (for the knot must first be tied, before it be loosed:) but this he himselfe in many places counteth a blasphemie to affirme: before blasph. 2. 3.

3. The word (openly) prooueth, that it was no triumph at all vpon the crosse: for that conquest vpon the Crosse, was openly an ouerthrow, and therefore no triumph. And againe a little after: If Christ triumphed on the Crosse, as you say he did, it was according to the proverbe: triumphus ante victoriam, a triumph before victorie. 2. b. p. 188.2. b. p. 188. What a derogation is this to the triumphant and victorious crosse of Christ, thus contrarie to the Scriptures to say, that it was an ouerthrow, rather then a triumph: seeing the Apostle thus witnesseth,Hebr. 2. 15. that he might destroy thorough death, him that had power ouer death, that is, the Deuill. If the Deuill were destroied by the death of Christ, then was he conquered, and ouerthrowne: how then did he not tremble to say, that the conquest vpon the crosse, was openly an ouerthrow: and did not our Sauiour himselfe say vpon the crosse, It is finished: what els was finished, but the redemption of mankind, in deliuering of mankinde from the kingdome of Satan. And was his heart so prophanely caried with the spirit of derision,The Confuter scoffeth at the triumph of Christ on the Crosse. to scoffe at Christ by that vsuall prouerbe, triumph before victorie: this is a more heinous offence, then Ismaels was to scoffe at Isaak. He may remember, whome he scornefully calleth Ismaelites: 2. b. p. 18.2. b. p. 18. Such an Ismaels tricke shall he not finde in all their writings: it were better they were all set on a light fire, then that their pennes should be stained with such impietie. God mollifie his hard heart, that he may in time repent him of this so great iniquitie.

4. As the theefe was partaker of Christs humanitie, in suffering with him on the crosse so he was partaker with him in all his deitie: 2. b. p. 199.2. b. p. 199. to this ende he tooke vpon him our humane nature, that we might be capable of his diuine substance: p. 203. ibid. p. 203. if we should not communicate with Christ in all his glorie, &c. we should be no better then the wicked. 2. b. p. 205. ibid. p. 205. What harsh stuffe is this, and fit to be waighed in the ballance of blasphemie, See before Recrimin. err. 9. that we shall be partakers of Christs diuine nature, as he was of our humane: and so the Saints shall become Gods with Christ, as he was made man with vs.

5. Resurrection is attributed by Peter, as well to Christs soule returning out of hell, as to his bodie rising out of the graue. 3. b. p. 38.3. b. p. 38. What a strange paradox is this? In the Creede we are taught to beleeue the resurrection of the bodie,The Confuter hath deuised a new kinde of resurrection of the soule. but the resurrection of the soule in the next world, was yet neuer heard of: neither hath Peter any such meaning: for that was raised of Christ, which rested in hope: but it was his flesh (not soule) that rested in hope, Act. 2. 26. that is raised, which before was sowne by death: but the bodie onely was so sowne, not Christs soule: both these propositions are S. Pauls: that which thou sowest is not quickened except it die, 1. Cor. 15. 36. so also is the resurrection of the dead: 24. it is sowne a naturall bodie, and is raised a spirituall bodie. v. 44. How farre now is he from bringing death vpon Christs soule, (which could not be quickened in the resurrection, except it first died) which he himselfe counteth blasphemie.

6. Is there not a most plaine distinction betweene the holy Ghost, The confuter affirmeth a distinction betweene the holy Ghost and Christ, not in person onely, but in the diuine nature. who foretold, and Christ, who endured these afflictions; and that not in person onely (which is the point I stand vpon) but in nature also, I meane his diuiue nature, &c. 3. b. p. 94. Doth hee not here manifestly affirme, that there is a plaine distinction betweene the holy Ghost and Christ, not in person onely,2. b. p. 94. but in his diuine nature? was this doting diuine well aduised thus to write? What Macedonian heretike would haue written more in disgrace of the holy Ghost, then to say he is distinguished from Christ, euen in his diuine nature?

7. And as hee dealeth with Christ himselfe,Error and arrogancie ascribed to Peter by the Confuter. the like measure he offereth his seruants, for thus irreuerently hee writeth of Peter: you thinke all men to be vncleane & impure in comparison of your selues, which was partly Peters error, Act. 10. 2. b. p. 107.2. b. p. 107. But doth hee speake as he thinketh, had Peter such an opinion of himselfe, as to thinke al men vncleane and impure beside: Peter onely held as yet them of the vncircumcision to be vncleane, not of any singularitie of opinion, but because it was not yet reuealed to him.

8. Thus also hee serueth the Prophet Dauid, Dauid almost in hell, in this prophane Confuters opinion. making him almost in hell: for that place, Psal. 94. 14. If the Lord had not holpen mee, my soule had almost dwelt in silence. This place of silence, he ignorantly vnderstandeth of hell. 2. b. p. 149.2. b. p. 149. yet falsly printed 159. But Dauid else-where declareth his hope, that he was sure neuer to goe to hell: when I awake I shall be satisfied with thine image, Psal. 17. 15. This holy Prophet now is much beholding to this (pragmatical Nouelist) in placing him almost in hell.

9. The like censure hee giueth of that holy man Iob, Iob also in hell in his prophane conceit. vnderstanding those his word the graue (or hell saith hee) shall bee mine house, and I shall make my bed in the darke, Iob. 17. 13. of hell: for the graue is neuer called the place of darkenesse. 3. b. p. 152.3. b. p. 152. and herein hee maketh Iob a figure of Christs beeing in hel, p. 153. What iniury doth this (vnholy glossograph) offer to this holy man, who was most sure he should neuer goe to hell, thus professing his faith; I am sure my Redeemer liueth, &c. Iob. 19. 25.

10. And to end where I began, with his hard vsage, as toward the seruants, so against the Lord and master himselfe: these words of Peter, quickened in the spirit, hee applyeth to Christs soule in this sense; that hee was not made aliue in soule, but kept or preserued aliue. 2. b. p. 85.2. b. p. 85. and alleadgeth to this purpose other places, where the word is so taken:Nehem. 9. 6. as Nehemiah speaking of the heauens & earth,Iam. 1. 21. saith, thou preseruest them: and Saint Iames saith, receiue the word with meekenesse, &c. which is able to saue their soules. Now then, if Christs soule be said to bee preserued aliue in either of these senses,Christs soule subiect either to corruption or damnation, by this profane Confuters words: a most horrible blasphemie. as in the first, then was it saued from death and mortalitie, and corruption, as the heauens and earth are; and so the soule of Christ should not be immortall of it owne nature, but by speciall preseruation: if he take it in another sense, to be saued as our soules are, which is from damnation, then it will follow, that Christs soule was subiect to damnation, as ours are without him, and so had neede of saluation: which way soeuer he saith his soule was saued aliue, hee must needes incurre most horrible blasphemie. Here I may now fitly apply Hieroms words vttered against Heluidius: aduers. Helvid. Illud dico praeveniens, gloriae mihi fore tua maledicta, cum eodem, qu Mariae detraxistiore, me laceres, & caninam facundiam servus domini pariter experiatur & mater: This I say aforehand, that your railing will bee a glory vnto me, when as you tare me with the same mouth, whereby you backbite Marie: that both the seruant of the Lord, and his mother, may together haue experiēce of your doggish eloquēce. But I may say more, that the seruant neede not thinke much to be slaundered, when as the Lord himselfe is blasphemed.

I am sory in my heart (God is my witnesse) that this man was so farre carried in his vncharitable heate, as not onely to breake charity toward men, but to violate pietie also toward God: and let him remember what the Apostle saith,Hebr. 10. 31. It is a fearefull thing to fall into the hands of the liuing God. in Epist. ad Roman. Augustine hath a seuere sentence, Si quis per inuidiam opera diuina blasphemat, quoniam bonis dei, hoc est, donis dei malitia sua resistit, in spiritum sanctum peccare, & propterea spem veniae non habere existimandus est: If any man through enuie doe blaspheme the workes of God, because he by his malice resisteth the good things of God, that is, the gifts of God, he is to be thought to s nne against the holy Ghost, and therefore to haue no hope of forgiuenesse. Let him therefore take heede, lest while hee goeth on, by enuy miscalling the gifts of God in others, counting the defence of the truth blasphemie, hee bee not giuen ouer euen to blaspheme the truth it selfe, and the Lord of truth, and so endanger his owne soule: he knoweth what the ende of blasphemers is: One may say vnto him,Philip. 2. as Tullie did to Antony, miror te, quorum facta imitere, eorum exitus non perhorrescere: I maruell that you are not afraide of their ende, whose doings you imitate: and let him in time recall his words, and bee sorie for the slips of his penne; lest what he hath erred in word, hee pay for in deed: and for the blots of his penne, feele the smart of punishment, according to that saying of Theophylact: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , what we haue offended in word, we shall suffer punishment for it in deede.

The 8. imputation of arrogancie.
The accusation.

1. BEcause the Replyer sometime setteth downe Synopsis in the margin, referring the Reader to that booke for breuitie sake;8. Imputation. as treating how the article of the descension hath beene omitted in diuers auncient Creeds: he addeth,Synops. 1034. as elsewhere is shewed; he calleth it in solent vanitie, which I should wonder at, but that I knowe 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 is alwaies 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . 2. b. p. 175.2. b. p. 175. and in another place, arrogant vanitie.

2. What arrogant presumption is this in a man of your profession, who should be an example of humilitie, thus imperiously, if not sawcily, to checke and controll all the learned of former ages, as if none of them knew the originall reading in this place, till you came this last day to teach them. 3. b. p. 114.3. b. p. 114.

3. It doth not become inferiour persons publikely to checke and controll their superiours for euery priuate difference in opinion: such malepart sawcinesse I leaue to you, and such other whose common practise it is. 3. b. p. 101.3. b. p. 101.

4. Such is your ambitious humor, that all your geese must be swans, and euery one a present for a prince; in so much that you pittifully complaine vnto the Kings maiestie of the small reward that you, &c. haue receiued, &c. 2. b. p. 103.2. b. p. 103.

The iustification.

1. ANd is it such insolent vanity for a writer, for breuitie sake to haue reference to some of his former bookes; then he himselfe must goe for an insolent craker, that vsually blotteth his margen, with making mention of his first worthy treatise: as 3. b. p. 54. p. 55 p. 42. and in many places beside. Doth he thinke also Augustine an insolent man therein, who often hath relation to other of his workes?De baptism. l. 2. cap. 1. Noui quomodo soleat contristare lectorem, &c. I knowe how it vseth to grieue the Reader, when from the booke which he hath in his hand, when he falleth into any hard questiō, he is sēt to another, where he may finde the solution thereof. As for his insolent tearmes of 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , and 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , hee himselfe is both, and 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , and 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 too, a louer of strife and contention. And yet it were better to be 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , as the Replyer is not, then 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , as the Confuter is. And for his obiection of 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ,Ad Rustic. selfe loue, Hieromes portraiture doth shew his liuely image: Quidam, qui sibi videntur scioli, pomparum ferculis similes prodeunt in publicum, vt caninam exerceant facundiam: Some, which seeme vnto themselues to know somewhat, doe come forth in publike, like messes of state, to exercise their doggish eloquence. There is no such signe of selfe loue, as when one doth braue a bad cause with insolent words, and bendeth his tongue and penne wholly to the disgrace of others: for he which seeeth his owne faults, will haue no leisure to prie into an others.

2. The occasion, which this (brauing bragger) taketh, thus to set vp his bristles is, by reason of these wordes of the Replyer: how translatours doe interpret we are not so much to respect, as how the Originall readeth: therefore because in the originall Greeke there is no word to expresse [were] we are not bound to retaine it. Limbom. p. 38. Is this any imperiousnes or saucines to preferre the Originall before all other translations? And haue not Arias Montanus, who leaueth the verbe out altogether, and Beza, who translateth it in the present tense, according to the natiue sense of the participle of the present tense, which is to be supplied, and the Geneva translators also, followed that reading, which the Replyer preferreth? And are these also for so doing, saucie and imperious, as (this saucie fellow) seemeth to inferre: who is iustly to be taxed for this malapertnes,Philippic. 10. with those words of the Orator: Cur eos, quos omnes venerari debemus, solus oppugnas: why dare you onely impugne those, whome we ought all to reuerence?

3. But who is he that checketh superiours for euery priuate difference in opinion? not the Replyer, who thus writeth, that there are most reuerend learned men of both opinions. Limbom. p. 5. And how doth he checke the iudgement of superiours, in the exposition of that place of Peter, B. Bilson in his first booke. seeing a reuerend Prelate of our Church (as this arrogant Controller himselfe confesseth) did encline to that opinion of Noahs time: 3. b. p. 105. how doth he checke authoritie, that consenteth with men of authoritie? But he himselfe is the man, that controlleth superiours: who chargeth the great Bible set forth by the authoritie and consent of all the Bishops of the land,3. b. p. 49. with maintenance of blasphemie: as shall afterward be more fully shewed in theRecrimin. 6. Recrimination. Indeede this fauning flatterer seemeth euery where to insinuate himselfe to authoritie, thinking vnder that pretense, to finde passage for his errors: as I feare me some in these daies, speake in defence of the place of Bishops, that hate the persons of Bishops. But in true loue and reuerence to that honourable calling, the Replyer thinketh great skorne to be compared with such a painted Parasite, (to returne his owne tearme.) He may be thought to be such a friend vnto them,Dialog. 1. adv. Pelag. as Hierome speaketh of: Pulchre adulator apud philosophos definitur, blandus inimicus: A flatterer is well defined among the Philosophers to be a fauning enemie. And as he speaketh of an other: Verba ei de alieno stomacho fluunt: Hieron. ad Theophyl. His words are framed to please other mens humours: he speaketh not out of his owne heart.

4. As is the building, such are the props thereof: the accusation is here salse, and the grounds thereof are vntrue: for neither hath the Replyer dedicated all his books to the Prince, nor yet the third part of them: nor yet doth he in that place, which he misreciteth, complaine of his small reward for his bookes, but laieth open the generall complaint of students, and the common vilipending of bookes. And doth not he the same, complaining that bookes are in so small request with many, Pref. to the 1. booke. p. 5. that they esteeme them no otherwise, then gentlewomen doe their fancie flowers, which in the day time they carrie in their heads, and in the night cast at their heeles: doth he thinke himselfe also worthie to weare a goose feather for thus writing. But as for the Replyers geese (for so he disdainfully calleth some of his bookes) they shall be able to compare with his supposed swannes, which by the hissing may seeme at the first to be swannes birds, yet by the gagling, shew, they were but hatched in a goose nest: for he is like vnto him, whom Hierom taxeth, Pisoniano vitio laborat, cum loqui nesciret tacere non potuit: he hath Piso his fault, he knoweth not how to speake, and yet he can not hold his peace. As the goose can not sing, and yet shee will alway be gagling. Erasmus spake it modestly of himselfe, but it may be truly said of this intempestiue writer:Ad Rustic. Multi hoc morbo laborant, mei similes, qui cum scribere nesciant, tamen à scribendo temperare non possunt: many haue my fault, who not knowing how to write, yet can not refraine from writing. When he hath cast all his cards, and taken his accounts, and seeth how little he hath gained by thus writing, he will beshrew himselfe, that he followed not Hieromes counsell: Ne ad scribendum cito prosilias, neque levi ducaris insania: Doe not hastily fall to writing, and be not caried away with cockbraine fittes.

The Recrimination.

But seeing he putteth the Replyer to it, to finde out the arrogant spirit indeede, who can not better cleare himselfe of this iniurious imputation, then in returning it thither, where it shall finde best entertainment: he shall be set forth in his owne colours, and by his owne words I wil sound the depth of his high and haughtie spirit.

1. I will ascend by degrees, and giue in the first place the least tast of his owne proud humour, how disdainfully he carieth himselfe toward the Replyer: he obiecteth vnto him, want of learning and iudgement. 2. b. p. 46.2. b. p. 46. you vnlearnedly mistake. 2. b. p. 101.2. b. p. 101. you impertinently and vnlearnedly bring the example of Lazarus, &c. 2. b. p. 141.2. b. p. 141. how vnlearned and erroneous is it, to distinguish the person of Christ, and the Messias. 3. b. p. 7.3. b. p. 7. And I pray you, who doth so? he is more vnlearned, that so imagineth. Your examples are impertinently and ignorantly alleadged. 3. b. p. 67.3. b. p. 67. vnlearnedly translated by you, preacheth. 3. b. p. 107.3. b. p. 107. but himselfe wanteth learning herein, 5. Imput. of ignorance, iustificat. 3. as is shewed before. He taketh exception also to the Replyers person and degree: If you know no difference, &c. you are ill worthie of those schoole degrees, which you haue taken. 3. b. p. 161.3. b. p. 161. And to his bookes: one he calleth a base pamphlet, 2. b. p. 19.2. b. p. 19. I had for a good space cast it aside into a corner, beeing in truth the fittest place for it. pref. p. 4.

Such ignorance and want of learning it had beene enough for this (Paidomastix) to haue obiected to his schooleboyes. The Replyer, as he confesseth his knowledge not to be great, so he is sure, the others is lesse: it is a pitifull thing, as one saide, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : when one that is not wise, Critias. seemeth to be wise: and so it is, when one that is vnlearned, doth arrogate to himselfe the name of learning. Tullie spake sharply to Antonie, and yet but the truth:Philippic. 2. Implicata inscitia impudentia est, si nescit, quod augurem, nec facit, quod pudentem decet: his encumbred inscience will prooue but impudencie, if he neither know, what becommeth a diuine, nor doe what beseemeth a shamefast man. The Replyers Antonie may take this if he will, as spoken of himselfe.

Concerning his person and degree, as the Replyer doth modestly acknowledge himselfe vnmeete for the same, so he seeth no cause, why he may not be thought as worthie thereof, as this brauing Pedantius, of his mastership: and he may say vnto him in Tullies words, without any great boasting: Non video, nec in vita, nec in gratia, nec in rebus gestis, nec in hac mediocritate ingenij, quid despicere posset Antonius: I see not, neither in life, nor in grace, nor in exploits, nor in this mediocritie of wit, what Antonie hath reason to despise.

As for the Replyers bookes, euen the most vile and base of them (hee doubteth not) but may compare with his most vaine-glorious writings: it had beene good indeede for him, if Limbomastix had beene laid aside, for then this Paidomastix had not shamed himselfe: and if a corner had beene the fittest place for that, I thinke his will prooue as a bundle of rotten stickes fit for the fire: there are some books, which though they availe not to vertue, yet otherwise doe bring some profit with them for knowledge; as Seneca saith,Senec. lib. de studiis liberal. ad alia multum conferunt, ad virtutem nihil: Some there are, which though they yielde no profit, yet shew arte and cunning in the framing of them; which may be likened to the Spiders webbes, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . Ariston. which are very artificiall, but nothing profitable. But this scholemasters scribling, in truth is of neither sort, the Reader shall finde it neither to edifie for the matter, and much to offend in the manner: vt onerent Seneca hath discentem. de tranquillit. lib. 1. legentem magis, quam instruant: they will cumber the Reader rather, then any wise further him. But I wil proceed, and shew how by higher degrees his owne arrogancy riseth still, till it come to the height.

2. He chargeth Tremellius, that in his translation concerning the word sheol, he dealt neither so ingenuously, nor so religiously as he ought. 2. b. p. 130.2. b. p. 130. His translation, of graue for hell, Psal. 6. he calleth false and foolish. 3. b. p. 25.3. b. p. 25. Tremellius and Iunius reading, Psal. 139. 8. is called false and immodest. 3. b. p. 151.3. b. p. 151.

3. Pagnine, Arias, and Tremellius translation, hee calleth false; adding, that whose late error herein must not ouerrule the auncient truth. 2. b. p. 148.2. b. p. 148.

4. Beza, beside that euery where reiecting his interpretation, he calleth him in scorne, your interpreter. 2. b. p. 171. and 3. b. p. 111. he further chargeth him, by his interpretation to confirme the heresie of the Arrians. 3. b. p. 15.3. b. p. 15.

5. It is no maruell that hee thus hardly censureth the priuate translations of some particular men, when he spareth not to condemne the publike translations of the Bible,The Confuters profane censure of the Geneua translation. which are vsed among vs: as first, beside his light regard of the Geneua translation, calling them in scorne, your Genevian translators. 2. b. p. 131. and 3. b. p. 27. hee thus in most vile tearmes disgraceth them: For your Geneva Bibles, &c. it is to be wished, and I trust, God will worke it in his Maiesties most religious heart, that either they may be purged from those manifold errors, which are both in the Text, and Margent, or else vtterly prohibited. 3. b. p. 49.3. b. p. 49.

6. Neither doth he thus deale onely with the Geneua translation, but euen the great English Bible also, authorized publikely to be read in the Church, cannot escape his virulent censure: as 2. b. p. 48.2. b. p. 48. thus he saith, I cannot conceale a foule & intollerable corruption, which is lately crept into a late edition of our Church Bibles. And further thus peremptorily he proceedeth in condemning the said translation together with the notes: for that diuerse of your Geneuian notes, especially such as tend to the maintenance of that blasphemie of hell torments in Christs soule, are foisted into the margent of the saidThe great Bibles printed 1595, 1583, 1591 Bibles, and some other before them: which you vrge, as if they were the very word of God, making them the pestilent premises of your blasphemous conclusions. 3. b. p. 50.3. b. p. 50. he meaneth the annotation, Luk. 22. 24.The Church Bibles charged by the Confuter with blasphemy. he felt the horror of Gods wrath, and iudgement against sinne. and another, Heb. 5. 8. beeing in perplexity, and fearing the horrors of death. Who can endure such presumption, to heare our authorized Bibles charged with maintenance of blasphemie, and pestilent premises of blasphemous conclusions.

But he goeth on still in this his arrogant inuectiue, and taketh not onely exception to the marginall notes, as 2. Cor. 13. 7. (wherein, though some ouersight might bee committed by the Compositor in transposing some notes, hee had no reason thus sawcily to checke and controll the translation it selfe) but further saith, neither is the text it selfe free from error in translation: and here hee noteth in the margin, 1. Co. 9. 21. where al the exceptiō he can take is to these words,The great English Bible defended against the cauillous obiections of the confused Confutor. when I am not without law, as pertaining to the law of God: whereas in the originall, it is onely, not beeing without law vnto God: the Geneua translation readeth, as pertaining vnto God: where who seeth not, that in the one translation, these words, as pertaining to the Lawe, and in the other, as pertaining, are no part of the text, but inserted by way of explanation, and should bee written in other characters. But against that other place, Eph. 6. 12. I wonder with what honestie he can take exception, seeing it agreeth exactly with the originall, better then the vulgar latine, which is such a pearlesse translation in his eie: Wee wrestle not against blood and flesh, saith the English, as it is in the originall; against flesh and blood, saith the Latine: against Princes saith the Latine: against rules saith the English, not rulers, as some Bibles haue: for the words are 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , against rules or principalities, not princes or rulers.

7. From finding fault with translations, he ascendeth to carpe at the originall, saying, whether the Greeke now extant be the true authentike originall or no, is the question: and he saith further, it is not free from corruptions in diuers places. 3. b. p. 14.3. b. p. 14.

8. He goeth on, and secretly taxeth the fathers; as first Augustine, for he counteth it a badge of presumptuous singularitie, and pernicious nouelty, to reiect the generall confession (he meaneth opinion, or exposition) of the fathers. 2. b. p. 131.2. p. p. 131. And yet Augustine hath a speciall interpretation of that place of Peter, contrary to the current interpretation of most of the fathers of those times; applying it to the times of Noah.

9. Hee meeteth also with Bernard, calling it absurd to apply descension to the graue. 2. b. p. 155.2. b. p. 155. whereas Bernard maketh direct mention of three descensions of Christ,Serm. part. 18. ad carnem, Limbom. p. 49. ad crucem, ad mortem, to the flesh, to the crosse, to death, which is to the graue: so that Bernard also must be content to weare his liuerie of absurditie.

10. Among these fathers may bee numbred the reuerend Prelates of the Church;B. Bilson. towards one of them yet liuing, a reuerend writer, and publike defender of religion, he thus vaunteth himselfe: That whereas he seemed in the first booke to incline to that opinion in Noahs time (in the exposition of that place of Peter) he is not so mislead with selfe-loue and singularitie, as you and others are (though euery way farre his inferiour) but hath much altered his former iudgement, moued as it may appeare, vpon those reasons laid downe by me, and none but me, in the former booke. 3. b. p. 101.3. b. p. 101. wherein, how vnmannerly hee vseth so reuerend a man,B. Bilson put to schoole to learne of this ignorant Confuter. who seeth not? first, saying by way of comparison, that hee is not so mislead with singularitie, &c. as though he should be somewhat mislead that way, but not so much as others: secōdly, he thinketh he hath his schoolboyes in hand, and would put that deepe learned father to schoole, to learne his lesson of him: thirdly, his vanitie appeareth, that hee, and none but he, hath hit vpon those reasons, which changed the Bishops minde; whereas in truth, he hath borrowed the most of his reasons and testimonies from the other, as may appeare by comparing their bookes together: fourthly, beside all this, it is vntrue which he saith, for that reuerend learned man is still of the same opinion, concerning that place of Peter; for these are his words:Suruey p. 676. I binde no man to my priuate exposition of the Scripture, but rather stand on those places, which haue the full consent of all antiquity to pertaine directly to this matter. And againe, I thought not fit to presse them, when Augustine had once resigned them.

11. But no maruell if particular fathers be thus taxed, when he spareth not whole Churches; as 2. b. p. 180.2. b. p. 180. in saying, The Orientall and Romane Church wanted this clause of Christs descension into hell, sheweth a defect in thē, no fault in the Apostles Creede: But the truth is, there was neither fault in the one, nor defect in the other, in the omission of that article then. Thus he prowdly maketh the whole Oriental and Romane Church defectiue, vnlesse he will giue Ruffinus the lie,Cyprian. vel Ruffin. in Symb. or Cyprian (for vnder both their names that treatise goeth) who so affirmeth, that the article of the descension was not added of olde, neither in the East, nor Romane Church.

