¶The apologye of syr Thomas More knyght.

[Page] [Page 2]Syr Thomas More knyght to the crysten reders.

The fyrst chapyter.

SO well stād I not (I thanke god) good reader in myne own conceyte, & thereby so myche in myne owne lyghte, but that I can somwhat with egall iudgement and an euyn yie, byholde and cōsyder both my selfe and myne owne. Nor I vse not to folowe the condycion of Isopes ape, y thought her own babes so b [...]utuouse, & so farre passyng in all goodly feature and fauour / nor the [Page] crow that accompted her own byrdes the fayrest of all the fowles that flew. But like as some (I se well) there are, that can somwhat lesse thē I, that yet for all that put oute theyr workes in wrytynge: so am I not so blynde vppon the tother syde, but that I ve­ry well perceyue, very many so farre in wyt and erudicyon aboue me, that in such mater as I haue any thyng wryten, yf other men, as many wolde haue take yt in hand as could haue done yt better, yt myght myche better haue becomē me to let the mater alone, then by wrytyng to p̄sume any thing to medle therwyth.

And therfore good reader, syth I so well know so many [Page 3] mē so farre excell & passe me, in all such thynges as are re­quyred in hym that myght aduenture to put his workes a­brode, to stand and abyde the iudgemēt of all other men: I was neuer so farre ouer [...]ne, as eyther to loke or hope that [...]ch fautes as in my writyng sholde by myne ouersyght es­cape me, coulde [...] the [...] of all other men [...] forth vn­spyed / but [...] both by [...] percey [...]d / [...] amo [...] so many [...]adde bre [...]erne as I wy [...] well wold be [...]oth wyth th [...] ̄, shold be both sought out and syfted to the vtte [...]most flake of branne, and largely theruppon controlled and reproued.

But yet agaynste all thys [Page] [...]eare this one thynge recom­forted me, that syth I was of one poynte very faste and sure, that such thynges as I w [...]yte are consonaunt vnto the comen catholyque fayth & determynacyons of Chrystes catholyque chyrch, & are clere confutacions of false blasphemouse heresyes by Tyndale and Barons pu [...] forthe vnto the cōtrarye / any great faute and intoll [...]rab [...]e sholde they none finde, of such maner sort and kynde as y re [...]ders shold in theyr soules peryshe and be destroyed by / of whyche poy­sened fautes myne aduersa­ [...]yes bokes be full.

Now then as for other fautes of lesse w [...]yght and tolerable / I nothynge douted nor [Page 4] do, but that euery good chry­sten reader wyll be so reasonable and indyfferent, as to pardon in me the thyng that happeth in all other mē / and that no suche man wyll ouer me be so sore an audytour, & ouer my bokes suche a sore controller, as to charge me with any great losse, by gatherynge to gether of many such thynges as are wyth very fewe men aughte regarded / and to loke for suche exa [...]te cyrcumspeccy on and sure syght to be by me vsed in my wrytynge, as ex­cept the prophetis of god, and Cryste and his apostles, hath neuer I wene be founden in any mannes elles byfore / that is to wit to be perfyte in euery poynte clene from all maner [Page] of fautes / but hath alway [...]en holden for a thyng excusable, though the reader in a longe worke perceyue that the wry­ [...]er haue as Horace sayth of Homere, here and there some tyme f [...]llen in a litle slomber / in whyche places as the rea­der seeth that the writer slept, so vseth he of courtesy yf he can not slepe, yet for cōpany at the leste wyse to nappe and wynke with him, and leue his dreme vnchekked. whyche kynde of courtesy yf I sholde shew how often I haue vsed wyth Tyndale and Barons both, wynkynge at theyr tole­rable fautes, and suche as I rather thought neglygently escaped them of ouersyght or foly, then dylygently deuysed [Page 5] of wyly falsed or malyce: y [...] I wolde adde all those fautes to theyr other, then sholde I double in lēgth all my bokes, in whyche the bretherne fynd for the speciall faute, that they be to longe all redy.

But all be it that whan I wrote I was (as I haue tolde you) bolded and encoraged by the comon custume of all in­dyfferēt readers, which wold I wyst well perdō and holde excused suche tolerable ouer­syght in my wrytyng, as men may fynde some in any man­nys all moste that euer wrote before: yet am I now myche more glad and bolde, whan I se y those folke whiche wolde faynest fynde my fawtes, can not yet happen on them / but [Page] after longe sekynge and ser­chynge for them, for all theyr bysynesse taken there aboute, are fayne to put for fawtes in my wrytynge, suche thynges as well consydered shall ap­pere theyr owne fawtes for the fyndynge.

For they fynde fyrste for a great fawte, that my writyng is ouer longe, and therfore to tedyouse to rede. For whyche cause they say they will neuer onsvouchsaufe to loke therō.

But than say they ferther, that suche places of theym as are loked on by those that are lerned and can skyll, be soone perceyued for nought, & my reasons of lytell force. For they bost mych that they here somtyme diuers partes of my [Page 6] bokes answered and cōfutedfully in sundry of some men­nes sermons, though my na­me be forborne / & than they wysshe me there they saye, for that it wolde do theyr hartes good to se my chekes redde for shame.

And ouer thys they fynde a greate fawte, that I handle Tyndale and Barons theyr two newe gospellers, with no fayrer wordes nor in no more courteyse maner.

And ouer thys I wryte they say in such wyse, that I shew my selfe suspecte in the mater & parciall toward the clergy.

And than they saye that my wurkes were wurthy myche more credence, yf I had wry­ten more indyfferentely, and [Page] had declared and made open to the peple the fawtes of the clergy.

And in this poynt they laye for a sample the goodly and godly mylde & g [...]ntle fashyon vsed by hym who so euer he was, that now lately wrote y boke of the deuisyon bytwene the temporaltye and the spy­ [...]ytualty / whyche charytable mylde maner they say that y [...] I had vsed, my wurkes wold haue ben redde both of many mo, & wyth mych better wyll.

And yet they saye bysydes [...]ll thys, that I do but pyke oute pyeces at my pleasure, suche as I maye mo [...]te easely [...]eme to soyle / & leue out what me lyste, and suche as wolde playnely proue the mater a­gaynste [Page 7] me. And so they saye that I vse but crafte & fraude agaynst Tyndale. For as for [...]rere Barons I perceyue by sundry wayes, that the bre­therhed [...]peke myche lesse of hym, eyther for that they find hym in theyr owne myndes well and fully answered, or ellys y they take him in respec [...] of Tindale but for a man of a secunde sor [...]e. And that may [...] peraduenture be, bycause he leueth out [...]omwhat that Tindale taketh in, that is to wy [...] the makynge of mockes and mowys agaynste the masse, & the blessed sacrament of the aulter.

But fynally they [...]aye fer­ther yet, that I haue not ful­fylled my promyse. For I promysed [Page] they saye in my preface of my confutacyon, y I wold proue the chyrche / and that they saye I haue not done.

The second chapiter.

Now wyll I begyn with that poynt that I most esteme. For of al the remanaūt make I litle coūte. But surely loth wold I be to misse reherse any mannys reason agaynst whome I wryte, or to reherse hym slenderly. And in that poynt vndoutedly they se full well them selfe, that they saye not trew. For there is no rea­son that I reherse of Tynda­les or of frere Barns eyther, but that I vse the contrarye maner therin that Tyndale vseth with myne. For he reherseth [Page 8] myne in euery place faintly and falsely to / and leueth out the pyth and the strength, and the profe that moste ma­keth for the purpose. And he fareth therin, as yf [...]here were one that hauynge day of cha­lenge appoynted, in whyche he sholde wrestle with his ad­uersary, wold fynde the mean by craft to gete his aduersary byfore the day into his owne handes, and there kepe hym & dyet hym with such a thynne diete, that at the day he bry [...] geth hym forth feble, faynte, and famyshed, and all moste hunger storuen, and so lene that he can scant stand on his legges / and then is yt etheye wote well to geue the sely soule a fall. And yet when [Page] Tyndale hath done all this, he taketh the fall hym selfe.

But e [...]ery man maye well se, that I neuer vse that way wyth Tyndale nor wyth any of these folke / but I reherse theyr reason to the beste that they can make yt theym selfe / and [...] rather enforce yt and st [...]ength it of myne own, th [...]n take any parte of theyrs there from.

And this vse I not onely in suche places as I do not re­herse all theyr owne wordes (for that is not requy [...]y [...]e in euery place) but I vse yt also in suche places [...]esyde, as of [...]ll the [...]r owne wordes I leue not one syllable out. For such darkenes vse they purposely, & Tyndale in especyall, that [Page 9] [...]xcepte I toke some payn [...] to set out theyr agumētꝭ plainly many that rede theym sholde ly [...]le wyt what they meane.

And to thentēt euery man may se y these good bretherne lytle care how lowde they lye: let any man loke who so wyl / and he shal fynd, that of frere Barons I haue left out lytle, except a lefe or two cōcerning the generall counsayles, and I shew the cause why / & as for Tindale of dyuerse whole chapyters of his, I haue not wyttyngly left oute one lyne / & very few I am sure of ouer syght eyther, but haue put in all his chapiters whole, wheruppon any weyght of his mater hangeth, excepte onely in the defēce of such englysh wordes [Page] as he hath chaunged in his translacion of the new te­stament. And yet therin they cā neuer say, but that I haue put in all the strēgth and pith of his profe.

But all the remanaunt of hys chapyters, as farre as I haue goone haue I putte in whole, leuynge out noughte but raylynge and preachyng wythoute profe / and that but in one place or twayne / and where I so do, I geue the reader warnynge.

Now that his chapyters be whole rehersed in my boke, I suppose yt maye metely well appere by the mater cōsequēt­ly pursuyng, if the reader leue my wordes out bytwene, and [...]ede but Tyndales alone. Or [Page 10] yf any one worde or some few left out of chaunce putte that profe in doute / yet haue the brethern among them I warraūt you of Tyndales bokes inough, by whyche they may trye this trew.

And well ye wote yf this were vntrew that I say, some of thē could assigne at the lest wyse some one suche place for a sample. But that thyng neyther do they, nor neuer can whyle they lyue.

The thyrd chapyter

NOwe where [...]s these good blessed bretherne say, y my wrytyng is so long and so tedyouse, that they wil not ones vouchsaufe to loke theron / they shew thē self that [Page] my wrytynge is not so longe as theyre wyttes be shorte / and the yien of theyr soules very poore blynde, whyle they can not se so farre, as to perceyue that in fyndynge so many fautes in that boke, whych they confesse thē selfe they neyther rede nor canne fynd in theyr hert to loke vp­pon, they shew theym selfe eyther of lyghtnes redy to geue hasty credence to other folke, or of malyce to make many lyes them selfe.

It is lytle meruayle that yt seme long and tedyouse vnto them to rede yt ouer wyth in, whome yt irketh to do so myche as loke yt ouer wyth­out / & euery way semeth long to hym that is wery ere he [Page 11] begynne.

But I fynde some men a­gayne, to whome the redynge is so farre fro [...]edyouse, that they haue redde the hole bok [...] ouer thryes / and some that make tables therof for theyr owne remembraunce / & that suche men as haue as myche wytte and lernynge both, as the best of all thys blessed bre­therhed that euer I herd of.

Now be it gladde wolde I haue bene yf it myghte hau [...] ben mych more shorte / for thā sholde my labour haue ben so mych the lesse.

But they wyll yf they be re­sonable men, cōsyder in them selfe that it is a shorter thyng [...]nd soner done to wryte here­s [...]s than to answere them.

[Page] For the most foly she heretyke in a town, may write mo fals heresyes in one lefe, than the wysest man in the hole world can well and cōuenyently by reason and authoryte soyle & confute in fourtye.

Now whan that Tyndale not onely techeth false here­syes, but furnysheth hys er­ [...]ours also wyth pretence of reasone and scrypture / and in stede of reason somtyme with blont subtyltyes and rude ri­dyls, to the makynge open & lyghtesome to the reader, the darke wrytynge of hym that wold not by his wyll be well perceyued, hath putte me to more laboure and lengthe in enswerynge, than some man wold peraduenture haue ben [Page 12] contente to take.

And I somtyme take the payne to reherse some one thynge in dyuerse fasshyons in mo places thā one, bycause I wo [...]de that the reder sholde in euery place where he fortu­neth to fall in redynge, haue at hys hand wythout remyt­tynge ouer ellys where, or la­bour of ferther sekyng for it, as mych as shall seme requy­syte for y mater that he there hath in hande. And therin the labour of all that lengthe ys myne owne, for ease & shorte­nynge of the readers payne.

Now on the other syde, as for Tyndale and Barns, I wote nere well whether I may call them longe or short.

For somtyme they be short in [Page] dede, bycause they wolde be darke, and haue theyr false fo lyes passe and repasse all vn­perceyued.

Some tyme they can vse such a compendyouse kynde of cloquēce, that they conuay and couche vp to gether, with a wonderfull breuyte, four fo lyes and fiue lyes in lesse then as many lynes.

But yet for all this, I se not in effec [...] any mē more long then they. For they preache some tyme a longe procesle to very lytle purpose. And syth that of all theyre whole pur­pose, they proue in cōclusyon neuer a pyece at al, were theyr wrytynge neuer so shorte / yet were theyre [...] worke at [...] to longe by all to gether.

[Page 13] But greatly can I not mer­uayle, though these euange­licall brethern thinke my workes to long. For euery thyng thynke they to longe that ought is.

Our ladyes psalter thinke they to longe by all the Aue Maryes / & some good pyece of the Crede to.

Then the masse thynk they to longe by the secretes, and the canon, and all the colectis wherin mencyon is made ey­ther of saintes or soules.

In stede of a longe portu­ouse, a shorte prymer shall serue them. And yet the prymer they thynke to longe by all our lady matens.

And the seuen Psalmes thinke they long inough with [Page] out the lateny.

And as for Dyryge or cō mendacyon for theyr frendes soules, all that seruyce they thynke to longe by all to ge­ther.

But now good readers, I haue vnto these delycat dayn­ty folke that can awaye wyth no longe redynge, prouyded wyth myne own payne and labour, as myche ease as my poore wyt coulde deuyse.

Fyrs [...]e when they were by­fore faste in the catholyque fayth▪ they neuer neded to haue redde any of these here tiques bokes, y haue brought them in to these new fangled fantasyes. But now syth they be by theyr owne foly, fallen fyrste into doutynge of the [Page 14] trouth, and afterwarde into the lenyng to warde a false by lyefe / they be very neglygent & vnreasonable, yf they wyll not at the leste wyse for theyr owne suerty, serche & se som­what, wherby they maye per ceyue whyther these newe tea chers of theyres be suche as they take them for.

Now haue I then cōsydered, y they wold peraduēture ware wery to rede ouer a lōg boke / and therfore haue I taken the more payne vppon euery chapyter, to thentent that they shal not nede to rede ouer any chapyter but one, & that yt shall not force greatly whych one thorow out all the boke.

For I dare be hold to say, [Page] and am redy to make yt good with the beste euāgelyst of all this euangely call bretherhed that wyll set his penne to the cōtrary, y there is not one cha­pyter of Tyndales or Barns eyther, that I haue touched thorowe myne whole worke, but that I haue so clere and so fully confuted hym, that who so rede yt indyfferently, maye well and clerely se that they hādle theyr mater so falsly, and yet so folyshely ther­wyth, that no man whyche regardeth eyther trouth or wit, sholde ones vouchesaufe to rede any farther of them

Now he that wyll therfore rede any one chapyter, eyther at aduenture, or ellys some chosen pyece in whyche hym [Page 15] selfe had went that hys euan­gelycall father Tyndale had sayed wonderfull well, or els frere Barns eyther / when he shall in that one chapyter as I am sure he shall, fynde his holy prophete playnely pro­ued a fole, he maye be soone eased of any ferther laboure. For than hath he good cause to caste hym quyte of, and ne­uer medle more wyth hym / & thā shall he neuer nede to rede more of my booke neyther, and so shall he make it shorte inough.

How be it yf he lyste for all that to perdon hys prophete in that one place, aud thynke that he wrote that pyece per­aduenture whyle the spyryte was not vpon hym, and that [Page] he sayth mych better in some other place, and so wyll rede on ferther to fynde it: than shal hym self make my worke longe. For he shall I truste rede it ouer, and yet shall he neuer come to it. And thus as for the tedyouse length of my wry [...]ynge, I haue I truste without greate length geuen the good bretherhed a suffy­cyent answere.

The .iiii. chapyter.

BUt now wyll the bre­therne peraduenture saye, that I may be bolde to say very largely of myn own, bycause men may not be bold in these maters to defend. Tindals parte.

It were in dede somwhat [Page 16] better then it is yf they sayed trewe. But neyther are suche thynges so dylygentely con­trolled, nor such folke so [...]erd of suche heretycall fauour, as they shold be yf euery man dyd hys parte / nor they lacke no wyly dryftes in such wyse also to defend those thynges, as they may saue for thē selfe some colour to saye that they ment none harme.

And to proue that they be neyther so sore aferde in such thynges, nor lacke suche in­uencions of vtterynge theyr forbodē ware, bysyde the bold erronyous talkynge that is now all moste in euery lewde laddys mouth / the bretherne bost that they here diuers partes of my boke well & playn­ly [Page] in sundry of theyr sermons confuted / & than they can not saye ye se well that they leue me vnanswered for fere.

Howe be it though they be bolde vpon some partes euen nowe / some partes happely there are wherupon they dare not be so bolde yet, but lytle & lytle wyll peraduenture here­after.

How be yt some partes that they be all redy bolde vppon, be metely well for a begyn­ny [...]ge / whereof for ensample I shall remember you one or twayne.

Tyndales false translacion of the new testament was (as ye wo [...]e well and as hym selfe confesseth) trranslated wyth suche chaunges as he hath [Page 17] made therin purposely, to the entent that by those wordes chaūged, the people shold be noseled in those opiniōs whi­che hym selfe calleth trew catholyque fayth, and whyche thynges all trew catholyque people call very false pestylēt heresyes.

This translacion therfore beynge by the clergy cōdempned, & at Poules crosse open­ly burned, and by the kynges graciouse proclamacyō opēly forbodē: I wrote in a place of my dyaloge in y .C. lefe amōg other thynges these wordes.

The fautes be so many in Tyndal [...] translacyon of the new testament / and so spred thorough the hose boke / that [Page] lyke wrse as it were as sone done to weue a new webbe of cloth, as to so we vppe euery hole in a net / so were it almost as lytell labour and lesse, to translate the hole booke all new / as to make in hys trans­lacyon so many chaunges as nede must be ere it were made good / bes [...]des thys that there wolde no wyse man I trow take the brede whych he well wyste was of hys enemyes hand onys poysoned / though he saw his frend after scrape it neuer so clene.

These wordes of myne were rehersed in a sermon, and an­swered in this wyse, y though there were brede that were [Page 18] poysoned in dede, yet were poysened brede better then no brede at all.

Now was this word takē vppe, & walked about abrode among the bretherne and sys­terne, so hyghly well lyked a­monge them, that some of thē sayd that all my reasons were auoyded clene wyth that one worde.

Now be it in dede one of theyr owne wyues yet told her own husbande at home, when she harde hym boste yt, how ioly­ly yt was preached better poysened brede then no brede / by our laken brother husbande quod she, but as properly as that was preched, yet wold I rather abyde the perell of bredynge wormes in my bely by [Page] eating of flesh without brede, then to eate wyth my meate the brede y I wyste well were poysoned.

And of trouth good reader, this worde of his was one of the moste proude and pre­sumptuouse, and therewyth the most vnwyse to, that euer I harde passe the mouth of a­ny man reputed and taken for wyse.

For when the thynge had ben examyned, consydered, & condempned, by suche as the iudgement and the orderyng of the thynge dyd apperteyne vnto, that false poysened trāslacyon was forboden the people / it was an heyghnouse presumpcyon of one man, vppon the truste of his owne wyt, to [Page 19] geue the people corage and boldenesse to resyste theyre prynce and disobey theyr pre­lates, and geue thē no better staffe to stande by, then suche a bald poysoned reason, that poysened brede is better the [...] no brede.

For [...]yrste I pray you how pr [...]ueth [...]e that poysened bred were better then no brede. I wolde wene yt were as good to forbere meate & starue for hunger, as to eate rat [...]is bane and dye by poyson / but yf the precher pro [...]e me that it were better for a man to kyll hym selfe then dye.