12. He bringeth a scandall vpon the whole Church of England, affirming, that in the same there is dissention about substantiall points of doctrine; for he misliketh and condemneth that defence of the Replyer against the obiection of the Romanists,A slaunder vpon the whole Church of England. wherein he affirmeth, that in the Church of England there is no difference in any substantiall point of faith: and concerning the descending into hell, giuē in instance by the Iudasite, whom he confuteth, he answereth,Antilog. p. 15. that the difference is not concerning the truth or substance of the article, but the manner. This answer this (slie fellow) reiecteth,2. b. p. 89. and would needs haue protestants dissent in substantiall, points of faith: for (saith he) the right sense & meaning of the articles of faith, is of the substance: It is true that the substantiall sense of an article is of the substance, but the sense, which concerneth the manner is not of the substance: as the sense or beleife of the articles, that the world was created, that Christ was crucified, that the body shall rise againe, are of the substance: but how the world was created, and in what forme Christ was crucified, and how the resurrection shall be, belongeth to the manner; and is of curiositie rather to enquire, then of faith, And so likewise in the article of the desceusion, that Christ descended, no good Christian denieth, and that is of the substance; but how he descended is a question, as euery boy Logician knoweth, that belongeth to the manner.

13. As he thus disgraceth the Church, so he handleth the whole state of the common wealth; thus vnreuerently and seditiously writing of the honourable assembly of the Parlament: speaking of Limbomastix he saith, published, as the onely colourable meane, whereby to conuay an appeale from his Maiestie and the Clergie, vnto the Parlament, in behalfe of himselfe and others: then it followeth, whereby such their Agents might worke, Epist. ded. p. 10. as hee well kn we were busiest in hindring the vnitie of the Church: A slaunder of the Parlament house. epist. dedicat. p. 10. In the which words, beside diuers vntruths, as that the Replyer conuayeth an appeale from his Maiestie, whereas there is no appeale at all: and it was not fit in the dedication to ioyne his pearelesse Maiestie with his subiects: beside, from the Clergie there is no appeale, the spirituall Lords beeing directly mentioned in the inscription of the dedicatorie: neither doth the Replyer make any appeale for himselfe at all, hauing no agrieuance (he thanketh God.) Beside these manifest vntruths, he most sawcily, and malepartly (which are his owne tearmes) nay mutinously, maketh the honourable Senators of the Parlament house, busie bodies, & hindrers of the vnitie of the Church: which presumptuous speech, how that graue Senate will take, at such a light & base Cornercreepers hand, I referre to their godly graue wisdoms to consider.

Thus in some particular and speciall instances, we haue seene this vaine-glorious Thraso play his part vpon the stage: hee spareth neither newe writers nor olde, in his prowd censures, neither fewe nor many, neither inferiours nor superiours, he giueth them all the checke mate: I may here vse Augustines words, Cernis quam tibi perniciosum fit crimen obijcere talibus, Lib. . contra Iulian. & quā mihi gloriosum sit quodlibet crimen audire cum talibus: you see how pernicious a thing it is to obiect a crime vnto such, and how glorious vnto me, to heare of a crime with such. This sheweth nothing else but his owne arrogant spirit, thus to censure better men then himselfe: hee speaketh of one in his rude discourse, whose bookes (in his opinion) the Replyer should not be worthy to beare: but he himselfe hath trampled vpon some with his fowle feete, whose shooes for learning and pietie,9. Imputation. hee is not worthy to wipe. Aristotle is said thus to haue taxed a prowd young man: O yong man, I would I were such an one, as thou seemest to thy selfe to be; but such an one as indeede thou art, I wish mine enemies were. Plutarch vseth this handsome and fit similitude, The husbandmen doe better accept, Lib. de profect. virtu. sentien. and more willingly behold those eares which hang downe their heads; those that stand vpright they hold to bee light and emptie: so humilitie is a signe of worth; but hautinesse and arrogancy bewraieth lightnesse and vanity. And so I ende this place with that wise saying of Euagrius: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : It is an vnworthy thing, that he which can performe little, should brag much. And as vnseemely a thing is it for this ambitious humorist, so to set others at light, that is so emptie himselfe.

The 9. imputation of Contradictions.
The accusation.

1. In that the Replyer maketh this the question, that Christ descended not into hell to deliuer the Patriarchs: hee saith, you wound your selfe incurably. 2. b. p. 4.2. b. p. 4. for the former, which euery Aristotelean knoweth, must of necessitie be graunted, before you can dispute of the l tter. 2. b. p. 3.2. b. p. 3. and so in effect, he chargeth the Replyer to affirme that which he denieth, the descension to Limbus.

2. That the Replyer doth in other places as earnestly maintaine it (that is,Synops. p. 1017. 1018. that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hel for himselfe) as here you impugne it. 2. b. p. 37.2. b. p. 37.

3. These words nephesh and sheol say you, doe properly signifie sometime (soule) and (hell) and doe also properly sometime betoken (life) and (graue:) they cannot properly signifie both, beeing two distinct things. 2. b. p. 121.2. b. p. 121. in other places you contend,Synops. p. 999. 1005, 1006. &c. that these words may in no wise be taken for (life) and (graue) but for (soule) and (hell) onely: this is the certainty you keepe.

4. You affirme, that no figure is to be admitted in these words soule and hell, and yet you fall presently to figuring vpon figuring.2. b. p. 141. 2. b. p. 141. Hitherto you haue borne vs in hand, that soule doth properly signifie (life) and that no figure at all is to be admitted; and yet you here affirme, that it is so taken by the figure Metonymia; what grosse contradiction is this?2. b. p. 144.

5. Againe, in another place you will needs haue this word soule, not to be taken 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 for the life, but 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 for the whole person.Synops. p. 1050. 2. b. p. 144. againe you say, that soule is here taken for the whole person, whereas a little before you contend by examples of scripture, that in this place it signifieth life.2. b. p. 161.

6. In these two examples alleadged by you, you graunt that the particles (not and neither) doe shewe a difference of the clauses & diuersitie of matter, &c. because the greatnesse or littlenesse of a difference is but an accident, &c. and thus in wielding the weapon against me, you wound your selfe with the blowe: And yet after you haue yeilded thus much, you presently reuoke it, compelled thereunto by the euidence of holy Scripture, and so conuince your selfe of falsehood, in condescending to a truth. 2. b. p. 163.2. b. p. 163.

7. You contradict your selfe palpably, in calling that Limbus patrum here, which you called before in se ting downe the question (hel:) whereas you your selfe affirme in expresse words, that Limbus patrum is no part of hell. 2. b. p. 165.2. b. p. 165.

8. Your selfe in the next page affirme directly,Limbom. p. 43. that after that (consummatum est) vttered by Christ vpon the crosse, his glory, victory, & triumph remayned (vnaccomplished:) wherein you doe not onely grosly contradict your selfe in saying here, that Christ triumphed ouer death, hell, and the diuell vpon the crosse, but also derogate from his blessed death and passion, &c. 2. b. p. 189.2. b. p. 189. the same contradiction is againe obiected, 3. b. p. 156.2. b. p. 156.

9. You affirme in an other place,Synops. p. 1052. that the theefe made request to Christ as man, and not as he was God, &c. now your self dare not defend your former opinion, but say, that Christ spake this, as he was the Messias: wherein, as you delight in contrarietie, &c. 2. b. p. 195.2. b. p. 195.

10. Herein you contradict your selfe: for in the former ection you say, that Christ is with vs in respect of his Godhead, but we with him, as he is our Messias. 3. b. p. 9.3. b. p. 9.

11. You contradict your selfe herein many waies, for before p. 9. you acknowledge this reading (of the sorrowes of hell) to be the true reading, &c. how then can you say here, that Christ onely suffered the sorrowes of the first death? 3. b. p. 25.3. b. p. 25.

12. The Reader may see how vnlearnedly you condemne that for an error in Bellarmine (for saying, that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell for others, not for himselfe) which your selfe defend for a truth.3. b. p. 36.

13. We say not (saith the Replyer) that Christs bodie felt sorrowes (in the graue) but was vnder the sorrowes or bandes of death: and yet your selfe (meaning the Replyer) in the former section, make it all one, to be vnder the sorrows of hell, and to suffer them.3. b. p. 36.

14. Your (minor) or assumption containeth grosse error, and contradiction, in that it implieth Dauids soule to haue beene sometime in hell, because it was not left in hell:3. b. p. 40. it is your owne reason,Synops. p. 1017. and indeede most true.

15. Your contradiction is, in that you say in your proposition,Synops. p. 1050. that this prophesie (of Dauid, Psal. 16.) was wholly performed in Christ. Againe, in an other place you say, that this prophesie is so applied to Christ, as it must first be true in Dauid vpon which supposition you inferre thus: well then, first Dauids soule is in hell, and then it must be in the lowest hell, &c.3. b. p. 42.

16. You say the whole is a peculiar prophesie of Christ, not partly of him, partly of Dauid: and presently after, that this prophesie typically agreeth to Dauid.3. b. p. 42.

17. There is no more necessitie here by flesh to vnderstand the whole humanitie of Christ his soule and bodie, then in that place of S. Paul, Rom. 1. 3. Christ was made of the seede of Dauid according to the flesh, &c. if the soule should necessarily be comprehended vnder the name of flesh, it would follow, that Christ receiued his soule of the seede of Dauid, and so anima should be ex traduce. 3. b. p. 61.3. b. p. 61. And yet in an other place the Replyer speaking of the very same place, saith: Synops. p. 979. 980. Here whole Christ is described vnto vs as God and man: the soule then of Christ is comprehended vnder the name of flesh, or els it is excluded, and so the Apostle should set before vs an vnperfect Christ. 3. b. p. 62.3. b. p. 62.

18. You contradict your selfe herein in iustifying that for a veritie (because the Replyer saith, to what purpose rather should Christ be thought to preach to the spirits in hell, then for their comfort?) which you condemne a little before for a most grosse heresie: namely that by Christs descending into hell,3. b. p. 77. the incredulous persons beleeued.

19. You grossely contradict your selfe in an other place, where you affirme, that the doores opened, and gaue way vnto Christ,Synops. papism. p. 526. when he entred: and yet you say here, that they were shut in the very instance of his entrance.3. b. p. 118.

20. In euery place you defend, that by prison in this place (of Peter) hell and the infernall place of darkenes is to be vnderstood, and doe you now recant it, and bring vs an other signification of sinnes and errors?3. b. p. 122.

21. The Replyer saith, hauing cited that place of the Prophet Dauid, Psal. 139. 15. (thou hast fushioned me in the lower parts of the earth) I trust they will not say, he was borne in hell. 3. b. p. 134.3. b. p. 134. And yet in the first testimonie, you (that is, the Replyer) bring S. Ambrose to prooue, that by these very words of the Prophet Dauid, we ought to vnderstand Christs descending to hell. 3. b. p. 140.3. b. p. 140. see the same contradiction vrged, 3. b. p. 183.3. b. p. 183.

22. Bearing vs in hand, that Bernard acknowledgeth no further descension of Christ, then to death, &c. and yet in an other place you are driuen in the ende vtterly to forsake and reiect him, (as one carried away with the error of his time) in thinking that Christ in his soule after death went locally downe into hell.3. b. p. 149.

22. In the former place you say, that Bernard goeth not beyond Christs death, nor findeth any further degree of descension after that: and yet that he maketh here one degree, to be his descending to the graue: for I am sure, that you wil not say he was buried, before he was dead.3. b. p. 160. 3. b. p. 160.

23. Before in this place you will needes haue the lower parts of the earth, to be meant of the crosse, death, and graue: 3. b. p. 170.3. b. p. 170. and yet here you say, that the parts of the earth are not compared with it selfe, but considered as parts of the world,3. b. p. 163. in respect whereof, they may be called lower or lowest parts. 3. b. p. 163. And againe: to descend to the lower parts of the earth, is to descend from hea en to earth: and yet other where you defend, that (by descending into the lower parts of the earth) is meant Christs descension to death and the graue: so that you doe here notably contradict your selfe, vnlesse you make this world to be all one with death and the graue.3. b. p. 173.

24. You told vs before, that there is none of the auncient fathers, which speaketh of the descension of Christs soule to hell, but addeth withall, that it was to this ende, to deliuer the soules of the fathers from thence:3. b. p. 193. 3. b. p. 193. and yet you say; neither did all the fathers agree in iudgement, that Christ descended into hell, to redeeme the soules of the fathers. p. 190.3. b. p. 190. what truth can there be in your words, when you thus blow hoate and cold with one breath.3. b. p. 193.

25. You change me before to haue misalledged (Calvin) for Christs descension into hell in that place of Peter, whereas you alledge him here your selfe to the same purpose.3. b. p. 195.

The iustification.

1. THis (Contradicter) hath found out a new kinde of reasoning, neuer heard of before: that in a proposition, where two questions are included together, the second can not be denied, before the former be graunted. As, the question beeing, whether Christ descended to (Limbus) to deliuer the fathers:The Contradicters new Logike. one (in his logike) can not denie, that he descended to that ende, vnlesse first he graunt, that he descended to Limbus: by the same reason, he that saith, that an Idol must not be bowed vnto to worship it, doth graunt, that it may be bowed vnto, but, not to that ende: and he which holdeth, that the Scriptures must not be abused to enchantment, confesseth, they may be abused, but no to that ende: or it is not lawfull to sweare falsly by the creatures, as the heauen, the earth, therefore it is lawfull to sweare by them, but not falsly: which indeede was the doctrine of the Pharisies, Math. 5. 33. but our Sauiour reacheth the contrarie, that it is not lawful to sweare at all by any creature. And what thinketh he of this proposition, It is not lawfull to sweare to the Pope, to assist him inuading the land, before the King: doth it follow therefore, that it is lawfull to sweare to the Pope, so that it be not to that ende?

And may not this argument be returned vpon himselfe: Christ descended not to (Limbus) to deliuer the Patriarks: I thinke he will denie this proposition, then he must grant by his owne consequent, that Christ descended to (Limbus.)

Indeed in an affirmatiue proposition it holdeth: as it can not be confessed, that Christ descended to Limbus to deliuer the Patriarkes, but first it must be graunted, that he descended to (Limbus) but in the negatiue it is not so.

2. The Replyer in that place groundeth his argument vpon the Latine text, that Christ loosed the sorrows of hell, shewing that seeing he loosed the sorrowes of hell for himselfe, they could not be the sorrowes of the locall hell: for he felt not the sorrowes of hell after death: Synops. p. 1017. and here he saith, he was neuer in the sorrowes of hell after death: here is no contradiction at all. If he can finde any place, where the Replyer affirmeth, that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell for himselfe after death, he will graunt a contradiction: but to say, that Christ loosed not the sorrowes of hell for himselfe after death, and yet that he loosed the sorrowes of hell for himselfe, are not contradictorie, but doe implie, that he speaketh of other sorrowes of hell, which Christ loosed, then those after death: seeing then he speaketh not of the same sorrowes of hell, there is no contradiction, and that this Cauiller knew right well.

3. As though the same Hebrew word may not properly signifie two distinct things, contained in one generall sense: as gez, signifieth any thing that is cut, and therefore some translate a fleece, Psal. 72. 5. as the Latine, and Montanus: some, the mowne grasse, as Vatab. Iun. because they both vse to be cut.Bellar. lib. 4. de Christ anim. c. 12. And concerning this word nephesh, his great Master confesseth, significat sine vllo tropo, tam animam, quam animal, immo etiam corpus: it fignifieth without any trope, as well the soule, as the liuing creature, yea the bodie: these I hope are all distinct things: yea this (palterer) confesseth, that it is one of the words 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , and that it signifieth all those three things giuen in instance by Bellarmine, lib. 2. p. 159. 160.lib. 2. p. 160. But that the Replyer saith, these words, are taken for the soule and hell onely, is a manifest vntruth:Synops. 1005. for in the place quoted, he confesseth in direct words,A great vntruth. that in some places, the soule is taken for life, but contendeth, that Isa. 53. 10. it is properly taken for the soule.

4. The Replyer, when he saith these words doe properly signifie life, and the graue, speaketh of the Hebrew words, nephesh and sheol: when he saith, that the soule is here taken 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , for the life, he meaneth this word, Englished soule: like as anima in Latine indifferently signifieth, the soule, or life: therefore this is no contradiction to say, that the Hebrew nephesh, sometime signifieth life, without a figure: as, Levit. 17. 14. the nephesh, the life of all flesh is his blood: it were improper, to say, the soule of all flesh: and that the Englished and translated word soule, is not taken for life, without a figure: for this trifler confesseth, that the Hebrew word nephesh, is more generall in signification,Bellarm. ibid. then either the Latine word anima, or the Greeke word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , as his Ringleader confesseth, of whom he borrowed it: and yet either of these are more large, and generall, then the English word, soule.

5. The Replyer in that place, doth not so much as vse that tearme 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 :Synops. 1050. he both there, and in other places alleadgeth that, as a reasonable and fit exposition, to take soule for the person: but he rather preferreth the other sense, to take soule, for life: Limbom. p. 9. to bring two probable interpretations of a place, as indifferent to be receiued, and of the two to preferre the more likely, is no contradiction.

6. To denie, that not, and neither, doe not alwaies shew two distinct clauses, and that sometime, they argue no great difference or diuersitie, he that saith they are speeches contrarie, sheweth himselfe to be contrarie to reason: vnlesse he thinketh there is no difference, betweene a plaine distinction, and a small diuersitie: hath he so much forgotten his Logike, that he knoweth not diversa to be defined, which dissent onely in some reason, and respect: and opposita to be such as differ, re & ratione, both in respect, and in deede and effect. And whereas the Replyer saith, be it admitted that these particles doe inferre a distinction in the sentence, &c. doth he reuoke any thing? is he so blind, that he can not discerne betweene a simple assertion, and that which proceedeth vpon a supposall and conditionall graunt. But what new wine had intoxicated his braine, when he let these wordes fall from his penne, You presently reuoke it, and conuince your selfe of falshood, in condescending to a truth: The blind confuter counteth it falshood to condescend to a truth. I thought it had bin simplicitie rather, and integritie, to condescend to a truth, and not falshood: if this be falshood to condescend to a truth, then it is simplicitie and plainenes to contradict the truth. This may be the reason, that he is so aduerse to the truth, it is one of his vertues: but such falshood to yeild to the truth, God send me, and let him take his plaine dealing to himhimselfe: whosoeuer hath the blow, I am sure he hath the wound, and feeleth the smart too: as the Orator saith, Luculentam ipse plagam accepit, vt declarat cicatrix: Cic. Philipp. 7. he hath receiued a sufficient venie, as the scarre declareth.

7. The Replyer in that place,Limbom. 43. saith out of Augustines iudgement, that Abrahams bosome is no part of hell, he nameth not Limbus: it seemeth he himselfe hath a conceit that waies, in making Abrahams bosome, and Limbus all one. But for his owne opinion, the Replyer thinketh that Limbus patrum, is neither part of hell, nor of any place els, no more then Purgatorie is: yet he is not ignorant, but that his great Master, maketh it a member of hell. So then the question beeing propounded in the Romanists sense: to say sometime Christ descended not to hell, and otherwhile that he descended not to Limbus to deliuer the fathers, is no contradiction.

8. The Replyers words are these:Limbom. p. 17. his glorie, victorie, and triumph onely remained: so that, he fraudulently putteth in (vnaccomplished) of his owne. The Replyer saith, that Christ triumphed ouer death, hell, and the deuill vpon the Crosse: that is, the victorie and triumph was then obtained: and yet his glorie, victorie, and triumph remained; that is, it was not yet manifested, and published: for this word triumph, though it properly signifie, the publike solemnitie that followeth after the victorie: as the Romane Captaines had their honourable triumphs publikely solemnized in the Citie after their victorious returne: in which sense he that so triumphed, was called 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , a triumphant man: Plutark. yet in Scripture they are saide to triumph,2. Cor. 2. 14. that doe ouercome, as Paul saith; Thankes be to God, which alwaies makes vs to triumph in Christ: where the same word is vsed: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , triumpho. and yet the glorious and proper triumph of the Saints, is in the kingdome of heauen. As Christ now triumpheth in his members, in preuailing, and ouercomming: so he triumphed vpon the Crosse, in obtaining the victorie. And if any derogate and detract from the blessed death and passion of Christ, it is this Contradicter and detracter: who a little before said, that Christs conquest vpon the Crosse, was openly an ouerthrow, and therefore no triumph. And againe, If he triumphed on the Crosse, See before, Blasp. recrim. 3. it was a triumph before the victorie. 2. b. p. 188.

9. And are these speeches, to make request to Christ, as man, and as the Messiah, contrarie? is there in them any contrarietie at all? are the manhoode of Christ, and the person of the Messiah contrarie? or when it is said as man, is he so absurd to thinke, that Christ is considered as man without his Godhead, and not as vnited with it in the person of the Messiah? or when, himselfe saith: that the theefe made request to him as God, doth he meane, his Godhead without his humanitie. And is S. Paul contrarie to himselfe, when not in diuers, but in one and the same place he ioyneth both together, there is one God and Mediatour, betweene God and man, the man Iesus Christ, that is, the Messiah? Doth not the Replyer in direct wordes expound himselfe: that these wordes must not be vnderstood of the presence of Christ in heauen, in respect of his Godhead onely, but of his whole person, as the Mediatour? But it may be he tooke this exception, because he enclineth to his cousin germanes opinion, that Christ exercised his mediatourship as man onely, not as both God and man:Bellarm. lib. 5. de Christ. anim. c. 1. and therfore noteth this as a contradiction and contrarietie.

10. It is not the former sect. which is the 16. but the 15. sect. where the Replyer saith, wee are said to be with him as the Messiah: and doth hee not say the selfe same thing here? for hauing rehearsed those words of our Sauiour, Ioh. 17. I will that they which thou hast giuen mee, be with me where I am: and then follow the other words, that they may behold my glory which thou hast giuen me: he addeth in very direct words, Doth hee not here speake also of that glorie, which was giuen him as the Messiah? How could then this humorous Contradicter so much as dream of any contradiction here: but it seemeth his wits went a woole-gathering, when he noted this; for in the next sentence before, in stead of confuting the Replyers reasons, he repeateth and confirmeth them: for whereas the Replyer brought this as one: if Christ, saying (where I am) speake of his Godhead, his request was euen then fulfilled, for his Apostles were with him then present as God. 3. b. p. 5. 3. b. p. 5. This cō fused Confuter steppeth forth,The wise Confuter reasoneth against himselfe. and saith; secondly, if they were with him as God, then was Christs prayer vnto his father in vaine, to graunt them that which they presently enioyed. 3. b. p. 9.3. b. p. 9. Is not this the very same reason vrged before by the Replyer, to proue that Christ speaketh not of his Apostles being with him as God; for could he not see, how vpon his words it may be assumed: but Christs prayer vnto his father was not in vaine, therefore hee prayeth not, they should be with him as God. And thus hee hampereth himselfe, and woundeth his owne cause.

11. It is vntrue, that either in that place, Limbom. p. 9. or in any other, the Replyer acknowledgeth sorrowes of hell, Act. 2. 24. to be the true reading: he only thus saith, the hell that Christ went vnto, he loosed the sorrowes of, Act. 2. 24. which place hee citeth, not for the name of hell, but for loosing of the sorrowes: because euen in the Confuters opinion, that which is called hell, v. 27. is named death, v. 24. And the Replyer is so farre in that place from iustifying that reading of hell in the 24. verse, that he would convince by this reason, that hell is not meant, no not in the 27. verse, because it would then follow, that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell there, which had seized vpon him. As vntrue it is, that the Replyer in that place goeth about to prooue, that Christ suffered the sorrowes of hell (in his sense) but rather declineth it as an absurdity.Synops. p. 1017. But in another place he inferreth that conclusion, grounding his argument vpon the latine text, which the Romanists make their onely authentike translation; and therefore it is a good text against them.

12. To say that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell (the place of the damned) for himselfe, the Replyer counteth it absurd; and yet to say that the sorrowes of death, which Saint Peter speaketh of, and Bellarmine readeth (hell) were not loosed for Christ, is contrary to the text, as there he sheweth by diuers reasons: hereupon no contradiction can be inferred, but this followeth, that the death which Saint Peter speaketh of, the sorrowes whereof were loosed for Christ, cannot be vnderstood of hell.

13. That it is all one to say that the soule is vnder the sorrowes of hell, and doth suffer them, beeing full of sense and feeling; and yet that it is not all one, for the body in the graue, to be vnder the sorrowes and bands of death, and to feele or suffer them, because it is senslesse, implyeth no contradiction.

14. Not to be left in a place (the word beeing taken properly for to be forsaken) implyeth a being first in the place;Synops. p. 1017. and in that sense the Replyer thus reasoned: Christ was not left or forsaken in hell: ergo, he was in hell: but in this other place, by not leauing, he vnderstandeth not beeing: but the not beeing, or leauing of the soule in hell, &c. And so is the word sometime vsed, as Ioh. 14. 17. I will not leaue you comfortlesse: that is, you shall not bee comfortlesse: for otherwise, in the other sense of this word it might be inferred: Ergo, they were comfortlesse, but were not so left or remained. And so in a certaine place Origen taketh the not leauing in hell, Tract. 35. in Math. for the not beeing in hell: sine dubio neque nostras animas derelinquet in inferno, &c. without doubt (as he left not Christs soule in hell) so shall hee not leaue our soules in hell, &c. and he which called him from hell after the third day, shall also call vs in due time.

15. 16. To say that this whole prophecy of Dauid was onely historically true of Christ; and yet typically agreed to Dauid, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . is no contradiction: hath he so forgotten his Logike principles,The Confuter hath forgotten his Logike. as that he remembreth not that euery contraritie and opposition must be secundum idem, & ad idem, in regard of the same part or place, and in one & the same respect? But where the Replyer inferreth, first Dauids soule is in hell, hee reasoneth ex concessis, because the Romanists doe hold that Dauids soule, with the rest of the fathers was in hell.

17. It is euident by the reason here set downe concerning the originall of Christs soule, which cannot bee said to be ex traduce, to bee deriued by propagation, as the body is, without great inconuenience, and in a manner impossibilitie, that the Replyer reuersed his former iudgement, concerning the exposition of the word flesh, Rom. 1. 3. that howsoeuer in some other places it is taken for the whole nature of man, consisting of soule and body, yet it cannot bee so taken there, for the former reason: And herein the Replyer followeth Augustines iudgement,Aug. lib. quest. 83. quest. 80. who against the Apollinarists, that held Christ onely to haue taken humane flesh, without a soule, grounding their error vpon those words, Ioh. 1. The word was made flesh, abiecteth that place of Scripture, all flesh shall see the saluation of God, and the like, where flesh comprehendeth the whole nature of man: yet against Felicianus the Arrian, which asked the question, why the habite of the sonne of God might not animate Christs flesh in stead of a soule, reasoneth after this manner; that if Christ tooke not also an humane soule, one of those fower must followe, it was either for that he thought the soule of man to bee innocent, but that could not be, because sinne is voluntary, and so incident properly to the soule: or that it belonged not vnto him, which also is otherwise, seeing God is the creator of soules: or for that he could not heale the soule, thē should he not be omnipotent: or because the soule was abiect and vile;Cont. Felician. Arrian. lib. 1. c. 13. but that is not so, as he addeth in the same place to this effect: that the flesh was not formed by the breathing in of God, Carnem non inflatu Dei, sicut animam, sed de limo terrae constat esse plasmatam. as the soule was, but of the slime of the earth. Here then is no contradiction, but a reuocation, or qualification rather of his former opinion, concerning the interpretation of one word in one place, which the Replyer taketh to be no disgrace vnto him, hauing altered his minde therein, before this cauiller found it out; seeing hee himselfe affirmeth the like (but vntruely) of a Reuerend Prelate of this land,3. b. p. 101. that he retracted his iudgement in a waightier matter, in the expounding of that difficult and obscure place of Saint Peter. This is the onely place which he had any colour of reason to obiect.

18. The Replyer affirmeth not out of his owne opinion, that Christ preached in hell to the disobedient spirits, for their comfort; but hee vrgeth it as an inconuenience which followeth vpon their interpretation, that say, that Christ went and preached in hell: and the same absurdity is pressed by Augustine epist. 99. what grosse blindnesse then is this in him, not to discerne when the Replyer deliuereth his owne iudgement by way of position, and when he presseth the aduersarie, by way of obiection?

19. The doores were shut vp in the very instant of Christs entrance: that is, not onely before, but at that very instant, when Christ began to enter: and yet the doores opened and gaue way to Christ, when he entred: here is no contradiction; for first it is said, in the instant of his entrāce, that is, he found them shut when he began to enter: then it is said, when he entred: that is, while he was going in: is it not euident that a difference of the instant time is here noted; one, wherein hee found the doores shut, beeing to enter: the other succeeding, when the doores opened, as he entred: it is lost time that is spent with such a trifler.

20. The Replyer still without altering of his iudgement, vnderstandeth by prison in that place of Peter (hell:) yet he produceth expositions of some of the fathers, which by prison vnderstand, the bands of sinnes and errors, out of the which the prisoners were deliuered; to shew that herein, though not in euery point they make for the Replyer, vnderstanding the deliuering of prisoners, of preaching to the liuing for their cōuersion, not to the dead, as the Confuter doth: Is there not here now great contradiction?

21. The Replyer alleadgeth the testimony of Ambrose, that so expoundeth the lower parts of the earth, of hell, not to that end, but onely to shew, that he vnderstandeth Christs descension to hell, of the presence of his diuine power there. 2. b. p. 12. Is it necessarie when a testimony is produced to one ende, that whatsoeuer is contained there beside, should be acknowledged: Then he himselfe cannot auoide it, but hee must needs goe for a maintainer of Limbus, for he bringeth in Ambrose, 3. b. p. 169. and Augustine, and Origen, p. 193. affirming the same; as appeareth by their testimonies, as he alleadgeth them: such measure as he meateth, shal be measured to him againe.

22. To affirme that Bernard in one place findeth no further descension of Christ, then vnto death; and yet that in another, beeing carried away with the error of those times, he holdeth the descension of Christs soule to hell, is no contradiction: neither would this (iangling sophister) haue thought so, if he had remembred the lawes of opposition and contradiction, whereof I touched two before; secundum idem, & ad idem: where, as he failed in the latter, (I affirming Dau. prophecy to be true of Christ one way, i. historically, & of Dauid another, i. typically: and therefore it was without any contradiction:) so he faileth here in the other, because Bernard is said to affirme diuers things, but not 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , in the same part and place.

23. As though, when Bernard maketh the third degree of descending to bee admortem, vnto death, his descending to the graue be not there implyed: for otherwise, he descended not from the crosse to die, for he yeilded vp his spirit vpon the crosse. And this Bernard sheweth, by the words following; nunquid amplius potuit? Behold how farre he descended, could he doe any more? but if hee meant nothing else but his death vpon the crosse, excluding the graue, our Sauiour Christ both might haue done more, and did more for vs, not onely in dying, but in being buried for vs.

24. And doth not the descending of Christ to the crosse and graue, include also, and imply his descending to the earth? vnlesse you thinke that his crosse and graue was not in the earth: thus much also the Replyer noted, foreseeing and preuenting this obiection; the other two expositions (that is, of Christs descending to the earth, & then to the crosse and graue) may well agree and stand together, and he that affirmeth the one, denieth not the other. Limbo. p. 52. These two then were two degrees of Christs humiliation and descension, his taking vpon him the forme of a seruant, and beeing obedient to the death of the crosse, as S. Paul obserueth, Philip. 2. 7, 8.

25. The Replyer saith againe, that there are none of the fathers which speake of Christs descension to hell, but held it was to that ende to deliuer the fathers: and yet some of the fathers differ in iudgement, for they hold that place where the fathers were, not to haue beene any part of hell, but Paradise; as Origen, Chrysostome, Augustine: is here now any contradiction? for they which hold the Patriarchs to haue beene in Paradise, and not in hell, speake not of Christs descension to hell, but to Paradise, to illuminate the fathers.

26. What a strange fellow is this, to say that I alleadge Calvin my selfe, for the same purpose for which he alleadged him; namely, to prooue the local descension into hell: whereas I alleadge Caluin, Beza, and Iunius to the contrary. 3. b. p. 191.3. b. p. 191. Limbom. p. 59. Thus hath this busie body troubled himselfe to spie faults, where he could find none. Such Seneca compareth to the restles Ants,Lib. 1. de tranquil. vitae. quae in summū cacumen, deinde in imum aguntur: which creep vp & downe vpon trees from the top to the bottome, and finde no resting place. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . And Aristo in Plutarke, to the windes, which do vncouer our garments, which of all other are most troublesome.Plutar. lib. de curios. Such are they which hunt vp and downe to seeke others disgrace, and to vncouer their nakednesse, not being able to hide their owne vncomelinesse: Augustine doeth fitly resemble the enuious man,O inuide vermis mortifere, qui in hedera, Ionae quotid ie nasceris: ad frat. in erem. ser. 18. to the worme which did breed in Ionas gourd; so still hee gnaweth vpon others credit, and fretteth at their well-doing and where he cannot ouercome with wrestling, seeketh to supplant by fraud: and as Augustine saith, Aliorum gloriam facit suam poenam, Maketh anothers fame his owne ane: as shall nowe appeare in the returning of this accusation.

The Recrimination.

1. This Contradicter findeth fault with the Replyer, as though he should say, that eternall continnance in them, is not of the essence and nature of hell torments. Synops. p. 1014. 3. b. p. 77.3. b. p. 77. whereas he onely saith, the inseperable adiuncts, and necessary members of hell are these: 1. the place, which is infernall. 2. the time, which is perpetuall. 3. the darkenesse, vnspeakable: And hee himselfe confesseth as much, whose (that is, of hell) inseperable adiuncts, are vtter darkenesse,1. b. p. 3. and endlesse paines.

2. Hee saith it is Iudaisme to apply the prophecy of Dauid, Psalme 16. to any, but to our Sauiour Christ. 3. b. p. 41.3. b. p. 41. And yet hee himselfe graunteth, that the prophecy of the ascending of Christ, and leading captiuity captiue (which is as peculiar to the ascension of Christ, as the other concerneth his resurrection) is literally spoken of King Dauid himselfe, &c. but prophetically meant of Christ our Sauiour. 1. b. p. 57.1. b. p. 57.

3. Hee saith that the Creede was made and composed by the Apostles themselues. 2. b. p. 182.2. b. p. 182. but else where he saith, it was made either by the Apostles themselues, as the auncient fathers doe thinke, or by Apostolike men, as all diuines confesse. 1. b. p. 5.1. b. p. 5. If it were made by Apostolike men, then not by the Apostles, which he certainely affirmed before.

4. Hauing recited that place, Psal. 6. 4, 5. O Lord deliuer my soule, for 〈◊〉 death there is no remembrance of thee: who shall giue thee thankes in the pit: which word, hee whome he confuteth translateth hell: he thus inferreth; by the which last word all our late interpreters; both latine and English, doe with one accord vnderstand the graue, as beeing the ordinary sequell of temporall death. 1. b. p. 12.1. b. p. 12. Here he vnderstandeth in this place temporall death, whereof the graue is an ordinarie sequell: and yet in the next page following, he affirmeth the contrary; wherefore (death) in that place cannot signifie the seperation and dissolution of the soule from the body, which is onely temporall: but the diuorcement and sequestration both of body & soule from God. 1. b. p. 13.1. b. p. 13.

5. Neither can this word (graue) signifie any other place, then the place of corruption, and mortality. 1. b. p. 12.1. b. p. 12. And yet the word avad, Psal. 88. 10. which the Septuag translate 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , the Latine, in sepulchro, in the graue, hee saith is meant of hell. 3. b. p. 28.3. b. p. 28.

6. Who shall giue thee thankes in the pit? Psal. 6. 5. by which last word, all our late interpreters doe with one consent vnderstand the graue, &c. which can signifie no other place, then the place of corruption and mortalitie. 1. b. p. 12.1. b. p. 12. And againe, no English translators turne (sheol) graue, in this place, but pit, which most fitly and truely agreeth to hell. 3. b. p. 26.3. b. p. 26. thus in the same place, the same word shall signifie both the graue, and hell.

7. He fondly reprooueth the Replyer, for running from the new Testament to the Old, and from the Greeke to the Hebrew. 2. b. p. 120.2. b. p. 120. you well perceiued the Greeke was vtterly against you, and therefore cunningly, but cowardly you forsake it, and flie to the Hebrew. ibid. p. 121.2. b. p. 121 yet he himselfe doth the same: which to be so in this place, if you will graunt the Hebrewes to haue had any skill in their owne naturall language, you must needes confesse. 1. b. p. 16.1. b. p. 16. Is it lawfull for him to haue recourse vnto the Hebrew writers, and a fault in the other to runne vnto the Hebrew Scriptures?

8. Now if you take exception (saith this Contradicter) against this reading, as mistranslated in all our Bibles, which I see not by what right you can doe, beeing publikely authorised.) 1. b. p. 26.1. b. p. 26. and 2. b. p. 130.2. b. p. 130. he calleth it an authorised translation: yet he himselfe most scornefully reiecteth the great English Bible authorised publikely to be read, as hath beene shewed before, Imputat. 8. recriminat. 6.

9. He findeth fault with the Replyer, for translating 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , tell him his fault, as the Geneva translation, and great Bible readeth: 2. b. p. 67.2. b. p. 67. & yet he himselfe translateth the same word,Ecclesiast. 19. 10. 13. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , tell thy neighbour roundly of his fault. ibid. p. 71.2. b. p. 71.

10. He saith, that faithfull perseuerance in pietie, is the finall possession of the land of promise 2. b. p. 113.2. b. p. 113. and yet els where he denieth, that the true ioyes of heauen may be in this world. 2. b. p. 207.2. b. p. 207. for if a man by faithfull perseuerance, hath in this life a sure hope, and by hope possession of heauen, how hath he not some true sense of the ioyes thereof?

11. That sheol was alwaies taken to signifie hell onely: 2. b. p. 119.2. b. p. 119. and yet els where he confesseth, that the same word, Psal. 6. 5. translated the pit, is taken for the graue the sequele of temporall death. 1. b. p. 12.1. b. p. 12.

12. He readeth thus, Exod. 21. 23. He shall pay life for life, not soule for soule. 2. b. p. 14. the Hebrew word is (nephesh) which in an other place he saith, was alwaies taken onely to signifie soule. 2. b. p. 119.2. b. p. 119.

13. In that the Replyer saith, that the glorie, victorie, and triumph remained, (that is, the manifestation and accomplishment of it) after Christ had said, Consummatum est, it is finished: this Contradicter saith, you doe greatly derogate from his blessed death and passion: for if he obtained not victorie ouer those enemies vpon the crosse, then are they yet vnconquered, and consequently mans redemption vnperformed. 2. b. p. 189.2. b. p. 189. And yet a little before he denieth, that Christ triumphed vpon the crosse: for that conquest (saith he) vpon the crosse, was openly an ouerthrow: and againe, so that if Christ triumphed vpon the crosse (as you say he did) it was according to the prouerb, a triumph before victorie. ibid. p. 188.2. b. p. 188. who could imagine, that he should haue such a sihttle and crazie braine: as in the compasse of tenne lines to affirme and denie the same thing.

14. It is the Obiecter, not I that so taketh it, that is, the soule 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 for the whole person: and yet a little after, forgetting himselfe, he saith: I graunt that the word soule, beeing ioyned with the bodie, may be taken for the whole person.2. b. p. 143.

15. Whereas the Replyer vnderstandeth those words of S. Peter, that Christ shall be the Iudge of the quicke and the dead, 1. Pet. 4. 5. of those which are now dead, but shall be aliue at the comming of Christ: he thus friuolously obiecteth, that then we must correct an article of the Creede: and say, that Christ shall come to iudge the quicke, and not the dead. 3. b. p. 71.3. b. p. 71. And yet afterward, within two lines he saith, as the dead shall be liuing then, so the liuing now, shall be then dead: where beside his absurditie and contradiction to Scripture, that the liuing now shall be dead at Christs comming, whereas the Apostle saith, that the liuing shall not preuent them that sleepe, 1. Thess 4. 15, 16. &c. and the dead in Christ shall rise first: he crosseth himselfe, in altering and chaunging the article after his owne fancie: that Christ shall be Iudge of the dead and quicke.

16. He saith that these words of Origene, doe they not read, what is written of their hope, that perished in the flood, 1. Pet. 3. can not conuince him of that most grosse heresie recorded by Augustine: that some thought, by Christs descending to hell, the incredulous persons beleeued, and all were deliuered thence. 2. b. p. 76.2. b. p. 76. And yet he himselfe chargeth Origene in the next page following, with a more grosse heresie; that he thought the very damned in the ende should be saued themselues. ibid. p. 77.2. b. p. 77.

17. He would confute the Replyer for defending, that the true ioyes of heauen may be perceiued in this life. 2. b. p. 207.2. b. p. 207. and yet he saith, that Paul beeing rapt into the third heauen, beheld the very essence of God. 2. b. p. 205.2. b. p. 205. I hope then he saw the true ioyes of heauen: and S. Paul at that time, had not resigned this life.

18. The Saints shall not see God so perfectly, as he is visible in himselfe. 2. b. p. 204.2. b. p. 204. And yet afterward he saith: they shall see him in plaine manner, and in perfect measure. ibid. p. 205.2. b. p. 205. thus they shall see him perfectly, and yet not perfectly.

19. None of his elect are with him, during their aboad in this life; otherwise what meant S. Paul to say, I desire to be dissolued, and to be with Christ, if he were with him without dissolution, &c. 3. b. p. 4.3. b. p. 4. yet in an other place, he misliketh that saying of the Replyer: that Christ is saide to be with vs in respect of his Godhead, &c. but we are said to be with him, as our Messiah: as S. Paul saith, I desire to be dissolued and be with Christ: he calleth this assertion, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : 2. b. p. 198.2. b. p. 198. and yet in the other place approoueth the same himselfe.

20. What shall the simple and vnlearned doe, when they heare those Bibles, which haue beene allowed by publike authoritie of this Realme, and openly read in our Churches these 46. yeares, to be condemned by some Ministers and Preachers among vs, for false, erroneous, and iniurious to the word of God, &c. 3. b. p. 46.3. b. p. 46. And yet he himselfe chargeth the same Bibles with errors in the text, and with blasphemie in some of the annotations. 3. b. p. 49.3. b. p. 49.

21. He saith, that Noe was no preacher at all in any other sense, then all other godly men are, namely in doing the works of righteousnes: 3. b. p. 109.3. b. p. 109. and yet a little after it followeth: with this construction the Latine word praeco, vsed by all translatours in that place, doth most fitly agree: which doth properly signifie him, that maketh open proclamation of a thing, as an Herauld or trumpetter: as Alexander called Homer the trumpetter or sounder out of Achilles prowes. ibid. p. 110.3. b. p. 110. If Noe were in this sense a proclaymer of righteousnes, as Homer was of Achilles valure, it was not a mute and dumbe, but a vocall proclayming and preaching thereof: which he denied before.

22. You will neuer prooue, that there was any other descension but this: he meaneth the descension into hell, whereof he spake immediatly before. 3. b. p. 155.3. b. p. 115. And yet afterward he confesseth two descensions: descensions of Christ in the new Testament are none mentioned, sauing these two onely. ibid. p. 157.3. b. p. 157. he meaneth the descension from heauen to earth, and from thence to hell.

23. Those wordes of the Prophet, (in thy presence is fulnes of ioy,) Psal. 16. 11. are not meant of the Godhead of Christ, but of the glorie, which his manhood was to receiue at his resurrection. 3. b. p. 165.3. b. p. 165. here he confesseth, there was glorie due vnto Christ as God; and glorie, which he receiued as man: but els where he denieth, that there was one kingdome (that is, glorie) due vnto Christ as God, an other, as he was the Messiah. 2. b. p. 201.2. b. p. 201.

24. He saith, that there is a plaine distinction between the holy Ghost, &c. and Christ, not in person onely, &c. but in nature also, I meane his diuine nature: 3. b. p. 95. but afterward, he better remembring himselfe, saith: I distinguish onely the person of Christ from the holy Ghost ibid. p. 96.2. b. p. 96.

25. He saith, mans perfect redemption was purchased by his precious death vpon the crosse. 3. b. p. 155.3. b. p. 155. And yet in an other place, he thus writeth: our whole and entire freedome was wrought and effected by our Sauiour Christs descention into hell, and not onely by his death and passion. 3. b. p. 143.3. b. p. 143. how could therebe a perfect redemption vpon the crosse, without a perfect freedome?

26. You dissemble the Apostles words immediately following in the same place, let vs proceede by one rule, &c. And yet within a fewe lines after, he confesseth thus: you speake I graunt of this proceeding by one rule, &c. 2. b. p. 12.2. b. p. 12. If the Replyer speaketh of it, how then doth he dissemble it?

27. He denieth that Christ had a kingdome (that is, power, authoritie, glorie) belonging to him as God, and an other, as he is God and man. 2. b. p. 201. And yet these words he hath in an other place: those words of the Prophet repeated by the Apostle (thou wilt shew me the waies of life, &c.) are not meant, as you mistake them, of the Godhead of Christ, &c. but of that glorie, which his manhoode was to receiue at his resurrection and ascesia ,3. b. p. 165. He here manifestly affirmeth, that there was glorie due to Christ as God, and an other glorie due to his manhoode. But by the way he himselfe grossely mistaketh the Replyer: for those words he referreth not to the Godhead, but to the soule of Christ: for these are his words: to say that Christs soule did not enioy his fathers presence in heauen all the while it was absent from the bodie, is contrarie to the Scriptures, (thou wilt shew me the waies of life, &c.) 3. b. p. 162.

Thus this impure imputation of contradictions is returned also vpon the Contradicters owne head. The Scribes and Pharisies shewed themselues more wise, who were ashamed to cast one stone at the adulterous woman,Iob. 8. beeing guiltie themselues. And this contentious brabler should haue beene better aduised, then to obiect difference and contradiction vnto others, seeing he agreeth no better with himselfe. That was a wise saying of Theophr •• stus to a young man that blushed: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , Be of good cheare (saith he) for vertue hath such a colour. If this bold outfacer of others, had first blushed at his own faults and ouersights, it had beene more commendation to him.Lib. 2. Offic. c. 8. Ambrose saith well: An eum putabo idoneum, qui mihi det consilium, qui non dat sibi, & mihi eum vacare credam, qui non vacat sibi: shall I thinke him meete to giue me counsell, that can not giue himselfe, or that he can finde leisure for me, that hath no leisure for himselfe: that is, to finde his owne faults. It had beene good, if first he had viewed the ruines and droppings thorough of his owne house, before he had surueied an others. The contradictions which he hath dispersedly in his contentious plea obtruded, doe rather shew the humour of contention in the wrester, then the spirit of contradiction in the writer. Greater aduantage a man can not lightly haue against his aduersarie, then the Replyer in this vaine accusation against his (Contradicter:) to whome in that behalfe that saying of the Orator against Antonie most fitly agreeth, as if it had beene first spoken of him:Philippic. 2. Tam eras excors, vt tota in oratione tecum ipse pugnares, vt non modo non cohaerentia inter se diceres, sed maxime disiuncta & contrariae, vt non tanta mecum, quanta tibi tecum esset cont •• ti : were you so witlesse, that thorough your whole discourse, you were at oddes with your selfe: so that you did not onely vtter things not hanging together, but most different and contrarie, that you were at greater strife with your selfe, then with me?

Imputat. 10. of the pretended falsification of his wordes.
The accusation.

1. He cutteth off those my words, (much lesse in heauen, where there is fulnes of ioy) which follow immediatley, and containe part of my reason, &c. 2. b. p. 37.2. b. p. 37. and 3. b. p. 36.3. b. p. 36.

2. You conceale my meaning,10. Imputation. and corrupt my words: for it is the obiecter, not I, that so taketh it (namely, the soule for the whole person.) 2. b. p. 143.2. b. p. 143.

3. You cut off all the first part of my sentence here enclosed, (it is a generall axiome of Theologie among all diuines,) &c. thereby to couer your legerdemaine, least the Reader should see (to your shame) your contemptuous reiection of one common receiued axiome in diuinitie, &c. 2. b. p. 120.2. b. p. 120.

4. You clippe my words in the latter: and thus auncient, godly, and learned fathers haue expounded it. 3. b. p. 6.3. b. p. 6.

5. What dishonest dealing is this in you, first to corrupt my words, and then to affirme, that I make no opposition betweene Christ and Dauid, saue onely in incorruption, resurrection, and ascension. 3. b. p. 41.3. b. p. 41.

6. You clippe my words, in leauing out the Antecedent, whereof this reading is a consequent, &c. 3. b. p. 58.3. b. p. 58.

7. After your wonted manner, you misreport my words, &c. for these my last words, (turning the humane soule of Christ, first into his diuinitie, &c.) are not as I make them any part of that period, where I blame the obiector for confounding the persons of the Trinitie, but are referred to his contradicting of himselfe. 3. b. p. 96.3. b. p. 96.

8. Where doe I affirme, (that by the lowest parts of the earth, hell is alwaies signified) but that it is your custome alwaies to charge me falsely. 3. b. p. 140.3. b. p. 140.

9. It is denied (say you) that Christs descension in soule to hell, doth more set forth his loue and fauour, then his crosse and passion: you are still forging one falshood or an other against me: for where doe I affirme any such thing? 3. b. p. 148.3. b. p. 148.

10. My words are not in that place, as you report them. 3. b. p. 150.3. b. p. 150.

11. You still detort and depraue my words, as if you had beene hatched in the nest of the Harpies, &c. the indifferent Reader may see, that I doe not attribute the victorie to Christs descension into hell, but to his blessed passion on the crosse. 3. b. p. 154. 155.3. b. p. 154.

12. Thirdly it is vntrue, when you say, that I make but one degree of Christs exaltation, for I speake onely of his ascending into heauen. 3. b. p. 161.3. b. p. 161.

13. Lastly, touching the Greeke article ( 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ) I doe not precisely affirme, as you vntruly make me, that it doth particularize, & distinquish the parts of the earth, &c. 3. b. p. 171.3. b. p. 171.

14. You still misreport my words, and peruert my meaning, I speake in that place of the diuers glosses, which those of your opinion make, of this descending of Christ, &c. 3. b. p. 175.3. b. p. 175.

The iustification.

1. VVHereas the Replyer vrgeth these words of the (Confuter) S. Peter mentioneth sorrowes which were loosed at Christs resurrection, &c. thereby inferring that the Confuter in these words implieth Limbus patrum; because those sorrowes (of hell) were not loosed for Christ, but for others: to what purpose should he alleadge that impertinent addition, much lesse in heauen, where there is fulnes of ioy? for the question is, for whome those sorrowes were loosed: I thinke, he will not say, for any that were in heauen: there is then no iniurie done vnto the Confuter, in the omitting of those words: the Replyer should haue had more aduantage in setting them downe.

2. The Obiector indeede first saith, that the soule by a synecdoche is taken for (me:) but the Confuter also hath these very words, the state of the questiō is not, whether the soule ioyned with the bodie, may be taken 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , for the whole man liuing (in which sense it can not be denied, but it is taken in diuers places of Scripture.) 1. b. p. 7. The Replyer then corrupteth not his wordes, but the (Refuter) denieth his owne wordes: and that word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , is onely vsed in that place by himselfe, not by the Obiector.

3. The whole sentence is this, (it is a generall axiome in Theologie among diuines) that the words of holy writ are alwaies to be taken and vnderstood, according to their natiue and proper signification, but onely when there followeth some manifest and apparant absurdity: what fraud now or legerdemain is there in omitting of the first clause, which is but a flourish to the sentence, no substantial part therof? The Replyer was not bound to rehearse all his idle words, but such as were materiall to the purpose. But the legerdemaine that here is, is found onely in the Confuter, who falsely chargeth the Replyer for reiecting of this axiome, whereas he admitteth it: and vpon that ground prooueth these two points; that the words (sheol and nephesh) doe sometime properly signifie, the (life, and graue) and if they did not, yet by reason of the absurdities and inconueniences ensuing, a figuratiue sense of those words should be acknowledged.

4. To what purpose should the Replyer haue added that clause, and thus auncient learned, &c. seeing the Refuter onely nameth certaine fathers in the margin vpon this point, as Augustine, Euthimius, Damascen, but produceth not their testimony; for the hunts-man looseth but his labour in tracing the hare, vnlesse he finde her sitting in her forme, or can finde her out by her sent: and as wearisome a thing it is to follow the fathers in the large field of their writings, the particular places beeing not noted.

5. True it is, that the Confuter maketh a double Antithesis betweene Christ and Dauid: a generall betweene their persons, in these words, thou wilt not leaue my soule in hell (as he readeth:) and a particular, in his incorruption, resurrection, and a scension: which last (the Refuter) calleth the true antithesis: The Replyer then had no reason to make mention of that generall antithesis, 1. because hee speaketh of the true antithesis: which the Refuter himselfe saith, doth consist in those three points before mentioned: and this he affirmeth, not onely in his simple text, but in his friuolous marginall notes, that herein the true antithesis consisteth, betweene Christ and Dauid, in his incorruption, resurrection, ascension. 2. Neither will his generall antithesis helpe him, which hee saith is not betweene the soule of Christ, and the soule of Dauid, but betweene their persons. 1. b. p. 19. But the Replyer giueth an instance in the soule of Dauid, that it neither was at all in hell, nor yet left there, as likewise Christs was not; and therefore therein the antithesis was not.