But now falleth he in double foly / for fyrst hys proper wyse worde can haue no wyt therin, but yf he proue that y [Page] people must nedes perishe for lacke of spyrytuall foode, e [...] ­cepte the scrypture be translated into theyr owne tonge.

Now if he say and afferme that / then euery fole almoste may fele the mannys foly.

For the people may haue euery necessary trewth of scryp­ture, and euery thynge necessary for them to know, concer nynge the saluacyon of theyr soules, trewly taught and preched vnto theym, though the corps and bodye of the scryp­ture be not translated vnto them in theyr mother tonge.

For ellys hadde it ben wrong wyth englyshe peple from the fayth fyrste brought into this realme, vnto our own dayes / in all whyche tyme byfore, I [Page 20] am sure that euery englyshe man and woman that coulde rede yt, hadde not a boke by theym of the scrypture in en­glyshe. And yet is there I dout not of those folke many a good saued soule.

And secundly also, yf the hauynge of the scryputure in englyshe, be a thyng so requysyte of precise necessyte, that the peoples soules sholde ne­des perysh but yf they haue it translated into theyre owne tonge: then muste there the most part perishe for all that, except the preacher make far­ther prouysyon besyde, that all the people shall be able to rede yt when they haue yt / of which people farre more then four partes of all the whole [Page] dyuyded into tenne, could ne­uer rede englyshe yet, and many now to olde to begynne to go to scole, & shall wyth god­des grace though they neuer rede worde of scrypture, come as well to heuen, & as sone to, as hym seit peraduēture that preched y wyse word. Many haue thought yt a thing very good & profitable, that y scrypture well and trewly transla­ted sholde be in the englyshe tong. And all be yt that many ryghte wyse and well lerned bothe, & very vertuouse folke also, bothe haue bene and yet be in a farre other mynde: ye [...] for myne owne parte, I both haue bene and yet am also of the same opynyon styll, as I haue in my dya [...]oge declared, [Page 21] yf the men were amēded and the tyme mete therfore. But that it were a thynge of suche precyse necessite, that the peo­ples soulys muste nedes pe­rysshe but yf that be had / and that therfore we sholde su [...]er rather such a poysoned trans­lacyō then none, and wylful­ly kyll our selfe wyth poysen rather thenne we wolde take holesome mete ī at our mouth but y [...] we maye fyrste haue it in our own hādes: thys herd I neuer any wise man say, no nor fole neyther▪ tyll Tindale came forth wyth his new trāslated scrypture, translatynge the truth of Cryste into false Luthers heresyes.

And yet whan the bretherne haue herde such a wyse word [Page] in a sermone / that worde vse they to take solempnely for a sure authoryte, and saye that all the longe reasons of syr Thomas More is here answered shortely wyth one worde.

But now haue I with mo wordes than one, made you playne and open the foly of that wyse worde.

And whan so euer he that preched it, can herafter again wyth many mo wordes than I haue here wrytē, proue his worde wysely spoken / let hym kepe one copye therof wyth hym selfe for lesynge, & sende an other to me / and than that copye that I receyue, I wyll be bounden to eate it though the booke be bounden in bor­des.

The .v. chapyter.

ANother sāple of such kynde of answerynge haue I sene made vnto the fyrste chapyter of my thyrde boke of Tyndals cōfutacyō / of whyche answere the bre­therne boste greately and say that I am answered euyn to the poynt.

For thys worde was sayd vnto a frend of myne in great boste, by a specyall sure secret brother of thys newe broched brotherhed / wherupon when I had herde it, I longed sore to se that answere. For ī good fayth I had my self thought, that I had so fully answered that chapyter of Tyndalys, whyche is whyther the chyr­che were before the worde or [Page] the worde before the chyrche / that he sholde neuer wythout hys shame be able to reply whyle he lyued. And therfore lōgyng sore to se how I was answered now therin / I re­quyred my frend to fynde the meanes yf he myghte, that I myghte se the boke / wenynge that some newe worke of Tindals hadde bene of late come ouer. But afterwarde he brought me word that it was answered not beyond the see, but here wythin the realme / not by any booke specyally made agaynste it, but in a ser­mon onys or [...]wyes openly preched. How be it not of a so­dayn brayed, but fore studyed and penned / wherof the boke as a spyryte in close goo [...]h a­boute [Page 23] secretely, velut negotium per ambulans in tenebris, amonge thys blessed bretherhed / but I trust to turne it into demonium meri­dianum, that euery man maye se hym somwhat more playne appere, and shewe hym self in hys owne lykenesse.

Now is it so in dede, that in that chapyter of Tyndals there be certayne lyuys lefte out in myne answere. How be it they were of trouth left out by ouerfyght in the pryntyng whyche maye well appere by thys. For in myne answere I so touche those wordes, that the leuynge out of them ma­keth myne owne more darke and lesse perceyued. And therfore are they content to fynde [...]o fawte at the leuyng out of [Page] them, but make as though all were in / & also bycause that myne answere is as they bost by that sermon, so well & sub­stancyally confuted.

But now bycause I wold be lothe to be iudged by the onely bretherne and sisters of the false fraternite / and to the entente they shall all well se that I fere not the iudgement of indyfferent folke, I shall put abrode that all folke may se those wordes of y solempne sermon, by whyche they boste that myne answere vnto that chapyter of Tyndales chapi­ter is so goodly confuted.

The very formall wordes lo good reders of that sermō, for as farre as ꝑtayne to this mater, after y copy that was [Page 24] delyuered me (whyche copy I reserue and kepe for my declaracyō) therin be these wordes that here after folow.

Now yt foloweth in the epystle, Vo [...] [...]arie enim genuit nos verbo veritatis.

This text may be expowned after thys maner, He made vs by the [...]routh of hys worde / he made vs [...] (ye knowe) of nothynge / and he made vs as the chyefe and pryncypall of all his creatures. For he gaue vnto vs wyt and reason, the whyche he gaue vnto no creature [...]ynynge in the erth but onely to vs. But to come more nere the mater, we may say that god wyllyngly begate vs by the worde of his trouth / and hath putte vs here in to thys worlde, and here to be as the lord and ru­ler of al his creatures, the which he made for our comforte and soco [...]re. But yet we may go more nere you, and say how that he hath begoten vs by the worde of hys trouthe. Marke I pray you here, howe that saint Iames sayth that god hath be­goten vs thorough his worde of trouth▪ Here yt appere [...]h that we be not trew of [...]ure selfe / for we are made trew by god [...]orough his word. And where as of our [Page] selfe we were no nother but [...]yer [...], god of his [...] go [...]dnes hath made vs [...]y his wor [...]e the chy [...]d [...]en [...]f trouth and of [...] as bef [...]re we were but [...] as worketh none othe [...] thyng [...] euen the very dyspleasure of god.

Now god o [...] his mercy [...]ul goodnes by his h [...]ly wor [...]e of trouth hath made vs hys chyl [...]ren / that is to saye the chy [...]dren of his tr [...]uth, euen as yt p [...]eased hym (sayth [...]ay [...]te Iames) he hath begoten vs by the word of his trouth. Marke how that he sayth eu [...]n as it pleased him he begate v [...]. If we were begoten and made as yt p [...]eased hym / then was yt not done as yt pleased vs. And agayne and y [...] we were bego­ten by hym / then could not we gyue hym none occa [...]yon to lo [...]e vs. F [...]r why we cam of hym & not we of vs. [...]e [...]e may yo [...] percey [...]e al [...]o, that this texte maketh a­gaynst theym that wyll saye, the chyrche was before the gospell.

It is playne yn [...]u [...]h that th [...] chyrche [...] not before the worde / for saynt Ia­mes sayth that god begate vs thorough th [...] word of his trouth. If we were begotē by the worde, then nedes must the worde [...]e be [...]ore we were gote [...] / or elles howe [...] we be begoten by the word / and by [...] [...]rde he sayth we were begoten. If [Page 25] god bega [...]e vs thorow the word / we must nedes graunte that he that begate vs was before that we were begoten / and he that begate vs, begate vs by the worde / then nedes mu [...]e the worde be before that we were begoten. Nowe then yf this worde were before we were begoten / howe can we say that the chyrche was before thys worde.

If we meane by the chyrch, the chyrch of [...]yme & stone, then yt is playne ynough that the word was before any such chyrch was made. For we fynde that yt was many a daye a [...]ter man was made, or eue [...] there were any suche chyrches made. If ye meane by the chyrche, the vnyuersall chyrche of god, the whych is the congregacyon of all chrysten peple. If you mean this chyrche, and saye howe this chyrche was before the worde: then saint Iames maketh you an answere to that, sayenge how that by the worde this chyrche was begoten. Then nedes mus [...]e we graunte that the worde of god was before any chyrche was.

ye but some wyll not be content wyth this answere, but they wyll saye that the chyrche was before that this worde was wryten of any man, and yt was admyt­ted and alowed by the chyrch, and so was [Page] the chyrche before his word [...]. ye but yet I wyll say to you agayne, how that this word was writen before the chyrch was / [...]e and yt was not wryten by men, but yt was wryten by god our sauyour afore the begynnynge of the worlde / as wytnesse saynt Poule, where he sayth to the He­brewes, D [...]bo leges meas &c. I wyl gene my laws [...]ayth god into theyr hertes, & in theyr myndes shall I wryte yt. Beholde how god gaue yt them at the begynnyng in theyr hertes, and wryt yt in theyr myndes, and they exercyses his lawe wryten in theyr he [...]tes in de [...]e and [...] effecte.

Thus may ye [...]e that at the begynnynge god wrote his lawes in theyr hertes, and therfore mu [...]e we nedes graunte that the w [...]rde of god was taught to them longe or euer the congregacy [...]n taught yt. For you se that by the word we were begote / therfore the worde must nedes be before we were begoten / or elles how coulde the worde begete vs.

Some peraduenture wyll say, that the chyrche was before this worde was wryten in bokes of paper and pa [...]chement and suche other thynges, and that the chyrch dyd admit them to be rede of them, which they thought necessary to loke on theym. They wyll saye that the chyrche was [Page 26] before this was done. ye but what thyng is this to the purpose, or what shall we nede to stand arguynge of this mater.

It is playne ynough to all men that hath eyes to se & [...]ares to heare, how the word of god was before any chyr [...]h was, & how the word of god was writen afore yt was wryten in any bokes or tabuls / and ther­fore what shall we nede to dyspute thys mater. But good lorde, yf yt had not ben wryten by the euāgelyfies in those days, how shold we do in these dayes, the whi­che brynge forth the scrypture for theym in dede / and yet they wyll bere theym in hand that yt is no scrypture, and yf yt had not ben wryten in bokes then. Not wythstandyng ye may perceyue how the word was or euer the chyrche was, & the worde begate vs and not we the worde / and al­so yt was wryten or euer the chyrche a­lowed yt to be wryten.

Now good readers, to the entent ye maye the better per­ceyue for what purpose the bretherhed bosteth these wor­des, ye shall vnderstande that where as Luther fyrste and [Page] Tyndale after hym, tell vs for a fundacyon of all theyre abomynable heresyes, that there is nothynge that ought to be taken for a sure and vn­dowted trouth of the chrysten bylyefe, but yf it maye be pro­ued by playne and euydent scrypture: the kynges hygh­nes in his most famouse boke of assercyon of the sacramen­tes, layed agaynste Luther / & I out o [...] the same boke of my sayd souerayne lord▪ toke and layed agaynste Tyndale and all such, that the word of god is parte wryten in the scryp­ture, and part vnwryten that appereth not proued therein / as for ensample y perpetuall virgynyte of our lady & other dyuerse poyntes whych were [Page 27] onely taught by Cryste to his apostles and by them fo [...]th to the chyrche / and so by trady­cyon of the chyrche bysyde the scrypture and wythout wry­tynge, taught and delyuered vnto chrysten peple from age to age / and so the faythe and bylyefe of those thynges kep [...] and contynued fro thapo [...]les dayes vnto our owne tyme. And that yf the chyrche were nothynge boun [...]en to byleue, but onely the thynges playn­ly wryten in scrypture / than had all folke b [...]fo [...] Moyses dayes bene lefte at lyberty [...] to leue all goddes wordes vnbyleued. And than had Cry­stes chyrch in the begynnyng ben at libertye to leue a great parte of Crystes own wordes [Page] vnbyleued. For the chyrche was gathered and the faythe byleued, before any parte of the newe testamēt was put in wrytynge. And whyche wry­tyng was or is the trew scrypture, neyther Luther nor Tindale knoweth but by the cre­dence that they gyue to the chyrche.

And therfore syth the word of god is as stronge vnwry­ten as wryten, and whyche is hys worde wryten Tyndale can not tell but by the chyrch, whyche hath by the assystence of the spyryte of god therin y gyfte of dyscrecy on to knowe it / and syth that that gyfte is gyuē (as saynt Austayn sayth and [...]uther hym selfe confes­seth) to thys comon knowen [Page 82] catholyke chyrch: why shold not Luther and Tyndale as well byleue the chyrch, in that it telleth theym, thys thynge dyd Cryste and hys apostles saye, as they muste byleue the chyrche (or ellys byleue no­thynge) in that it telleth them thys thynge dyd Crystes euā gelystes and apostles wryte.

Now good readers, Tyn­dale seyng how sore thys rea­son of the kynges hyghnes doth towch and [...]urne vp the very fundacyō & great parte of hys heresyes: he doth ī his boke agaynste me, of whyche booke he maketh the tytle, whych is the chyrch and whether it may erre or not, putte thys chapy [...]er, Whether the chyrch were before the gos­pell, or the gospell before the chyrche. whyche chapyter to thende ye [Page] the more clerely perceyue the mater, I shall reherse you hole / & after that some parte of myne answere therto. And thā yf ye rede agayn the wor­ [...]es of thys sermon y I haue here inserted byfore / euery chylde almoste shall be well able to iudge, whyther thys preacher haue in hys sermon auoyded well myne answer [...] or no. These are Tyndals wo [...]des.

[...]ther d [...]ute there is, whether the chyrch or [...] be before the gos­pe [...]l or the gospell before the chyrche. Whyche que [...]yon is as harde to solue, as whether the father be elder then the sonne, or the sonne elder then his father. For the hole scryptu [...]e and all beleuynge he [...]tes tes [...]yfye▪ that we are begoten tho­rowe the worde. [...]herfore yf the worde begette the congregacyon, & he y beget­teth is before hym that is begoten / then is the gospe [...] be [...]ore the chyrche. Paule [Page 29] also Romano .ix. sayth, Howe shall they call on whom they byleue not? And how shall they byleue wythout a preacher?

That is, Chryste must fyrst be preached [...] men can byleue in hym. And then yt foloweth, that the worde of the preacher must be before the sayth of the byleuer.

And therfore in as myche as the worde is before the fayth, and fayth maketh the congregacyon / therfore is the worde or gospell before the congregacyon.

And agayne, as the ayre is darke of yt selfe, & receyueth all her lyght of the [...]o [...] euen so are all mēs hertes of thē self darke wyth lyes and receyue all theyr trenth of goddes word, in that they cōsent therto.

And moreouer as the darke ayre gyueth the sonne no lyght / but contrarye wyse the lyght of the sonne in respecte of the ayre is of it self, and lyghteneth the ayre, and purgeth yt from darkenesse: euen so the lyeng herte of man can geue the word of god no tre [...]th / but cōtrary wise y treuth of goddes word is of her selfe and lyght­neth the hertes of the byleuers, and ma­keth them trew / and clenseth them from lyes / as thou redest Ioh [...] .xv. ye be clene by reason of the worde. Whyche is to be vnderstande, in that the worde hadde pu [...] ged theyr hertes from lyes, from false opinyons [Page] and from thynkynge euyll good, and ther [...]ore from consentynge to synne. And Iohn .xvi [...]. Sanctyfy them o [...]ather [...]horow thy treuthe. And thy worde y [...] [...]euth. And thus thou seeft that goddes trouth dependeth not of man. It is not trew because man so sayth or admytteth yt for trew. But man is trew bycause he beleueth yt, te [...]fyeth, & g [...]ueth wytnesse in his herte that yt is trew. And Chryste also sayth hym selfe Ioh [...] .v. I rec [...]yue no witnesse of man. For yf the multytude of mannys wytnesse myght make ought trew, then were the doctryne of Mahe­mete trewer then Chrystes.

Lo good reders, here haue ye herde Tyndals chapyter / the mater wherof y bretherne boste that the wordes of that sermon do so well and substā ­cyally mayntayne, agaynste mine answere made vnto this chapyter.

But nowe to thentent ye may your self iudge, whyther y sermon may bere out theyr [Page 30] [...]oste or not / I shall reherse you some parte of myne an­swere. Lo thus begynneth myne answere vnto Tindals chapyter.

Lo he that redeth thy [...] and hereth not thansw [...]r [...] / except hym self be well typed in the mater / may wene that Tyn­dale in these wordes had quit hym selfe syke a man / & borne me ouer quyte / he solueth the obieccyon so playnely / & playeth therwyth so pleasauntly. But now when ye sha [...] vn­derstād that neuer man wa [...] so madde to make thys obieccyon to Tyndale but hym selfe / then shall ye laugh [...] to se that [...]e wreste [...]eth all alone [Page] and gyueth hym selfe a fall / and in his mery solucyon mocketh also no mā but hym self.

I sayed in my dyasoge that the chyrch was before the gospell was writen / and that the fayth was taughte, and men were baptysed, & masses sayd & the other sacramentes my nystred amonge cristē people before any parte of the newe testament was putte in wrytyng / and that thys was done by the worde of god vnwryten. And I sayd also there / & yet saye here agayne / that the ryghte fayth whyche Adam had and suche as in the same fayth succeded hym long ere wrytyng began, was taught [Page 31] by the word of god vnwrytē / and so went from mā to man fro the father to the sonne by mouth. And I sayd that thys word of god vnwryten / is of as greate authoryte as is the worde of god wryten.

I shewed also that the chirch of Cryste hath ben / is / & eu [...]r shall be / taughte & instructed by god and hys holy spyryte with his holy word of eyther hynde / that is to wytte bothe wyth hys worde wryten and hys worde vnwryten / & that they whyche wyll not byleue goddes worde but yf he putte it in wrytynge / be as playne infydeles as they that wyll not byleue it wrytē / syth god­des [Page] worde taketh hys authoryte of god that speketh it / & not of man that wryteth it.

And th [...]re is lyke suerty and lyke certayne knowledge of the worde of god vnwryten as there is of the word of god writen / syth ye know neyther the tone nor the tother to be the worde of god, but by the tradycyon of the chyrche.

whyche chyrche as all crysten m [...]n byleue / & the scrypture shew [...]th / and saynt Austayne declar [...]th / and Luther hym selfe confesseth / & the deuyll hym selfe sayth not naye / the ble [...]sed spyryte of god hath inwardly ta [...]ght / tea [...]heth / and [...]uer shall teache / to knowe / [Page 32] iudge and dyscerne the worde of god from the word of man and shall kepe the chyrch frō errour / ledynge it into euery trouth / as Crys [...]e sayth hym selfe in the .xvi. chapyt [...]r of saynt Iohans gospell. which he dyd not yf he suffered the chyrche to b [...] dampnably de­ceyued in takynge the worde of man for the worde of god / wherby it sholde in stede of seruyce to be done to god / fall in vnfaythfulnesse / and wyth idolatry do seruyce to the de­uyll.

And therfore I shewed in my sayed dyaloge / and yet the kynges hyghnes myche more playnely shewed in hys [Page] most erudyte famouse booke agaynst Luther out of whych I toke it: that the worde of god vnwryten is of as greate authoryte / as certayn / and as sure / as ys hys worde wrytē in the scryp [...]ure. which poynt is so faste and sure pytched vpon the rocke [...] our sauyour Cryst hym selfe that neyther Luther, Tindale, nor [...]us­kyn, nor all the hell houndes that the deuyll hath in his ke­nell / neuer hytherto could nor whyle god lyueth in heu [...]n & the deuyll lyeth in hell neuer hereafter shall (barke they / baw [...]e they neuer so fast) be able to wreste it out.