6. The whole place is this: (if by flesh you vnderstand the humanitie, and by spirit the diuinity,) you must read the text thus: Christ was mortified in his humanity, &c. What needed here the needlesse repetition of this friuolous antecedent, seeing the very summe and substance of the obiection is expressed? the Replyer laboured for breuitie, to comprehend much in few words; not to speake much, and say little as the Refuter doth, who by loathsome prolixitie wearieth the Reader, that hee should not see his vanity.

7. The Refuter chargeth the obiector directly with two things together, ignorantly to contradict himselfe, and erroneously to confound the distinct persons of the Trinity: and both these he shufleth vp together: and doe not those words, you turne the soule of Christ first into his diuinity, &c. in his collection, as well shew a confounding of the persons, as contradiction? Therefore the Replyer summing the obiection together, missed not an haires breadth of the (Refuters) meaning, if hee vnderstood himselfe.

8. And where doth the Replyer charge him so to say directly? his words are these: It is euident that the answerer more boldly then truely saith, that by these words (the lowest parts of the earth) hell is alwaies signified: for vnlesse he be able to prooue that, he doth but trifle. Is it not euident by these words, that the Replyer chargeth the Refuter by a disiunctiue speech, that either he must say so, or he doth but trifle?

9. Neither doth the Replyer affirme that hee saith so, but whereas the Confuter setteth forth the greatnesse of the loue of the Prince, in not disdaining in his owne person to go down into the prison, where the captiues were: the Replyer denieth (as a consequent of this assertion) that the descension to hell should more haue commended Christ loue, then his death and passion: for if the comparison be not betweene Christ death, and descension, it is impertinent.

10. To what ende should the Replyer trouble himselfe and his Reader with setting downe all his friuolous words: if there were any siluer or gold in them, or matter of worth, they might be deliuered by number, & weight: but beeing as they are, full of droffe, I thought it best to refine them, and not to take refuse and all. I appeale vnto the indifferent Reader, if the very sense of his long periods be not exactly kept, though all his words are not giuen by tale. And he himselfe is the man, that mis-reporteth his owne words: for whereas in the first booke hee said, here is a plaine opposition of the personall motions of ascending and descending: now he saith (to mende the matter) here is a plaine exposition, &c.

11. These are the Refuters owne words: The conquest was not obtained and effected by his comming downe from heauen, nor yet by his incarnation, &c. but by his passion on the crosse, and his descension to hell: wherein now are his words depraued? doth not likewise the Replyer, in propounding his obiection, ioyne both his crosse, and passion, and his descending to hell together? But seeing he ascribeth Christs victorie ioyntly to both these, is hee not ashamed to say, he doth not attribute this victory to Christs descension to hell, but to his blessed death and passion? And doth he not elsewhere say, that our whole and entire freedome was wrought and effected by our Sauiour Christs descension into hell, and not onely by his death and passion vpon the crosse. 3. b. p. 143.3. b. p. 143. There is then no other Harpy here but himselfe, that scratcheth his face with his owne nailes: hee neede to feare no other talents but his owne, to vse the Orators words; Philip p. 2. Num expectas, dum te stimulis fodiam, haec te, si vllam partem habes sensus, lacerat, haec cruentat oratio: Doe you looke while I should gore you with pricks: if you haue any part of sense, this (your owne) speach doth teare and wound you.

12. The very words of the Refuter are these: His ascending beeing but one exaltation, prooueth inuincibly, that this descending was but one humiliation. 1. b. p. 58.1. b. p. 58. whence the Replyer inferreth, that hee maketh but one degree of Christs exaltation: The first is his owne assertion, without any mis-reporting; the other is a collection vpon his words, without any wresting: for in saying his ascending was but one exaltation, he saith in effect, that his exaltation was but one (namely his ascending) and so consequently there should be but one degree of his exaltation. And as by descending, he vnderstandeth generally the comming downe of Christ from heauen, vnto the lowest point of his humiliation: and not for the locall descension onely to hell: as appeareth by that opinion which he confuteth, of them which vnderstand Christs descending into the lower parts of the earth, of his descending from heauen to earth: so by ascending in this opposition hee must vnderstand the whole returne of Christ from the lowest point of his humiliation, vnto heauen againe: for that there were not many debasements in Christs descension, is prooued (saith hee) by the contrary motion of ascending, which was but one exaltation, &c. who seeth not, by this inference, that as hee denieth many debasements (i. degrees) of Christs humiliation, so hee denieth many degrees in his exaltation.

13. The Refuters words at large are these: The article 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , added here to the words ( 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ) which is not alwaies expressed in the Greeke, but commonly when it is put ( 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ) to particularize some singular or speciall thing, seemeth here plainely to distinguish the parts of the earth in generall, from those notorious infernall parts. 1. b. p. 58. Now the Replyer abridgeth the obiection thus: the article ( 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ) added here doth particularize and distinguish, &c. Is here any vntruth? seeing these are his owne words, seemeth here plainely to distinguish: what great difference is there betweene distinguishing, and seeming plainly to distinguish: that tearme of affirming precisely, is his owne, and not the Replyers.

14. The Refuters words are these: his ascending being but one exaltation, prooueth inuincibly, that this descending in like manner was but one humiliation.1. b. p. 58. 1. b. p. 58. The Replyer reporteth them thus: his ascension being but one exaltation, prooueth that his descending likewise was but one humiliation: for ascending (hee hath) ascension, for (in like manner) likewise: and leaueth out inuincibly, the omitting whereof, if it make any thing at all, is against the Replyer. Is he not ashamed now to crie out, that his words are misreported?

Now this false accuser of falsification,Prou. 14. 5. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . what hath hee gained, but the reproach of a false witnesse? the Scripture saith, that a faithfull witnesse will not lie: if hee had dealt faithfully,Hieron. ad Pammach. aduers. Ioann. Hierosolym. he would not haue forged such an vntrue & vniust accusation. Hierom well saith, Testimonium pro se, nec Catoni creditum: that, no not Cato was credited in his owne testimonie. And this Refuters accusation hath no other ground but his owne surmise,AEsop. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . and bare word. He said well, that beeing asked what aduantage came by a lie to him that made it, that they shall not bee beleeued when they speake the truth. And I doubt not, but this fabler shall finde the lesse credit with euery iudicious Reader, hauing so often failed in his accusations. There was an a uncient lawe among the Romanes, that hee which tolde a false testimonie,Qui falsum testimonium dixerit, vinciatur apud eum, in quem dixerit. Senec. declam. lib. 5. should bee cast in bonds with him against whome hee spake it. And this rewarde shall this false witnesse haue, that hee himselfe, as bounde and intangled with his owne false accufation and slaunder, shall bee deliuered vp to the partie innocent and accused, as shall now appeare in the returning vpon his head his owne suggestion.

The Recrimination.

1. This falsifier himselfe thus mis-reporteth the Replyers words, and peruerteth his meaning, that wheras he thus writeth; Some would haue all purged, not the superfluous humors onely, but some profitable parts, &c. And then a little after it followeth: But the better sort, desire neither with Herodicus nothing to be purged, nor with Heraclitus, all things to be euacuated and purged: but rather approoue Hippocrates methode, that what is euill may be purged, the rest to be comforted and strengthened. And afterward alleadging that place of S. Paul, 1. Cor. 5. 7. concerning the old leauen and new lumpe: he addeth, we would not, the leauen,Preface to the Antilogie. lump of dough, and all to be cast out; but the lumpe to be renewed, the old sower leauen to be reiected. Now see how this (peruerse mis-construer) plaieth his part: But the better sort (he meaneth himselfe, and such other) thinke that there (be superfluous humors) which haue neede to bee purged, that the (new sweete) lumpe (of their laicall prosbyterie) hath need to be renewed, and the olde sower leauen (of our Ecclesiasticall policie) to be reiected. 2. b. p. 20.2. b. p. 20. where beside the addition of all those words inclosed in the parenthesis, he chargeth the Replyer, against his owne conscience, and contrary to the words of the Replyer, as beeing an enemie to the Ecclesiasticall policie; who a little before, in the same place, maketh the calling of reuerend pastors and Bishops in it self, one of the profitable parts of the church.

2. Whereas the Replyer thus writeth, Wee reioyce to heare of your honours Christian consultation for the propagating of the gospel, in planting euery where of good pastors, that the people may be brought from darkenesse of their ignorance, to the light of knowledge, that they bee no longer children in vnderstanding, and as babes and sucklings in religion. Epist. dedicat. to Limbom. He thus corrupteth his words: Our people of England (saith hee) for want of good Pastors (such as himselfe) liue in darkenes and ignorance, are children in vnderstanding, &c. 2. b. p. 21.2. b. p. 21. making the Replyer to speake of the people of England in generall, whereas he meaneth onely such places, where good Pastors are wanting, and the word not preached, where the people cannot choose but bee ignorant, and as children in vnderstanding, as God he knoweth. But it seemeth, that this enemie to Gods glory, & the peoples saluation, could be contented, they should liue in ignorance still.

3. The Replyer readeth; But we doe all hope, that this your honourable Session shall rather deserue to be so called: the Falsifier addeth, But we (the wel-willers of Sion) doe all hope, &c. 2. b. p. 24.2. b. p. 24.

4. Thus also he maketh the Replyer to write: (that all Ministers that cannot preach, may bee remooued, and such Ministers prouided in their roomes, (as heretofore for their zeale and diligence haue been excluded) which haue store of milke in their breasts,2. b. p. 24. & which seeke in peace, and in a good conscience to nourish the people of God (being like babes ready to star e for want of such Nurses.) All these words inclosed, as the Reader seeth, are added by the Falsifier.

5. The Falsifier thus forgeth: that hee (i. the King) acknowledgeth the Romane Church to be our mother Church, it is (saith Limbomastix) a foolish conceit, and imagination. 2. b. p. 28.2. b. p. 28. The Replyer thus writeth; a foolish conceit & imagination it is, that Rome should bee the mother Church, and Nurserie of all the world: where there is no reference at all to the Kings Maiestie, neither are the words as hee repeateth them: for it is one thing to say the Romane Church is our mother Church, in respect of the antiquitie of the place;See before Imput. 2. because the Romane faith and religion (before it yet declined) did spread into these westerne parts: & another, that it should be our mother Church, as it now standeth corrupted in religiō: it is one thing to say it is our mother Church, another, that is the mother Church, and nurserie of all the world.

6. The Confuter thus forgeth: doth it follow, because I say it ought to be translated, to the spirits which were, & not which are in prison, that therefore they were in hell, and are not, I deny your argument. 2. b. p. 39.2. b. p. 39. whereas hee leaueth out this other part of the Replyers argument, or else hee striueth about words.

7. He imagineth the Replyer to say, that Christ loosed the sorrowes of hell for others (detained in hell) and that to thinke otherwise is very absurd. 2. b. p. 42.2. b. p. 42. whereas the Replyer so affirmeth, not out of his owne iudgement, but vrgeth the Confuter with that inconuenience: and concerning the inference of absurditie, these are his words, and not as he repeateth them; I thinke he is not so absurd, as to thinke he loosed them for himselfe, who was neuer in the sorrowes of hell after his death. 2. b. p. 36.2. b. p. 36.

8. You affirme some Popish bookes to haue beene written by Protestants,2. b. p. 54. whereas these are the Replyers words, There are bookes abroad maintaining offensiue doctrine,Preface to the Antilog. p. 9. too much declining to Poperie.

9. The Replyer saith, Antilog. p. 15. Durand maintaineth contrary to the opinion of the rest: but he thus falsifieth the place; Durand maintaineth an opinion contrary to (all) the rest: where (all) is added, 2. b. p. 190. & the order of the words inuerted.

10. You graunt, that these two particles (not) and (neither) doe shew a difference of the clauses, and a diuersitie of matter,2. b. p. 163. whereas these are the words of the Replyer; here these two negatiues (lo, lo,) are vsed, & yet there is no great difference in these two clauses, &c. nor they shew no great diuersity of matter: he setteth it downe negatiuely, & the other repeateth his words affirmatiuely.

11. His glory,2. b. p. 189. victory, and triumph remained (vnaccō plished:) this word (vnaccomplished) is added of his owne.

12. That Christ hath 2. kingdoms belonging vnto him, one as he is God,2. b. p. 201. and another as he is God & man: but these are the Replyers words, that kingdome whereof Christ promiseth to make the thiefe partaker,2. b. p. 194. is not that kingdome which belongeth to him as God.

13. The sorrowes of hell or death,3. b. p. 33. had fastned on Christ: but the Replyer hath, the sorrows, of death and the graue.

14. You most grossely ouerreach your selfe, so prophanly and vnchristianly to censure the , (i. the fathers) to prepare the way to a most grosse heresie 3. b. p. 76. whereas these are the Replyers words, rather this sense of the place, to interpret it of the descending of Christ to hell, where the disobedient persons and vnbeleeuers were, giueth way, and openeth a most wide gap to a most grosse heresie.3. b. p. 71. He doth not simply charge the fathers, or any other, but speaketh onely by way of comparison.

15. Your bookes (saith the falsifier) should be in so base esteeme of all hands, that many would not vouchsafe the reading of them, &c. nay that the labours of your sacred wit were onely vsed to beautifie walls:3. b. p. 103. whereas the Replyer onely hath, bookes were growne into such small request, &c. and the labours of sacred witts he speaketh not of his owne bookes: for he (thanked be God) had no cause to complaine of his owne, which he doubteth not but will liue in the memorie of the world more yeares, then his shall moneths or daies.

16. The Replyers words are these: this phrase is neither straunge nor vnusuall to say, that Christ went in spirit, or the spirit of Christ went, seeing Noah went in the spirit of Christ:3. b. p. 103. which the Confuter corrupteth thus: Christ went in spirit: that is, saith he, Noah went in the spirit of Christ: and yet he denieth, that he corrupteth the words: whereas he leaueth out this clause altogether: or the spirit of Christ went which the Replyer insiste •• vpon: making these in a manner all one; that Christs spirit preached in Noe, and Noe preached in the spirit of Christ.3. b. p. 98.

17. It followeth not (say you) Christ died not the death of the soule by sinne or damnation, Ergo he can not be said to haue died in soule 3. b. p. 84. But the Replyer hath, can not be said (any waies) to haue died in soule: which words (any waies) he clippeth off.

18. He chargeth the Replyer to say, that many of the auncient fathers affirme, that Christ was crucified in his soule: 3. b. p. 93. where he clippeth off the Replyers words which immediatly follow, that he gaue his soule a price of redemption for our soule. Synops. p. 1008. So he saith not that many of the fathers affirme the first, wherein Ambrose onely is produced: but both must be put together.

19. The Replyer saith: this article of the present tense, beeing here to be supplied, and the sense not enforcing a change of time, 3. b. p. 113. doth rather giue to be translated are, then were. The falsifier clippeth off all that clause: (and the sense not enforcing a chaunge of time:) and repeateth the words thus: because you make a difference betweene the sense of a word (expressed,) and a word (supplied:) not making any mention, of the enforcing of the sense: and therefore all these 14. examples produced by him, wherein the necessitie of the sense enforceth a participle of the time past, as Matth. 1. 36. 2. 25. 5. 40. They that (were) with him: and so in the rest, are impertinent: for the sense doth necessarily giue, that it must be vnderstood of the time past.

20. The Replyers words stand thus: doth he thinke, that these disobedient spirits were in hell, and are not? if he doe not,3. b. p. 113. he trifleth: for the word (were) will helpe him nothing. Now commeth this deceitfull forger, and thus turneth the sentence: whosoeuer thinketh, that those disobedient spirits were in hell,3. b. p. 119. but are not, is a trifler: whereas the Replyer saith the contrarie: if he doe not (thinke so) he is a trifler.

21. He chargeth the Replyer thus to say: that the bodily death of Christ was not sufficient for mans saluation: yea, that his bodily sufferings made not properly to our redemption: 3. b. p. 156. and because his forgerie should not appeare, he confusedly shuffleth diuerse places together in the margen,Synops. p. 979. 980. 1000. 1003. 1046. quoted out of Synopsis: in the which, no such words can be found.3. b. p. 980. The Replyer saith: Christs blood we confesse, in Gods omnipotencie to haue beene sufficient to redeeme vs, though but one droppe had been shed, but it so stood not with the decree and purpose of God. p. 1000. By one part the rest are signified, for if blood be taken strictly, then Christs flesh is excluded, and beside his blood, there issued forth also water: all these were necessarie parts of Christs passion, p. 1003. We ascribe the redemption of our bodie and soule, equally to the sacrifice of his bodie and soule. Againe, it is not affirmed, that the compassion of the soule with the bodie did not properly belong to our redemption simply, but to that redemption, which was to be wrought by the soule. Who seeth not, how shamelesse this Cauiller is, to charge the Replyer to affirme that, the contrarie whereof he maintaineth?

12. Your selfe make three descents of Christ: to the crosse, to hell, to the graue: and yet beside these, you make three more in an other place:3. b. p. 162. whereas the Replyers words are these, Bernard maketh the same degrees of Christs descension, which we doe, his descending to the flesh, to the crosse, to the graue.3. b. p. 159. He calleth them not three descents, but three degrees of his descension. Now may not his owne words with better reason be returned vpon his owne head: If you know no difference betweene descension, and the degrees thereof, you are ill worthie of those schoole degrees, which you haue taken. But concerning himselfe, howsoeuer he might goe out master of Art in the croud; for forgerie, railing, vntruths, falsifications, and such like, he may well be admitted to be a professor. Beside, the Replyer speaketh not in that place of descending to hell, but to the crosse. Neither in that other place quoted, sect. 17. doth the Replyer make three more descents: his words are these, We also confesse, that Christ by his death ouercame hell, and shaked the powers thereof, that he humbled himselfe to the ignominious death of the crosse, and descended from thence to the graue, and there continued in the state of the dead till the third day: and whatsoeuer els may be comprehended in the article of Christs descension. Here are not many descents affirmed, but diuers senses and explications of one and the same descension deliuered, all agreeable to the Scriptures.

23. You imagine that Christs soule was depriued of his fathers presence,3. b. p. 165. while it was in hell: but this is his owne imagination: for the Replyers words are these; to say that Christs soule did not enioy his fathers presence in heauen, all the while it was absent from the bodie, is contrarie to the Scripture: thou wilt shew me the waies of life, &c. he speaketh not of the depriuing of his fathers presence in 〈◊〉 but of the enioying thereof in heauen.

24. You hold he descended into hell,Synops. p. 1018. yea into all the torments,3. b. p. 175. that hell could yeild: whereas the Replyer affirmeth the contrarie in that place: the whole punishment, is the whole kind of punishment, that is in bodie and soule, which Christ ought to haue suffered, though not in the same manner, and circumstance, neither for the place of hell locally, nor for the time, eternally, nor for the manner, sinnefully.

May not now this (Momus) iustly beshrew his vnblushing cheekes, and bold face, in accusing the Replyer, of falsifying and corrupting his words: seeing it is so ordinarie a thing with himselfe, to falsifie, peruert, and corrupt the Replyers both sense, and sentences. He little remembred in this leud course, the saying of our Sauiour: whatsoeuer you would that men should doe vnto you, Matth. 7. 12. euen so doe you to them. He would be loath himselfe to haue his words thus clipped, and curtalled, chopped, and changed, which measure he hath meated with to the Replyer: who if he had somewhere failed in his sayings, the Confuter might well haue spared him, beeing so vnconscionable himselfe in his doings: and he might haue vsed toward him, that saying of the Greeke Poet:Sophocles in Aiace. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : as you dare not praise my sayings, so neither can I commend your doings. If herein he would haue beene without blame, he should in repeating of the Replyers words haue obserued the same rule, which Seneca prescribeth in citing of authors: tota inspicienda, tota tractanda sunt, 11. Imputation. per lineamenta sua i genij opus nectitur, ex quo nihil subduci sine ruina potest: epistol. 23. lib. . the whole must be looked into, the whole must be handled, the worke of wit is tied together by lineaments, from the which nothing can be withdrawne, without the ruine of the whole. It was therefore an easie matter for this vnderminer, to ruinate the Replyers whole building, in supplanting of it by parcels, and racking and dismembring one peece from an other. Wherein he may complaine that he hath bin dealt with,hom 25. in Luc. as Origene sometime was, who saith, Alij tractatus nostros calumniantes easentire nos criminantur, quae nunquam sensisse nos novimus: some doe cauill with our treatises, and doe blame vs to thinke those things, which we know we neuer thought. And so plaieth this (Catchpole) ascribing vnto the Replyer such things as he holdeth not: and sheweth himselfe to be of that number, whome Hierome complaineth of: non meritum stili, sed suum stomachum sequentes, not following the merite (and manner of the Replyers) stile, but his owne (humor) and stomake.

The 11. Imputation, of the forged falsification of Fathers.
The Accusation. 1. Origene pretended to be falsified.

1. Whereas the Replyer saith, that one bond of faith in the diuersitie of some priuate opinions, may containe and keepe vs in peace: that same, vnum fidei linteum, quod vidit Petrus quatuor Euangelijs alligatum: that sheete of faith, which Peter saw tied with the foure Gospels in the corners: The Confuter crieth out: he applieth it not, (as you vntruly report him) vnto the diuersitie of opinions in matters of faith,2. b. p. 108. &c.

2. Who would translate, cum ligno crucis, in the tree of the crosse.3. b. p. 185.

3. He saith, he clippeth Origenes words, because the Replyer leaueth out (fere.)3. b. p. 178.

4. So in an other testimonie cited out of Origene, he saith,3. b. p. 182. that Origenes words are clipped.

5. The Reader may see, what little care you haue of credit or conscience, thus to abuse so auncient, and learned a father.3. b. p. 188.

6. So an other place of Origene (he saith) is abused in like manner. p. 188.3. b. p. 188.

The iustification.

1. IT is well that this (false Accuser) confesseth Origenes sense onely not to be followed, and so graunteth his words to be rightly alleadged. But he applieth it not (saith he) vnto the diuersitie of opinions in one particular Church, &c. but that all people and nations whatsoeuer, without difference of place, or distinction of persons, should be gathered vnto his Church. He would be asked, whence he hath this application: for Origene onely alleadgeth the prophesie of Isai, and the vision of Peter, without any speciall application in that place. And if nations that were at enmitie and of diuers religions, shall be conteined in this sheete of faith, much more they which are of one faith, differing onely in some priuate opinions.The vnlearned Confuter himselfe clippeth Origene. But he is the man that clippeth and corrupteth Origene: for beside that he translateth ill, as turning the passiue into the actiue, quae alia nobis figura servanda est, what other figure should we obserue, for, what other figure is to be obserued of vs: which I would not note, but that he is so captious in other places, to finde fault with the Replyer in the like, to shew his grammer learning: he also englisheth, simul ire ad pascua, to feede together: which signifieth, to goe together to the pastures. He leaueth out also a whole clause, eorum que foetus simul paleis vesci, and their young shall eate straw together. 3. b. p. 107.

2. Had malice so blinded him, that the Replyer translating, in the tree of the crosse, he could not consider, that it might be the Printers fault, to set cum ligno, for in ligno, especially seeing in the printed copies of Origene, it is in ligno: as, in an other place he saith, principatus traducti & triumphati in ligno, the principalities were traduced, and triumphed vpon in the tree. tract. 3. in Matth.

2. Origenes words are these, inveniemus quia nunquā fere in sanctum quis locum descendisse legitur: we shall find, that neuer (almost) any is said to descend into an holy place: hereupon he taketh this exception, because this word fere, (almost) is omitted by the Replyer. A doubtie exception sure. But is Origenes sense any thing chaunged by the omission of that word: nay, is not his sense made more full to the Replyers purpose, by the supplying of that word: for is he so ignorant in his owne grammar learning, that he knoweth not, that fere is sometime a word of vniuersalitie:Memini in eum sermonem incidere, qui tum fere erat in ore. i. semper. if he had consulted with Calepine, he could haue told him, that fere is otherwhile taken for semper, for alwaies, as he sheweth out of Cicero. And that it is so taken here, it may be gathered by the sentence going before, observand m est, &c. quomodo in singulis (quibus que locis) ascendere dicatur & descendere: it must be obserued, how in (euery) place, it is said to ascend, and descend: so then in the next sentence, (fere) almost, is taken in the same sense that (quibusque) euerie, is in the former.

4. The place cited out of Origene is this: si qui mente & cogitatione descendit in abyssum, &c. if any man in thought and minde descend to the deepe, thinking Christ there onely to be contained, as though it were all one, and alike to call him from the dead, &c. Origene, he saith, is here abused, because he speaketh not of Christs humanitie, but of his diuinitie,3. b. p. 182. his words also are clipped. First, the Replyer onely alleadgeth Origene in this place for the meaning of this phrase, to descend to the deepe: which he sheweth out of his owne words, quasi simile sit revocare Christum à mortuis, ita subiungit, hoc est Christum reducere à mortuis: as though it were alike to call Christ from the dead, he adioyneth thus, that is, to bring Christ againe from the dead. He euidently sheweth, that to descend into the deepe, and to bring Christ from the dead, is in a manner all one: whether he speake of the diuinitie or humanitie of Christ, concerneth not the vse of the phrase. Secondly, the Replier leaueth out the latter clause, ita subiungit, &c. partly, because the same in effect was saide in the former wordes, partly, supplying it by an &c. for breuitie sake: which clause beeing added, maketh the Replyers collection more strong, and full, and therefore it was not omitted of any fraud,The Confuter himselfe prooued a corrupter of Origene. Thirdly, he himselfe is the man, that corrupteth Origene: for whereas Origene thus rehearseth the Apostle, therefore the iustine, which is of faith, saith thus: say not in thine heart, who shall ascend into heauen: he turneth it, say not in thine heart, who shall descend into the deepe: & thus corrupteth both the Apostle, & Orig. that, citeth him.

5. Origene is alleadged by the Replyer, to vnderstand Christs descension sometime of his comming downe from heauen to the lower parts, in these words: Paul us quoniam descensionis Christi mysterium praedicat, &c. Paul because he preacheth the mysterie of Christs descension into hell, he named the deepe, as of one comming from the higher to the lower parts, &c. Could any thing be spoken more plainly? what vnshamefast dealing then is this, or what meaneth this bold fac'd fellow to say, that Origene speaketh not a word of any of the former fictions (he meaneth belike, the mysterie of Christs descension, whereof the Replyer entreateth) but onely of the length, breadth, and height of Noahs Arke: And that by the higher parts, he vnderstandeth the heauenly, by the lower, the earthly, (which is an other thing, that he cauilleth at) it is euident by the words following in the next sentence: de terrenis & humilibus ad coelestia & excelsa conscenditur: frō terrene and low things, it is ascended to heauenly, and high. He himselfe also clippeth Origen here: for whereas Origen thus reciteth the Apostle, vt sciat is, quae sit longitudo, & latitudo, &c. that yee may know, what is the length, breadth, height, and depth; he leaueth out (breadth.)3. b. p. 188.