And that they be all as I [Page 33] tell you so feble in this poynt wherupō theffect of all theyr hole heresyes hangeth (for but yf they veynquyshe this one poynt / all theyr heresyes fully be burned vp and fall as flatte to asshen as it were allmoyse all obstynate here­tykes dyd) ye maye se a clere proue by these wordes of Tyndale / whych he hath set so gloriously forth in the fore fronte of hys batayle / as thoughe they were able to wynne the hole felde. For where as I sayed that the gospell and the worde of god vnwrytten was before the chyrch / & by it was the chirch begon gathered and toughte / [Page] and that the chyrche was by­fore that the gospell that now is wryten w [...] wryten / that is to wy [...]e byfore any parte of the gospell was wryten / for as for all the hole gospell that is to wyt all the wordes of god that he wolde haue knowen byleued and kepte / was yet neuer wryten: thys beynge the thyng that I sayd Tyndale w [...]th all the helpe he hath had of all the herety­kes in A [...]mayne thys two or thre yere to gyther is yet in suche d [...]spa [...]re to be able to matche therewyth, that he ys wyth shame inough fayne to forgette that I sayd the chyrche was before the gospell [Page 34] wryten. whyche thynge hym selfe can not denye, & is fayne to frame the doute and make the obieccyon / as thoughe I had sayd that the chyrche had ben before the gospel and the word of god vnwriten / wherof hym selfe knoweth well that I sayd clene the cōtrary And therfore good reders hauynge thys thynge in your remembraunce: take nowe the [...]ayne to rede Tyndal [...] wordes agayne and ye shall haue a pleasure to se how fondely [...]e [...] afore you. For now hys crafte open [...]d and decla­ [...]ed vnto you [...] ye shall per­ [...]ue that he playeth nothing [...]ene but fa [...]eth [...] [Page] that conuayeth hys galles so craftely that al the table spy­ [...]th them.

Lo good readers, here haue I nowe rehersed you but a pyece of myne answere vnto that chapyter of Tyndale / & yet by this one pyece alone may ye clerely perceyue, that all those wordes of that ser­mon go so farre wyde fro the [...]oynt, that they not onely do nothynge helpe Tyndale (for all the labour that they take aboute yt) but also the prea­cher of them taketh a fowler faller than Tyndale / in that the preacher stumbleth at the same stocke, and falleth into the same puddell that Tyn­dale dyd, and that after that [Page 35] he was warned by myne an­swere made to Tindale afore.

For this here ye se, that this preacher in the fyrst part of his wordes, toucheth not the mater / but lytle and lytle he descēdeth therto by the ex­pownynge of these wordes of saynt Iames, voluntarie enim ge [...]uit nos verbo ver [...]atis / that ys in englyshe, He hath wyllyngly begoten vs by the worde of trewth.

[...]ow be yt the peacher en­glysheth it thus, [...] whyche wordes after that he hath expowned after dyuerse maners, he cometh at laste to that exposycyon, by whych he expowneth those wordes in this wyse, that god hath wyllyng­ly [Page] by his worde made vs the [...] of [...]rewth and of [...]. And after a thynge or two noted & mar­ked therin, whyche I shall happely make you to marke well & s [...] somwhat more ther­in hereafter, then the preacher sheweth you there / he cometh to y poynt wyth whych we be now in hand and therin thus he begynneth. [...].

But now do you good readers clerely perceyue and se, that this precher sayth wrōg. For while they against whom he preacheth, that is to wytte, they that say the chyrche was byfore y gospel writē, do both m [...]ane and playnely, wryte that the chyrche was not by­ [...] [Page] [...] that the he [...] wolde make men [...], that goddes word were of none authorite nor worthy to be byleued, but yf yt were wryten in the bokes: nowe I [...] that syth ye knowe good [...]aders, that they agaynste whom this preacher thus precheth, do meane, and say, and wryte, as ye nowe se they do / ye cā not but clerely perceyue and se, that this precher doth in this poynte but laboure to blynde his audience, & meteth [Page] nothynge wyth the mater▪

For now this thyng hadde in mynde and cōsydered / all his reason after, whych he taketh oute of Tyndales chapyter, wa [...]eth euyn dede for colde.

For what he [...]e or what one sparke of life after this thyng consydered, haue all his wordes y folow, wherin he sayth.

It is playne ynough that the chyrche was not before the worde / for faynt Ia­mes sayth that god begate vs thorough the word of his trouth. If we were begotē by the worde, then nedes must the worde be before we were goten / or elles howe [...] we be begoten by the word / and by the worde he sayth we were begoten. If god be ga [...]e vs thorow the word / we mu [...]t nedes graunte that he that begate vs was before that we were begoten / and he that begate vs▪ begate vs by the worde / then nedes muste the worde be before that we we [...] [...]. Nowe then yf this worde were bef [...]e we were begoten / howe can we say that the chyrche was before thys [Page 37] worde.

If we meane by the chyrch, the chyrch of [...]yme & stone▪ then yt is playne ynough that the word [...] before any such chyrch was made. For we fynde that yt was many a daye after man was made, or euer there were any suche chyrches made. If ye meane by the chyrche, the vnyuersall chyrche of god, the whych is the congregacyon of all chrysten peple. If you mean this chyrche, and saye howe this chyrche was before the worde: then [...]aint Iames maketh you an answere to that, say [...]nge how that by the worde this chyrche was begoten. Then nedes muste we graunte that the worde of god w [...]s before any chyrche was.

Al this chyldesh reason ye wote well, whyche Tyndale hath begoten hym, and why­che he bryngeth out of Tyn­dales chapyter, and fathereth yt vppon saynt Iames, be yt neuer so quicke ī another ma­ter, is yet in this as touchyng them agaynst whome he preacheth [Page] yt, clene quayled in the trauayle, and vtterly borne dede / whyle they agaynste whome he preacheth, saye not precysely that the chyrch was before the gospell, nor byfore goddes worde, but onely saye that the chyrche was byfore the gospell and goddes word was put in wrytynge.

And that his reason is dede, as I say yt is / hym selfe that preached yt perceyueth / and therfore he goth farther and draweth nerer to the mater, and sayth.

ye but some wyll not be content wyth this answere, but they wyll saye that the chyrche was before that this worde was wryten of any man, and yt was admyt­red and alowed by the chyrch, and so was the chyrche before his worde, ye but yet I wyll say to you agayne, how that this word was writen before the chyrch was / [Page 38] y [...] and yt wa [...] not wryten by men, but yt was wryten by god our sauyour afore the begynnynge of the worlde / a [...] wytnesse saynt Pon [...]e▪ where he sayth to the He­brewes, Dabo leges mea [...] &c. I wyl geu [...] my law [...] sayth god into theyr hertes, & in theyr mynde [...] [...]all I wryte yt. Behold [...] how god gaue yt them at the begynnyng in theyr herte [...], and wryt yt in theyr myndes, and they exercyses his lawe wryten in theyr hertes in dede and in effecte.

Thus may ye se that at the begynnyng [...] god wrote his lawes in theyr hertes, and therfore m [...]ste we nedes graunte that the worde of god was taught to them longe or euer the congregacyon taught yt. For you se that by the word we were begotē / therfore the worde must nedes be before we were begoten / or elles how coulde the worde beget [...] v [...].

By these wordes good rea­ders ye se, that hym selfe per­ceyueth that all his other wordes were not wurth a ryshe, bycause they came not nere y purpose, nor any thyng tow­cheth them agaynst whom he [Page] precheth them. And therfore seynge that Tyndale is by myne answere therin proued a fole / he goth as ye se ferther than Tindale went. But ther in the nerer he cometh to the poynte, the more he proueth hym selfe to go the ferther frō reasō. For what reasō hath he y in arguyng agaynst other, sayth but the same y they say?

Now all that euer he sayth in these wordes, saye we a­gainst whom he precheth thē.

And we not onely saye the thynges that he sayth nowe, that is to wytte that goddys worde was ere euer it was wryten, and that it was wry­ten in hartes ere euer it was wryten in bokes / but these be also the thynges that we spe­cially [Page 39] lay agaynst him, whose sayd chapyter thys preacher wolde wyth these wordes de­fende. For syth the gospell o [...] Cryste and the wordes of god that are now wrytē in bokes, were all wryten in hartes by­fore they were wryten in bo­kes, and yet were at that time of the same strength and au­thoryte that they be now / we saye to Luther and Tyndale & all such oher heretikes, that they say false in that they pre­che & teche, that mē are boūdē to byleue nothyng but if it be wrytē in bokes / syth god is at his liberty to geue his word in to hys chyrch euen yet at thys daye, by hys owne mouthe, thorow thinspyracyon of hys holy spyryte sent therunto, & [Page] by hym selfe abydynge euer therin / & at y prechyng of the chyrch, wryte it ī y hertes of y herers, as well & as surely as euer he gaue hys word to his chyrche by hys apostles, and wrote it in the peoples hartes at theyr prechynge, at suche tyme as it was yet vnwryten in any of thapostles bokes.

And ouer this, we tell them that the same chyrch, by onely which chyrch they now know whyche bookes be those tha [...] haue the word of god in them that the apostles and euange tystes haue wryten / the same chyrche I say doth tell them, that the wordes of god which god wyll haue vs byleue, be not all wryten in those bokes but some parte styll remayne [Page 40] onely writen in hartes, as be­fore the bookes wryten they dyd all to gyther. And we tell them that Tyndale muste as well byleue the chyrche in tel­lynge hym whyche be those wordes of god y yet remayne vnwryten, as he doth & must byleue it in tellyng hym why­che be those bokes, in whyche the wordes of god are wrytē.

And therfore good reders what thynges in thys worlde coulde thys precher haue de­uysed worse to brynge forth agaynst me for Tyndals de­fence, than those wyth whych as ye se Tyndale is most cle­ [...]ely confounded.

But nowe shall ye se, that this precher perceyueth it wel inough hym selfe. And ther­fore [Page] after that he hathe sette forth Tyndals reason, & dys­symuled myne answere that I haue made to it / and so be­fore hys audyence wrestled a whyle in the darke, where for lacke of syghte of the mater they myghte se how he fell: he waxed yet halfe wery therof at last, and somwhat ashamed to, leste he were peraduenture spyed / & fayne wolde he ther­fore haue shakē of the mater, & rydde him self out honestly / and therfore in conclusyon he cometh downe to thys.

Some peraduenture wyll say, that the chyrche was before this worde was wryten in bokes of paper and parchement and suche other thynges, and that the chyrch dyd admit them to be rede of them, which they thought necessary to loke on theym. They wyll saye that the chyrche wa [...] before this was done▪ ye but what thyng [Page 41] [...] this to the purpose, or what shall we nede [...]o stand arguynge of this mater.

It is playne ynough to all men that hath eyes to se & eares to heare, how the word of god was before any chyrch was, & how the word of god was writen afore yt was wryten in any bokes or tabuls / and ther­fore what shall we nede to dyspute thys mater. But good forde, yf yt had not ben wryten by the euāgelysles in those days, how shold we do in these dayes, the whi­che brynge forth the scrypture for theym in dede / and yet they wyll bere theym in hand that yt is no scrypture, and yf yt had not ben wryten in bokes then. Not wyth standyng ye may perceyue how the word was or euer the chyrche was, & the worde begate vs and not we the worde / and al­so yt was wryten or euer the chyrche a­lowed yt to be wryten.

Here haue ye sene good rea­ders after longe wrestelynge wyth me, what shyft this pre­cher maketh to shake y mater of. For seynge that he can in no wyse defende Tyndalys reason, he wold at laste fayne [Page] shake of the questyon. And in dede the questyō as Tyndale frameth it of hys own fasshyō for hys owne aduauntage, is very fryuolouse and folysshe. And therfore thys preacher goth (as I say) somwhat fer­ther and cometh nerer to the poynt, in whyche the mater of the questyon lyeth. But than bycause he can not defende Tyndale and auoyde myne answere, after y tyme dreuyn forth in forneshynge of Tyn­dals reason / whan he cometh to the poynte he leueth myne answere vntouched, & wolde shake of y questiō for nought

But that thyng now good readers wyll not well be for hym. For the necessyte of this questyō you se now your self. [Page 42] For syth Luther, and Tyn­dale, and other suche herety­kes, do teache that no worde of god is now to be byleued, nor to be taken for goddes worde by the teachyng of the catholyke chyrche, but yf it be wrytē in scripture: they droue vs of necessyte to tell theym agayne, that the chyrche was before the scrypture, & before that any of goddes wordes were wryten therin / and that all hys wordes that he wyll haue byleued, were neuer writen / and that he is not so tong tayed, but that he is at lyber­tye to speke yet mo wordes whan he wyl, and may bynde vs as well to byleue them, as euer he bounde vs to byleue any worde that euer he spake [Page] before be it vnwryten or wry­ten. And that in all such thin­ges Luther & Tyndale both, and frere Barns to, & all the heretykes of them, muste (as I sayd) of reason byleue the chyrch as well whan it telleth theym, these thynges Cryste hath by hys owne spyryte or by the mouth of hys apostles taught vs, as whan it telleth them these thinges hath Crist by the penne of hys apostles wryten vs. Now is thys knot so sure, that it can neuer be lo­sed, but yf these heretykes or thys precher for them, can by playne scrypture proue vs y god hath caused al such thin­ges to be wryten in scrypture all redy / and ouer that made a promyse, eyther that he wyl [Page 43] neuer speke any suche worde more, or that yf he do, he wyll at the leste wyse take no dys­pleasure wyth vs, though we tell hym playnely that syth it is not in scrypture all redy, he shall wryte it in yf he wyll, or els wyll we not byleue hym.

The .vi. chapyter.

ANd thys precher hym selfe so well ꝑceyueth that thys poynt is trewe that I tell you, that he wold fayne yf he coulde proue it, say that all suche thynges are wryten all redy in scrypture. And therfore though bycause he seeth that I haue in the laste chapyter of my fyrste parte of Tyndals confutacyon, ouer­throwen Tyndale therin, he [Page] forbare to afferme it forth out in playne and open wordes: yet he gyueth hys audyence a proper insinuacyon therof, & maketh a prety glaūce therat, in those wordes where he sayth in the la [...]te ende. ‘But good lorde, yf yt had not ben writen by the euā gely [...]tes in those dayes, h [...]we sholde we do in these dayes, the whych bryng forth the scrypture for theym in dede / and yet they wyll bere theym in hande that yt is no scrypture, and yf yt ha [...]de not ben wryten in bokes then. Not wythstandyng ye may perceyue how the word was or euer the chyrche was, and the worde begate vs and not we the word / and also yt was wryten or euer the chyrche alowed yt to be wryten.’

By these wordes wolde he lo (though he say it not playn oute) that folke sholde wene that of any thynge whych we be bounden to byleue, the euā gelystes and apostles lefte in [Page 44] theyr dayes nought vnwrytē ▪ whyche poynt yf yt coulde be proued wolde helpe some he­resyes well forth, but yet not so many as heretyques wold make men wene. For many thynges that they saye be not in scrypture, are yet in scryp­ture ī dede. As is for the sacrament of cōfyrmacion, and an­elyng, & holy orders, and ma­trymony, and the very blessed body and bloud of Chryste in the holy sacrament of the aulter. And for good workes a­gaynste fayth alone, and for holy vowes of chastyte a­gaynst thabominable bychery of freres that wedde nonnes, and many suche other thyn­ges. And in all suche maters the questyō is not of the word [Page] wryten or vnwryten, but vp­pon the interpretacyō and the ryght vnderstādynge of god­des worde all redy wryten.

And therin is in effect the questyon also no more but whe­ther that in the construccion & exposycyon of holy scrypture, we sholde of reason better by­leue holy saynte Austayne / holy saynt Ambrose, holy saynt Hierom, holy sayn Cypriane, holy saynt Chrysostome, holy saynt Basyle, holy saynte Cyryll, and the thre Gregoryes of Greke holy saintes all thre, and holy saynte Gregory the pope, wyth all the other olde holy doctours and fathers of the faythfull doctryne on the tone syde / or els on the tother syde lewde Luther, and Lambert, [Page 45] Barns, Huyskyn, and Swynglius, Swartherth, Tyndale, George Ioy, and Denk [...]hius, Baynam, Bay­felde, Hytton▪ and Teuxbery, wyth brother Byrt, and yong father Fryth.

There wolde be nowe by­twene these two sortes no gre [...]dou [...] in the choyce (as me thynketh) yf he that sholde chose haue wyt.

And in suche maters thys is the great questyon in dede / whyche thyng yf any of theyr fauorers dare denye, and wyl afferme, that in the cōstrucciō of the scrypture they haue the olde holy doctours on theyre syde / let all these heretyques and al that bere them fauour, fynde out amonge theym all [Page] so myche as one of all the old [...] holy sayntes, that so dyd con­strue the scrypture, as nowe these newe heretyques do for weddynge of monkes, freres, and nonnes, which the whole catholyke chyrch all thys fyf­ten hundred yere, byfore these late lewde heresyes beganne haue euer more abhorred and holdē for abominable / let the­se new bretherne (I say) nowe fynd out among them all, any one of the olde holy sayntes, that sayde the breche of theyr vowes was no synne / & then am I content they say that all the remanaūt be whole vpon theyr part in all the remanaū [...] of al theyr poysoned heresies.

But on the tother syde, y [...] they can not among them all [Page 46] fynde out so myche as one old holy man for theyre parte in this poynte, in whych we can brynge many agaynst them: then must they nedes cōfesse, that in the construccion of the scrypture (for as mych at the leste wyse as apperteyneth to this poynte) sauynge for the vndouted fayth of the whole catholique chyrche full fyften hūdred yere to gether agaynst these vowbrekynge brethern (which thyng alone suffyseth for theyr full condēpnacyon) ellis standeth all the question but in this, whyther of the twayne shold in thexposycion of holy scripture be by reason amonge the vnlerned people better byleued / the olde holy gracyouse doctours and sayntes, [Page] or these new wedded mō ­kes and freres gracelesse apostatas and heretyques.

And then syth no good crysten man can doute whyther parte ys the better of these twayn / no good mā can there dout (ye se well) but that these new doctours, Luther, Lambert, Tyndale, Huyskyn▪ and Swynglius, wyth all theyre adherētes, be playn abomynable heretikes in this one point at the lest. which poynt while yt is so shamefull and full of fylthy bestelynes / I dare be bold to say that neyther hath that man nor that womē any respect or regarde of any clennesse or honeste, that can with fauoure vouchsaufe to rede theyr bokes or here them, tyll [Page 47] they fyrste forswere & abiure the defence and mayntenaūce of that incestuouse sacrylege and very bestely bychery.

The .vii. chapyter.

BUt nowe to retorne to the poynt whych thys precher wold couertly colour in hys sayde wordes, & wolde make it seme that thapostles and euangelystes had wryten all thynges that god byndeth vs to bylyefe, where he sayth, ‘But good lorde yf yt hadde not ben wry­ten by theuangelistes in those dayes, how sholde we do in these dayes the whyche brynge forthe the scrypture for theym in dede / and yet they wylt bere them in hand yt is no scrypture and yf yt hadde not ben wryten in bokes then▪’

These wordes seme to be myswriten, eyther in the pryncypall booke or in the copye.

[Page] For I thynke it wold be, yf it hadde not bene wryten by the euangelystes in those dayes, how sholde we do in these dayes, in whyche we brynge forth the scrypture for vs in dede, and yet they beare vs in ha [...]de that it is no scrypture. How be it how so euer hys wordes were in dede / he me­neth by them (as ye se) to shew y there was a necessyte wher­fore god caused all necessary thinges to be put in writyng. But vnto that poynte as I haue all redy made answere vnto Tyndale in the confu­tacyon / all the thynges that the chyrche techeth for neces­sare, and saye they were god­des wordes, all those I mene whyche these heretykes saye [Page 48] be not specyfyed in scrypture, and that therfore they be not goddes wordes nor any necessary treuthes, but false inuencyōs of Sathan (as Tindale sayth) & dāpnable dremys of men (as Barns sayeth) this precher yet can not denye, but kepte haue such thynges ben in remēbraunce and obserued this thousand yere, ye twelue or thyrtene hundred amonge chrysten people, ye & as longe as the gospels of Cryste hath bene wryten, & happely somewhat before to, as may be ga­thered of olde auncyent wry­tynges.

How be it though it were somwhat lesse shall lytle force for the mater. For if they may abyde by any meane in remē ­braunce [Page] a thousande yere / by the selfe same meanes maye they abyde in remembraunce another thousande to. Than sych these folkes saye that these thynges beyng so longe preserued and kepte in remē ­braunce, be out of the scryp­ture: now wolde I wytte of thys preacher, whyther they haue bene so [...]onge kepte and preserued by god, or by man, or by the deuyll. If he saye by god / than be they of likelyhed good thynges, & not falsedes but treuthes. And yf he saye that they be false, and that yet god hath kepte them / than foloweth it at the leste that he could haue kept them as well all thys longe whyle though they had bene [...]rewe, and that [Page 49] wythout the scrypture, as he hath kepte theym hytherto.

And thereof foloweth it also that he hadde no necessyte to cause [...]uery necessary trouth that he wolde haue kepte in remembraunce to be putte in y scrypture, as thys precher wol [...]e haue it seme.

But now yf thys preacher wyll saye on the tother syde, that these thynges haue not ben preserued by god among chrysten people / but be false thynges, and haue all thys longe whyle bene kept eyther by man or deuyll: yet syth god is as strong & as mighty as man and deuyll bothe, it foloweth ye se well that the thyng whych they haue done in kepynge of false thynges, [Page] god coulde as well do in the kepynge of trewe thynges, & neded to the kepyng no more scrypture then they.

And thus good readers euery way ye se that this rea­son of thys precher▪ whyche Tyndale layed agaynste me before hym, y god dyd cause all necessary thynges to be wryten in scrypture, bycause that els they coulde not haue contynued in remembraūce / thys reason I saye ye se can not holde. For those thynges haue contynued as longe in remembraunce, whych thyn­ges theym selfe saye be not in the scrypture.

For where this precher protesteth the necessyte of y put­tynge of all thynge in scryp­ture, [Page 50] wyth a fygure of apos­trophe and turnynge his tale to god / cryenge oute, O good lorde, yf yt had not ben writen by the euā gelystes in those dayes, howe sholde we do in these dayes, the whych bryng forth the scripture for thē in dede / & yet they wil bere them in hand that yt is no scrypture.

These wordes lo proue playnely for my parte, that there is as great suerty in the worde of god vnwryten and taught vnto the chyrch by the spyryt without the scrypture, as in his word wryten in the scrypture. For who so byleue the chyrch, wyll graunt both / & who so byleue not y chirch, wyll deny both, as this prea­cher here sayth hym selfe. For he knoweth not whych is the scrypture but by the chyrche And therfore where he saith y [Page] men now a days yf we lay thē forth y scrypture in dede, they wyll bere them in hande yt is no scrip [...]ure / veryly yf yt hap (as yt happeth often) that the preachers of these new sectes do lay forth for them very scripture in dede, whyche scrypture maketh not for theym in dede, but som fals gloses that they geue the scrypture in dede / there wyll the trewe ca­tholyque preachers say, that they abuse the scrypture in dede. But they wyl neuer say that the scrypture whych they brought forth, is no scripture in dede. For y way doth none vse but these heretikes onely / nor they can not all saye that there is any lefe or lyne, tha [...] euer them self haue taken for [Page 51] scrypture hytherto, but the catholyque chyrche of whome they lerned yt dothe afferme the same. But on the tother syde there are some partes of scrypture, whyche the whole catholyque chyrche affermeth for scrypture / whyche partes yet these heretyques afferme for none. As for ensample the selfe same pystle of saynt Ia­mes, which this precher made that sermon vppon / whyche pystle frere Luther and frere Barns both, lette not boldely to deny for scrypture, bycause in many places yt destroyeth theyr heresyes. And yet is there neuer an heretyque of them for all that, but where yt may serue to seme to proue hys purpose, there wyll he [Page] brynge yt forth for saynt Ia­mes owne, and fynd no faute therwyth.

And thus good crysten readers here haue I somewhat shewed you howe lytle cause the brethern haue to bost that pyece of that sermon, and say that it hath well defēded Tindales sayde chapiter, and cle­rely cōfoded meū in that part of my con [...]utacyon. And thys haue I shewed you somwhat the more at length, because yt toucheth a poynte that is ey­ther for the maynteynynge or cōfoūdyng of many great he resyes a very specyall kay.

The .viii. chapyter.

[...]or as for the preachers other pieces in y begynnyng of those wordes, I haue [Page 52] let passe vntouched / where he sayth, he hath begoten vs by the word of hys trouthe, euen as yt pleased hym▪ Marke that saynte Iames sayth euen a [...] yt pleased hym. If we were begoten and made euen as yt pleased hym / then was yt not done as yt pleased vs. And agayne yf we were begoten by hym / then coulde we gyue hym none occasyon to lo [...]e vs. For why we cam of hym & not we of vs. These wordes good readers haue no great harme in them at the fyrst face. But they al­lude vnto certayne wordes of Tyndale, wyth whych he ar­gueth agaynst me, bycause I saye in my dyaloge that man may with his fre wyl by good endeuoure of hym selfe, be a worker wyth god toward the atteynyng of fayth. Agaynste whych sayeng of myne, Tyndale (as I haue shewed in my seconde parte of Tyndales cō futaciō, [Page] in mockage of mānes endeuoure toward the bylief, & in scornyng that man shold captiue his vnderstandyng & su [...]dew his reason into the seruyce of fayth) answereth me wyth an hydyouse exclamacy on / and cryenge out vpon my fleshelynes and foly, fometh out hys hygh spyrytuall sen­tence after this fashyon.

O how betleblynde i [...]e fleshely reason [...] the wyll hath none [...]peracyon at a [...] in the workynge of fayth in my soule, no more then the chy [...]d hath in the be­getynge of his owne father. For sayth Poule yt is the gyfte of god and not of vs. My wytte mu [...]te sh [...]we me a trew couse or an apparaunte cause why, [...] my wyll haue any workynge at all.

To this pyece of Tyndales tale yt semeth, that this preacher dothe allude. And he co­uertly layeth as ye se, the reason [Page 53] that Tyndale layeth for it, of the begeter & him that is begotē. But he layeth not the authoryte of saynte Poule as Tindal doth. But he layeth y wordes of saynt Iames, why [...]he he hath here in hande, God hath wyl [...]yngly begotten vs wyth the worde of his trewth / and stycketh for this purpose vppon thys worde, wyllyngly, and argueth thus, god begate vs wyllyngly sayth here sa [...]nte Iames, that is to wyt after hys owne wyll, and as yt pleased hym / ergo he dyd not begete vs after our owne wyll nor as yt pleased vs.

This argument hath this preacher vnderpropped and enforced, wyth interpretynge of the worde wyllyngly / for that is the word of saynte Iamys. whyche worde the preacher s [...]rengtheth here wyth after hys [Page] o [...]ne wyll and as yt pleased hym self.

And yet neyther that word [...] wyllyngly of yt selfe, nor streng­thed wyth all these other, can make but a bare forme of ar­guynge yf yt were in another mater. For if I desyred a man to geue me a thyng, and labored myche to hym therfore, & myche endeuered my selfe in many thynges to please hym, to thentēt that he [...]holde geue yt me, and that he theruppon so dyd / thys were then but a pore argument to saye thus: this man wyllyngly gaue me this thynge, & after his owne wyll, and as yt pleased hym / ergo he gaue yt me not after myne owne wyll & as yt plea­sed me. For as ye se, yt bothe pleased hym to geue yt me, & [Page 54] also yt pleased me that he so sholde / or elles I wold neuer haue desyred yt, nor neuer haue labored therfore.

And thus ye se that thys authorite of saynt Iamys no thynge helpeth thys precher in hys purpose agaynst all occasyon and all endeuoure of man towarde the gettynge of fayth, by whyche we be by­goten.

But Tyndale layth that texte of saint Iamys agaynst the sacrament of baptisme, to proue that the worde of the promyse dothe all the wurke in the regēdrynge of the soule by fayth / and that the water toward the infusyō of grace, or wesshynge of the soule, is none instrument of god, nor [Page] no thynge ellys but a bar [...] graceles token / bycause saint Iamys sayth that god hath clensed vs by the worde of trouth, whych Tindale there expouneth by the word of his promyse / as though neuer a worde of god were trewe, but onely hys promyse. Now of trouth the worde of god that a precher precheth, by whych the poyntes of the faith be lerned / be sygnes & tokens that sygnyfye the thynges in the mynde, whyche are by those wordes brought vnto the he­rers [...]are, and from the eare to the hart / as the water syg­nyfyeth and betokeneth the inward washyng of the soule in that sacramēt. And as god vseth the tone tokē of y word [Page 55] to the wasshynge & clensynge of the soule thorow y meane of obedyence of the wyll, in captyuynge of hys reason & vnderstandynge in to the ser­uyse of fayth, by credence and assent geuyng vnto the word of fayth / in whyche what so euer Tyndale saye and thys prechour to, mā hauynge age and vse of reason, maye be a wyllyng wurker with god / or ellys wherto sholde any man aduise and byd another come vnto the trewe fayth: so may god vse the tother tokē of the water as an instrument also to the same purpose, by the lyke meane of obedyence on the mannys parte, in submyt tynge hym selfe to that ablu­ [...]yon, for the fulfyllynge of [Page] goddes commaūdement and ordynaunce.

How be it what I ferther answere Tindal to these wordes of saynt Iamys / who so lyste to se, let hym rede in my fyrst parte of Tyndalys confu [...]acyon in the answere vnto Tindals preface y nōber .liii. and than set this to it / and he shall se that neyther Tyndale there nor thys precher here, hath by theyr maner of expounynge these wordes of saynte Iamys, wonne thē self mych wurshyp. How be it of trouth the thynge that goth nerer to theyr purpose agaynst all the wurke of fre wyll, and all en­deuour of man towarde the attaynyng of fayth, is the au­thoryte of saynte Poule that [Page 56] Tyndale bryngeth forthe / which yet proueth it not. And the reason that he layeth by sāple of y father and y sonne / whyche reason thys precher though somewhat fayntely syth he seeth it wyll not serue, yet somwhat repeteth here by these wordes, where he sayth, ‘And agayne yf we were begoten [...]y hym, then coulde not we geue hym none occa­syon to loue vs / for why we came of hym and not we of vs’ ▪ by these wordes he meaneth the thynge that Tyndale alledgeth where he sayth, ‘The wyll hath none operacyon at al in the working of fayth in my soule, no more then the chylde hath in the begetynge of his father.’And of trouth Tyndale & hys precher sayde somwhat, yf in the spyrituall generacyon the man that ys regendred, were euer more as [Page] farre from all wurke of wyll at suche tyme as god goth a­bout to bygete hym by fayth, as is the chylde at such tyme as hys graundefather goeth about by nature to byget his father.

But now on the tother syde, yf in the generacyō at the be­ge [...]yng of hys father, y sonne be not yet so mych as a chyld, nor hath no wyl at all / and at the tyme of the spyrytuall re­generacyon of hym selfe, he that is regendred happe to be more than a chylde, and haue the fredome of his own wyll, and hath the choyce therby put in hys owne hande, why­ther he wyll at goddys cal­lyng to fayth by redyng, pre­chynge, myracle, and suche [Page 57] other occasyons, wyth good inwarde mocyons added also therto, folow the spyryte, and walke and wurke wyth god by captyuynge of hys owne vnderstādyng & subdewynge of hys owne reason, into the assent and bylyef of the thyn­ges that he shall be moued vnto, and by callynge vppon the contynuaunce of goddes gracyouse helpe therunto, & therby come into the seruyce of fayth / or whyther he wyll ellys reiecte goddes good & gracyouse mocyon and resyst it, and so fle from the gettyng of the gyfte of fayth: yf the man I saye be at the tyme of hys spyrytuall bygetynge in thys case, as euery man that hath at the tyme age and vse [Page] of reason is / thā is thys sam­ple that Tyndale doth there put, & that this preacher doth here repete, of the chylde at the carnal byrth of his father, mych lesse lyke the man at the spyrytuall byrth of hym selfe, then is an apple lyke vnto an oyster.

Howe be yt good readers, bycause the bretherne blame my bokes for the length / I wyll make no lenger argumēt of this mater here / for in these few wordes yt appereth metely well.

But yf any mā thynke hym selfe with this not yet fully satysfyed, then hath he nede for his contentacyon to se the mater handled somwhat more at length. And who so therfore [Page 58] lysteth so to do, let him rede in my fourth boke of Tyndales cōfutacion, which is in y fyrst boke of the second part, in the chapiter of y maner and order of our eleccyon begynnynge. If he lyst in y lefe that is marked wyth the nomber of .c.xii. and then wyll his owne reason serue hym to se how farre the mather goth: whych yf he rede out, I dare boldely pro­myse that he shall there fynde suche thynges, as agaynste Tyndale and thys preacher both, shall as for this poynte in all reason be suffycyent to satysfye hym.

But now yf thys preacher wyll peraduenture saye, that of his word [...] in both these maters I haue mysse rehersed [Page] hym / I am redy to brynge forth my copye and the man of whome I hadde yt to. Or elles I shal make him a mych fayrer offer / bycause he maye peraduenture say that he ne­uer wrote that sermon hym selfe, but that some of his audyence whyche of deuocyon wrote as myche as they bare away vppon the heryng, dyd wryte yt dimynute and māg­l [...] for lacke of good remem­b [...]unce / let hym vppon thys answere of myne sene (yf yt [...]ppen to come into his han­ [...]es) wryte his owne wordes hym selfe / not onely as well as he thē sodaynly spake thē, but as well also as he cā with longe laysoure make theym. And when he hath done in thē [Page 59] the beste that euer he can, and take whose helpe he wyll to / if he make it so as he may therwyth auoyde and refell my cōfutyng of Tyndale in those two poyntes that those wor­des of his sernon touche, then dare I be boūden to forswere this lande, and lyue in Ant­warpe and be Tyndals man.

How be it yf in the mater of mānys endeuoure toward the attaynynge of fayth, by walkynge on wyth god wyl­lingly after that god hath preuented hym wyth hys grace, by callynge on hym and gy­uynge hym occasyon to come forward / yf any brother thin­ke to scape and auoyde my profe in the place afore remē ­bred, by the dystynccyon that [Page] Tyndale hath lerned of Phi­lyppe Swar [...]the, and bryngeth forth agaynste me of hy­storycall fayth and felynge fayth (whyche dystynccyō dy­uerse of the bretherne and sy­sterne haue in theyr mouthes now, and therwyth sodaynly caste a myste before vnlerned mēnys eyen, and make them adased for y tyme that neuer harde of it before) he y wolde wynde awaye wyth thys dy­styncyon, shall nothynge a­uoyde my confutynge of Tindale in that place. For yf hys dystynccyon be trewe / yet vp­pon goddes gracyouse preuē cyon and fyrst callyng vpon, I saye and there proue that the wyllynge endeuoure of man in folowynge, helpeth to [Page 60] the attaynynge of euery ma­ner kynde of fayth / and procu [...]eth the progresse & encreace of grace to the perfytynge of that vertue in man and wyth man, whyche god fyrst began in man by goddes owne pre­uencyon without man / but in them that haue age and dys­crecyon, vseth not to fynysshe and fulfyll it wythout man / but whā man refuseth (except he mende and turne) els god leueth fynally hys own good bygone wurke vnfynysshed. And therfore sayth saynt Au­stayn to euery man that hath vse of reason: He that hath created the wythout the, doth not iustyfye the wythout the.

And yet for [...]erther conclu­syon, bycause I here say that [Page] the same dystinccyon of hystorycall fayth and felyng fayth, glytereth nowe so gayly in the bretherns eyen / lette them rede my confutacyō thorow. Or bycause they call that to longe, lette them rede but the seuenth boke, whyche is en­tytled the defence of the secūd reason agaynst Tyndale. Or yf they thynke y boke alone to longe, let them leue a grete parte of the boke, and begyn in that lefe and that syde of the lefe that is marked wyth the nomber of .cccxl. And then yf they can for hart burnyng abyde and endure to rede it vp to the ende / I dare be bold to warraunt, that they shall fynde the same gaye golden dystynccyon of hystorycall [Page 61] fayth & felynge fayth, foūden f [...]st by Phylyp Swarterthe whych lyke as frere Huskyn [...]th na [...]en hym selfe [...]co­lampa [...]ius, hath made hys name n [...]w Melācthon) This [...] I saye so made by Melancthon, shall they se so brou [...]t in there by Tyn­dale and so se [...] forth and fur­n [...]he [...] by the lernynge and labour of them bothe, that it cometh to suche passe in con­clusyon, that no parte of all Tynda [...]s tale is brought to more shamefull confusyon.

But nowe the bretherne wyll (when any good catho­lyque man prouoketh theym to rede the place in my boke) answere as dyue [...]se of theym haue done ere [...]is to suche[Page] good catholyque folke as prouoked them therto & offered to rede yt with them, and ther uppon to trye betwene theym whyther Tyndale or I hadde better reason on oure parte: the bretherne haue vpon this offer shronken at last therfro, after great crakes made of Tyndales parte, wyth great contempte of myne answere byfore / and haue answered y they wyll not myssespende theyr tyme in redyng of myne answer, they se Tīdales tale so sure.

Now of trouth this had ben a good answere and a reaso­nable, yf when they were fast in the trew catholyque fayth, they wolde thus haue answered any such as wold haue aduysed [Page 62] theym to rede in Tyndale, and serche whether the fayth of all the holy sayntes & of all the whole corps of crys­tendome thys .xv. hundred yere to gether, were trewe or false. For that were a thynge wherof yt were a very fransey to doute.

But now they that are fled from the fayth of all them, of whose fayth there was no cause to doute / and are fallen to the faith of a few faythless [...] folke, false apostatas wylde wedded monkes and freres and theyr fonde dyscyples: if they make theym selfe so sure of theyr deuylyshe doctryne, that they refuse to rede the thynges that are wryten for the confutacyon of theyr er­rours / [Page] euery good catholyke man that so seeth thē do▪ may w [...]th good reason tell theym y they do not cleue to these folyshe heretykes for any th [...]ng that they thynke them to saye [...]outh, but bycause they wold fayne yt were trouth whyther yt be or no / and that they shew they [...] frowar [...]nes therin very playnely, whyle theyr hertes abhorre and can not abyde to rede any boke, by which theyr o [...]n conscy [...]nce geueth them y they shal fynd theyr opiniōs playnely proued false, & theyr ar [...]h [...]eretykes playnely pro­ued folys. For yf they hoped the contrarye, they wolde (I warra [...]nt you) be them selfe th [...] fyrste that wold call other therto.

[Page 63]And thus myche for thys [...]me suffyseth for this poynt.

The .ix. chapyter.

NOw come I to theym that say I hādle Tyn­dale and Fryth and Barons vngoodly and wyth vncome­ly wordes, callynge them by the name of heretykes and folys / and so vse them in wor­des▪ as though the men had neyther wytte nor lernynge / where as it can not be denyed (they say) but y they be suche as euery man knoweth well haue both.

As for wytte and lernyng I no where saye that any of them haue none / nor I meane no ferther but for the maters of theyr heresyes. And in the [Page] treatynge of those / they she [...] so lytle wy [...] or lernyng eyther that the more they haue, the mo [...] appereth the feblenesse of theyr pa [...]e and the falshed of theyr heresies, yf they haue any great wytte or any great lernyng in dede, and than for all that, in the defendynge of those maters with such folish handelynge so shamefully cō founde them selfe.

How be it of very trouth, god vppon such folke as ha­uynge wyt and lernynge fall wylfully from fayth to false heresye, sheweth hys wrath & indygnaciō with a more ven­geaunce in some parte, than (as some doctours saye) he doth vppon the deuyll hym selfe.

[Page 64]For (as dyuerse doctours holde opinyon) the fendes be fallē from grace, and therfore haue lost theyr glory / yet god hath suffered theym to kepe theyr gyftes of nature styl, as wy [...]te, bewty, strength, agy­lyte, and such other lyke.

And father Alphonse the Spaynish frere told me, that the deuyls be no suche defor­med euyll fauoured creaturs as men imagyne theym / but they be in mynde proude, en­uyouse, & cruell. And he bode me that yf I wolde se a very ryghte image of a tende / I sholde no more but euyn loke vppon a very fayre woman that hath a very shrewed fell cursed mynde. And whan I shewed hym that I neuer saw [Page] none such, nor wist not where I myghte any such fynde / he sayd he coulde fynde foure or fyue / but I canne not by leue hym. Nor veryly no more can I byleue that the fendes be lyke fayre shrewd women yf there were any such. Nor as the world is, it were not good that yonge men sholde wene so. For they be so full of co­rage, that were the fendes ne­uer so cursed, yf they thought them lyke fayre women, they wold neuer fere to aduenture vpon them onys. Nor to saye the treuth no more can I by­leue neyther, that the dāpned spyrytes haue all theyr natu­rall gyftes as whole and as perfayte as they had byfore theyr fall.