6. In the sixt place cited out of Origen, the Replyer abridging his testimony in those places, for the which hee is not alleadged, leaueth out in diuers clauses, in coelum, de coelo, in coelo, into heauen, from heauen, in heauen; and not onely these words, but a whole sentence is omitted: qui nō rapinam arbitratus, &c. which thought it no robbery to bee equall to God, but made himselfe of no reputation, taking the shape of a seruant: that he might hasten to that part of the sentence which is vrged; our Lord descended not onely to take care of vs, but to beare our insirmities. If hee can shew any word of moment for that purpose, wherefore Origen is produced, to be omitted, let him crie out, that Origen is abused. And doth not Origen himselfe abridge his owne words, when in the next sentence hee saith, cum descendit, when he descendit,The Confuter clippeth Origen. omitting, de eoelo, from heauen. And how chanceth it, that he could not see his owne fault; cutting off this whole clause, astiterunt (inquit) tres viri super eum: three men (saith he) stood by him: which followe immediatly after those words,3. b. p. 188. as we haue declared before. It is a fond part of him to spie a mote in another mans eie, when he seeth not a beame in his owne: to complaine of curtalling of words, when he clippeth off a whole sentēce.

2. Other Greeke Fathers pretended to be falsisied, Athanasius, Cyrillus, Chrysostome. The accusation.

1. That Athanasius words are not truely alleadged, & that the Replyer goeth about to make him contrary to himselfe.3. b. p. 125.

2. For S. Cyril (saith the Confuter) I find no such thing in the place quoted by you, but those words in the 49. chap. v. 9. after, beeing in effect the same with the other, hee most plainly expoundeth of Christs locall descension to hell.3. b. p. 123.

3. Chrysostome in the same place saith plainly, that both Dives and Lazarus were apud inferos, 3. b. p. 124. in hell.

2. The iustification.

1. Athanasius words truly alleadged are these:Athanas. epist. ad Epictet. apud Epiphan. heres. 77. nunc vero ipsum quidē verbū ivit ad praedicandū, corpus autē syndone inuolutum deposuit Ioseph: now the word it selfe went to preach, but his body wrapped vp in a linnen cloth, Ioseph laid vp, &c. Is he not ashamed to denie that Athanasius said the diuine nature went and preached? for was not the word his diuine nature. Nay, doth not hee falsely alleadge Athanasius, that hauing cited an impertinent sentence out of him tenne lines long,The Confuter mangleth Athanasius. breaketh off at these words, nune vero ipsum verbum, &c. for the which he was produced, and passeth them ouer in silence, as though no such words were there to be found?

2. These are the very words of Cyril, vpon the 49. cha. of Isay, v. 9. His qui in vinculis & catenis suorum peccatorum constrictierant, &c. to those which were tied in the bands and chaines of their sinnes, he cried out, come forth, which were conuerfant in the darkenesse, and the mist of their minde, &c. those he bid to be lightened, and to come to the light, and to open the eies of their minde, &c. Seeing he confesseth these words, Isay, 49. v. 9. to bee in effect the same with the other, Isay, 42. v. 7. how was he blinded that he could not trace out Cyril there?The Confuters ignorance in the fathers. but this his ignorance in the Fathers, sheweth that hee gathered vp other mens scrapings, and trusted not to his owne reading. And whereas he citeth another place out of Cyril, De rect. sid. ad Theodos. to shewe the meaning of the prophet Isay; there, though some allusion and reference be made to that place of that Prophet, yet is it not quoted by name, not of purpose interpreted. But what did he meane himselfe, in reciting of that sentence, to leaue out this whole clause?Cyrillus curtalled. quiddam etiam divinus Paulus dixisse videtur, &c. and diuine Paul also seemeth to haue said somewhat of the word of God, and his soule, according to the vnion of dispensation: which whole clause, omitted by him, followeth immediatly after these words: and this Peter also declareth, &c.

3. Concerning Chrysostome, they are his words; Paradisus pauperis, sinus Abrah , Abrahams bosome was the poore mans Paradise: whence the Replyer inferreth, that in his opinion Christ went not to hell, but to Paradise: what Chrysostome saith beside in that homily, is not the question, but whether he hath these words which if hee haue, what impudent and brasen face dealing is this, to cry out here of illiterate and irreligious dealing? true it is, that he saith that Abraham was (apud inferos) because Christ was not yet risen, that should bring him to Paradise: Seeing then Chrysostome saith in the same sermon, that both Abrahams bosome was Paradise, and that hee was not yet in Paradise himselfe, it is cleare, that he taketh Paradise in a double sense, and maketh two kindes of Paradise, one in inferno, beneath, or belowe; another, in heauen aboue: in inferno, cannot signifie hell, for he putteth these two together, quicunque in inferno est, & in regno coelorum est, &c. He which is in the infernall, or inferiour place, and in the kingdome of heauen, I cannot tell, whether hee can haue pitie: where Paradise is, and the kingdome of heauen is, there is not hell. Therefore when he saith, that Abrahams bosome was the infernall or inferior Paradise, and yet hee himselfe not in the superior or heauenly Paradise, he meaneth nothing but this, that by the resurrection of Christ, there was an accession of ioy, and of greater bliffe & glory to the holy Patriarchs departed: for hee also saith, Omnes in illius sinū ire festinemus, Let vs all make haste to go into his bosome: the faithful that now depart, doe not presently enter into the fulnesse of that ioy, which they shall haue in the resurrection; but they goe also to Abrahams bosome, vnto a place of heauenly ioy and rest, where they expect the consummation and perfection of their glory at the resurrection of their bodies. There is another place in that homilie, which this (blinde busie-body) would not see: Abraham nec dum erat in Paradise, quia nec dum Christus intrauerat cum latrone: Abraham was not yet in Paradise, because Christ was not yet entred with the thiese: But Christ as God entred not into Paradise, beeing neuer out of Paradise: therfore his meaning is, that Christ entred in his soule into Paradise, and the thiese with him.

3. Ambrose pretended to be falsified. The accusation.

1. Saint Ambrose is no lesse iniuriously handled by you.3. b. p. 20.

2. The other place you corrupt shamefully, &c. S. Ambrose speaketh of no such matter,3. b. p. 20. 21. as you would make your Reader beleeue.

3. Another place maketh as clearely against you, as nothing more.3. b. p. 22.

The iustisication.

1. Ambrose is produced, who expoundeth Christs descending into hell, of the presence of his diuine power: Abyssum opinione si penetres, &c. If thou in thought wilt search into the deepe, you shall see also Iesus worke there: these are the very words of Ambrose: here is no mention (saith this dreaming Confuter) of Christs personall descension into hell, but of the powerfull operation of his godhead. As though the Replyer to that ende alleadged not Ambrose, that he expoundeth the descension of the presence of his diuine power; for he said immediately before, descende verbo in infernum: descend not (in the word, as hee drawleth it out) but with the word into hell: for to say (in the word) hath no sense. And what calleth hee a personall descension? he would haue said locall, for I hope he will not appropriate Christs person to his humane nature: when our Sauiour saith,Ioh. 3. 15. No man hath ascended vp to heauen, but he that descended from heauen, &c. Doth he not speake of his personall descension, and the powerfull operation of his Godhead together: how then without any learning or iudgement, doth he here distinguish them? And if Ambrose be iniuriously handled by any, it is by himselfe, that leaueth out this whole sentence: etenim si ascenderis in coelum, Ambrose •• talled. &c. for if you ascend into heauen, Iesus is there: if you descend into the deepe, he is present: which sentence followeth immediately after these words, Descend with the word into hell, Iesus is there.

2. In the second place, he saith Ambrose wordes are clipped, and corrupted: because whereas Ambrose deliuereth two senses of those words, Psal. 139. 15. My substance was in the lower parts of the earth: the one of the beeing of his soule there, to set at libertie the soules of the deceased: the other of the presence of his diuine substance, the first is omitted. But, 1. the question is not here, whether Ambrose held the locall descension of Christs soule to hell, but whether he sometime vnderstand not the beeing of Christ there, of the presence of his diuine power: which is so euident, that this wilfull gaine-sayer confesseth it: to what ende then should the Replyer alleadge that part, which was impertinent: 2. if the first part of the sentence be added, it maketh not for his opinion, vnlesse he say with Ambrose, that Christ wrought in hel, to set at libertie the soules of the deceased. 3. this sentence was not fraudently cut off,Ambrose clipped by the Confuter. but supplied by an, &c. 4. But what if he himselfe prooue the clipper: for he skippeth ouer this whole sentence, denique ad divinam substantiam, &c. and that the diuine substance is here vnderstood, the words following declare; thine eies sawe mine vnwrought substance, that is, the vnmade and vncreated word.

4. Hierome pretended to be falsified. The Accusation.

1. The like dealing you vse with S. Hierome misqueting the place, and misapplying the words: for it is not in his Epistle to Fabiola, the argument whereof is de veste sacerdotali, as you note beeing the 128. but in his epistle vnto Marcella beeing the 130.lib. 2. p. 72.

2. Whereas the Replyer alleadgeth Hierome, who vnderstandeth by prison spoken of in Esai, 42. 7. the bandes of sinnes and errors: the Confuter, to make the Reader beleeue, that there is no such thing in Hierome, supposeth an other place out of him, where he should say, that Christ descended to hell, 3. b. p. 122. where the rich man was.

3. Valerius also being cited, whose epistle to Ruffinus is found among the works of Hierome: he saith, the author, whence he had them, (for I can not finde it) hath not the words, as he reported them: but thus, reprobata est fatu vex tanquam anseris inter olores.2. b. p. 27.

The iustification.

1. That saying of Hierome, beeing alleadged rather for exornation, and accomodation onely to the present purpose, then produced for any praise or confirmation, required not such an exact quotation of the place: the saying is this: other matters, which you desire to know, let vs conferre of together in presence, that if we be ignorant of any thing, where is neither witnes nor Iudge, it may die in a faithfull are: what if the place had not beene quoted at all, the matter had not beene great: this allegation beeing as of a sentence, not of a testimonie: as he to the same purpose citing a sentence of Augustine, vseth no other quotation but this,3. b. p. 89. as Augustine saith some where. Neither is the mistaking of the place such, as he proclaimeth: for the epistle to Marcellus is of the same argument with the other to Fabiola: treating also de veste sacerdotals, namely of the Ephod.

2. First, Hierome vpon those words of the Prophet, Isai 42. 7. That thou maist bring out the prisoners from the prison: thus writeth, funibus peccatorum vnusquis que constringitur, &c. Euery one is tied with the coardes of their sinnes: and those which sit in darkenes, he interpreteth, qui in error is nocte & caligine versabantur: which were conuersant in the night and darknes of error: the very like interpretaion, and in the same wordes he giueth, of the like place, Isa. 49. 9. all which is deceitfully concealed by this Cauillous wrangler. Secondly, who told him, that Hierom hath such a saying vpon the 14. chap. of Isai: some other mens notes deceiued him, for there I finde it not. And if he will haue Hierome to write, that Dominus descendit ad infernum (locum suppliciorum & cruciatunm) in quo videtur Dives purpuratus, vt vinctos de carcere dimitteret: that our Lord descended to hell, a place of punishment, and torment, where the rich man cloathed in purple was seene, to dismisse the prisoners out of prison:A great error laid vpon Hierome by the Confuter. then is a great error laid vpon Hierome, that some were deliuered out of hell, where the rich glutton was tormented: contrarie to the Scripture it selfe, They which would goe from hence to you, can not, neither can they come from thence to vs. Luk. 16. 26.

3. This Trifler sheweth his great learning, and deepe reading,The Confuters ignorance in the fathers. that could not finde out Valerius epistle to Ruffinus in the 4. tome of Hieromes workes, whence the Replyer taketh that sentence: and that it may appeare in deede, who is the liker that gagling cheate, he will take vpon him to gesse at the authors words, though he know them not. Now that his ignorance may fully be displaied, Valerius words are these: reprobata est fatui vex anseris: the gagling of the foolish goose is contemned: and a little after follow the other wordes, ea tamen Senatores docuit vrbem servare ab incendie: yet the goose taught the Senatours to saue the citie from the fire: but those words comming betweene, according to the saying, a goose among swannes. which should haue beene enclosed in a parenthesis, are inserted by the Replyer, not borrowed from the author. Now, because this (gagling mate) sporteth himselfe, in retorting that by-word vpon the Replyer,The Raylers immodest term of goose, returned home to the full. anser inter olores, a goose among swannes, and so after his vnmannerly fashion, thinking he hath his schoole-boyes in hand, calleth him in plaine teannes, a goose: this his addle goose egge, which he hath brooded, shall be broken vpon his owne face. Though with Valerius the Replyer thinketh not scorne, in comparison of Ruffinus, and such graue and wise men, as he writeth vnto, to be counted, (tanquā anser inter olores) yet it becommeth not such an anser, so to gaggle at him, that would be ashamed, if he were not worthie to goe for an olor, among such anseres. But the Replyer is contented for this time, to goe for an anser inter olores: as the Poet saith,Virgilius. digna sed argutos inter strepere anser olores; though a goose, yet meete to make a noise among swannes: and the Rayler shall be a counterfeit swanne: but I feare me such an one, as Valerius speaketh of: forsan cum Senatoribus intellig s, quod tibi organizent olores interitum, & anser salutem strepat: it may be you shall perceiue with the Romane Senatours, that the swannes sing your baine, and the goose gagleth health: for the propertie of the swanne is, to sing before her death, as the Poet elegantly saith,Oridius. cantator cygnus funcris ipse sui: the swanne doth celebrate her owne funerall. So, beside that this glosing flatterer, which with the false Prophets, would sow pillowes vnder all arme-holes, •• ech. 17. 13. and sing a song of securitie: he hath in his gagling pamphlet in this one propertie imitated the swanne, to sing out his owne shame and confusion; in all others parts bewraying his anserine follie: for as he saith,Philemon. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : if one should gather 30. thousand foxes together, he shall finde the same nature and disposition in them all: so one goose differeth not from another in gagling and creaking.

5. Augustine pretended to to be falsified. The accusation.

1. Augustine much misvsed & corrupted: for he saith, si quid aliter sapio,2. b. p. 13. &c. Limbom. readeth si quid erraueris.

2. The place of Augustine mis-quoted, the third book for the second: some of his words are cut off, some mistranslated. 2. b. p. 166.

3. To translate (trophaeum) a deuise or policy, is but your owne politike deuiseithe crosse of Christ is rather called trophaeum, because it was the ensigne and monument of his victory.2. b. p. 189.

4. S. Augustines words falsely translated, and corrupted, for triduo illo corporeae mortis, is not three daies by his bodily death:3. b. p. 2. but the three daies of his bodily death.

5. You corrupt Augustines words, turning blasphemy, into error. 3. b. p. 74.

6. These words of Augustine, which are the two waies, whereby the soule can be said to die; you cut off.3. b. p. 84.

7. S. Augustines words you alleadge corruptly, by leauing out halfe of the sentence.3. b. p. 91.

8. His other words to the same purpose, whereof, as your manner is,3. b. p. 115. you take but a piece, are these, &c.

9. S. Augustines words vntruly alleadged, for you leaue out the word (forte.)3. b. p. 128.

10. S. Augustine clearely against (Limbom.) in the place alleadged by him.3. b. p. 189.

11. And because the Replyer saith, Why may wee not as well expounde Christs descending into hell with Ambrose,3. b. p. 20. of the presence of his diuine power, as with Augustine his ascending vp to heauen? The disgracefull Confuter thus insulteth; Where doth Augustine expound Christs ascending vp to heauen, of his diuine power? dare you vpon your owne bare worde, without any proofe or shewe of reason, so contumeliously traduce so holy a man, as an ouerthrower of an article of our Creede? for you quote no place, neither will any Christian man beleeue, that euer he dreamed of any such exposition.

The iustification.

1. For further and full satisfaction herein, I referre the Reader to the 3. Imputation of vntruths. Iustificat. 5.

2. The mis-quoting of the figure of 3. for the figure of 2. is no such ouersight, which might escape the Printer, as wel as the Author; seeing there is as wel the 3. as 2. booke de doctrin. A grosse ouersight in the Confuter. Christian. But that is a more grosse ouersight in this blinde Confuter, in quoting the 28. homilie of Origen vpon Iosua, 3. b. p. 19. whereas hee wrote but 26. in all: those words omitted, (spem atque charitatem, &c. hope and charity, which we handled in the former booke) were impertinent to the matter in hand, and therefore it was not necessary to alleadge them: for the translation, the Replyer englisheth, in ijs, quae aperte posita sunt, &c. in those places, &c. the Confuter englisheth, among those things, which are plainely set downe in Scripture, all those things which containe faith and manners are found. Now I pray you (Sir Grammarian) is not in ijs, better translated, in those, then among those: retaining then the proper signification of the preposition? whether is better supplied, in those places, or in those things? for to say in those things, all those things are found, &c. beside the vaine tautologie, it includeth absurditie, that the same things should be both the continent, and the things contained: wherefore his meaning is, that matters concerning faith and manners, are handled in the plaine and perspicuous places of Scripture.

3. Augustines words are these, trophaeo suo diabolus victus est, The diuell was ouercome by his owne deuise: the word is not referred to Christ; for then hee would haue said,The Confuter hath forgotten his Grammer rule. trophaeo eius, not suo: hath hee, professing himselfe a Grammarian, forgotten his Grammer rule •• ui & suus reciproca sunt? And in another place Augustine sheweth more plainely, that he referreth this word to the diuell: diabolus trophaeo suo victus est, Serm. 174. de Tempor. exultauit, quando mortuus est Christus: The diuell was ouercome by his owne policie, he reioyced, when Christ died, &c. and was ouercome by Christs death: He calleth the death and crosse of Christ, the diuels trophaeum, because hee supposed to haue vanquished Christ by putting him to death: if now trophaeum be taken in the vsuall sense, for a monument or ensigne of victory obtained, as hee would haue it, his translation will containe blasphemie; that the crosse of Christ was the monument of the diuels victorie: therefore how could it be more fitly translated, then deuise; or policy? the diuell supposed, or intended to set vp Christs crosse, as a triumphant pillar, but hee was ouer-wrought in his owne deuise.

4. The words of Augustine, triduo illo corporeae mortis apud inferos custodiae mancipari: the Replyer translateth thus; to be kept in hell three daies by his bodily death: the Confuter thus; to be kept in bondage in hell the three daies of his bodily death. Who seeth not, that the sentence hauing no distinction comming betweene, will beare both these translations? if corporeae mortis, bee ioyned with triduo illo, the latter, if it be put to custodiae, the former: but it is an harsh speech, that Christs soule should be said to bee kept in bondage three daies in hell, for it was not there in bondage at all; but in the graue his body might be said to be in bondage, during that time, because it was vnder the bands of death, which Christ loosed, as Saint Peter saith, Act. 2. 24. And Dauid saith in the person of Christ, The sorrowes, or coards of the graue (for the word heblee signifieth both) tooke hold vpon me: therefore the former reading yeildeth the safer sense. See more hereof, 5. imput. iustificat. 1.

5. The Replyer there citeth no testimonie out of Augustine, but onely conformeth and applyeth his sentence, with the qualifying of one word, to his purpose: This captious controller taketh greater liberty himselfe, in the next page following; for citing a place out of Augustine, to make it serue his turne, he inserteth these names, Arrius, Eunomius, Apollinaris, and Athanasius, Epiphanius, Fulgentius, making Augustine to bring them in, whereas Fulgentius was after Augustines time: what reason had hee to finde fault with another for strayning a gnat, wheras himselfe swalloweth a Camel?

6. The addition of that clause was not necessary, and therefore the Replyer for breuities sake omitted it: hee vseth not with long and impertinent periods to weary his Reader, as this palfrey-man posteth often out of the way, till he hath lost both it, and himselfe. That which is alleadged out of Augustine sufficeth to shewe his iudgement, that the soule cannot be said to bee quickened, because it cannot die: but what reason had he to translate, quibus duabus de causis, &c. which are the two waies: he that translateth causae, waies, sheweth that he was neuer well wayed himselfe.

7. The point there handled is, how Christ is said to be quickened in the spirit: therefore the Replyer omitteth the former part of the sentence; Mortificatus carne, &c. Hee is said to be mortified in the flesh, because hee died in the flesh onely: for the question is not, how hee was put to death in the flesh: and then he beginneth the sentence, at viuificatus spiritu, but he was quickened in the spirit, &c. But wheras the Replyer here by flesh, vnderstandeth Christs humane nature: how can this sophisticating Sophister infer, that he meaneth his soule and body: for is there no difference between his humane nature, and his whole humane nature? as is your logike, such are your conclusions.

8. What an absurd fellow is this, that will not allowe a sentence to be taken out of a Father, but one must hale in that which goeth before, and commeth after, beeing not to the purpose pertinent: the question beeing about the varietie of copies; Augustine giueth two rules, that the more must bee preferred before the fewer, the Elder before the nower and thus much was sufficient to be cited out of that place. But what meaneth himselfe to corrupt Augustine by a false translation? whose words rightly translated are these: hoc modo quaerunt, &c. by this means they search, which would find out in the holy Scriptures, confirmed with so great authority, what moueth them: hee translateth thus; this course they take, who doubt of any thing in holy Scriptures, 3. b. p. 117. confirmed with so great authoritie.

9. As before he quarrelled about the omission of (fere) in a place of Origen, loc. 3. so now for leauing out (forte.) It seemeth he wanted matter, when thus he hunteth after words. Hee is a furious man, that will begin a fray vpon a word; and it is a quicke fire, that wil flame out straight vpon a sparke:Hieron. Pammach. if he had read that sentence of Hierome, Difficile est alienas lineas insequentem non alicubi excidere: it is an hard matter for one that followeth anothers lines, not sometime to misse: hee would not haue stumbled at a strawe But forte is a particle of doubting and •• certaintie saith he, & sheweth he did not resolutely pronounce, &c. And will you speake this of your Grammer skill, that (forte) is alwaies vsed as a particle of doubting?Ioan. Godscalcus obseruat. ling. latinae. I much doubt of that: for sometime, if you will giue credit to a good Latinist, it is vsed for exornation: sometimes it is a word of attention, & deep consideration: as Ionathan saith, si forte, if perhaps the Lord will worke with vs, 1. Sam. 14. 6. he doubted not of it, but with an earnest desire and attention waited vpon God. And so is it here vsed by Augustine, as a note of more deepe consideration: so that the omission of it, doth most disaduantag the Replyer.

10. And how proue you, that Augustine is against the Replyer in the place alleadged? his words are these: Haec terrena vita, &c. This earthly life, where flesh and blood is, if it be compared to that, is the lower part, or hell, &c. Augustine is alleadged, to shew that the earth is called the lower part in respect of heauen: let him shew now, how Augustine maketh against him in this very place: forsooth, because he maketh mention afterward of Christs descension to hell: as though the Replyer were ignorant of that; for doth he not directly confesse, that Augustine in the words following seemeth to incline to the opinion of Christs descension to deliuer the Patriarchs. 3. b. p. 186. But this Trifler was to giue instance of this place here alleadged, therfore he doth but palter, and still beateth the bush where the bird is not: and so as Hierom well saith, Manum peteris, & pedem porrigis, You are asked your hand, and you stretch out your foote.

11. 1. As the godhead in Scripture is said to descend, Iohn 3. 13. None hath ascended into heauen, but he that descended, &c. So God is said to ascend, Gen. 17. 22. God ascended vp to Abraham: where the same word ghalah is vsed, which is applyed to Christs ascension, Psal. 68. 18. 2. And so Augustine expoundeth that place also, Iohn 3. 13. of Christs ascension and descension according to his godhead: for these are his words in the same epistle, 57. which is cited by the Confuter vpon that place, none hath ascended, &c. secūdum hominem; &c. According to man he was in earth, not in heauen, where he now is, when he said (none hath ascended, &c.) although according to that, hee was the sonne of God, hee was yet on the earth, and was not ascended into heauen. Here he vnderstandeth Christs ascension and descension, as he was God. 3. Neither is this to denie his ascension, as hee was man, and so to ouerthrowe an article of the Creede, for then he hath made a good argument against himselfe; that because Christ is there said to descend from heauen in his deitie, therefore it followeth, he descended not in his humanitie. 4. Nay then hee himselfe ouerthroweth an article of the Creed, that confesseth the ascension and descension there spoken of, to be diuers from that mentioned by S. Paul, Ephes. 4. 9. and to be meant of the deitie of Christ. 3. b. p. 172. 173. Now sir, to returne your owne words, though it belongeth not to a Christian mans beliefe, what Augustine writ or thought to or fro: yet I hold him no reasonable man, that hearing Augustines owne words, will not thinke he spake of one kind of ascension and descension of Christ in his godhead, (though properly the godhead neither ascendeth, nor descendeth.) But he is no good Christian, that the Scripture so speaking (that God ascended) will not beleeue it: and so in effect, hee prooueth himselfe no good Christian, if hee deny that Christ is said in Scripture to ascend, as hee is God.

6. Other Authors pretended to be falsified. The accusation.

1. These nine words (of Bernards sentence) are left out by you;2. b. p. 198. and so we shall alwaies be with the Lord.

2. Bellarmine (he vnmannerly saith) you haue belied now the second time;2. b. p. 190. for leauing out this clause, for the enlightning of the Fathers with the vision of God.2. b. p. 196.

The iustification.

1. Bernard is produced by the Replyer to shewe the difference of Christs beeing with vs, and of our beeing with Christ: the sentence is this; Christ is with vs at all times to the ende of the world: but when shall we be with him? when we shall be taken vp, and meete Christ in the ayer: thus farre Bernard is alleadged; then follow those words, which hee crieth out are omitted, and so we shall alwaies be with the Lord. And why might not these words be spared, seeing sufficient was alleadged before for proofe of that difference? and if these words be supplyed, they make more fully to the Replyers purpose, and therefore this exception of omission is friuolous. But it is strange, that hee date obiect this, seeing in the same recitall of Bernard, hee cutteth off a long period himselfe: for after those words, who could persist in it without him, followeth this sentence: omne gaudium existimemus, The pitifull Confuter taketh himselfe by the nose. &c. let vs count it all ioy, when we fall into diuers tribulations my brethren, not only because wee must through many tribulations enter into the kingdome of God, but because the Lord is neere vnto those that are of a troubled heart: one faith, &c. then follow the next words, If I shall walke, &c. All these lines are left out by this pitifull Confuter, p. 198. who doth most of all confute himselfe. A shame it is for a man to ee so senslesse, to reprooue another for omitting a fewe words, and those not necessarie, himselfe skipping ouer diuers lines.