[Page 65]But surely yf they haue / thā (as I sayed before) god hath on Tindale, Barns, & Fryth, & those other heretykes, more shewed hys vengeaunce in some parte, then he dyd vpon the de [...]yll. For in good fayth god hath as it semeth fro these folke taken awaye the be [...]te parte of theyr wyttes.

For lyke wyse as they that wolde haue byelded vppe the toure of Babylō for them self agaynste god, hadde suche a stoppe throwen vppon them, that sodaynely none vnder­stode what another sayed / su­rely so god vppon these here­tykes of our tyme that go be­syly aboute to hepe vp to the skye theyr foull fylthy dung­hyll of all olde and newe false [Page] [...] [Page 65] [...] [Page] stynckyng heresies, gathered vp togyther agaynst the trew catholyke fayth of Cryst, that hym selfe hath euer hytherto taught hys trewe catholyke chyrch: god I say, which whā the apostles wente aboute to preche the trewe fayth, se [...]te downe hys owne holy spyryt of vnyte, concorde, and treuth vnto them, wyth the gyfte of speche and vnderstandynge, so that they vnderstode euery man & euery man vnderstode them / hath rered vp and sent amonge these heretykes the spyryte of errour and lyenge, of dyscorde and of dyuysyon, the dampned deuyll of hell, whyche so entangleth theyre tunges and so dystempereth theyr▪ braynes, that they ney­ther [Page 66] vnderstande well one of them another, nor any of thē well hym selfe.

And this that I here saye, who so lyst to rede my bokes, shall fynde yt so trewe and so playnely proued in many places, that he shall well se & say that this is the thyng whych in my wrytynge greueth this blessed bretherhed a litle more then the length.

And therefore where they fynde the [...]aute that I handle these folke so foule / how could I other do? For whyle I I declare and shewe theyre wrytyng to be suche (as I ne­des muste, or leue the moste necessary poyntes of all the mater vntouehed) yt were very hard for me to handle yt in [Page] suche wyse, as when I playnly proue them abominable he re [...]ykes and agaynst god and his sacramentes and sayntes very blasphemouse folis, they sholde wene that I speke thē fayre.

But then they saye that the pacyfyer whyche wryteth of the deuysyon bytwene the spyrytualty the temporalty, cal­leth no man by no suche na­mes / but speke he neuer so euyll of any, he can yet vse his wordes in fayre maner, and speke to eche man gentylly.

I can not say nay but y is very trouth. How be yt euery man hath not lyke wytte nor lyke inuencyon in wrytynge. For he fyndeth many proper wayes of vtterynge euyll mater [Page 67] in good wordes, whyche I neuer thought vppon, but am a simple playn body mych lyke the Macedonyes, for whome Plutarche wryteth y kynge Philyppe theyr mays­ter made a reasonable excuse.

For whē they were in y warre some of theyr enmyes fled fro theyre owne kynge and came in to kynge Philyppes ser­uyce agaynste theyr owne coū trey. wyth whome when the Macedonyes fell some tyme at wordes, as it oftē happeth among souldyours / the Macedonyes in spyght wold call them traytours. wheruppon they complayned to kynge Philyppe, and made the ma­ter [...]ore and greuouse / that where as they had not onely [Page] left theyr owne natyue coun­trey, but dyd also fyghte a­gaynst yt and helpe to destroy yt, for the loue & seruyce that they bare towarde hym / hys owne people letted not in an­gre and in despyghte to call them false traytours. wheruppon kynge Phylyp answered them. Good felowes I pray you be not angry wyth my peple, but haue pacyence. I am sory that theyre maner ys no better. But I wysse ye know them well ynough / theyr na­ture is so playne, and theyr vtteraūce so rude, that they can not call an horse but an horse they. And in good fayth, lyke those good folke am I. For though Tyndale and Fryth in theyr wrytynge, call me a [Page 68] po [...]te / yt is but of theyr owne courtesye, vndeserued on my parte. For I can neyther so myche poetry nor so myche rethoryque neyther, as to fynde good names for [...]uyll thyn­ges / but euyn as the Macedonyes could not call a tray [...]our but a traytoure, so can I not cal a fole but a fole, nor an he­retyque but an heretyque.

Some of y bretherne sayd, that I sholde at the lest wyse call frere Ba [...]ns by the name of doctour, bycause he was authorysed and made a doc­tour of dyuynyte by the vnyuersyte. But one answered for me to y, & sayd that name was geuē, to serue for y tyme in which he was mete to tech / and not nowe when he is not [Page] mete to teache, but is by the chyrche for false teachyng for boden to teache. But then vn­to that one of them answered agayne and asked, why shold I then call hym frere styll▪ whyle he is nowe no lenger a frere no more then a doctour.

But vnto this I coulde betwene theym tell some reason of dyfference. How be yt ra­ [...]her then to make this boke ouer longe, by holdyng a probleme vppon euery tryfle / I shalbe content like as in stede of doctour men call hym heretyke, so in stede of frere to call hym the tother name that euery man calleth all those that be runne out of relygyō. [...]o there haue I fallen on a fayre fygure vnware, that ys [Page 69] I trowe called periphrasys, to voyde the fowle name of apostata.

But nowe these good bre­therne that fynde the faute wyth me, that I speke no fayrer vnto these holy prophetes of theyrs / be so egall and in­dyfferent, that in theym they fynde no faute at all for theyr abominable raylyng agaynst so many other honest honorable good and vertuouse folke, nor for condēpnynge for damned heretyques the whole ca­tholyque chyrch of all crysten people except heretykes, both spyrytuall and temporall, se­culare and relygyouse to.

But then y good brethern excuse them and say, that they wryte agaynst none but onely [Page] theym that are noughte, and write but against theyr v [...]ces.

But this wyl euyll defend them, when Barons wryteth against y whole clergy, & Tindale saith expressely y of them all there is neuer one good.

And also they wryte not so mych agaynst pompe & pryde and glotony, as agaynst wat­chynge and prayeng, fastyng and wylfull pouerty / and all these thynges in good religy­ouse people the heretyques abhorre, and call yt but ypo­crysye.

Then rayle they not so sore in wordes agaynste the lay [...] people / but as fayre as they flater theym to make theym enmyes to the clergy, yet they damne them all to the deuyll, [Page 70] both them selues and theyr fathers, & theyr graundfathers, and theyr graūd fathers great graundfathers to. For they say that thys .viii. hundred yere all the corps of crysten­dome hath ben led oute of the ryght waye fro god, and haue lyued al in idolatry, and dyed in seruyce of y deuyll / because they haue done honour to Cristes crosse, and prayed [...]to sayntes, and reuerenced theyr relyques, and honored theyr ymages, and ben baptysed in latyne, and taken matrymo­ny for a sacrament, and vsed confessyon, and done penaūce for synnys, and prayed for all crysten soules, and ben aney­led in theyr deth bedde, & haue taken theyre housell after the [Page] ryte and vsage of the chyrche, and haue set more by y masse then they sholde do, and byle­ued that it was a sacryfyce, an hoste, and an oblacyon, & that yt sholde do theym good, and haue byleued that there was neither brede nor wyne in the blessed sacrament of the aul­ter, but in stede of brede and wyne y very bodye and blood of Cryste. All these thynges say Tyndale and Barns both be very false [...]ylyefe and gret damnable synne in y doyng / and so dampne they to the de­uyll the whole catholyq [...]e chyrche bothe temporall and spyritual & (excepte heretikes) leue not one man for goddes parte this .viii. hundred yere paste by theyr owne lymytacy [Page 71] on / and of trouth yf theyr fals heresyes were trew, not in the tother .vii. hundred byfore y neyther.

Now whan that agaynste all the whole catholyke chyr­che, bothe that now is, & that euer before hath ben from the apostles dayes hytherto, both temporall and spyrytuall, ley men and relygyouse, and a­gaynst all that good is, sayn­tes, ceremonyes, seruyce of god, the very sacramentes & all, and most agaynst the best that is to wytte the precyouse body and bloud of our sauy­our hym selfe in the holy sa­crament of the aulter, these blasphemouse heretykes in theyr vngracyouse bokes so vilanously ieste and rayle: [Page] were not a mā wene you very farre ouersene and wurthy to be compted vncourtayse, that wolde in wrytynge agaynste theyr heresyes, presume wythout great reuerēce to reherse theyr wurshypfull namys.

If any of theym vse theyr wordes at theyr pleasure, as euyll and as vyllanouse as they ly [...]te agaynste my selfe / I am content to forbere any requy [...]ynge therof, and geue them no wors wordes agayn then yf they speke me fayre / nor [...]nge them selfe toward all other folke as they do, fairer wordes wyl I not geue theym then yf they spake me [...]owle. For all shall be one to me, or rather the wurse the better. For the pleasaunt oyle [Page 72] of heretykes caste vpon myne hede, canne do my mynde no pleasure / but contrary wyse the wurse y suche folke wryte of me, for hatered y they bere to the catholyke chyrche and fayth / y greater pleasure (as for myne owne parte) they do me. But surely theyr raylyng agaynst all other, I purpose not to bere so pacyentely, as to forbere to lette theym here some parte of lyke language as they speke. How be it vt­terly to matche them therin, I neyther cā though I wold, nor wyll neyther though I coulde / but am content (as I nedes muste) to geue theym therin the maystry, wherin to matche theym were more re­buke then honestye.

[Page]Now yf they excuse them selfe, and say they speke euyll but of euyll thynges (for so call they good wurkes of pe­naunce, and so call they the ceremonies and sacramentes of Crystes chyrch) I answere them playnely that they lye / wherin euery trewe chrysten man wyll testyfye that I say treuth / for those thynges be good and holy whyche they rebuke and call nought. And I saye ferther also, that by y excuse of theyrs, they make myne excuse to, in the thynge wherwyth they be wurst con­tent / that is to witte, where [...] sumewhat sharpely rebuke wedding of frerys & nonnys / whyche thynge is as all the worlde woteth, bestely and [Page 73] abomynable in dede.

And also yf they wyll excuse them selfe, and saye that as [...]owchynge men, they rayle agaynste none but suche as be [...]ewde and nought: to this I answere fy [...]ste that in thys thyng they lye. For they rayle agaynste all. And some they call noughte by name, whose specyall goodnes shall haue reco [...]de and wytnesse of all good folke that know them. Secundly I say ferther▪ that by thys excuse of theyrs / they must nedes excuse me to, whā I rebuke them selfe. For they be wel [...] and openly knowen & cōuycted for heretykes, whi­che is ye wore well the wo [...]st [...]ryme that can be / & that for [...]eretykes of suche a maner [Page] sorte, as is the wurste kynde of that cryme that euer came out of chrystendome.

How be it I am yet contēt for all thys, to fall at some reasonable composycyō with them. Let vs take thys waye bytwene vs from hense forth yf they lyst. Lyke as I do not allow but abhorre inconty­nence in sacred professed per­sons y haue vowed chastyte / so let them confesse that them selfe abhorre also the bestely bycherly mariages of mōkes freres and nonnes, and of all suche as haue vnto god pro­mysed & vowed the contrary. And than syth all our mater is onely of the fayth / let them forbere in stede of reasonyng to fall to raylynge vppon [Page 74] other mennys lyuynge. For therby fleynge fro the mater of fayth / they furnysshe oute theyr processe w [...]th lyenge, wh [...]le the fawtes of some, they lewdely laye to all.

If they wyll not (whyche were the beste) reuoke theyre false heresyes / nor wyll not (whyche were the next) be he­retykes alone them selfe, and holde theyr tunges & be styll, but wyll nedes be babelynge and corrupte whom they can: lette them yet at the lest wyse be reasonable heretykes and honeste, and wryte reason & leue raylynge / and than lette the bretherne fynde the fawte wyth me, yf I vse theym not after that in wordes, as fayre and as mylde as the mater [Page] maye suffre and bere.

But thys waye wyll they neuer take I wene. For t [...]an they se well that theyr dysc [...] ­ples wyll neuer haue half the luste to loke vpō they: bokes wherin they shold than fynde but a poore feste and an euyll dressed d [...]er. For in theyre onely raylynge standeth all theyr reuell, wyth onely ray­l [...]nge is all theyr roste me [...]e bas [...]ed, and all ther pot seaso­ [...]ed, and all theyr pye me [...]e sp [...]ed, & all theyr maūche [...]es, [...] all [...]heyr wafers, and all [...] ypocrace made.

The .x. chapyter.

NOw passing ouer this poynt / I come to this [...] good brothern say, [Page 75] that they lyste not to rede my bokes / for I am suspecte in these maters, and parcyall [...]o warde the spyrytualty.

As for suspecte / yf I be now suspecte the world wax­eth all of a new kynde. For men were wont to call those folke suspecte, y were suspect of heresy. And thys is now a new kind of suspect [...], if mē be now suspected of y catholyke fayth. How be it ī that suspy­cyon am I glad to be fallen, & purpose neuer to purge it.

Now as towchynge par­cyalyte vpō my parte toward the spyry [...]ualtye / I meruayle wherof they gather it. My self am perde a tēporall man / and by twyse weddynge am come in the case that I can [Page] neuer be preste. And for as all y landes & fees that I haue in all England, bysyde suche landes and fees as I haue of the gyfte of the kynges most noble grace is not at this day nor shalbe whyle my mother in lawe lyueth (whose lyfe & good helth I praye god long kepe and continue) wurth ye­rely to my lyuyng the somme of full fyfty poūde. And ther­of haue I some by my wyfe, & some by my father (whose soule our lorde assoyle) and some haue I also purchaced my selfe / and some fees haue I of some tēporall men. And then maye euery man well gesse, y I haue no very great parte of my lyuynge by the clergy, to make me very par­cyall [Page 76] to them.

And ouer that this shall I trewly saye, that of all the ye­rely lyuynge that I haue of the kynges gracyouse gyfte / I haue not one grote by the menes of any spyritual man / but far aboue my deseruynge haue hadde yt, onely by hys owne syngulare bountye and goodnes, and specyal fauour towarde me.

And veryly of any such yerely fees as I haue to my lyuīg at this of any other / I haue not had one grote graunted me syth I fyrst wrote, or went a­bout to write my dialoge / and that was ye wote wel the fyrst worke that I wrote in these maters.

But then say the brethern as [Page] theyr holy father writeth, and telleth also dyuerse whom he talketh wyth, that I haue ta­ken great rewardes in redy money of dyuers of theclergy for makynge of my bokes.

In good fayth I wyll not saye nay, but that some good and honorable men of theym, wolde in rewarde of my good wy [...]l and my labour agaynste these heretyques, haue geuen me myche more then euer I dyd, or could deserue. But I dare take god and theym al­so to recorde, that all they coulde neuer feffe me wyth one peny thereof / but (as I playnly tolde them) I wolde rather haue caste theyre mo­ney into the Temys. thenne take yt. For al be it they were [Page 77] as in dede there were, bothe good men and honorable / yet loke I for my thanke of god that is theyr better, and for whose sake I take the labour and not for theyrs.

And yf any of the brethern byleuyng theyr holy fathers, thynke as some of them saye, that I haue more auauntage or these maters then I make for / and that I sette not so lytle by money as to refuse yt when yt were offered: I wyll not myche dispute wyth them lenger vppon the mater. But let theym byleue as they lyst / yet this wyll I be bold to say for my selfe, all though they shold call me pharysye for the boste and pelagiane for my labour to, that how bad so euer [Page] they reken me, I am not yet fully so vertulesse, but that of myne owne naturall dysposycyon wythout any specyall peculyare helpe of grace therto, I am [...]othe ouer prowde and ouer slouthfull also, to be hy­red for money to take half the labour and besynesse in wry­tynge, that I haue taken in thys gere synnys I began.

And therfore cause of par­cyal fauour to the prestes persons haue I none, more then hath euery good crysten man and woman / whych is of dewty bounden to geue honour & reuerence vnto that holy sa­crament of order, wyth why­che the clergye is specyally cō secrate & dedycate vnto god.

But where as the brethern [Page 78] say that I am not indyfferent in the mater / therin do they the thynge that they seldome do that is to wit say y trewth. For yf they call the mater ey­ther the vyce or vertue of the persones, whyche I take not for y mater: yet therin am I not indifferēt in dede bytwene a temporall man and a spyrytuall. For as for vyce, I hold yt myche more dampnable in a spyrytuall person then in a temporall man. And as for vertue / egall vertue I holde yt yet myche more yf yt hap­pen in the temporall man thē in the spyrytuall / bycause though the thynge be egall, they be not both egally bound therto. And therfore yf they take this for y mater / in this [Page] wyse I am not indyfferent.

Nowe yf they take for the mater the thynge that I take for the mater, that is to wytte y trew fayth & false heresyes / then▪ am I mych lesse indyfferent. For god kepe me from beynge indyfferent betwene those two sortes. For euery good man is boūden betrwene trewth and falshed, the catholyque chyrche and heretykes, betwene god and the deuyll, to be parcyall / and playnely to declare hym selfe to be full and whole vpon the tone syde and clere agaynste the tother.

But ellys as for any par­cyal fauour that I bere to the clergye, wherby do these bre­thern proue yt? I neuer sayde that they were all fauteles, [Page 79] nor I neuer excused theyre fautes. And yf euer I dyd / let the [...] reherse of my wry­tynge some one place at the leste, let them tell where I cō mende pompe & pryde, where I prayse auaryce, where le­chery, or suche other thynge.

Those that be spyrytuall persones by professyon, and are therwyth carnall and wreched in theyr condicyon, haue neuer ben fauoured by me.

when I was fyrste of the kynges counsayle, and after his vnder treasorer, and in y tyme whyle I was chaūceller of his duchye, of Lancaster, & when I was his chaūcellour of this realme / yt was metely well knowen what maner of fauoure I bare towarde the [Page] clergy / and that as I loued & honored the good, so was not remysse nor slacke in prouy­dynge for the correccyon of those that were nought, noy­ouse to good peple, and slaunderouse to theyr owne order. whyche sorte of prestes and religyouse runnynge oute of relygyon and fallynge to thefte and murder, had at my hand so litle fauour, that there was no man that any medling had wyth theym, into whose han­des they were more lo [...]he to come.

And in this poynt found I theyr ordinaryes so well mynded to theyr amendemēt & correccyon / y they gaue me gret thankes therfore.

And I foūde those prestes [Page 80] rather content to remayne in the kynges prysōs a mon [...]th, then in the bishoppes a weke / sauynge for hope of delyue­raunce by the comen course of theyr purgacyon.

And yet as farre as my pore wyt could geue me, sauynge that the daunger of escapes is to the ordinary so chargea­ble, that y fere therof maketh theym fayne of theyre delyue­raunce / elles were they lykely to be waxen better ere they gate thense, or elles to tarye there as longe as euer they lyued.

But I perceyue well that these good brethern loke that I sholde rebuke the clergy, & seke out theyr fawtes, & laye them to theyr facys, & wryte [Page] some wurke to theyr shame / or ellys they can not call me but parcyall to the prestes.

How be it by this reason they maye call me parcyall to the lay men to. For I neuer vsed that waye neyther towarde the tone nor y tother. I fynde not yet suche plenty and store of vertue in my selfe, as to thynke it a metely parte and conuenyent for me to play, to rebuke as abomynable vycy­ouse folke, any one honest cō ­panye eyther spyrytuall or temporall / & mych lesse mete to rebuke & reproche eyther the whole spyrytualtye or tē ­poraltye, bycause of suche as are very starke noughte in bothe.

I dare be bolde to say tha [...] [Page 81] prowde folke be nought, that couetouse folke be nought, y lecherouse folke be noughte / and to speke agaynste open knowen theuys, open knowē murderers, open knowen per [...]ured persons, open knowen apostatase, open knowen professed or cōuycted heretykes. But surely my guise is not to lay the fawtes of y noughty, to the charge of any whole cō pany / and rayle vppon mer­chauntes and call them vsu­rers / nor to rayle vpon fran­cēs & call thē false iurrours / nor to rayle vpon shyryffes & call them rauenours / nor to rayle vppon eschetours & call them extorcioners / nor vpon all officers and call them [...]ry­bours / nor vpon gentyl [...]men [Page] and call theym oppressours / nor so forth vp hygher, to call euery degre by suche odyouse names as men myghte fynde some of that sorte.