2. I see it goeth neere to him, that his graund master is touched, that he so bestirreth him, in giuing the lie, after his rude manner. But it shall presently appeare, that none here hath tolde a lie but himselfe: So that according to the law of Honorius, Poena calumniae similitudo supplicij. Cod. lib. 9. tit. 46. leg 10. the penaltie of slaunder, is the equalitie of punishment: the brand of lying, which he would haue set vpon an other, shall be printed on his owne face. Bellarmines sentence is thus cited: Licet non esset necessaria animae Christi praesentia, &c. Although the presence of Christs soule were not necessarie in hell, yet it was of congrurtie that it should be present: three exceptions now he taketh to this allegation: 1. that, in hell is added, beeing not in Bellarmine. 2. that this clause is omitte, which followeth after (animae Christi) vt patres divina visione illustrarentur, that the fathers should be enlightened, with the vision of God: for he addeth immediatly, Christ descended not to hell, for the beatification of the fathers onely, but for other causes. 3. the necessarie presence of Christs soule in hell in substance,2. b. p. 190. he affirmed a little before.

Contra. 1. These wordes (in hell) beeing onely in the translation, and not in the latine sentence, doe free the Replyer from all suspition of corruption: and they are added in the English onely by way of explanation: and Bellarmine so expoundeth himselfe afterward, as his disciple also reporteth him, that Christ descended not to hell onely for the beatification, &c. 2. Seeing the Replyer shutteth vp the first clause of the sentence, ending at animae Christi, with an &c. 3. b. p. 191. it sheweth, that there was no fraud intended: neither was the rehearsall of that clause necessarie, seeing as much is saide immediatly before, that Christ needed not (by the sentence of Durand) to descend to hell to deliuer the Patriarkes: where upon Bellarmine is produced to confesse as much, that though it was not necessarie for Christ to descend (namely for that ende, for that is the point in questiō) yet it was of congruitie. And what though he make other endes of Christs descension? it is sufficient, that he maketh not that ende of necessitie, which onely is in question, to deliuer the fathers. 3. Bellarmine indeede saith before, that Durand was in error, for not holding the substantiall presence of Christs soule necessarie in hell: but there he addeth not the ende, for the enlightening or deliuering of the fathers: therefore both may stand together, that Bellarmine held Christs presence necessarie in hell: and yet not for that speciall ende, necessarie. But, if Bellarmine should say and vnsay the same thing, which is no rare thing with him: what is that to the Replyer: let him, whose darling he seemeth to be, looke to salue his masters credit.

Thus hath this (Calumnious aduersarie) opened his wide throate, and vttered his S •••• ors voice, in accusing the Replyer of falsification: whereas he is not able to fasten one line corrupted or falsified by him. If sometimes for breuities sake, he abridge a sentence, leauing out yet nothing materiall, and omitting what is impertinent, it is no falsification: that is a sound rule of Gelasius, Non mentitur, Caus. 22. qu. 2. c. 5. qui animum fallendi non habuit, he lyeth not, that had no intent to deceiue. It is no small iniurie, for one against his conscience,Cod. lib. 9. tit. 36. leg. 1. Si quis famosum libellum. Valentin. with a cauillous spirit, to accuse an other to be a falsifier. The Ciuill law is, that he which findeth a famous libell of an other, and publisheth it, should be punished, as if he were the author: Now this vnconscionable Slaunderer, is found both the author, and publisher too, of this infamous libell and accusation. If he escape humane censure, let him take heede he incurre not the diuine displeasure. As for the Replyer he regardeth no more such cholerike inuectiues, then Dauid did Shemeies throwing of stones, and casting dust in the aire: a good conscience as a brasen wall shall stand against all such p llets of enuie: and as Alexander saide of Darius great 〈◊〉 , wherein there were many thousands, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , that one slaughter man is not afraid of many sheep: So the edge of truth shall be able to cut downe, all such false accusations, that the defender thereof shall not neede to be afraid of them.

The recrimination.
1. Origene falsified and corrupted by the Confuter.

1. Beside those places of Origene, wherein the Replyer is falsly charged with corrupting them, but they are retorted vpon the Confuter himselfe, as namely the 1. 4. and 6. places before obiected: He doth diuersly peruert, and falsifie this learned father in other places by himselfe produced: as 3. b. p. 169.3. b. p. 169. he three waies abuseth a sentence of Origenes: 1. in misnaming the place, from whence he borroweth it: citing homil. 35. i Math. whereas it is not an homilie, but a 〈◊〉 vpon Mathew, containing aboue 20. leaues in folio, which could not be vttered in one homilie or sermon. 2. He clippeth off a great part of the sentence, which he beginneth thus: be that called Christ from hell, &c. leauing all out, that goeth before: Quod si vi audire, quid profuit Christo, &c. If you will heare, what it profited Christ to haue or ed out with a great voice,Origene curtalled by the confuter. and so to haue giuen vp his spirit, that is, to haue commended his spirit into the hands of the Lord, and so to haue giuen it vp, or to haue leaned his head vpon his fathers bosome, and so to haue deliuered his spirit, heare what the Prophet saith; for this therefore, he shall not leaue his soule in hell, nor suffer him to see corruption: if therefore we can so behaue our selues, that we can commend our spirit into the hands of the Lord; or leane our head vpon the Lords bosome, and so deliuer our spirit: without doubt, neither shall he leaue our soules in hell, nor suffer vs for euer to remaine in corruption. All this is quite cut off, because he saue what a pregnan place this was against the locall descent: seeing that Origene affirmeth, that he soules of Christs members, that cōmend their spirits into the hands of God, shall after the same manner, not be left in hell, as Christs soule was not left. But the soules of the faithfull come not into hell at all. 3. Beside, that, which he rehearseth out of Origene, is very corruptly translated: Origene corrupted. he that called Christ from hell after the third day; recalled vs also in due time: and he that gaue to him, that his flesh should not see 〈…〉 hath, also giuen to vs: whereas Origenes words are, nos revocabit, shall recall vs in due time, & nobis dona is, and shall all giue to vs: what greater forgerie could be 〈◊〉 ? what shamelesse dealing is this?

2. Againe, whereas Origene is produced by the Replyer, to shew his different iudgement from other of the fathers, concerning Limbus patrum, making Abrahams bosome to be, where were Angelorum ch r , &c. the company of Angels, the kingdome of Christ: he to confront this testimony of Origen, alleadgeth another place in this maner: the only begotten sonne (of God) descended into hell for the saluation of the world, and thence brought backe againe, the first man (Adam:) for that which hee said to the thiefe, to day thou shall be with me in Paradise, you must vnderstād to be spoken, not to him only, but to all the Saints, for whom he descended to hell. 3. b. p. 194. Here diuers faults are committed: 1. The words inclosed in the parenthesis, hee addeth of his owne. 2. Protoplostum he translateth the first man, which signifieth, the first made (man:) intellige, which is vnderstand thou, hee englisheth you must vnderstand. 3. Beside, this testimony maketh flatly against the Confuter, who holdeth Christs soule to haue beene three daies in hell;3. b. p. 165. whereas Origen thinketh, that not onely the thiefe, but all the other Saints went into heauen the same day of his passion: but they returned not without Christ: Christs soule then could not be so long in hell, in Origenes opinion. 4. Further, out of this very homil. 15. in Genest. it more fully appeareth; that Origene differed in opinion from the rest, concerning (Limbus patrum) for vpon those words of the Lord to Iakob, revocabo te inde in finem, &c. I will bring thee backe againe in the ende: he writeth thus, velut si diceret, &c. As if he should say, because thou hast fought a good fight, kept the faith, finished thy course, I will call thee now out of the world, vnto future happines, vnto the perfection of life eternall, vnto the crowne of righteousnes, which the Lord shall render in the ende of the world to all that loue him. The place, whether Iakob was called out of the world, was a place of happines, the perfection of life eternall, &c. therefore not a prison, dungeon, place of darkenes, or hell: as Limbus patrum was of some of the fathers imagined to be.

3. Origene is cited by this confused Confuter,3. b. p. 19. where he committeth diuers foule ouersights: 1. he nameth the 18. homilie vpon Iosuah: but in that homilie, the sentence which he alleadgeth, is not to be found: nor yet in the homilie vpon the 18. chap. for he might mistake the number of the homilie for the chapter. 2. Beside, to mende the matter with: in the margen, he setteth the 28. homilie vpon Iosuah, wheras there are but 26. in all vpon that booke. 3. The place is altogether impertinent to his purpose: for the question beeing of the meaning of those words of our Sauiour, Ioh. 17. Father, I will that where I am, these also may be with me: whether Christ speake of himselfe as the Messiah, or in respect of his Godhead onely: he bringeth in these words of Origene, Blessed is he, who sheweth himselfe such an one, &c. that of our Sauiour he may receiue the portion of the heauenly mansion in the world to come, The Confuters ignorance in Origens works. of which our Lord Iesus himselfe speaketh, (father, I will, &c. In which wordes it is euident, that Origene speaketh of Christ, as the Sauiour and Messiah. 4. And to shew his great skill in reading of this fathers workes: he citeth the 12. homilie vpon Matthew, 3. b. p. 35.3. b. p. 35. and the 35. homilie vpon Matth. p. 57. whereas they are the tractates or commentaries vpon Matthew, not homilies: which were his sermons to the people, or multitude, whereof they haue their name.

5. An other place of Origene he diuersly abuseth:3. b. p. 165. 1. by clipping of many words: as where Origene alleadgeth the text, to sacrifice vnto the Lord our God, he saith, to doe sacrifice vnto God: Againe, those words of Origene: Pharaoh would not permit thē to come vnto the place of signes: that is, mysteries: he omitteth altogether. 2. He translateth corruptly: for those wordes, resuscitabit nos Deus, &c. God shall raise vs after two daies, he englisheth, God shall visit vs after two daies. 3. He saith very boldly, that these words of Origene, (the first day to vs, is the passion of our Sauiour, the second day is that, wherein he descended to hell, and the third day is the day of the resurrection:) he doth not appropriate them to Christ, and his abode in hell: because he applieth them to vs. A very senslesse and vnlearned answer: for whereas the Prophet saith, vnto vs a childe is horne: he might as well inferre, that he doth not appropriate it to Christs natiuitie, because it is applied to vs. As though all Christs actions, his birth, passion, resurrection, and the rest, were not for vs. 4. Whereas he holdeth Origenes opinion to be, that Christs soule was three daies in hell, and citeth him to that ende, p. 169.3. b. p. 169. the contrarie is shewed before, loc. 2. that Origene held, that all the fathers, together with the theife, entred into heauen the same day of Christs passion: whence it will follow, that Christs soule also entred together with theirs. And in this place it is euident, that in his opinion the soule of Christ descended not till the second day.

6. Whereas the Replyer citeth a place of Origene, wherein comparing Christ to a victorious captaine, that diuideth the principall spoiles among his souldiers of best desert, he saith, that he likewise, vnto those, which haue laboured most, sibi similes decernit honores, doth giue honours like to his owne, 3. b. p. 10. such as he conferred vpon his disciples: when he said, Father I will, that where I am, they may be with me: And proueth hereby, that these honours like vnto Christs, are not those which are due to his godhead, which are not communicable vnto any, but such, as he receiued as Messiah. This vaine and trifling Confuter first quarrelling, because the Replyer abridged this sentence, keeping the sense, then denieth that he hath any such meaning; but that these words make directly against the Replyer: whereas Christ beeing compared to a victorious and triumphāt captaine diuiding spoiles, must be vnderstood as the Messiah, as he ascended into heauen, and led captiuitie captiue: which he did, not as God onely, but as the Messiah and captaine of the Church. These honours were due vnto him in deede as God, for who denieth that? (vpon which false supposall he groundeth all the force of his reason) but not as God onely, but as God and man, the blessed Sauiour and Messiah.

2. Ignatius, Thaddaeus, and Tertullian falsified.

1. Thaddaeus, as he is cited by Bellarmine, from whom he borrowed it, (for why should not the scholer be bould with the master) hath this sentence: Christus descendit ad inferos, & disrupit maceriem, &c. Christ descended into hell, and brake downe the partition wall, which no man had euer broken downe in the world: (who descended alone, but ascended with a great multitude) this last enclosed clause he cutteth off, 3. b. p. 143. least he should too openly haue discouered his opinion touching Limbus patrum.

2. He bringeth in Ignatius saying the same thing with Thaddaeus: 3. b. p. 143. for he ascribeth to them both the same testimonie.Bellar. lib. 4. de Christ. anim. c. 14. But herein he left his first instructer, who produceth two other testimonies of Ignatius: the latter whereof is this, Descendit ad infernum solus, regressus autem cum multitudine: he descended into hell alone, but returned with a great multitude. But he omitteth this testimonie also, to auoid the former inconuenience.

3. Tertullian is notably abused by him: 3. b. p. 143. lib. de anim. c. 55. 1. for his assertion in the same place is this: that Christ descended to the lower parts of the earth: vt illic Patriarchas & Prophetas compotes sui faceret: that there he should make the Patriarks and Prophets partakers of himselfe: this he concealeth. 2. The sentence by him alleadged, is not Tertullians affertion out of his owne iudgement, but an obiection: Sed in hoc (inquiunt) &c. but he descended (they will say) for this, that we should noe goe thither: for he taketh away this obiection: and thus confuteth them, satis superbe non putant,Tertullian grossely abused. &c. they proudly thinke that the soules of the faithfull are not fit or meete for hell, the seruants taking vpon them more then the Lord, and the scholers then the master: and concludeth the soules of the dead, apud inferos sequestari in diem iudicij: to be sequestred in hell vntill the day of iudgement: and a little before: nulli patet coelum, &c. heauen is not open to any, as long as the earth is preserued, transactione mundi reserabuntur regna coelorū, &c. the kingdome of heauen shall be vnlocked in the transaction (and passing away) of the world: what grosse ignorance then is this, to ascribe vnto Tertullian that opinion, which he confuteth, though (I confesse) he falleth into a worse error himselfe. But this excuseth not his deceitfull legerdemaine. These fathers for antiquitie, should haue beene placed before Origene: but he is raunged in the forefront, because diuers testimonies of his are corrupted by the Confuter.

3. Chrysostome falsified.

1. Thus Chrysostome is alleadged: Christ descended into the lower parts of the earth (that is, in 4. c. ad Eph. 3. b. p. 143. to hell, as himselfe doth interpret it) for our soules: whereas Chrysostome doth in the same place farre otherwise interpret it: for he expoundeth it by that place, Philip. 2. he humbled himselfe, and became obedient to the death of the crosse: quemadmedum illic de animi modestia,Chrysostome wrested contrarie to his owne minde. &c. as there giuing admonition concerning modestie, and humilitie of minde, he bringeth in Christ; so in this place, because he descended into the lower parts of the earth: yea further he thus expoundeth in direct words: inferiores terrae partes mortem dicit, &c. he calleth the lower parts of the earth, death; and that according to the suspicion and opinion of men, as Iakob also saith, you shall bring mine olde age with sorrow to (hell) or the lower parts:ad inferos. and againe in the Psalme, I shall be like to those that goe downe to the pit, that is, to them that die. What an vnsauourie fellow now is this? that dare so falsly charge Chrysostome, making him to vnderstand that of hell, which he interpreteth of death: which in the opinion of men seemeth to be as it were hell?

2. In another place these words of Chrysostome, Ista pro vobis ferens, Suffering these things for you; hee translateth, Suffering these things for Christs sake: whereas Chrysostome saith, Sed qui moritur indies? studio, voluntate, & quod promptus ad eam rem sit: How doth he die daily? in study and willingnesse, & because he is ready for that thing: he turneth the words thus; Animi promptitudine, quia esset ad mortem subeundam semper paratior:3. b. p. 64. In promptnesse of minde, and for that he was euery day more and more ready to suffer death for Christs sake.

4. Hierome falsified.

1. Hierome handling that place, Math. 18. 15. is alleadged thus; Praecipit. Dominus peccantes in os argui debere: translated thus; Our Lord commandeth that we should reprooue offendors to their face,2. b. p. 67. or openly: cleane contrary to Saint Hieroms words that follow: Hierom shamefully peruerted. Secreto, vel adhibito teste: Secretly, or taking a witnes, which words hee fraudulently omitteth: Hierome expoundeth in os, to the face, secretly, or before a witnesse, hee peruerting his sense saith, openly.

2. Saint Hierome also is cited vpon Psalme 70. verse 20. expounding it of Christs locall descension to hell:Hierom clipped. where the words of Hierom are omitted, which immediately follow vpon these wordes, thou hast encreased mine honour: 2. b. p. 136. cum hi, qui in inferno tenebantur, mecum redierant: when they, which were held in hell, returned with me: which sentence he concealed, for vnlesse he also maintaine Limbus patrum, it maketh nothing for him.

3. The Replyer is charged with many faults, in translating Hieroms sentence: Non tam stultus sum, vt diuersitate explanationum tuarum, me ladi putem, quia nec tu laederis, si nos contraria senserimus: I am not so vnwise, as to thinke my selfe hurt by your explanations,The Confuter cauilleth about the turning of nec into non. because neither are you preiudiced, &c. because he changeth nec into non: a great matter, and beseeming the grauitie of such an obiector: whereas, the Replyer readeth non, to make a perfect sentence. Againe, there is left out in the translation diuersitate, with the diuersitie: but seeing it is not omitted in the latine sentence, there can bee no fraud, and in the English it is implyed; for he could not be hurt or preiudiced, but by different and diuers explanations. A third fault hee sindeth, because the Replyer englisheth laedi, to bee hurt and preiudiced: whereas he translateth it wronged and iniuried, which is further off from the signification of the word, then the other.

But this (coyning Confuter) himselfe committeth many and great faults in the recitall of this sentence. 1. He saith he findeth it in the 13.Hierom clipped and corrupted and falsely quoted. Epistle of Saint Hierome to Saint Augustine: whereas Hierome did not write so many Epistles to Augustine, but tenne onely, or there-about, which are extant in the first and second Tomes of Hieroms workes: and this sentence which he alleadgeth, is found in the 6. of them. 2. These words, in Scripturarum disputatione versemur, he translateth, we may reason of the Scriptures: the english whereof is this; that we may be conuersant in the disputation of the Scriptures. 3. Nostrum emendemus errorem, hee translateth, and so either correct your error: which should bee thus englished; let vs amend our error. 4. After those words, that is a childish boasting, he leaueth out this whole sentence, quod olim adolescentuli facere consueuerant: which young men in time past were accustomed to doe. 3. b. p. 101.

5. Ambrose corrupted.

1. This Grammarian instructer, that professeth to teach boyes to conster, himselfe maketh a pittifull construction of Ambrose, 2. b. p. 59.2. b. p. 59. these words, Angelo non placuit ancillae insolentia: Lib. 1. de Abraham. c. 4. The insolencie of the hand-maid pleased not the Angel: hee translateteth; The Angel was not pleased to see the insolency and pride of the handmaide: reuertere ad Dominam tuam, Ambrose corruptly translated. Returne to thy Lady: he englisheth; turne againe to thy Lady and Mistresse. Verberantis savitiam, the cruelty of the beater: hee englisheth, the crueltie of Sara beating her. Fugientis discessionem, the departure of the flier or runner away he rendreth, Hagars departure in running away: adding Sara and Hagar of his owne. Humiliare, be thou humbled: he englisheth, humble thy selfe.

2. In another sentence taken from Ambrose, 3. b. p. 22. hee leaueth out these words:Ambr. lib. de incarnat. Dom. sacram. c. 5. In inferno positis vitae lumen fundebat eternae: To those which were in hell, he powred the light of eternall life. Which clause if he had added, he saw that Ambrose would make little for him, vnlesse hee held the locall descent of Christs soule to hell, for the enlightening and deliuerance of the Fathers thence.

6. Ruffinus falsified.

1. Ruffinus also is pitifully mangled: for his sentence (taking the whole) is this; But that he descended into hell also, is euidently pronounced in the Psalmes, where he saith, Thou broughtest me to the dust of death: Ruffin. in Symbolum. and againe, what profit is in my blood, while I descend into corruption: and againe, I descended into the mire of the deepe, where no substance is (that is, ground or bottome:) yea and Iohn saith, art thou he, which art to come (without doubt into hell) or looke me for another? All this is fraudulently left out: and then follow the next wordes,Ruffinus mangled. which he culleth out: Our Lord also himselfe speaketh, 2. b. p. 179. &c. But this deceitfull Iugler, that playeth fast and loose with the Fathers, well perceiued, that seeing Ruffinus expoundeth descending to hell, to be brought to the dust of death, and to the place of corruption and blood, that his meaning can be no otherwise, then to vnderstand death and the graue: as to the same purpose he said before, that vis eadem verbi videtur esse, &c. the same force of the word seemeth to be in that, he is said to be buried: as he is said before to descend to hell.

I maruell also, how his (mastership) could take no knowledge of another place in Ruffinus, not farre from that, which he thus hacketh and pareth: where hee saith, that Crux Christi trumphus est, &c. that Christs crosse was a triumph, and a famous (trophaeum) monument: and further, he sheweth how he triumphed ouer all things vpon the crosse, both celestiall, terrestriall, and infernall: vnto the first, applying the vppermost part of the crosse; to the next, that part where his hands were stretched out; and for the third he saith, ea vero parte, quae sub terram submergitur, inferna sibiregna subiecit: but by that part, which was hid vnder the earth, he brought vnder to himselfe the infernall kingdoms.

This cleare testimony of Christs triumph vpon the crosse, and his victory ouer hell, crosseth that impious and profane opinion of this drowsie and dreaming diuine; that the conquest vpon the crosse, A blasphemous scoffe vttered of the triumphant crosse of Christ. was openly an ouerthrowe, and therefore no triumph: and againe, if Christ triumphed in the crosse, as you say he did, it was according to the prouerbe, triumphus ante victoriam (triumph before the victory:) 1. b. p. 188.

7. Augustine falsified.

1. Thus Augustine is alleadged: 2. b. p. 165. This custome (of baptizing infants) I beleeue,Lib. 2. contr. Donatist. c. 7. as comming from the tradition of the Apostles, &c. whereas the question with the Donatists, was not concerning the baptizing of infants, Augustines sense corrupted. but the rebaptizing of those, which were baptized by heretiks: as it may appeare by the wordes going before; Nolite obijcere nobis authoritatem Cypriani ad baptismi repetitionem, &c. Doe not obiect to vs the authoritie of Cyprian, for the repeating of baptisme, &c. That question of Baptisme was not yet throughly handled, but yet the Chruch kept this wholesome custome; in the schismatiks and heretiks, corrigere quod pravum est, non iterare quod datum est: to correct what was amisse, not to iterate what was giuen: then follow those words, which saide custome, &c. (as many things are not found in their writings, nor in the latter Councels) &c. all this enclosed, is omitted.

2. Augustine is thus brought in:de vnitat. Eccles. c. 19. that custome of the Church, which was opposed against Cyprian, &c. whereas the name of Cyprian is not to be found in the 18. 19. 20. chapters of that booke.2. b. p. 167.

3. Againe the same place is quoted, where Augustine should write thus: 2. b. p. 167. Cum hoc nusquam legatur, &c. when as this is read no where, we must beleeue the testimonie of the Church, which Christ hath testified to be true: these words are not extant in that place, Augustine vntruly alledged. in that forme, but after this manner: Nunc vero cum in Scripturis non inveniamus, &c. now seeing we finde not in the Scripture, that any haue come to the Church from heretikes, &c. and afterward: perhibet Christus testimonium Ecclesiae suae, &c. Christ doth giue testimonie to his Church.

4. Augustine is cited, serm. (he should haue said) hom, 2. in vigil. pasch. tom. 10. in these words: si sepultus fuisset in terra, &c. If Christ had beene buried in the earth, they might haue said, they had digged vp the earth, and stollen him away, to prooue a difference betweene Christs tombe, and the earth:3. b. p. 164. yet in that homilie no such sentence is to be found: Augustine ignorantly cited. but rather the contrarie: quid illi tumulus in terris, cuius sedes manebat in coelis? why should he haue a tombe in the earth, whose seate remained in heauen: here he affirmeth Christs tombe to haue been in the earth. This grosse ouersight sheweth, how well (this pettifogger in diuinitie) is seene in the reading of Augustine.

5. That place of August. c. 15. cont. Felician. lib. 3. p. 2.lib. 3. p. 2. he diuers waies corrupteth: 1. he addeth generall resurrection: nullus ignorat, he translateth, euery man knoweth: which signifieth, no man is ignorant: cuius corpus, &c. saith Augustine, whose bodie common death had enclosed for the future resurrection: he readeth, whose bodie death had shut vp (in the graue) vntill the future resurrection of all flesh.

Beside, he bewraieth his ignorance, in mistaking the sense and scope of Augustine in that place: 1. he saith that Augustines whole discourse, is to prooue that Christ deserued not hell fire: whereas the very point of the question is, that though Christ died in bodie, yet his soule perished not: vt vita perderet vitam, that our life, should loos life: c. 4. in init. by occasion of which question he falleth also into that other point, concerning the death of Christs soule. 2. He saith, that Augustine taketh this for graunted, that the promise made to the theefe, was the voice of Christs Godhead: whereas Augustine onely propoundeth it by way of obiection: sed dicet aliquis, &c. but some one will say: Augustines meaning mistaken. we beleeue this was the voice of the deitie, not of the soule of Christ, &c. and afterward he rather reasoneth against that obiection, then yeildeth to it: & quid in eo cui promittebat, accipimus &c. and what doe we take in him, to whome the promise was made: and so he frameth his argument, from the soule of the theefe to the soule of Christ: reasoning from the lesse to the greater. 3. He denieth that any such collection can be made out of Augustine, that if the soule of the theefe went to Paradise, Christ much more: but that this is Augustines meaning rather, that because the theefes soule was presently made blessed, &c. in Paradise, and so freed from the feare of death, and hell, much more was the soule of Christ exempted. Contra. Augustines words are these: If the soule of the theefe was straightway (the bodie beeing dead) called to Paradise: shall we thinke any to be so impious, to thinke that the soule of our Sauiour was three daies kept in hell? &c. here is no mention of the feare of death or hell, but of calling the soule to Paradise: his wordes are plaine, that Christs soule could not be in hell all those three daies, that his bodie was in the graue: nay it can not be prooued out of this treatise of Augustine, that Christs soule was in hell: for it is euident, that he taketh (inferi) for the place of the dead: As c. 14. he saith, erat vno eodem que tempore totus in inferno, totus in coelo, illic patiens iniuriam carnis, &c. he was at one and the same time, whole in (hell) or below, whole in heauen: there suffering the iniurie of his flesh, here not leauing the glorie of his deitie. Againe, c. 17. iacebat quantum ad corpus, &c. he lay touching his bodie dead in the graue, raising the dead in hel, or in the low parts: but Christs flesh was in the graue, not in hell, and from the graue, not from hell he raised the dead.