And of all degrees specy­ally for my part, I haue euer accompted my dewty to for­bere all such maner of vnma­nerly byhauour toward those two moste emynent orders, that god hath here ordayned in erth / the two great orders I mene of speciall consecrate personys, the sacred prynces and prestes. Agaynste any of whyche two reuerent orders, who so be so lewde vnreue­rentely to speke, & malapertly to ieste and rayle, shall playe that parte alone for me. And rather wyll I that these bre­therne [Page 82] call me parcyall, than for suche yll fasshyon indyf­ferent.

And ouer thys I can not se what nede there were that I shold rayle vpō the clergy, & reken vp all theyr fawtes.

For that parte hath Tyndall played, and frere Barns both al [...]redy / & lefte no thynge for me to saye therin, not though my minde were sore set therō.

They haue wyth treuth & lyes togyther, layed y lyuing of badde, to badde and good bothe, in suche a vyle vy [...]a­nouse fasshyon, that it wolde make a good stomake to vo­myte to here they [...]e rybaul­douse raylynge. And yet not agaynste the sacred persons onely, but agaynst the blessed [Page] sacramentes also.

And now wolde theyr dys­cyples that I shold not speke agaynste theyr execrable he­resyes, and theyr dispyghtful dealynge / but yf I sholde by the waye do as they do, and helpe them forth in the same.

And▪ herein fare they mych lyke, as yf there were a sorte of vilayne wreched heretikes that metynge the prestes and [...] relygyouse and other [...] wyth baners, copys, crosses, and sencers, and the [...] borne about with [...] vppon a corpus chrysty daye, wo [...]d pyke quareilys to them, and fyrste call them all that coulde come in theyr vyllayne mouthes, and happely saye trewe by some / and than [Page 83] [...]ache them all by the heddys, and throw them in the myre, surplyces, copys▪ sensers, crosses, relyques, sacrament and all. And than yf any man re­buked theyr vilanouse dea­lynge, and wolde steppe vnto the prestes, and puile theym vppe and helpe to wype the copys, and reuerētly take vp the crosses, the relykes, and the blessed sacrament: were it not now well and wysely spoken yf one wold▪ reproue hym that thus dyd, & saye he shold not medle hym self in the ma­ter hote nor co [...]lde, but yf he wold be indyfferēt & do some what on bothe the sydes / and therfore he shold to shew hym selfe indy [...]erēt, eyther reuyle and rebuke the prestes, or at [Page] the leste wyse some of them / & sowse theym somwhat in the myre for the pleasure of them that so serued them / or ellys go by aboute hys other busy­nes, and let the mater alone / and neyther take vppe good man out of the myre, nor sur­plyce, cope, nor sencer, nor re­l [...]ke / but lette them lay the sa­crament in the dyrt agayne. were not thys a goodly way? Surely for my parte I am not so ambycyouse of suche folkes prayse, as to be called indyfferent, wyll in wrytyng agaynst theyr heresyes helpe them forth in theyr raylynge.

The .xi. chapyter.

BUt nowe where as the bretherne lay a blame [Page 84] in me, that I hadde not vsed suche a goodly mylde maner, and suche an indyfferent fas­shyon, as they fynde vsed by him that made the boke of the dyuysyon betwene the spyry­tualty and the temporalty: I am not greatly blame worthy therin. For his boke was put out synnes / & therfore coulde I when I wrote take none ensample therof / & euery man is not lyke inuētyue of his own wyt. For surely he hath foun­den some certayne proper in­uented fygures in that boke, in whych I am so farre from fyndynge the lyke of my self, that beynge as they nowe be founden to myne hande all redy, harde were it for me in the lyke mater to folow them.

[Page]And yet though my bokes be very farre vnder his / they may be for all that (ye wote well) metely good, yf hys be so farre excellent as the bre­thern boste yt. In which boke yet as mych as they boste yt / he declareth and expressely testyfyeth lyke a trewe crysten man, how so euer the maters go betwene the temporaltye and the spyrytualty, that yet theyr opynyons are heresyes.

But they take as it semeth all those wordes of his wel in worth, bycause they reken thē selfe recompensed in a nother parte, in that they falsely per­suade vnto them selfe, eyther that he dyssymuleth for the whyle and byleueth as they do / or elles that byleue he ne­uer [Page 85] so well him self, yet eyther of pytye or some other affeccyon, he could be cōtent to helpe, that they sholde theym selfe with theyr euyll bylyefe be let alone and lyue in reste, and be sufferd to byleue as they lyste.

But I trust in god that in that poynte they lene to mych to the letter of his wordes, & of theyr owne fauour to them selfe, mysse constre the good mannys mynde. For god for­bede that any crystē mā shold meane so.

Howe be yt as touchynge y mater wherwyth we be now in hande, that is to wytte the maner of mylde and indyffe­rent writyng by me or by him concernynge the spyrytualty and the tēporalty / therin am [Page] I very sure that his myld in­dyfferent boke of the dyuysyon, neyther is more myld nor more indyfferēt then any boke of myne.

For fyrst as for myne own parte, loke my dyaloge, my supplycacyon of soules, and both the partes of the confutacyon / and ye shall clerely se y I neyther haue vsed towarde the clergy nor toward the temporalty, any warme dysplea­saunt word / but haue forborn to touch in specyall eyther the fautes of the tone or of the to­ther. But yet haue I cōfessed the thyng y trouth is / neither part to be fautlesse. But then whyche is the thynge that of­fēdeth these blessed bretherne / I haue not letted forthermore [Page 86] to say the thynge whyche I take also for very trewe / that as thys realme of englande hath had hytherto god be thā ked as good and as laudable a temporalty, nōber for nom­ber, as hath hadde any other crysten region of the quātyte / so hath it had also nomber for nomber compared wyth any realme cristened of no gretter quantyte, as good and as cō mendable a clergye / though there haue neuer lacked in a­ny of both the partes, plentye of suche as haue alwaye be noughte / whose fautes haue euer ben theyr owne, and not to be imputed to the whole body neyther of spyrytualty nor tēporalty / sauyng that there haue ben peraduenture on eyther [Page] parte, in some suche as by theyr offices ought to loke therto, some lacke of the la­bour and dylygēce that in the reformynge of yt sholde haue belonged vnto them, whyche I declare alway that I wold wyshe amended, & euery man specyally labour to mēde him selfe / and rather accustome hym selfe to loke vppon hys owne fautes then vpon other mennes / and agaynste suche as are in eyther sorte foun­den [...]pen, euyll, and nought, and noyouse vnto the comenwell, as theuys, murderers, and heretyques, & such other wreches / the whole corps of the spyrytualty and temporaltye bothe, eche wyth other lo­uyngly to accorde and agre / [Page 87] and accordynge to the good auncyent lawes and commendable vsages long contynued in this noble realme, eyther parte endeuour them selfe dylygently to represse and kepe vnder those euyll and vngracyous folke, that lyke sores, scabbes, and cankers, trouble and vexe the body / and of all them to cure suche as may be cured, & for helth of the whole body, cutte and caste of the incurable cancred partes there fro / obserued in the doynge euermore such order and fas­shyon as may stand and agre wyth reason and iustyce, the kynges lawes of the realme, the scrypture of god, and the lawes of Crystes chyrch / euer kepyng loue and concord be­twene [Page] the two pryncypall partes the spyritualty and temporalty, lest the dregges of both sortes conspyryng to gether & encreasyng, may litle and litle grow to strong for both / wherto they myghte haue a fayre gappe and a brode gate to entre, yf they myghte fynde the meane by crafte to seuer and sette a sunder the temporalty against y clergy to stryue, and so let as yt were the soule and the body brable and stryue to gether / and whyle they study nothyng elles but the tone to greue the tother, the noughty then conspyre and agre to ge­ther, and set vppon the good people of both.

Thys hath bene hytherto the whole somme of my wry­tynge, [Page 88] wythout any dysplea­saunt worde vsed eyther to­warde temporaltye or spyry­tualtye. And more mylde ma­ner then this toward al good folke, hath not thys other boke of dyuysyon, nor yet a more indyfferent as farre as I can se / but yf he be rekened more myld, bycause he setteth hys wordes mych more myld and colde when he speketh awght of heretikes, & sheweth hym selfe therin more tempe­rate & therby more dyscrete then I / and but yf he be [...]eke­ned for more indyfferent, by­cause hys wordes ī rehersyng the fawtes of the spyritualty, be not in the wurste thynges parcyally poynted towarde suche as be nought, but indy [...] ferētly [Page] dyrected and poynted towarde the whole body.

The .xii. chapyter.

HOw be it as towching the maner of hys han­delynge / to tell you the very trouth, it semeth to me some what straunge, for one that wolde go about the purpose that he pretendeth, that is to wytte to pacyfye and appease two partyes, beyng at so sore a dyssensyon and dyuysyon, as he sayth that y temporalty is in grudge agaynst the spy­rytualty, not here and there but euery where noted, as he sayth in a maner vnyuersally thorow thys whole realme. How be it I trust in god very farre fro so. And yet not fully [Page 89] so farre, but that it maye by mysfortune for aboundaunce of synne and lake of grace, in tyme grow and come to it.

For trouth it is that mur­mur & dyssensyon (god know­eth how it begonne) agaynste the clergye is a greate waye gone onward in his vnhappy iourney / and maye by suche maner and meane of pacyfy­enge, within short processe be conuayed rounde aboute the realme, and leue no place in peace. Not y I wolde thynke the man that made that boke to be of suche malycyouse mynde, as wyllyngly to sowe dyssensyon / but that as me se­meth he taketh at the lest wise vnware a wronge waye to­warde the contrary / and that [Page] the maner of his handelynge is farre frō such indyfferēcye as he sholde vse, that wolde make a loue day and appease any murmur and grudge of the laye people agaynste the prestes.

For he sheweth in the pro­gresse of all hys processe, that the grudge is borne by the tē ­poraltye / and the causes and occasions therof growen and gyuen in effecte all by the spyrytualtye▪ whyche handelyng is not as me thynketh very myche indyfferent.

I lette passe that he which veryly wolde entende to pa­cyfye, swage, and appease a grudge, wolde (as myche as he conuenyentely myght) ex­tenuate the causes and occa­sions [Page 90] of the grudge. But & yf he wold nedes walke playnly forthe and take no such bye wayes / he wold not yet at the leste wyse not accumulate & exaggerate the greuys, and by all the meanes he myghte, make y greues appere many, great, and mooste odyouse. Or fynally, yf for hatered of theyr fawtes, no fauour of theyr persons coulde cause hym to forbere that / yet wold he forbere at the leste wyse to seke vppe and reherse causes of grudge before vnknowen vnto the partye, whose dys­pleasure he wolde asswage & pacyfye. But now thys ap­peasoure contrary wyse, not onely dothe in all these thyn­ges the cōtrary / but bryngeth [Page] forthe also bysyde all thys, some suche fautes mo, as yf they were trewe were of the greatest weyghte / and telleth theym as though they were tr [...]we, where they be very playne false in dede.

But now the good bretherne that boste it, laye forthe for a greate token of temperaunce and good mynde towarde the spyrytualty, that he forbereth to speke any thyng of y great open fawtes that many pre­stes be openly taken in / as thefte, robbery, sacrilege, and murder / whereof in soundry shyres of the realme there are at euery sessyons openly foū ­den some.

And yet the moste parte of such fawtes as he speketh of, [Page 91] he saith thē not as of him self, nor affermeth theym not for trew▪ nor as thynges neyther spokē by the mouthes of very many / but to mytygate the mater wyth, he sayth no more but that thus by the clergye some say, and some finde this fawte wyth theym, and some fynde that / and though that many smale sommes make a great, what can he do therto? can he lette men to speke? or is he bounde to stoppe hys earys and here theym not? or maye he not tell what he hea­reth some other saye?

And yet saye they ferther, that he telleth indyfferentely the fawtes as well of the tem­poralty as of the spyritualty / and wolde there shold not be [Page] bytwene the temporaltye and the spyrytualtye, so myche as any one angry worde. And therfore they saye that it can not be possyble that he wrote of any euyll entente, syth no man can vse hym self neyther more myldely nor wyth more indyfference, nor fynally with more tender cheryte.

But now to these excuses, some other men answere a­gayne, that the leuyng out of felonye, sacrylege, & murder, is rather a token of wylynes thē any forbering or fauour. For syth he saw well y euery wyse man wolde answere in hym selfe, that those greate horryble open euyls of suche desperate noughty wreches, were not to be layed agaynst [Page 92] the clergy / as the lyke in temporall wreches are not to be layed agaynste the tēporalty: he wolde therfore rather seke oute and hepe vppe a sorte of those thynges that myght by hys maner of handelynge, sowne in the readers eares to be suche as the temporaltye myghte ascrybe and impute vnto (& therfore bere a gruge vnto) the mayne multitude of the whole clergy, and extende in substaūce vnto euery part.

And as touchy [...]ge that▪ he sayth not the thynges as of hym selfe, but bryngeth them in wyth a fygure of Some say: to that poynt some other say, that for that curtesy no man hath any cause to can hym any thanke. For vnder [Page] hys fayre fygure of some say / he maye ye wote well, & some saye that he so doth, deuyse to brynge in all the myschyefe that any man can saye. And yet ouer thys wythout hys masker of Some say / he saith open faced some of the wurste hym selfe, and that in some thynges y are as some trewe men saye not trewe.

Then as touchyng his in­dyfferency, in tellynge the fautes of y tēporalty to / of trouth among a grete hepe of shrewd fautes rehersed agaynste the clergy, for whyche the temporalty myghte yf the thynges were all trewe, seme to haue great cause of grudge / he reherseth also some fautes of y temporalty to, as that they be [Page 93] to blame bycause they vse the prestes ouer familyarely, and geue them ouer gay gownes or lyght coloured lyuereys, & one or two such thynges [...] as though they might [...] mended, yet were of no such kynd as the prestes that so be [...]elte wyth all, haue ben wonte to fynd any cause [...].

How be yt yet in one place to shewe his farther indyffe­ [...]ency / he layeth against them both that the prestes agaynst laye people, and laye people agaynste prestes, haue vsed to haue euyll language / and eyther agaynst other to speke vnsyttynge wordes. And ther uppon she sheweth his tender charyte, and sayth: If all these wordes were prohybyted on bothe sydes [Page] [...]ppon great payne [...], I thynke y [...] wolde do great good in this behalfe.

The .xiii. chapyter.

BUt now good readers yf that yt so were, that one [...]ounde two men stādyng to gether, & wold come steppe in betwene theym, and ber [...] them in hand they were about to fyght / and wold wyth that worde putte the tone prete [...] backe with his hande, and all to buffer the tother about the face / and then go forth and say that he had parted a fray, & pacyfyed the partyes: some men wolde say agayne (as I suppose) that he had as lyu [...] hys enmy were let alone with hym, and therof abyde the ad­uenture, as haue such a frend [Page 94] steppe in betwene to parte theym.

How be it yf this pacyfyer of this dyuysyon wyl say that this is nothyng lyke the pre­sent mater, bycause he stry­keth neyther parte, but onely telleth the tone y tothers fautes / or ellys (as he wyll saye) telleth thē theyr fautes both: yf yt so happeth good readers he found a man that were an­gry with his wife (and happely not all wythoute cause) yf this maker of the boke of dyuys [...]on wolde take vpon hym to go & reconcyle them agayn to gether / and helpe to make them at one / and therin wold vse this waye, that when he hadde theym both before hym and before all theyre neygh­bours [Page] to, then sauynge for some chaung to make yt met [...] for theyre persones, [...]lles he wolde begynne holyly wyth y same wordes in effect wyth whyche he begynneth his in­differente mylde boke of dyuy [...]ion / and for an enter into his mater fyrste wolde saye thus vnto them / who may remember the state that ye stande in, wythout great heuenesse and sorow of hert? For where as in tymes passed hath reygned betwene you cherite, mekenes co [...]orde, & peace / there reygneth now angre, and malyce, de [...]ate, dyuysyon and stryfe. whych thynge to se so mysfortune betwene any two crysten folke, is a thynge myche to be lamented / & then myche more [Page 95] to be lamented, when yt mys­happeth to fall betwene a mā & his wyfe. And many good neyghbours gretly meruayle I wysse, vppon what causes this great grud [...]e is gro [...]en. And therfore [...]o chente [...]t that ye man r [...]moue y causes and amende these maters, & ther­by then by the gra [...]e of god agree / I wyll tell you what I here men saye that the causes be. And nowe after holy pro­loge made / go forth and tell them that some folke say, the wyfe hath this euyll condycyon, and some other saye that she hath that euyll condicyon, and yet other some saye that she hath a nother euyll condycyon / and so wyth twenty dyuerse some sayes of other mē, [Page] say there hym self by the pore woman, all the mychyefe that any man could dyuyse to say / and among those, some thynges peraduēture trew, which yet her husbande hadde neuer herde of byfore. And some thinges false also / wherof by­cause y pacyfyer wolde be put vnto no profe, he wold not sa [...] them as of him felf but bryng thē forth vnder y fayre figure of some say. And when he had all sayde then yet at the laste say thus mych of hym self. As for these thynges here & there I haue herd some other saye / whether they say trewe or no the charge be theyrs for me. But yet in good fayth good [...]yster, syth ye knowe that the dyspleasure and grudge that [Page 96] your husbande hath to you, is growen vppon these cau­ses / I meruayle mych my self that you do vse the same con­dycions styll. I wysse tyll you meke your self & amēde them, this anger of your husbande wyll neuer be well appeased.

Lo wyth suche wordes he voydeth the colour of hys fayre fygure of Some saye, eyther by forgetfulnes, or els by the playne fygure of foly. For whan he sayth of hym self, that she kepeth those euil condycyons styll and amen­deth them not / he sheweth y all hys Some sayes be of his owne sayenge, though he myghte happely in some of them here some other saye so to bysyde.

[Page]But than yf amonge all these fawtes so my [...]dely re­hersed agaynst her, he wolde to shewe somwhat of hys in­dyfferencye, tell her husband hys pars verse to / and saye, But yet forsothe your wyf [...] hath not geuen you so many causes of dyspleasure for nought. For I wyll be play [...] wyth you and indyfferent by­twene you bothe, you haue [...] some thynges towarde her not delte very well nor lyke a good husbande your selfe.

For thys I knowe my selfe▪ that ye haue vsed to make her to homely wyth you, and haue suffred her to be to [...] idle, and suffred her to be to [...]yche co [...]ersaunt amonge her gosseppys, and you haue [Page 97] gyuē her ouer gaye gere and to mych money in her purse / and surely tyll you mende all this gere for your part, I can not myche meruayle though she do you dyspleasure. And sometyme euyll wordes by­twene you causeth debate on bothe sydes. For you call her (as I here saye) cursed quene & shrew / & some saye that she byhynde your backe calleth you knaue & cuckolde. And I wysse suche wordes were well done to be lefte on bothe sydes / for surely they do no good. And therfore yf all the [...]e wordes were prohybyted on bothe sydes vppon greate paynes, I thynke it wolde do great good in thys byhalfe.

Now gete you hense as [Page] wyfe as a calfe wolde I wene the good wyfe saye to thys good goostely pacyfyer. For spake he neuer so myldely, and wolde seme neuer so in­dyfferent / though he loked therewyth ryght simply, and helde vp also bothe hys han­des holyly, & wolde therwith swere to the woman full de­pely, y hys entent were good, and that he nothynge mente but to brynge her husbande & her at one / wolde she thynke you for al that byleue hym? I suppose veryly naye, nor her husbande neyther yf he were wyse, all though he saw some parte of hys tale trewe / as none is so folysshe to saye all false, that wolde wynne hym credence. But byleue the hus­bande [Page 98] as he lyste / I durste be bolde to swere for the wyfe, that he shold neuer make her suche a fole, as to byleue that he ment to mende the mater, wyth rehersynge her fawtys mo then euer her husbande had herd of, and some of them false to / and than colour all hys tale wyth hys proper in­uenciō of Some say. But she wold for his some say shortly sai to hī, I pray you good mā Some saye gete you shortely hense. For my husbande and I shall agre myche the soner yf no such brother Some say come wythin our dore.