6. An other place of Augustine is corruptly alleadged: epist. 57. ad Dardan. lib. 3. p. 14.lib. 3. p. 14. first, he inuerteth the order of the wordes: for that sentence, beginning as it might rightly be said, and ending, because he is alwaies euery where, &c. is at least 40. lines after that sentence, if this (to day thou shalt, &c.) which he confusedly placeth immediatly after, as though it were all one sentence. Againe, in the next sentence, beginning, if this (to day thou shalt, &c.) and ending, humane soule: he clippeth off at the least 20. lines, and leapeth them all ouer, to those words, but the sense is much more readie, &c. which he ioyneth as immediatly following, beeing 20. lines after: thirdly, he fraudulently omitteth many sentences, which come betweene, making directly against his opinion of Christs descent to hell: 1. Augustine saith, Vnde quaeri solet, &c. whence it vseth to be questioned, Augustine clipped by the Cō futer, because he directly maketh against him. if the infernall places are vnderstood onely to be penall, how can we beleeue godly, that the soule of Christ was in hell: but it is well answeared, that therefore he descended, to succour, whome he could. Here Augustine maketh no other ende of Christs descending into the penall place of hell, but to giue succour and releefe. 2. If both the region, of those which were in griefe, and those which were at rest, &c. is to be beleeued to haue beene in hell, who dare say that Christ went onely to the penall places of hell, and not to haue beene with them which were at rest in Abrahams bosome: where if he were, that was the Paradise, which he vouchsafed to promise the thiefe: here he resolueth, that the soule of Christ went to the Paradise promised to the thiefe.

7. So Augustine is erroneously cited: for twice he quoteth tract. 91. in Ioh. 17. 3. b. p. 8. and 16. whereas the place is taken out of the 111. tract. in Ioh. 17. Beside, he would make the Reader beleeue, that Augustine expoundeth this glorie, 3. b. p. 8. which Christ speaketh of, Ioh. 17. onely of the glorie of his Godhead: 3. b. p. 16. and that other speach, (where I am, &c.) to be vnderstood of the presence of his Godhead. Cont. In the very same tractat. 111. Augustine thus expoundeth those words, I will, that where I am, they may be with me: Quantum attinet ad creaturam, &c. Concerning that creature, wherein he was made of the seede of David after the flesh, he was not yet himselfe, where he was to be: but in that sense he might say, where I am, as we might vnderstand, that he should quickly ascend into heauen: that he said he was there alreadie, where he was presently to be. In the same tractate, he also thus expoundeth the glorie: etiamsi eam dici hoc loco intelligamus, &c. Though we vnderstand that glorie to be here spoken of, not which the father gaue vnto his sonne beeing equall in begetting him: but which he gaue vnto him beeing made the sonne of man after the death of the crosse: he vnderstandeth it as well of the glorie giuen vnto him as man, as that due vnto him as God.

But more euidently Augustine sheweth his minde touching these points, in the former tractates vpon this chapter:

As, tract. 104. Haec est glorificatio, &c. This is the glorifying of our Lord Iesus Christ, which tooke beginning from his resurrection.

Tract. 105. That the sonne was glorified of the father, according to the forme of a seruant, whome the father raised vp beeing dead,Augustine maketh directly against the Confuter. and placed at his right hand, the thing it selfe sheweth, and no Christian doubteth. And if the Confuter doubt hereof, in Augustins opinion he is no Christian.

And vpon those words, Glorifie me with the glory, &c. which I had, &c. he writeth thus, sicut tunc praedestinatione, &c. as then in predestination, so now in perfection, doe in the world, what was with thee before the world, doe in time, that which thou appointedst before all time. Thus Augustine apparantly vnderstandeth the glory which was giuen vnto Christ, as man.

And how Christ our blessed Sauiour prayed vnto his Father, he thus also sheweth; tract. 104. Poterat Dominus noster, &c. Our Lord the onely begotten, and coeternall to the father, might in the forme, and by the forme of a seruant if it had beene needfull, haue praied in silence: but hee would so exhibite himselfe to his father a praier for vs; as that hee remembreth himselfe to be our teacher. And againe, in another place, Orauit Dominus non secundum formam Dei, &c.in Psal. 87. Our Lord prayed, not according to the forme of God, but according to the forme of a seruant, according to the which he suffered. For if he will stil stand vnto it, that Christ as God prayed vnto his father, and not as man, hee will make Christ a Priest, as he is God, and so inferiour vnto his father, as God, and so fall apparantly into Arrianisme, from the which hee cannot shift himselfe, with all the •• eights that a subtile head, and froward wit can affoard him.

8. He would wrest a sentence of Augustine, Epist. 99. to shewe, that he thought Abrahams bosome to be in hell:3. b. p. 194. producing this place; if the holy Scripture had said, that Christ after his death came into that bosome of Abraham, not mentioning hell, and the sorrowes thereof, I maruell if any durst haue said, that he descended to hell, &c. It is a strange thing, that a man should so cast off all modestie, as so apparantly to fasten vpon Augustine an opinion contrary to his owne words:The Confuter citeth Augustine, contrary to his owne words. for a little before he said; ne ips s quidem inferos, &c. I cannot finde hell in any place of the Scripture to be called for good: and immediately after he inferreth, that the bosome of Abraham, that is, the habitation of quiet rest, is not to be beleeued, to be a part of hell: yea and in these words, which he ignorantly presseth, as much may be gathered: for in saying, that vnlesse mention were made in Scripture of hell, and the sorrowes thereof, but onely of Christs going to Abrahams bosom, no man durst haue said, that Christ descended to hell: hee insinuateth that Abrahams bosome was not hell, for then any durst haue so said, without any further mention of hell. Thus he confoundeth himselfe with his owne testimony.

9. He citeth a place out of Augustine, to prooue that vnity is a note of the Church, quoting lib. 2. cont. liter. Petilian. c. 54.Lib. 2. p. 108. but printed 112. Augustine misquoted. Dissentio & diuisio facit haereticos, &c. Dissention and diuision maketh heretiks, but peace and vnitie maketh Catholiks. But in that place, no such sentence at all is to be found; which sheweth, what vaine oftentation hee maketh of his reading in the Fathers, beeing vtterly ignorant in them. The place which he aimeth at, is the 96. not the 54. chapter of that booke, which he corruptly alleadgeth: for Augustine saith, Dissentio quippe (vos) & diuisio facit haereticos, &c. Dissention and diuision maketh (you) heretiks, peace and vnity maketh Catholikes. But hee leaueth out (you) wherein the force of Augustines speech lieth. His meaning is, that not the diuersity of faith, or dissenting in religion; but diuision onely and seperation from the Catholike Church, made them, namely the Donatists, heretikes: for the Donatists confessed of themselues, and Augustine denied it not;Cont. Cich. lib. 2. cap. 7. nobis vobisque vna est religio, &c. You and we haue the same religion, the same sacraments, nothing diuers in Christian obseruation. Other heretiks were discerned then by their hereticall opinions; the Donatists by their schismaticall seperation. Againe, Augustine meaneth not, that vnity simply is a note of the Church; but vnity with the Church of God: for the Pagans had vnity among themselues: As Augustine in another place saith,Tom. 9. de vtilitat. i iun. Non proferant nobis, quasi concordiam suam, hostem quippe, quem nos patimur, illi non patiuntur: Let them not obiect vnto vs, as it were their concord, for they suffer not that enemie, whom we suffer. Therefore he two waies abuseth Augustines sentence, both in clipping his words, & peruerting his sense, in making vnity and dissention in the Church, the cognizances, and causes distinctiue, &c. wheras Augustine speaketh not of vnitie and dissention in the Church, and among themselues; but of vnitie with the Church, and of dissention & seperation from the Church. Wherefore this sentence was impertinently alleadged against the Replyer, who thus saith, That one bond of faith in the diuersitie of some priuate opinions, may containe and keepe vs in peace. There may be some diuersitie in opinion in the Church, and yet neither faith peruerted, nor peace violated.

10. Augustine is brought in thus writing;3. b. p. 16. tract. 12. in 3. Ioann. Behold, Christ was here, and he was in heauen, for so he came thence, Augustine very corruptly alleadged. that he departed not thence, and so returned thither, that he left vs not here: and what maruaile you? this God doth: for man according to the body both is in a place, and goeth out of a place, but God filleth all places, and is whole euery where: yet Christ was at that time, according to his visible flesh in earth. But Augustines words in that place are these, writing vpon this text: No man hath ascended into heauen, but he that descended, &c. Ecce hic erat, & in coelo erat, &c. Behold, he was here, and hee was in heauen: he was here in his flesh, and in heauen in his diuinitie; yea euery where in his diuinitie: borne of (his) mother, and not departing from (his) father, &c. And ome fewe lines after, he saith, mirari , &c. Do you maruell that he was in heauen also: he made his disciples such: heare the Apostle saying, our conuersation is in heauen: if Paul the Apostle beeing man, did walke in his flesh in the earth, & yet was conuersant in heauen; could not the God of heauen and earth, be both in heauen and earth? The iudicious Reader may see, what small affinitie and agreement there is betweene these two sentences: and although Augustines testimonie had beene truely alleadged, yet had it not beene to the purpose: for the question is not of the meaning of these words of our Sauiour, Iohn 3. 13. The sonne of man, which is in heauen: but of those, Iohn 17. 24. I will that they, &c. be with me, where I am. Other places cited out of Augustine, and other Fathers, are handled with the like vncleane fists; but these giuen in instance, doe sufficiently bewray his cunning counterfetting of antiquity: and the like fidelitie he sheweth, in producing the new writers, as now shall be seene.

8. Caluinee falsified.

1. In alleadging Caluin, Lib. 2. p. 183. lib. 2. Institut. c. 16. ser. 8. these corruptions are committed. 1. Hee clippeth off diuers sentences: for after these words, There is no small force to the effect of our redemption, this sentence followeth; Quanquam enim ex veterum scriptis, &c. For although it appear out of the writings of the auncient, that this particle was not of olde so much vsed in the Church, yet in handling the summe of doctrine, place of necessitie must be giuen vnto it: thē follow the words next obtruded by him: It cōtaineth a profitable mysterie, &c. then, in the last part of the sentēce, There is none of the auncient Fathers, which doth not in his writings make mention of Christs descension into hell: Hee quite cutteth off the words following, tametsi interpretatione diuersa: although in a diuers (sense) and interpretation: the which words doe euidently shewe, that Caluin receiuing the article of the descension, yet insisteth vpon the right interpretation. 2. Hee also peruerteth the order of Calvins words: for that clause, This certaine, is out of all question, &c. he putteth last, wheras in Calvin it goeth before the precedent part, this clause hath so great force, &c. 3. He alleadgeth Caluin for the locall descent, contrary to Caluins iudgement, who vnderstandeth it of the spirituall agony and perplexitie of Christs soule. ibid. sect. 10.

2. Caluin also is cited,3. b. p. 292. 2. lib. Institut. c. 16. sect. 9. as though he should hold, that the faithfull of the olde Testament were in that prison mentioned by Saint Peter, that is in hell, &c. where they carefully expected the promised redemption: where diuers vntruths are vttered. 1. Caluine saith, Concludere in carcere mortuorum animas, puerile est: To shut vp the soules of the dead in prison, is a childish thing. He denieth then, that they were in prison. 2. Hee speaketh not of redēption, which they expected; but saith, that piae animae eius visitationis, quam sollicite expectauerant, praesenti aspectu sunt potitae: The godly soules did enioy the sight of that visitation, which they carefully expected. His meaning is, that euen the godly soules departed had a sense of Christs death, and were affected with a lightsome ioy, the time of visitation beeing now exhibited vnto the Church, which they, while they liued, in faith beleeued, and in hope expected. 3. Yet is hee not ashamed to alleadge Caluin, as a maintainer of the locall descension; and not content therewith, hee addeth one vntruth vnto another, that the Replyer himselfe saith, that Caluin holdeth Christs descension into hel euen in that place of Peter: 3. b. p. 79. whereas he affirmeth the contrary, that Caluine and Beza hold not the descension as he doth, in that very place which he hath reference to in the margin, Limbom. p. 58. And indeede Caluines opinion is, Vim mortis Christi, vsque ad mortuos penetrasse: that the force of Christs death did pierce vnto the dead: that the power and effect of his death, not the presence of his soule was there.

9. Beza falsified.

1. Beza is here diuers waies wronged.2. b. p. 68. 1. His words are falsly translated: de priuatis iniurijs, of priuate wrongs, he englisheth, of priuate offences: a priuate wrong (that is) done to a priuate person, may yet be committed publikely,Beza in Math. 18. v. 15. but so cannot a priuate offence. 2. He curtalleth the sentence, repeating onely the first clause, they are deceiued, who thinke that Christ in this place speaketh of priuate offences: all the rest that followeth is omitted; quum Christus, &c. seeing Christ intendeth nothing else in these words, then to distinguish secret sinnes, from manifest: therefore he is said to sinne against one, not onely which hurteth him priuately, but which with his priuitie only, sinneth against God, or any other. 3. By this sentence it appeareth his meaning is, that Christ speaketh of secret sinnes, whether committed against God, or any priuate man. What immodest dealing then is this, to alleadge Beza, as expounding this place, not of sinnes secretly, but openly done?

2. Beza thus expoundeth, in te, id est, te tantum conscio, against thee,2. b. p. 69. thou onely knowing of it: but hee thus corrupteth that place; against another, thou knowing of it: where he addeth these words, against another, and leaueth out only: for the secret trespasser may as well sin me against him, whom he offendeth, as against another; as appeareth in the former testimony.

3. I omit certaine places out of Beza, 2. b. p. 107. clipped by him: as in that testimony cited vpon Act. 5. 17. Beza his words are, qui à (recepta) sana doctrina, &c. and, Dei (&) Ecclesiae, (ipsius:) where these words inclosed, are omitted by the Confuter. So,2. b. p. 171. vpon Iohn, 15. 26. he leaueth out more then foure lines in the middes of the sentence: but because the sense is not much hindred by these omissions, I will not take that aduantage, which he is ready to catch at vpon euery occasion.

He further abuseth Beza, 3. b. p. 69. in deprauing his words, and detorting his sense, as though he should thinke it a forced and violent thing, by spirits to vnderstand liuing men, 1. Pet. 3. 19. whereas he meaneth onely, that men yet liuing cannot be called spirits: but those which are now spirits, may by a certaine figure, called prolepsis, be vnderstood to haue beene sometime liuing men: as Peter calleth them spirits, in respect of that time present, wherein hee wrote, not of that, whereof he writeth. This then is a meere cauil, à dicto secundum quid, ad dictum simpliciter: because Beza in some sense counteth it a coact thing to vnderstand by spirits, liuing men, that simply and absolutely hee denieth it.

4. Beza is imagined to vnderstand that place,3. b. p. 92. 2. Cor. 13. 4. crucified concerning his infirmitie, not of the naturall substance of Christs flesh and humanity, but of the quality onely thereof: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , qualitatem declarat: infirmity declareth the quality of the substance: where he leaueth out the former part of the sentence: where Beza directly applyeth it, ad infirmam formam serui, to the weake forme of a seruant, (that is, to the humane nature) which Christ tooke: and saith further, idem hoc declarat, &c. this sheweth the same thing, which (according to the flesh) 1. Rom. 3. So Beza his meaning is, that though infirmitie in the natiue vse of the word, signifieth the qualitie onely; yet thereby in this place, the very substance of the humane nature is insinuated.

10. The Geneva translators abused.

This vnconscionable Confuter,3. b. p. 192. would fasten vpon thē, to hold Limbus patrum, and to fauour the opinion of the Fathers; that the Patriarchs went not to heauen, but were deliuered by the descension of Christ: and to this ende hee bringeth in that annotation, Hebr. 9. 8. which is thus set downe whole in that place: (So long as the high Priest offered once a yeare for his owne sinnes, and for the peoples) & also while this earthly tabernacle stood, the way to the heauenly Tabernacle, which is made open by Christs blood, could not be entred into. Here first, all the first words inclosed, are cut off: secondly, hee forgeth a sense, contrary to their owne iudgement: for that those godly learned men, that penned those annotations, did beleeue all the holy Fathers of the olde Testament, to be in heauen, appeareth by that their interpretation of Abrahams bosome, Luke 16. 22. whereby is signified (say they) the most blessed life, which they that die in the faith of Abraham, shall inioy after this world. Therefore they could not bee so forgetfull, or contrary to themselues, in that other place so to conceiue, as though the way in the olde Testament was not opened for the Fathers to enter into heauen, before the comming of Christ: wherefore they either speake comparatiuely, that the way was not so opened, and made plaine before the comming of Christ, as since; as they giue the like sense of those words, Heb. 11. 39. They receiued not the promise: they had no such cleare light (say they) of Christ as we haue: Or els their meaning is, that by the sacrifices and rites of the Tabernacle, that way was not opened, but by the blood of Christ: so that the times are not compared together, but the things; as they thus note, Hebr. 10. 19. By the blood of Iesus wee may be bold to enter into the holy place: we by Christ (say they) haue that liberty, which the auncient Fathers could not haue by the lawe.

Thus this Surmisers supposed falsifications are returned vpon his owne head, and hee himselfe is found to bee the clipper and deprauer, and corrupter of the Fathers testimonies: fewe whereof are recited by him, which hee doth not mangle and wrest at his pleasure. These places out of the old and newe writers (about thirty in all) giuen before in instance, are an euident proofe hereof: the like might haue beene shewed in the rest, but that it is not worth the labour, to spend time, to hunt after so meane a game, and to haue such a silly bird in chace; which hath (according to the saying) defiled the owne neast.

When he first entred into this challenge, and aduentured to lay load vpō the Replyer, with this cauillous charge of falsifications: he should first haue himselfe considered, whether one might not rubbe vpon his owne galled backe. And he herein playeth an euill fensers part, that lyeth open himselfe, where he thought to giue an other a venie. That wise sentence should haue come into his head: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ;Moschionis. wherein thou purposest to smite an other, therein expect a greater blow thy selfe. It is an euident argument either of a bad cause or weake defense, that is bolstered out with such indirect meanes. The truth (as the prouerbe is) will not seeke corners: nor yet will the veritie be defended with a lie, nor simplicitie by falsifications and forgerie. In the sixt Synode of Constantinop. Act. 6. when as Macarius and Petrus, with other Monothelites, had mangled the testimonies of the Fathers, as well in sense as words; the Catholikes said, Non congruit orthodoxis ita circumtruncatas patrum sententias deflorare, &c. It is not agreeable to the orthodoxall (men) so to deflowre, (and deface) the gelded sentences of the fathers: this is more proper for heretikes. If he would therefore haue beene taken for an orthodoxall and Euangelicall writer (as I wish with my heart, he may hereafter prooue, and that the amendment of his heart may reforme the error of his penne) then should he not haue trode in the pathway of Heretikes, and followed their guise, in corrupting of his witnesses. Therefore concerning his omissions, alterations, additions, and other corruptions in the allegations of the fathers, I say as Augustin did to Iulian concerning Chrysostome, whome he corruptly alleadged:lib. 1. cont. Iulian. c. 1. Si totum legisses, invenire potuisti, aut si legisti, miror quemadmodum te potuit praeterire, aut si praeterire non potuit, miror quomodo te non correxerit: If you had read the whole, you might haue found it: or if you read it, I maruaile how it could escape you, or if it did not escape you, I wonder, how it did not correct you.

The 12. Imputation, of the pretended corruption of Scriptures.12. Imputation.
The accusation.

1. Because Ecclesiastic. 19. 10. the Replyer leaueth out these words,2. b. p. 70. & confidens esto, and be sure.

2. In the place, Gen. 37. 31. these words are omitted: Ruben moreouer said vnto them. 2. b. p. 123.

3. In that place, Act. 2. v. 31. you falsifie the Syrian Translators words in mistranslating them: the Latine Translator you abuse in like manner.2. b. p. 160.

4. These words, (which had seased vpon him) are not in that place,2. b. p. 139. Act. 2. 24. as you pretend them.

5. You falsifie the word of God it selfe: for in that place of Exodus c. 22. 23. the word (nephesh) is and ought to be translated (life,)2. b. p. 143. not (soule.)

6. For, the soules that went downe with Iaakob into Egypt; you make the Scripture to say, their soules went downe into Egypt.2. b. p. 144.

7. The place to the Coloss. 2. 15. (triumphing ouer them in the same) is falsly translated: our authorised translatour readeth (in himselfe.)2. b. p. 186.

8. So, Psal. 88. 10, 11. is mangled, and corrupted: patching two distinct verses in one: see afterward, recriminat. 6.3. b. p. 26.

9. You falsifie the Scripture it selfe, in translating 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , to hold fast, Mark. 7. 8. whereas our Church Bibles read, (yee obserue the traditions.) 3. b. p. 31.3. b. p. 31.

10. Limbom. inverteth the text, Act. 2. 31. to serue his turne. 3. b. p. 37.3. b. p. 37.

11. You cōmit a double fault in your translation of S. Peters words: the one in confounding hell with the graue, which is heathenish; the other in burying the soule of Christ in it, which is impious.3. b. p. 38.

12. You falsifie the prophesie, in leauing out the words (in hell,) wherein the maine of the controuersie consisteth. Act. 2. 31.3. b. p. 42.

13. This is your dalying with the word of God in this place: where hauing translated it, (thou wilt not leaue my soule in hell) you interpret it cleane contrarie, (thou wilt not leaue my life in graue.) 3. b. p. 44.3. b. p. 44.

14. You cut off the wordes (of sanctification) which are annexed to the word spirit,3. b. p. 57. &c.

15. The word (by) is violently intruded by you, 1. Pet. 3. 19.3. b. p. 59. (by which spirit.)

16. The words are not, as you cite them, 1. Pet. 2. 18. he hath suffered for our sinnes: but (Christ hath also suffered for vs.)3. b. p. 63.

17. Where Peter saith it was Christ that preached, you say it was Noe,3. b. p. 70. and so make him a lyar.

18. When you say, you know no ende of Christs preaching to the disobedient in hell, but for their comfort and deliuerance, you contradict the Scriptures, which teach, that the ministerie of the word consisteth as well in denouncing retention in sinne to the obstinate, as in pronouncing remission of sinnes to the penitent.3. b. p. 77.

19. Those words (that speaketh in you) though they be added in S. Matthew, are not here expressed by S. Marke. 3. b. p. 104.3. b. p. 104.

20. The wordes of the Euangelist are not as you report them, (when the doores shut vp,) but when the doores were shut.3. b. p. 118.

21. Neither is the text, (no man ascendeth,) but (no man hath ascended.)3. b. p. 172.

22. Psal. 139. 13. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 ,3. b. p. 183. is ignorantly left out by you.

23. Because the Replyer alleadgeth those words of S. Paul, 1. Cor. 15. 31. I die daily, vnderstanding them, of inward afflictions: the Confuter taketh a double exception, both, that some of the words are omitted: As by our reioycing, which I haue in Christ Iesus our Lord: and that the Scripture is misinterpreted: which Chrysostome expoundeth of the readines and promp •• of minde, that he was euery day more and more readie to suffer death, &c. 3. b. p. 64.3. b. p. 64. And therefore he crieth out, that dishonour is offered to the Apostle, and contumelie to the spirit of God, to say, that Paul died the death of the soule: whereas contrariwise, that which you call (inward afflictions) was thorough inward ioy, and consolation in the holy Ghost, &c. p. 65.

The iustification.

1. THe whole sentence is this: if thou hast heard a word, let it die with thee, and (be sure) it will not burst thee: the Replyer abridging this sentence, keeping the sense, did not take himselfe tied to repeate euery word, seeing he bringeth it not in as a testimonie, specially out of Scripture, but hath reference vnto it by way of allusion, quoting no place. But it is a greater fault in him, to adde vnto the text: if thou hast a word (against thy neighbour,) which words enclosed, though retained in the English translation, yet are not in the originall. Beside, he himselfe clippeth off many words: citing the beginning onely of the 13. and 17. v. reprooue thy friend, reprooue thy neighbour, leauing out all the rest. 2. b. p. 71. in marg.

2. Those words, moreouer Ruben said, were not materiall, or pertinent to the Replyers purpose, and therefore he omitted them.

3. The Syrian Translator: I meane he which translated the Syrian text, readeth thus; quod non sit derelictus in sepulchro, that he was not left in graue: is here any mistranslation? And the Latine translator is not alleadged for the word infernus, but because in stead of his soule, as it is in the originall, he readeth, neque derelictus est, he was not left: the Replyer then is here no Corrupter, but the Confuter is a Trifler.

4. These words, which had seazed of him, the Replyer alleadgeth not as the words of the text: but onely these, he loosed the sorrowes, Act. 2. 24. Here then he is charged with a plaine vntruth.

5. Then the Latine interpreter, Montanus, Pagnine, Vatablus: all these falsifie the word of God, which translate there, not vitam, life, but animam, soule: and the Septuag. also, which read, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , shall giue soule for soule.

6. The Replyers words are these: as in like sense it is said,Synops. p. 105 . Gen. 46. 26. the soules that went with Iakob into Egypt: is he not ashamed therefore so notoriously to charge him with an vntruth. But he himselfe corrupteth the text in that place, reading the soules, that went downe, &c. whereas the word is, habiah, which signifieth onely comming or going.

7. Beza so readeth, following Origenes reading, hom. 4. in Exod. hom. 17. in Numer. and hom. 9. in Iosua.

8. Call you this patching, to put two verses of Scripture together? what thinke you of S. Paul, which doth the same, Rom. 3. 10, 11. ioyning together, a part of the 1. and a part of the 2. v. Psal. 14. as the Reader may see by comparing the places together: you had best count him a patcher of Scripture.

9. Say also that the Latine translator, and Beza, which in that place readeth, tenetis, you hold: and the Syrian interpreter, retinetis, you hold fast: Montanus, that readeth, prehenditis, you lay hold, &c. that all these doe falsifie Scripture: and is he indeed so ignorant, as he maketh himselfe, that 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 doth not signifie to hold fast: how else will he interpret that place, Heb. 4. 14. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , let vs hold fast the profession: as both our English translations read.

10. The Replyer inuerteth not the text, but the Confuter peruerteth his wordes: for he alleadgeth the text right, Act. 2. 31. He spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soule should not be left (in hell) or the graue: whereupon the Replyer reasoneth thus; the Prophet speaketh here of Christs resurrection, but the descending of Christs soule to hell, belongeth not to his resurrection, but the not leauing of his soule in graue implieth the resurrection: Ergo: vnto this, the pitifull Confuter maketh this answer: your reason should haue beene this; Dauid spake of the resurrection of Christ, &c. but not leauing of Christs soule in hell, doth no way belong to his resurrection, &c. therefore, &c. here the minor is apparantly false,The idle Confuter as slender a Logician. &c. Contra. This poore Logician is much to be pitied: 1. doth he not see, that the conclusion of his argument must be this: therefore Dauid speaketh not of the not leauing, &c. which is cleane contrarie to the text. 2. If he in deede might make the Replyers argument for him, he would make him as sensles and absurd as himselfe. 3. He grossely mistaketh the Replyers argument: which was this, the descending of Christs soule to hell belongeth not to his resurrection, but the not leauing of his soule belongeth: ergo the not leauing, &c. prooueth not the descension. This argument though he inuert and peruert at his pleasure, he is not able to euert with all the skill he hath.

11. The Replyer confoundeth not hell and the graue, (which is more heathenish in him so to imagine, then in the other so to write) but ioyneth together two vsuall acceptions of the word sheol, neither doth he burie his soule, but his life thereby signified in the graue. And yet to take infernum for the temporall death, and graue, is neither heathenish nor absurd: vnlesse you will count Augustine heathenish, who expoundeth that place, Psalm. 88. 3. My life draweth neare to hell, by those words of our Sauiour, My soule is heauie vnto death: August in Psal. 87. Quod enim aijt, tristis est anima, &c. For that he saith my soule is heauie vnto death, this is the same that is said, my soule is filled with euill: and that which followeth, vnto death, the same is said, my life draweth neare to hell, &c.

12. These words (in hell) are not expressed, because the Replyer groundeth no argument vpon them: but onely by setting downe the first words, hath reference to the whole prophesie there contained: for in other places, where there was cause, he omitteth them not, as Limbom. p. 74.

13. Though the Hebrew word sheol, is indifferently taken sometime for hell, sometime for the graue: yet in this place, Act. 2. 27. the Replyer contendeth thoroughout that whole discourse, that it signifieth the graue: and therefore to say, he translateth it hell, is according to his vsuall manner, to fitten and forge of him.

14. The Replyer citeth not the words of the text, Rom. 1. 3. but onely sheweth, that there is an opposition betweene the flesh and the spirit: and therefore there was no cause to adde those words (of sanctification) no more then other words of the text.

15. As though it be not an vsuall phrase in Scripture, to say, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , in spiritu; when it must be vnderstood, by or through the spirit: as Eph. 2. 22. In whome ye also are built together, to be the habitation of God (by the spirit:) so road, not Beza onely, but Vatablus, the Syrian interpreter, the Geneva, and the authorized English translation: let him accuse these also of violent intrusion.

16. But the Apostle also saith in an other place, that Christ once suffered for sinnes, 1. Pet. 3. 18. the figure 2. might easily be mistaken for 3.

17. Christ by Noah preached: the one as the author, the other as the Minister: so both may wel stand together, S. Peters text that speaketh of Christ, and the interpretation, that applieth it to Noah. If any make the Apostle a lyar, it is himselfe that corrupteth his sense by a false interpretation: and maketh him to speake that, which he neuer intended.

18. Though the preaching of the word vnto vnbeleeuers is thorough the hardnes of their heart, the sauour of death vnto death: yet the principall and onely ende in respect of God, is the comfort and conuersion of men: the hardening of the heart is effected accidentally by the word, and is not the proper ende thereof. This is euident by that prophesie of Isai of Christ;Isa. 61. 1. The spirit of God is vpon me, &c. he hath sent me to preach good tidings to the poore. Epist. 99. And this is Augustines reason, that if there be preaching in hell, some may be conuerted and beleeue in hell: to say therefore, to what purpose should Christ be thought to preach to the spirits in hell, &c. then for their comfort and deliuerance, is no contradicting of the Scriptures, but a manifesting of his ignorance, that knoweth it not.

19. And is it not sufficient if one Euangelist haue those words? and is it not lawfull, what is wanting in one, to supplie out of an other? But it can haue no excuse, to clippe the Euangelists words as he doth: whatsoeuer is giuen vnto you at the same time, that speake, saith Saint Marke: but he citeth the place thus: that which shall be giuen you, 3. b. p. 105. that speake.

20. And is he so captious, that he could not, or would not see, that the omission of this word (were,) was a meere ouersight in the setter, and therefore the Replyer hath amended it among the Errata before Limbomastix. And this (poore-blinde pryer) might haue obserued the like scape in his owne blotted lines: where he thus writeth; where the soules of sinners wont to be tortured, for, were wont, 2. b. p. 35. &c.

21. This is a small exception to the Geneva translation, to take the present tence for the preterperfect: especially, seeing the Apostle so readeth, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , ascending, Eph. 4. 8. and the same tence with the Hebrewes, serueth both for the present, and time past: as Psal. 68. 19. from whence S. Paul borroweth that testimony.

22. These words 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , are englished in the translation: but the words in Greeke it was not pertinent to repeate; because all the force lieth in the other words, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 .

23. 1. The Replyer citing those words of the Apostle, to prooue the inward afflictions, had no cause to repeat the rest, which speake of his glorying and reioycing in Christ: but onely so much, as was to the purpose. 2. Hee refuseth not Chrysostoms exposition, though bySee before Imput. 11. Recrim. 3. Chrysost. him much mis-alleadged; neither doth it make against him: for that inward resolution and preparation of the minde, daily beeing in expectation of death, was it not an inward affliction and temptation? to suffer death, I hope hee will not deny to be an affliction: then the daiely expectation of death, being inward, must be an inward affliction. 3. Neither are those words cited, to prooue that Saint Paul died the death of the soule, but for the similitude of the phrase. Hee might else-where haue further seene the Replyers meaning,Synops. p. 978. expressed in this manner: As the body is not said onely to die, when the soule departeth from it, but when it is pressed with deepe and dangerous afflictions, which threaten death: as Paul saith, I die daily: so the soule may be said after a sort to die, not only when it is finally separated frō God, but perplexed with the horror and feeling of Gods, wrath. 4. It followeth not, because Paul had inward ioy and consolation, therefore he had not inward afflictions: for speaking of terrors within, 2. Cor. 7. 6. he addeth, God which comforted the abiect, comforted vs, &c. His inward afflictions, and terrors, were tempered with inward ioy and comfort also: here is neither dishonour done to Paul, nor contumely to the spirit, vnlesse it bee by his contumelious and slaunderous mouth.

Such are this Cauillers exceptions, to the Replyers allegations of Scripture, as we haue seene; wherein I doubt not, but that hee hath rather shewed himselfe a wrangler, then the other a corrupter: for although in the citing of other forraine testimonies, greater liberty may bee vsed; as Hierom saith hee did in interpreting of Greeke Authors,Hierom. Pammach. de optim gener. interpretand. Non verbū de verbo, sed sensum exprimere de sensu: not to expresse euery word, but the sense by the sense: yet in alleadging Scripture, we must hold vs to the very words: where, as he againe saith, Verberum or do & mysterium est: there both order and mysterie is in the words. But had hee beene sincere himselfe in alleadging of Scripture, hee would not haue beene so suspicious of another; according to that saying, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : A wit free from euill, is slowest to suspect euill. Now then it followeth to shew, what a pregnant wit, and ready facility he himselfe hath in corrupting of Scripture.

The Recrimination.

1. That place,2. b. p. 56. 2. Timoth. 2. 5. he citeth thus: 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : no man is crowned, vnlesse he striue lawfully: whereas these are the Apostles words; 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , &c. If any man striue, hee is not crowned, except he striue lawfully: where for any man, he putteth no man.

2. For 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 :2. b. p. 83. perrils among false brethren: he readeth, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 , false brotherhood: beside, he quoteth 2. Cor. 12. 26. for 11. 26.

3. Hee thus vnreuerently speaketh of the Scripture: 2. b. p. 158. which shewes your state wholly dependeth vpon shifting; first from the newe Testament to the olde, from the olde to the newe, and from the new to the olde againe: thus he profanely calleth the comparing of the newe Testament with the old, shifting.

4. He corrupteth the sense of the Apostle,2. b. p. 202. vnderstanding his words,2. Pet. 1. 4. of beeing partakers of the diuine nature, of participating with his godhead: which is onely meant of a similitude and likenesse vnto God, not in substance, but in qualitie, in flying the corruption of the world, as the words following shew: which thing was well expressed by Iustinus Philosophus, that the end which a Philosopher propoundeth to himselfe, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 . is to be like vnto God, as neere as may be.

5. Christ saith, Where I am, there shall also my seruant be, Iohn. 12. 26. he thus addeth vnto it; where I am (now) there shall my seruant be (hereafter.)3. b. p. 3.

6. I goe to prepare a place for you, (and though I goe to prepare a place for you) I will come againe, Iohn 14. 2. 3. all this inclosed he leaueth out; 3. b. p. 4. and here he ioyneth himselfe two verses together, which he before called patching: Accusat. 8.

7. Ye shall lie downe in sorrow, Isay, 50. 11. hee readeth, ye shall sleepe in affliction and sorrow.3. b. p. 138.

8. Saint Peter saith thus, searching, when, or what time the spirit, which testified before of Christ, which was in them, should declare the sufferings (which should come) vnto Christ, &c. 1. Pet. 1. 11. he clippeth the text, saying, the spirit prophecied before of the afflictions of Christ.3. b. p. 93.

9. For, wisdome calleth or preacheth in the high waies, Prou. 1. 21. he readeth, wisdome is preached, &c. see before Imput. 5. Ac. 3.3. b. p. 107.

10. This Iesus hath God raised vp, whereof we are all witnesses, Act. 2. 32. he corruptly addeth to the text, this is that Iesus, whom God hath raised vp (from death, and hell) whereof we are all witnesses.3. b. p. 180.

11. He quoteth for that place before recited, Act. 1. 9. where there is no such thing.3. b. p. 180.

12. Lest I sleepe in death, Psal. 13. 4. lest at (any time) I sleepe in death,3. b. p. 138. saith he: where he addeth, at any time.

13. Thou art Lord alone, thou hast made heauen, and the heauen of heauens, Nehem. 9. 6. but he readeth, Thou Lord,3. b. p. 86. hast made heauen, and the heauen of heauens.

14. Againe, in the same place, thou preseruest them all, and the host of heauen worshippeth thee:3. b. p. 86. but he addeth, thou preseruest them all (in their beeing,) and hee leaueth out that which followeth.

15. Hee profanely scoffeth at Scripture; whereas that place of Peter is alleadged, Noe the preacher of iustice: hee scoffingly inferreth, Noe is no sooner formed a Carpenter, but he is presently a reformed preacher.3. b. p. 108.

16. Whereas Saint Peter saith, Noe the eight, a preacher of righteousnesse, 2. Pet. 2. 5. hee clippeth the words, Noe the preacher of iustice.3. b. p. 108. ibid.

17. He shall not preserue the vngodly, Iob. 36. 5. but hee readeth thus, thou wilt not preserue: changing the tence. 3. b. p. 86.3. b. p. 86.

18. Saint Iames thus writeth, to receiue with meekenes, the word, that is graffed in you, which is able to saue your soules: Iam. 1. 21. he audaciously changeth the person, reading thus; to receiue with meekenesse, the word engraffed in them,3. b. p. 87. which is able to saue their soules.

19. Againe the same Apostle: Let him knowe, that hee which hath conuerted a sinner, from the error of his way, shall saue a soule, &c. Iam. 5. 20. but he thus mangleth this place, He that conuerteth a sinner, from the way wherein he erreth, shall saue his soule, &c. In this one place, he clippeth off the first clause, Let him know: hee changeth the tence, conuerteth, for hath conuerted: and addeth these wordes, (wherein) and (his.)3. b. p. 88.

20. Our Sauiours words are, when they lead you, and deliuer you vp, take ye no thought afore, neither premeditate what ye shall say, but whatsoeuer shall be giuen vnto you, &c. Mark. 13. 11. he thus boldly corrupteth the text, Foule corrupting of Scripture. when yee shall be lead, & deliuered vp into their hāds, take no thought what to speake, but that which shall be giuen, &c. 3. b. p. 104.3. b. p. 104. where he both changeth the actiue for the passiue: for they shall lead, and deliuer: he readeth, shall be lead and deliuered: he addeth (into their hands) and clippeth away (neither premeditate.)

21. Reproouing the Obiecter, for leauing out the word mourning, in citing that place, Gen. 35. 37. he himselfe committeth the very same fault: the text truly alleadged (saith he) is this, I will goe downe, &c. to my sonne mourning: 1. b. p. 12. where he leaueth out, into the graue.

22. Exod. 1. 22. the text is, Pharaoh charged all his people: he readeth, all the people: leauing out (his.) 1. b. p. 30.1. b. p. 30.

23. Esech. 13. 19. the text is, will yee pellute me among my people (for handfuls of barlie,1. b. p. 30. and pe ces of bread?) &c. where he leaueth out all the last enclosed clause.

24. Esech. 18. 27. the text is, when the wicked turneth away from his wickednesse (which he hath 〈◊〉 ) and doth that which is lawfull and right: hee in alleadging this Scripture, leaueth out (which he hath committed.) ibid.

25. Numb. 22. 33. the Angel saith thus, And the Asse saw me, and turned from me now three times or else if shee had not (turned from me) surely I had 〈…〉 , &c. he clippeth the text thus; There 〈…〉 turned from mee now the third time, and if shee had not, I had surely slaine thee, &c. where these words enclosed (turned from me) in the second place, 1. b. p. 30. are omitted: and he putteth the (third time) for (three times.) ibid.

26. Beside, all these places are falsly quoted: as Esech. 13. 18. for 19. Esech. 18. 72. for 27. Psal 41. 12. for 41. 2. Numb. 22. 32. for 33.

Now concerning this vnfaithfull and fraudulent handling of Scripture, I will not giue such an harsh sentence, as Ambrose doth vpon some:Epistol. 4. Qui Scriptur 〈◊〉 fidem destr •• t, destruitur ipse: hee that destroyeth the faith of Scripture shall be destroyed himselfe: as it is said, hee that rem •• ueth an hedge, a serpent shall 〈◊〉 him. or as hee •••• ureth them that had rased out certaine words of Scripture:Lib. 3. de spirit cap. 11. Illa litura de libro vitae nomina vestra delet: that blot doth blot your names out of the booke of life. But yet that saying of Epiphanius may be applyed vnto him non it a interpretantur vt scripta sunt, sed id volunt significare, quod ipsi sentiunt: they do not so interprete (Scripture) as it is written, but they will haue it to signifie, as they imagine: Of this number is the Confuter, who by this time may perceiue his owne fault, which he hath not healed, by supposing another to bee like faultie with himselfe: for it is a good saying, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : that no man healeth one euill by another: neither is one mans fault redressed by anothers.

But it is nowe high time to leaue weeding anothers ground; time is better spent in setting of good plants, then in weeding of thistles:Prou. 24. 31. I passed (saith the wise man) by the field of the slouthfull, and by the vineyard of the man destitute of vnderstanding, and l e, it was all growen ouer with thornes, &c. I looked vpon it, and receiued instruction. And this instruction may we receiue, by viewing this thornie field, wherein this simple workeman hath solaced himselfe, that such badde tillage sheweth the husbandman not to be very good: It is odious and a thanklesse office, still to be scoring out mens faults; therefore I say with Tullie, against Sallust. finem dicendi faciā, saepius enim vidi grauius eos offendere animos aeuditorum, qui aliena vitia apertè dixerunt, quā eos, qui crimen cōmiserunt: mihi ratio habēda est, non quid (Sallustius) merito debeat audire, sed vt ea dicam, si qua ego honeste effari possum: I wil make an ende of speaking, for I haue often seene, those more grieuously to offend the hearers minds, which openly told of others faults, then they which committed them: therefore I must haue regard, not what hee is worthy to heare, but what I may with credit speake. Diogenes beeing reprooued for going into an vncleane place, made answere, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : that the sunne doth enter likewise into such, but is not defiled. But I dare not say so: I feare rather, lest by raking long in a stinking puddle, some euil sauour should remaine. Hitherto I thought it needfull to shape a wrangler an answer, that he might know himselfe, and reforme his error; not to that ende, as Sallust said to Tullie, Si quam volupatem maledie endo caepisti, eam male audiendo amittas: that if you haue taken any delight in speaking euill, you may loose it againe in hearing euill: for my care hath beene, not, in reproouing him, to commit that my selfe, which I note in him worthy of reproofe, his owne tearmes I might returne, and quicke and tart speech differeth from rayling: but I wish vnto him the like sober mind that Gennadius noteth to haue beene in one Seuerus, Gennad. catol. script. who beeing seduced by the Pelagians, Agnoscens loquacitatis culpam, silentium vs que ad mortem tenuit, vt quod loquendo contraxerat, tacendo penitus emendaret: did acknowledge his talkatiue fault, and held his peace till he died; that what he had committed in speaking, hee might amend in keeping silence. But if he finding himselfe netled shall begin to stirre, and beeing rubbed on the galled backe, fling out his heeles againe, I will rather choose, by silence to set him vp as a tired hackney, in his owne durtie stable; then to play the iade, in kicking at him I haue lost too much time already, from other more profitable studies, though I spend no more so: yet if he minde still to brabble, and contend about words;1. Cor. 11. 16. I say with the Apostle, If any man list to be contentious, we haue no such custome, nor the Churches of God. He shall plaie his prizes alone for mee, and mooue laughter vpon his stage of vanity; for if the Replyer should set his foote to his, and take vp the gauntles vpon euery rawe fencers challenge; it might be said of them both, as Demonactes Cynicus of two wrangling disputers: Alter ulget hircum, alter supponit cribrum: the one milkes an he goat, the other putteth vnder a siue. The truth needeth no defence, and as our blessed Sauiour best answered Pilate with silence, so hee knoweth how to grace the truth in his members, that loue the truth, euen when they hold their peace:Ambr. serm. 49. and so I say with Ambr. Ambiat defendi, qui metuit super ar : let him seek defence, which is afraid to be ouercom: Melior est causa, quae non defenditur, & probatur: the cause is so much the better, which is not defended, and yet approoued. And so to conclude, if he be disposed yet to busie himselfe further,Epist. Epiph. ad Synod. Constantin. 5. act. 1. I send him that sentence of Epiphanius for a posie, This is naturally graft in such as are giuen to error, vt contra eos pugnent, qui ipsos redarguunt: to fight against those which doe reprooue them.

FINIS. Soli Deo honos & gloria. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 : Let God be true, and euery man a lier: Rom. 3. 4.
A TABLE OF THE PRINcipall places of the Aduersaries Apologie confuted and answered. The first figure sheweth the page of the Apologie: the rest the pages of the confutation.
The second Booke which is the first of the Apologie.

Pag. 2. p. 13. 28. p. 39. pref. p. 4. 134. p. 83. p. 190. p. 3. pref. p. 6. p. 28. 29 p. 40. pref. p. 5. p. 12. p. 84. p. 27. p. 4. p. 99. p. 42. p. 132. p. 85. p. 86. p. 5. p. 28. p. 44. p. 44. p. 37. 51. p. 87. p. 44. p. 7. p. 14. p. 46. p. 91. p. 89. p. 97. p. 8. p. 15. 83. p. 48. p. 94. p. 90. p. 15. p. 10. p. 28. p. 49. p. 37. p. 91. p. 15. 79. p. 12. p. 28. 34. 121. p. 50. p. 19. p. 92. p. 15. 39. p. 13. p. 149. p. 51. p. 37. 79. p. 94. p. 85. p. 18. p. 84. p. 52. p. 19. p. 96. p. 120. p. 19. p. 16. 92. p. 53. p. 19. p. 97. p. 67. p. 20. p. 17. 73. 130. p. 56. p. 190. p. 102. p. 48. 91. 166 p. 21. p. 131. p. 57. p. 51. p. 103. p. 88. p. 23. p. 16. p. 58. p. 19. p. 107. p. 55. 76. 85. p. 24. p. 131. p. 59. p. 166. p. 108. p. 137. p. 25. p. 48. p. 60. p. 20. p. 110. p. 13. p. 27. p. 146. p. 67. p. 38. 79. 117. p. 113. p. 117. p. 28. p. 131. 165. p. 116. p. 51. p. 29. p. 13. 14. 16. p. 68. p. 16. 39. p. 118. p. 40. p. 33. p. 29. p. 70. p. 69. 182. p. 119. p. 39. 40. 51. p. 35. p. 37. 188. p. 72. p. 146. 117. 118. p. 36. p. 12. 122. 132 p. 76. p. 19. 119. p. 120. p. 117. 123. p. 37. pref. p. 3. 83. p. 77. p. 119. p. 121. p. 99. 177. 99. 122. p. 82. p. 14. p. 122. p. 146. p. 123. p. 44. 182. p. 156. p. 101. p. 186. p. 182. p. 124. p. 51. p. 158. p. 190. p. 188. p. 83. 118. p. 125. p. 39. p. 159. p. 22. 56. p. 189. p. 101. 118. p. 127. p. 44. p. 160. p. 182. 132. 149. p. 128. p. 45. p. 161. p. 100. p. 190. p. 41. 132. 153 p. 130. p. 93. 117. p. 162. p. 70. p. 193. p. 79. p. 131. p. 95. p. 163. p. 100. 132. p. 194. p. 132. p. 136. p. 22. 69. 165. p. 164. p. 41. 169. p. 195. p. 42. 101. p. 139. p. 182. p. 165. p. 168. p. 196. p. 70. 153. p. 141. p. 91. 100. p. 166. p. 10. 149. p. 198. p. 119. 153. p. 143. pr. p. 6. 118. p. 167. p. 169. p. 199. p. 84. 123. 182. p. 170. p. 75. 76. p. 201. p. 57. 120. 132 p. 144. p. 100. 182. p. 175. p. 88. p. 202. p. 70. 190. p. 148. p. 93. p. 178. p. 55. 70. p. 203. p. 63. 84. p. 149. p. 85. p. 179. p. 167. p. 204. p. 65. 119. p. 151. p. 45. p. 180. p. 19. 96. p. 205. p. 68. 84. 119 p. 154. p. 40. p. 182. p. 116. p. 207. p. 57. 63. 65. p. 155. p. 45. 95. p. 183. p. 176. 67. 117. 119.

The third Booke, which beginneth where the Pages are not figured.

Pag. 2. p. 149. 167. p. 47. p. 22. p. 3. p. 37. 52. 191. p. 25. p. 93. 101. p. 49. p. 90. 94. 120. p. 4. p. 119. 191. p. 26. p. 45. 116. 182 p. 50. p. 94. p. 5. pref. p. 7. 109. p. 28. p. 56. 116. p. 56. p. 123. p. 6. p. 84. 123. p. 30. p. 69. p. 57. p. 42. 68. 183. p. 7. p. 92. p. 31. p. 182. p. 59. p. 183. p. 8. p. 172. p. 33. p. 133. p. 60. p. 51. 73. p. 9. p. 101. 109. p. 35. p. 161. p. 61. p. 102. p. 10. p. 161. p. 37. p. 182. p. 62. p. 102. p. 14. p. 68. 95. p. 38. p. 84. 182. p. 63. p. 23. 183. p. 15. p. 93. p. 40. p. 101. p. 64. p. 165. 184. p. 16. p. 172. 175. p. 41. p. 21. 22. 115. p. 66. p. 23. p. 19. p. 150. 160. 123. p. 67. p. 92. p. 20. p. 144. 149. p. 42. p. 101. 102. 183 p. 68. p. 177. p. 21. p. 144. p. 44. p. 183. p. 69. p. 178. p. 22. pref. p. 8. 144. p. 46. p. 120. p. 70. p. 183. p. 71. p. 40. 118. 133 p. 122. pref. p. 8. 102 p. 170. p. 103. p. 72. pref. p. 8. 51. p. 123. pref. p. 8. 141 p. 171. p. 124. 178. p. 74. p. 23. 149. p. 124. p. 142. p. 172. p. 183. p. 76. p. 113. p. 125. p. 24. 141. p. 173. p. 103. p. 77. p. 24. 102. 115 p. 126. p. 46. p. 175. p. 124. 136. p. 79. pref. p. 8. 42. p. 127. p. 47. 57. p. 178. p. 138. 177. p. 128. p. 149. p. 179. p. 13. p. 82. p. 55. p. 134. p. 102. p. 180. p. 191. p. 83. p. 23. p. 136. p. 53. p. 182. p. 138. 139. p. 84. p. 43. 133. 149 p. 137. p. 49. p. 183. p. 102. 183. p. 86. p. 56. 191. 192 p. 138. p. 191. 192. p. 184. p. 50. 52. p. 87. p. 192. p. 139. p. 43. p. 185. p. 138. p. 88. p. 192. p. 140. p. 102. 123. p. 188. p. 138. 141. p. 89. p. 48. p. 142. pref. p. 8. p. 189. p. 149. p. 90. p. 46. p. 143. p. 121. 127. p. 191. p. 115. p. 91. p. 149. 162. 164. p. 192. p. 177. 179. p. 92. p. 179. p. 148. p. 123. p. 193. p. 52. 103. p. 93. p. 134. 191. p. 149. p. 103. p. 194. p. 160. 173. p. 96. p. 123. p. 150. p. 51. 123. p. 195. p. 103. p. 98. p. 133. 134. p. 151. p. 43. 93. p. 198. p. 13. p. 99. p. 53. p. 152. p. 86. p. 201. p. 73. p. 101. p. 88. 96. 112 p. 153. p. 25. p. 203. p. 19. p. 103. p. 133. p. 154. p. 124. p. 207. p. 57. p. 104. p. 25. 49. p. 155. p. 121.   183. 192. p. 156. p. 134. Out of the Epistle. p. 105. p. 90. 188. p. 157. p. 120.   p. 107. p. 53. 178. 191 p. 158. p. 49. p. 5. p. 34. p. 108. p. 191. 192. p. 159. p. 135. p. 6. p. 13. p. 109. p. 120. p. 160. p. 103. p. 9. p. 36. p. 110. p. 120. p. 161. p. 92. 124. p. 10. p. 12. 13. p. 113. p. 134. p. 162. p. 135.   p. 114. p. 88. p. 163. p. 103. Out of the Preface. p. 115. p. 120. 149. p. 165. p. 120. 121.   p. 117. p. 153. 136. 160. 161. p. 2. p. 13. p. 118. p. 102. 183. p. 166. p. 26. p. 5. p. 15. 36. p. 119. p. 46. 134. p. 169. p. 158. 161.  

FINIS.