Now of very trouth thys pacyfyer, as some saye, goth yet wurse to wurke ī his boke of dyuisyon, then this Some [Page] say, that we put for a sample bytwene the man & hys wyfe. For he gathereth fyrst all the causes of dyspleasurys that he can fynde out or dyuyse / and dyuerse of them suche as few ley people vnlerned, ye & fewe of the lerned to, had any thynge herd of byfore, as are dyuerse of those which he ga­thereth out of Iohn̄ Gerson.

If he saye that he ment as Gerson dyd, that he maketh mencyon of them bycause he wolde haue the clergy mende them / surely who so for suche good wyll telleth a man hys [...]wtes, vseth to tell hit hym secretely / and so dyd Iohn̄ Gerson hym selfe when he wrote them in latyne, & not in the vulgare tunge.

[Page 99]But this pacyfyer cōtrarywyse bycause he wolde haue the lay peple both men & wo­men loke on them, doth translate them into englysh / where as Iohn̄ Gerson wolde not that a man sholde reproche & rebuke y prelates before the people.

Also this pacyfyer aggre­ueth (as mych as ī him lyeth) the clergye of englande, for vse of the lawes not made by them selfe, but be the comon lawys of all chrystendome.

If he wyll say that he blameth but theyr abuses therof the trouth appereth in some place otherwyse in hys boke. And yet syth he proueth that poynt but by a some saye / he myght wyth the same fygure [Page] laye lyke fawtes in the temporaltye concernyng the lawes of thys realme, and proue it in lyke wyse wyth a greate Some saye to. And therin he sheweth hym selfe not indyf­ferent whan he bryngeth in the tone and leueth the tother out. And on the tother syde, yf he bryng in the tother to / thā shall he make two fawtes for one. For if he handle them as truely as he handeleth these / than shall he make two lyes for one.

And yet bysyde all the faw­tes that he bryngeth in vnder some saye and they say / some that him selfe sayeth without any some say, be such as some saye that he can neuer proue, and some they say be playne [Page 100] and open false.

By all whyche maner of handelynge it appereth, that yf the man meane well hym selfe (as by goddes grace he doth) than hath some other sotle shrew that is of his coū ­sayle deceyued him, not onely in the mysse framynge of hys mater more towarde diuysyō then vnyte, but also by cau­synge hym to plante in here & there, some suche worde as myghte make hys beste fren­des to fere, that he greately forced not for the furtheraūce of the catholyke fayth.

The .xiiii. chapyter

BUt for as mych as the touchynge of y boke is here not my prīcipal purpose / [Page] I wil therfore not peruse it o­uer & touch euery poīt therof. whyche yf I wolde, I coulde I thynke well made men se, y very fewe partes therof had eyther such cherite or such in­differēcye [...]herin, as not onely the new naughty bretherhed bosteth, but some good folke also take yt at a superfycyall redynge.

And yet bycause y bretherns boste hath made yt an incydēt vnto my mater / and that some thynges therin are suche, as yt is more then necessary that men be well aduysed of them, and well fore se what they do in them / and leste a better opypynyon of the boke then the mater may bere (yf yt be pon­dered ryght) may be occasy­on [Page 101] to moue mē in some great thynges to do no lytle wrōge / & to then [...]nt also that ye may se y in all that I haue sayde, I bylye hym not: I shall for a sample of handlynge, touch by the waye one or two places of hys.

And le [...]te folke shold thynke that I pyke oute here & there two or thre lynes of y wurst: I wyll take his fyrst chapiter whole. In whyche though all be not noughte, nor all false (For a very fole were he that wold putforth a boke & make all nought and all false, euyn in y very fore fronte that shall come fyrste to hande) yet yf yt be consydered & aduysed wel / there will I wene euyn in the very fyrste chapyter appere, [Page] lesse good and lesse treuth to, then men at a sodayne shyft in the fyrst redyng ouer, do tho­rowly perceyue. Lo thus yt begynneth.

Who maye remember the [...]tate of thy [...] realme now in these dayes, wythout gret heuyne [...] and sorow of herte: For there as in tymes pas [...]e hath [...]eygned charyte, me­kene [...], concord, and peace, reygneth n [...]w enuye, pryde, [...]yuysyon, and [...]ry [...]e: and that not onely betwene lay men and laye men, but also betwene r [...]lygyons and re­lygyons, and als [...] [...]etwene pre [...]es and religyon [...], & that is yet more to be lamēted, also betwene prefi [...] and pre [...]es.

Some say y a man myght here a lytle lament this man­nys wyt, that weneth yt lesse to be lamented, that debate & strife shold be bytwene prestes and religyouse persons, or bytwene those that are both the partyes relygyouse folke, thē bytwene those y are both the [Page 102] partyes prestes. For some say that many relygyouse folke be prestes. And they y so say / do say also that as many pre­stes be relygyouse folke. And some say therfore, that except this man meane here by rely­gyouse folke eyther womē or chyldren, wyth whose vary­aunce the temporalty is not very greatly cūbred / or ellys the laye bretherne that are in some places of religyō, which are neyther so many nor so myche estemed, that euer the temporalty was myche troubled wyth theyre stryfe: ellys bysyde these there falleth no variaūce lyghtly betwene religyouse & relygyouse, wher­with the temporalty haue ben offended / but yt falleth of necessyte [Page] betwene prestes and prestes / and thē the varyaūce, namely suche a varyaunce as thys boke speketh of, that is so notable that the temporalty so mych marketh it, and hath so great cause to lament yt, when yt falleth betwene relygyouse and relygyouse, ys a thynge no lesse lamentable then yf yt fell betwene as many prestes when them selfe be both prestes.

And then yf he meane here by prestes, those that are seculare prestes, as by his other wordes he semeth to do / and so taketh yt for a thyng more to be lamented, yf varyaunce fall betwene seculare prestes then betwene those prestes y are in relygyō: then say some [Page 103] men that he sayth somwhat worse. And then they y so say, seme to me to say trew. For al be it gret pitye yt is to se stryfe and variaūce fal betwene any seculare prestes: yet is it more pitye to se it fal betwene those prestes that haue also vowed and professed farther, som­what a more strayght renouncyng of all such maner thyng, as mater of debate and stryfe do comenly sprynge vppon. And therfore this maner of encreace and growing of this mannys oracyon, is but a coū terfeted fygure of rethoryque as some men say.

And in good fayth as for my selfe I se not the reason that moued hym. For it were [...] very colde skuse to a man [Page] lerned that wyll way the hole periodus togyther, if he wold hereafter say that he ment by these wordes bytwene prestes and prestes, the prestes that are in relygyon. For bysyde that a man maye by dyuers [...] thynges well perceyue the cō trary / he had yf he so hadde mente, lefte than no lamentacyon for any stryfe that hap­peth bytwene seculare prestes amonge them selfe. I can not therfore ī good fayth diuyne, what he sholde mene by that increase endynge in prestes after all the relygyouse, but yf he mente to sygnyfye that the state of prestes pofessyng relygyon, were a state of lesse perfeccyon by reason of the professyon, then is the state of [Page 104] those seculare prestes y haue temporall landes of theyr own purchace or enheritaūce, or that ellys serue some chaū tery or lyue vppon tr [...]ntallys abrode.

And surely yf the man thus ment in dede / bysydes that he sholde haue sette out hys sen­tence more playnely: his me­nynge wyl [...] but yf he declare it the better, mysselyke better men and better lerned to, thā I & he be bothe. And sauynge for that poynte whyche is no small mater / ellys as for his rules of rethoryke or gram­matycall congruyte eyther, or ouersight in reasonyng, as thynges of no gret weyght & wolde not myche vouchsaue to towche. For they be suche [Page] offences as a man maye fall in, and yet be a saued soule, as well as though he neuer wrote any wurke at all

The .xv. chapyter.

WHyche dyuysyon hath ben so vny­uersall, that it hath ben a great vnquyetnes and a great breche of charyte through all the realme: and pa [...]te of y [...] hath rysen by reason of a great syngularyte, that relygyous person [...] and pre [...]es haue [...] to theyr siate of lyuyng, wherby many of thē haue thought theyr state mo [...]e perfyte before all other. [...]nd some of them haue therby e [...]alted theym selfe in theyre owne syghte so hyghe, that they haue rysen into suche a [...] pryde, that they haue in maner disdayned and despysed other, that haue not lyued in suche perfeccyon, as they thynke they do. And of thys hath folowed, that some of theym haue hadde vnsyttynge wordes of the other, callynge them flatterers, dy [...] mulers, and hypocrytes: And they haue called the other agayne proude persons, couetous, vayne gloryo [...]se, and louers of wordely delytes, and suche other.

[Page 105] Of some partyculare va­ryaunce among dyuerse per­sons of the clergy haue I dy­uerse tymes herde / as some­tyme one person agaynste an other for hys tythes / or a per­son agaynste a relygyouse place for medelynge wythin hys parysshe / or one place of relygyon wyth another vpon some suche lyke occasyon / or somtyme some one relygyon haue had some questyon and dysputed as it were a pro­bleme, vppon thantyquyte or senyoryte of theyr [...]stytuciō, as by whyche the carmelytes clayme to fetche theyr orygy­nall from Helias & Helizeus. And some questiō hath arysē in y order of saynt Francisce, bytwene the obseruauntes & [Page] conuētuallys. For as for the thyrde cōpany that is to wyt the cole [...]ams, there are in this realme none. But yet of all these maters was there neuer as farre as I rede or remem­ber, in thys realme eyther so very great or so many suche thynges all in hand at onys, that [...]uer it was at the tyme noted thorow the realme and spoken of for a great notable fawte of the hole clergy. And as for y faw [...]es of some party culare partys eyther persons or placys, is nothynge that oughte of reason be rekened for the cause of thys diuysyō, and of thys dyspleasure and grudge of the temporaltye [...] the clergye / no more than many mo varyaunces [Page 106] growynge dayly in dyuerse tymes and places, wyth vn­lawfull assembles and greate ryottes also▪ cause the clergye to grudge agaynste the tem­poralty. And as it is not rea­son that it so were / so that it is not in dede maye well be perceyued by thys. For yf it were / then must thys grudge of ours agaynste them haue ben a very olde thyng / where as it is in dede neyther so great as this man maketh it, and growen to so great as it is, but euyn of late syn [...]e Tindals bokes and Frythes and frere Barons beganne to go abrode. And yet all though that it appereth well in hys wordes afterward, that those varyaūces canbe no parte or [Page] cause of this diuisyon wherof he maketh his boke: yet hath it delyted eyther hym selfe or some sotle shrewes y so haue sette hym a wurke to brynge them in to▪ of a good mynde & a fauorable, to lay these faw­tes to y clergyes face, bysyde the mater of thys dyuysyon that he taketh in hande to treate of.

Now the remanaūt (wherby somwhat appere thalso, that by the encreace of his oracyō, wyth puttynge in the ende, and that is yet more to be lamented also bytwene prefies and prefies, he ment to put for the more lamenta­ble strife, that variaūce which falleth bytwene seculare pre­stes, then that that falleth by­twene those that bysyde theyr [Page 107] order of prestehed, haue by theyr holy vowys entred into relygyon) he handeleth here in suche wyse that he fyrst re­procheth bothe the partys of greate syngularyte, whyche bothe relygyouse persones & also prestys haue had to theyr statys of lyuynge / by whyche wordes he sheweth, that eche of them contende wyth other vpon the perfeccyon of theyr two states whyther sholde haue preemynence, these pre­stes that are seculare or those that are relygyouse / & whych of the bothe hym selfe taketh for the chyef appereth, by the pytuouse encrease & growing of hys lamentable oracyon.

Then rebuketh he of y relygyouse, some that haue apparaunce [Page] to be the moste perfyte and beste / and sayth, that thorow the great syngularyte that they haue to theyr state of lyuynge, they haue exalted them selfe in theyr owne syght so hyghe, that th [...]y ha [...]e rysen into suche a go [...]iely pryde, that they haue in maner dysdayned and despysed other, that haue not lyued in suche pe [...]feccyon, as they thynke they do.

This is a great thyng spoken by gesse, bycause among many good vertuouse folke, there may fall some by the de­uyls meanes into some great gostely pryde, as Lucyfer dyd in y good cōpany of angelles. But thys chaunce of suche chaunge is so olde, that these wordes wyll nothynge serue his lamentable begynnynge / whyche standeth ye wote well in lamentynge the chaunge from the old vertues of times [Page 108] passed, into the new vyces of this tyme presēt. And this vy­ce is very old, & reygned most when relygyouse folke lyued beste. And veryly the clergye is not all thynge so euyll as he maketh yt, yf y relygyouse folke lyue nowe so holyly, as the temporalty may note that thorow perfytnes of lyuyng, the deuyll brynge so many to suche an hygh spyce of pryde.

But then goth he sorth and setteth thē to chyde to gether. How be it his wordes be so cō founded wyth they and them and other / and in the two versys of theyr chydyng his wor­des be so vnsewtely sorted, that I cā not perceyue which of the t [...]o partes calleth whi­che nor who calleth whome, [Page] by those names that he sayth the [...]one sorte calleth y tother / nor hym selfe I suppose ney­ther, as the thynge that he neuer knew for trew, but thyn­keth he may boldely tell eue­ry thynge for trewe, that any man perceyueth possyble.

The .xvi. chapyter.

ANd an other parte of this dyuisyon hath [...]ysen by dyuersyties of opy­nyons, that haue ben vpon the au­thoryties, powers and [...] on of spyrytuall men amonge theym self. And vpon these dyuysyons [...]ome laye men haue in tyme paste fauored the [...]ne [...] / and some the other: wherby the people haue greatly be inquieted.

Dyuerse opynyons vpon powers, authoryties, and iu­rysdyc [...]yōs of spyrytuall men amonge them selfe, there happeneth I thynke nowe & then [Page 109] to ryse, whyle in suche cases eyther par [...]e hath his opynyō vpō his owne syde. But of a­ny great inquyetacyon that y people hath had by any suche dyuysyon rysen wythin thys realme / or of any lay men be­ryng theyr fauour some to the tone parte and some to the tother, I wene the peple of this realme that fe [...]t yt haue forge ten yt, yf any suche were yt is so longe a go. And surely my self remēber none, nor I trow no man elles for the [...]yme of this .xx. yere / wythin whyche tyme or tenne fewer, all thys gere is begōne wherof he maketh hys dyuysyon. And therfore this pyece of his is to my [...]lynge very coulde.

The .xvii. chapyter.

BVt I wote not fully by what o [...] casyon yt is, that nowe of late the gre [...]t [...] of all the laye people haue founde defaulte / as well at prestes as religyous, so farreforth that yt is now in maner noted through all the realme, that there is a great dyuysyon bytwene the spyrytualtye and the tempo­raltye. And veryly yt is great pytye, that such a noyse shuld spryng and go abrode.

In the begynnyng he sayd that dyuysyon reygneth now betwene spyrytuall men and spyrituall mē. And then sayth he here: But it reygneth now bytwene spyrytuall men and temporall men.

I am contente to let his but alone, and wyll not shote ther at for this ones. How be yt surely his but beynge a preposycyon aduersatyue, standeth more properly to shote at be­twene [Page 110] his two nowes, then yt wolde yf yt were turned into some cōiunccyon copulatyue.

But where as he cā not ful­ly tell by what occasyon the great multitude haue founde defaute, as well at prestes as religyous / a mā nedeth neuer to study for occasyons therof / but yf he be so curyouse as to seke for fautes, he maye sone fynd inough, not onely in prestes and in relygyous, but in euery sorte and kynde of tem­porall people to, & euer might yet in euery age syth crysten­dome beganne, and may per­aduenture yf he serche well, fynde some in hym self to. So y yf there be no nother cause of varyaunce then that / they may both spiritualty and temporalty [Page] take eche other by the hande like good felowes, and agre to gether well inough.

But yet happeth yt well that this good pacyfyer hath so great pytye, that the noyse of this diuisyon shold spryng and go abrode. For he to remedy that mater with all, and to pul backe the noyse therof, and to stoppe vppe clerely the sprynge / bycause all shold be hushte and neuer mo wordes made therof, hath as ye se put yt oute abrode in prent.

The .xviii. chapiter.

ANd some alledge dyuerse ca [...] ­ses why yt shold be so noysed.

A very fewe folke may sone begynne a noyse of euyll wyll and malyce. And a [Page 111] noyse maye sone be borne a­brod what so euer y mater be, with some of symplicite, some of light geuynge credence, & some of a luste vnto talkyng.

Fyrste they saye, that neyther pref [...]es nor religyouse ke [...]e the perfeccyō of theyr order to the honour of god & good exam­ple of the people, as they shuld [...] do.

Ueryly they that so saye, peraduenture saye not myche vntrewe. For I thynke that euery mannys dewty toward god is so great, that very few folke serue hym as they shold do. And therfore who so prye vpon euery mannys dede so narowly, as to spy that faute and fall at variaūce of greate zele with euery man that doth not to the very poynt and perfeccyō, euyn all that he shold do / shall waxe within a whyle [Page] at varyaūce wyth euery man & euery man wyth hym. But I suppose they kepe it now at thys day, mych what after suche a good metely meane maner, as they dyd many of those yeres before in which thys dyuysyon was neuer dremed on. And therfore they that saye thys is the cause / haue nede to go seke some other.

But that some of theym procure theyre owne honour, and call yt the honour of god, and rather coueyt to haue rule ouer the people then to profyte the people.

were there neuer none of these tyll nowe so late as a­bout the begynnynge of thys dyuysyon / or be they all such now? Amonge Crystes own apostoles was some desyre of prelacye, and that wyth some [Page 112] contencyon to. There are of oure prelates some suche at thys day now, as I pray god that when there shal any new come, they maye proue no wurse. For of these whā they dye yf they waxe not wurse byfore / who so shal lyue after thē, may in my mynde be bold to say, that englande had not theyr better any day thys .xl. yere, and I durste go a good waye aboue to. But thys is more by twenty yere and ten sette therto, then this diuysiō hath any thyng be spoken of.

And that some couet theyr bodyly ease and worldly welth, in meate and drynke, and suche other, more then commenly a­ny temporall man doth.

This is a very colde cause of thys new dyuysyon, to say that there be not now comēly [Page] so badde men in the temporaltye as there be some in the spirytualtye. For whan was it otherwyse? not euyn in Cry­stes owne dayes. For Iudas that was one of hys owne a­postles, was not onely wurse then the comon sorte of all those that loued theyr belyes and theyr ease amonge Cry­stes dyscyples were they men or women / but wurse also thā the very wurste in all y world bysyde. But what cause were thys that the tēporaltye shold (nor though thys man saye thus, I thynke theym not so vnreasonable that they wold) be at debate & dyuisyon wyth the hole body of the clergye, bycause that some of thē were wurse then those are that are [Page 113] in a meane comon sorte of noughtynesse amonge them selfe.

And that some se [...]ue god for a wordely lande and to be magni [...]yed therfore, more they for th [...] pure [...] of god.

That same some that so do, be some of the most folysh apys that the deuyll hath to tūble afore hym and to make hym lawghe, when he seeth them take so mych laboure & payne for the rewarde of the blast of a fewe mennes mow­thes.

How be it there maye be some suche for all that, & yet nothynge to the purpose of thys mater. For as for the speche of folys is not to be compted for a profe of dyuy­syon. And amonge wyse men [Page] the gesse and contecture that in the clergy there be secretly some very noughte before god, whom yet in the syghte of the worlde men take for very good, can by no reason be the cause of any grudge toward the spyrytualty, wherin maye be bysyde them that are such and so there are in dede, many very vertuouse holy men in dede / whose holynesse and prayour hath bene I ve­ryly thynke one great special cause, that god hath so longe holden his hande frō geuyng of some sorer stroke vpon the neckes of them y are nought & care not in the spyrytualty and the temporaltye bothe.

And yet thys fawte that thys pacyfyer assygneth of [Page 114] seruynge god for lawde, is I suppose somewhat amended of late / & wyll within a whyle if some gere go forward, were a way quyte, by the helpe and meanys of an other fawte.

For yf these heresyes that rayle vppon relygyons, and call all theyr prayour pare­rynge, and all theyr fastynge foly, & all theyr holy vowys of chastyte worse then frere Lutherslechery: yf these he­resyes I saye may grow and go forward, as they begynne to grow now and prosper ful pretily in some places / & then yf those that be of the same secte, and of polycy dyssymule it for a season, maye in the meane tyme sprede abrode an opynyon in the myndes of [Page] menne that of them self mene none harme, that the relygy­ouse people do faste and pray but for lawde: they shall wel perceyue wythin a whyle, y they shall haue so lytell lawd therof, that yf there wolde re­mayne none other cause of thys dyuysyon but bycause they serue god for lawde, ye shall haue it soone chaunged of lykelyh [...]d / and then shall we shortely agre togyther ve­ry well.

But now good reders consyder I beseche you, that yf these causes whyche thys pa­cyfyer alledgeth vnder the coloure of Some say, be causes that myghte moue the temporaltye to be in dyuysyon and grudge agaynst the clergye / [Page 115] that is to wytte bycause they serue not god as they sholde do, but some of them loue au­thoryte and some loue theyr case, and some serue god of vayne glory for lawde and prayse of men: thanne sholde thys dyuysyō not haue so late bygon, but muste haue ben [...] euer before / and can neuer be remedyed hereafter, but as longe as the worlde lasteth muste thys dyuysyon euer cō ­tynue styll.

For how coulde thys pa­cyfyer fynde the meanes, that in the whole clergy so many as are therin, none sholde be nought [...] / when of Chrystes apostles there was yet one nought in the smale nomber of twelue. And veryly in thys [Page] declynacyon of the worlde, & by this great fall of faith, the olde feruour of cheryte so be­gynnynge to cole: it is to be [...]ered at length, that yf it thus go forth and contynue, bothe the spyrytualtye from thapo­stles, and the temporaltye frō the other dysciples, maye fall so farre downe downe down downe, that as there was thā one nought amonge twelue, so may there in tyme comyng yf these heresyes go forward, amonge twelue spyrytuall or peraduenture twenty tempo­rall eyther, be founden at last in some whole cuntre scante any one good. But y worlde is not I thanke god in En­glande yet, nor neuer shall I truste come.

[Page 116] How be it y all may be made good that wyll be harde for thys pacyfyer to deuyse the meanes. So that if the being of some noughte maye be a good cause of dyuysyon / dy­uysyon maye be by sometyme fewer noughte, made some­tyme somwhat lesse / but ende can it neuer haue whyle the worlde standeth.

But yf this pacifyer to cease and quenche this dyuysyon, coulde fynde the meanes to make al y whole clergy good: yet for all that, syth he layeth for causes of this dyuysyon, that some men say this by the clergy, and some men saye by them that / were all the clergy neuer so good in dede, and serued god neuer so well, thys diuysyon [Page] by hys owne tale, yet coulde not for all that cease / excepte he coulde prouyde farther, y no pytuouse pacifyer sholde in lamentyng▪ o [...] [...]uysion, put forth a [...]ke and say, that some lay men say y some of the clergye be nought, and loue theyr ease & theyr welth / and that some saye that those that seme beste and take most labour and payne, be but ypocrytes for all that, & serue god but for vayne glorye to gete theym selfe laude and prayse amonge the people.

The .xix. chapyter.

ANd some lay men saye farther, that though relygyouse men h [...]ue [...]tyde wy [...]h relygyouse / and that some pref [...]es haue [...] wi [...]h relygyous in some poyntes [...] the premynence of theyr perfeccyon / as [Page 117] [...]

As for callyng the worldly honour of y chyrch & of spyrytuall men, the honour of god: I wote nere whether I per­ceyue well▪ what this mā meaneth therby. But by the fyrste of those two thynges, that ys to wyt by the worldly honour done to the chyrch, and taken as honour done to god, he someth to meane the honoure that crysten people here in the world vse to do to the chyrch, as in byeldyng of y chyrches fayre and goodly, & in appa­rellynge the chyrches for the [Page] vse of goddes seruyce hono­rably.

And then in the secōd poynt, that is to wytte the honour of spyrytuall persons / he mea­neth I suppose suche honour as good crystē peple do & are boūdē to do to theyr prelates and theyr curates, and to prestes and relygyous persons, for the respecte and regarde that they bere both of deuocy­on and very boūden diewty, to the holy sacrament of theyr sacred orders, and holy pro­fessyon of theyr godly state of lyuynge.

Then as for the thyrd poynt that is the thynges that he sayth perteyne to the encreace of ryches in spyrytuall men / hym self declareth sone after, [Page 118] that he meneth trentals, chaū [...]eryes, obytes, pardones, & pylgrymages.

Now sayth he that some laye men laye thys for a farther thynge, that all the clergy do vse to agree to gether in all these thynges, howe so euer they happen to varye among them selfe for some other thynges. And veryly therin I thynke he sayth trewe / for so muste they do or dysplease god / and so doth euery good lay man agre with them ther­in to. And I haue sene yt proued by experyence, y in some of these thynges when the lay men haue moued some thyn­ges some tyme, wherby shold be [...]estrayned some such thynges as y clergy myght wynne [Page] by / ye and also no lytle som­what takē from them, to that that lawfully was theyr own byfore: the clergye haue not st [...]uen wyth the temporaltye therfore / but rather then to stykke in conten [...]yon, haue suffered and let yt pa [...]e, all be yt the cantelles that haue ben cut of, haue ben somwhat broder then a brydecake, and greter then a chrystmas lofe in a righ [...] good husbandes house.

And yet where this pacy­fyer sayth, that some lay men say that in all suche thynges all the clergye both seculare & [...] agre and holde to [...] selfe can yf he [...] same some lay men [...] so told hym so, that some other lay men saye naye. For [Page 119] they say that they se very wel, that in all those thinges there are now some suche of the clergye, suche as yt is pytye that euer they were therof, eyther seculare prestes or relygyouse persons. And yet are there some suche of bothe, whyche now caste o [...] theyr fauour frō borh [...]wayne, and from the cristen fayth also / and therfore agre not to [...]hese th [...]nges, as those [...] this man that the whole cl [...]rgy dothe / but do bo [...]e speke & wryte a­gaynst al these thinges euery whyt, bothe honour to prela­tes, byldynge of chyrches, by­enge of bellys and ornamen­tes, & agaynst pylgrymages, [...], chaunteryes, obitis, and perdons, and fynally purgatorye [Page] to.

The .xx. chapyter.

ANd therfore they say, that all spyrytuall men, as to the multytude, be more dylygent to enduce the people to such thinges, as shall bryng ryches to the chyrche, as to gyue money to trentals, & to founde chaunteryes and obytes / and to obteyne pardons, and to go vpon pylgrymages, and such other: then they be to enduce them to the payment of theyre dettes, to make restytucyons for such wronges as they haue done, or to do the workes of mercy to theyr neyghbo [...]s that be pore & nedy / and that somtyme be also in ryght extreme necessyte.

Nowe in good fayth for oughte that I se, suche as so murmur agaynst chaūteries, trentals, obytes, pardōs, and pylgrymages, as wold haue them all for done / haue an in­ward hatered vnto the profyt of mens soules, besyde the en [...]e [Page 120] that they bere to prestes. For some of these thynges be suche that they make not the prestes so very ryche, that all the clergye shold for the great lucre so sore bend vnto the set­tynge forth therof.

For as for chaunteryes, though ther be many, no one man can haue any greate ly­uynge therby / & that a preste sholde haue some lyuynge of suche a meane thynge as co­monly the chaūtryes be, there wyll I wene no good man fynde great faute that all the clergy wolde haue it so / for so wolde I suppose euery good lay man to.

And as for pylgrymages, thoughe the shrynes be well [Page] garnysshed, and the chapell well hanged wyth wex: fewe men I fere me nede myche at thys daye to grudge and cō ­playne of very chargeable offrynges / but those menne make moste a do that o [...]re no thynge at all.

And perdons haue bene purchased not onely by the spyrytualty, but in dyuerse places by the good fay [...]hfull deuocyon of vertuouse tem­porall prynces / ass was to westmynster and vnto the Sauoy, greate perdon pur­chased by the moste noble prynce of famouse memory kynge Henry the seuenth, fa­ther to pu [...] moste dere soue­rayne lorde the kynge that now is. And in good fayth I [Page 121] neuer yet perceyued the peple make so great offerynges at a [...], that we sholde eyther pytye greatly theyr coste, or enuy the prestys that profyte.

But than the trentallys lo, they be the thynges ye wote well wherby the multitude of the clergye and specyally the [...]lates, ge [...]e euery mā among theym an infinyte treasure in a yere / so y it is no meruayle though the whole clergye se­culare and relygyouse, what variaunce so euer they haue amonge them selfe bysyde, cō cernynge the preemynence of theyr perfeccyon as thys pa­cyfyer sayth, agre togyther for all that [...]n thys poy [...]t, to kepe and holde faste the tren­ [...]a [...]ys, bycause of the grea [...]e [Page] encreace of the rychesse that they brynge in by hepes vnto euery man amonge them. I that nothynge can gete by them, beseche god to kepe in mennys deuocyons towarde trentallys & towarde obytes to. For as myche as he sayth that seculare and relygyouse both, stycke to these profites / yet yf religiouse Lutheranys maye procede and prospere, that caste of theyr abytes and walke out and wedde nonnys and preche agaynste purga­tory, and make mockes of the masse: many men shall care litle for obitis within a while and set no more by a trentall then a ruffyane at Rome set­teth by a trent v [...]e.

How be it where thys pa­cyfyer [Page 122] sayth, that some saye that all spyrytuall men as to the multytude, do rather in­duce the people to p [...]lgryma­ges, perdons, chaunteryes, obytys, and trentallys, then to the paymēt of theyr dettes, or to restytucyon of theyre wronges, or to the dedys of almoyse and mercy to theyr neyghbours that are poore & nedy, & somtyme to in ryghte extreme necessite: for my part I thanke god I neuer herde yet of any one that euer wold geue that counsayle / nor no more hath I se well thys pa­cyfyer hym selfe, for he sayth it but vnder hys comon fy­gure of some saye. But ther­fore thys wolde I saye, that eyther he byleued those some [Page] that so sayd vnto hym / or els he byleued them not. If he byleued them not / it hadde bene well done to haue lefte theyr tale vntolde, tyll he hadde by­leued them better. And on the tother syde if he byleued them well / he myghte as well with conscyence haue be lesse lyght of bylyefe, or boldely myghte haue byleued that they lyed / rather then lyghtely byleue y lewde wordes of some, and vppon the malycyouse mow­thes o [...] some, blow abrode in bokes so false a tale hym selfe agaynst not a smale somme, but as hym selfe sayeth as to the multytude agaynste all spyrytuall men.

The .xxi. chapyter.

ANd for as myche as yt is most comenly sene, that amonge a great multitude there be many, y worke rather vpō wyl then vpō reason / and that though they ha [...]e good zele, yet man [...] tymes they lacke good order and dyscrecyon, whyche is the mother of all vertue: therfore some persons thinkyng that wordely honour and▪ ryches letteth greatly deuocyon / so myche that as they thynke, they can not stand to gether, haue holden opinyon, that yt is not lawfull to the chyrche to haue any possessyons. And some takynge a more meane way therin, haue sayde, that (as they thynke) yt y [...] lawfull & also expediēt, that the chyrche ha [...]e possessyons: but they thynke, that the gret ha [...]daūce, that is in the chirch, doth great hurte, and induceth in many of t [...]em / a [...] to worldely thynges, and [...]etteth and in maner s [...]raungleth the loue of god. And therfore they thynke, that it we [...] good to take away that is to mich / and to leue that is suffycyent. And some [...] as of a polycye to pu [...]l ryches fro the ch [...]rche, haue inueyed agaynste all suche thynges as brynge ryches to the chyrch. And bycause great ryches haue comme to [Page] the chyrche for [...]rayenge for [...]oules in pu [...] gatorye, haue by wordes affyrmed that there is no purgatory: and that graun­tynge of pardon [...] ryseth of couetyse of the chyrch, & profyteth not the peple / & that pylgrimages be of no effecte / and that the chyrche may make no lawes, and suche other thynges / as foundynge of chaunte­ [...]yes, makynge of brotherhedes, and ma­ny mo. wherin they shewe outwardely to ryse agaynst all the thynges before rehersed, and to dyspyse theym / and yet they know and byleue in theyr hartes, that all these thynges be of them self ryght good and profytable, as they be in dede yf they were ordered as they sholde be. And some persones there be, that thorough grace fynde defaute onely at the abusyon and my [...]e order of such thynges / and speke no thynge agaynste the thynges selfe / ney­ther of purgatory, pylgrymages, settyng vppe of ymages, or suche other. For they know well, they be ordeyned of god, and that the mysorder ryseth onely of man for couetyse, syngularyte, or some other such lyke defaute, thorough persuasyon and desceyte of the gostely enymye.

Here is good reders a spe­cyall frutefull pyece of thre [Page 124] maner of Some sayes or thre maner of thynkynges. The fyrste is of those that thynke and saye, that it is not lyefull that the chyrche sholde haue any possessyons / but that all theyr lyuelod and all suche thynges as any rychesse com­meth into the chyrch by, shold be taken awaye euery why [...].

And these men in the iud­gement of thys pytuouse pa­cyfyer be not dyscrete / but yet they haue be sayth a good zele though. And thys good zele hadde ye wote well Simon Fysshe whan he made the supplycacyon of beggers. Bu [...] god gaue hym such grace af­terwarde, that he was sory for that good zele, and repen­ted hym selfe and came into [Page] the chyrche agayne, & forsoke & forsware all the whole hyll of those heresyes, out of whi­che the foūtayne of that same good zele sprange.

And of trouth some suche are th [...]re yet, that haue the same good zele styll that Si­mon Fys [...]e had whā he▪ was at the wurste. And god sen­deth some of them such good spede as they haue good zele. For some such haue I know [...] that haue engroced ī to theyr handes myche other mennys goodes, and for a whyle flowred, & were accōpted thryfty, a [...] helde theyr owne & other mennes to / but in conclusyon wasted awaye bothe [...]wayne, a [...]d fayne to fynde a place to hy [...]e theyr heddes, or to kepe [Page 125] them from pryson fynde some other shyfte.

Of these sorte was there one not very longe a go, whi­che wente aboute to make a good bargayne, and was no [...] than knowē but for his owne man / and yet is now god be thāked his own man agayn, for any other mā that he hath to wayte vppon hym. But so happed it than that as he sa [...] in a tauerne in Lumberdes strete wyth an honeste mer­chaunt wyth whome he shold haue bargayned / the tother had herd an inclynge whyche yet he beleued not▪ y this man was not mych afo [...]re hād. And as they [...]ell in tal [...]yng of the worlde, they talked at laste of the clergy: wherin whan he [Page] was fallē, he waxed so warme wyth the wyne, and so full of good zele, that he sware by y masse he trusted shortely to se them lese all / & that the kyng sholde put theym all for euer out of hys proteccyon. And wyth that worde he clapped his fyste vpon the borde, with suche a feruent zele that hys own proteccion fell out of his sleue. whych whan the tother perceyued / brother (quod he) you be not a these I thynke, and therfore I truste it is no perdō that ye haue purchaced there. you truste you say to se the clergy put out of the kyn­ges protecciō / and I purpose to se you oute of the kynges protecciō, e [...]e you and I bar­gayne ony more togyther.

[Page 126]And suche banke ruptes be these men of that good zele, that gape after the spoyle of the spyrytualty / whych whan they haue wasted and mysse spent theyr owne, wolde than very fayne saue for hangyng robbe spyrytuall and tempo­rall to.

The .xxii. chapyter.

THe secund sorte that thys pacyfyer speketh of, be they that thynke & saye that it were good to take a­waye fro the clergy all that is to myche, and leue that is suffycyent / bycause that greate habundaūce letteth they say, and in maner straungleth y loue of god. And these that thus saye / thys pacyfyer al­loweth [Page] for folke wyse & dys­crete. But by what right men maye take awaye from any man spyrytuall or temporall agaynste hys wyll, the lande that is all redy lawfully hys owne / that thynge thys pacy­fyer telleth vs not yet. But he wyll peraduēture at an other tyme tell vs of some men that laye this reason and that rea­son for it. But I haue herde some good and wyse and well lerned men saye, that all the worlde can neuer brynge the reason that euer can preue it ryghte. And as for myne own parte, lyke as I haue some­what more largely sayed in my boke of the supplycacyon of the soules / yf any mā wold gyue the counsayle to take [Page 127] any mannys lande or good from hym, pretendynge that he hath to myche, or that he vseth it not well, or that it myght be better vsed yf some other had it: he gyueth such a counsayle as he maye when he lyste, and wyll peraduen­ture after, streche a great dele ferther then the goodys or possessyons of onely spyry­tuall men.

And where he sayth that some saye that great habun­daunce doth lette, and in ma­ner strangle the loue of god: y is many tymes very trew, that many men in plenty for­g [...]te god, whyche in penury runne vnto hym. But thys reason runneth out agaynste euery kynde of mē spyrytuall [Page] and temporall to / and yet are there in bothe twayne some, in whome the loue of god is neyther letted nor strangled therwyth / but it is made by the good vse therof the mater and occasyon of meryte. why­che yf it myghte not be, but must nedes lette and strangle the loue of god / then were y reason so stronge agaynst all men, that no mā myght with oute dedely synne kepe any habundaunce in hys handes. And than yf to wythdrawe that ineuytable necessyte of dampnable dedely synne, it were lawfull to take as mych awaye from any one man, as the remanaunt that were left hy [...] sholde be but euyn suf­fycyent: the same reasō wold [Page 128] as I say serue with one lytell wrēche ferther, to take in lyke wyse awaye from euery other man were he spyrytuall or temporall, in whome there myght be layed apparence of so mych habundaunce, that it letted hym to loue god. For that is ye wote well euery mā bounde to do spyrytuall and temporall bothe.

And on the tother syde yf there be taken from no man any thyng, but from him that hath so mych, as no man that hath so mych, may so loue god as he may come to heuē / then shall there be from no man taken any thynge. For I doute not but that there are at thys day holy sayntes in heuyn, of suche as were spyrytuall and [Page] of such as were temporall to, that hadde whyle they lyued here, as great possessyons as hath eyther spyrytuall or temporall wythin the realme of Englande now.

Moreouer syth this pacy­fyer accompteth them for dyscrete, that leuynge the clergy suffycyent, wolde that all the remanaunt were taken away from them, bycause the great habundaūce letteth them they say to loue god: yt hadde ben well done that he hadde som­what declared his mind how lytle he calleth sufficyēt / lest y some of his discret folke wold vndyscretely mysse construe that worde, and for lacke of suche fauour & pytye as hym selfe ye se well [...]ereth to y cle [...] gye, [Page 129] wolde leue theym to lytle and call yt ynough. For yf this pacifyer wolde moder & measure his suffycyencye by the wordes of saynte Poule, where he sayth: Hauyng mete and drynke and where wyth to be couered, lette vs be con­tent: excepte hym selfe that loueth theym go farther therin and appoynte them theyr fare & theyr apparell to, some other happely that loue them not so well, wyll deuyse them a diete as thynne as Galiene deuy­seth for hym that hath an obstruccyon in his lyuer / and bycause saynt Poule speketh but of keueryng, wyll dyuyse them clothes that shall onely keuer theym & not kepe them warme.

[Page]Bysyde this, yt semeth that yet his dyscrete folke sholde not vnder the name of habundaūce, take all from y chyrch that they wold take from euery man to whome thay wolde leue bare suffycyent / but that they rather shold such as they wold take from one that hath more then suffycyent▪ dyuyde it amonge suche other of the chyrche that haue lesse then suffycyent. Now yf they shold yet besydes this (whyche I wene they sholde not) fynde yet a great some remaynynge after all the spyrytuall folke sufficyētly prouyded for / then hadde it ben good that he had yet farther dyuysed, howe yt wolde please hym y his discre [...]es sholde order y remanaūt. [Page 130] For though they be as he ta­keth them dyscrete persons of them selfe, bycause they wold take away but the great habū daunce, and leue but the bare suffycyent: yet theyr dyscrecy on shall do a great deale the better, yf yt lyke hym to geue them his dyscrete coūsayle to.

when it shold come to this poynt / here myght paduēture hym self & his discretes make vs many deuycys, & euer the more the more vndyscrete.

I haue bene wythin these foure or fyue yeres (For by­fore I herde lytell talkynge of suche maner of dyuycys) but within thys foure or .v. yeres, I haue ben at such dyuy­ces in diuers good mery cōpanyes, neuer ernestely talkyng [Page] therof (For as yet I thanke god that of thys mater I ne­uer herde any suche) but for passe tyme by waye of famy­lyare talkynge, haue I herde dyuerse, bothe in hande wyth prelates and seculare prestys and relygyouse persons, and talked of theyr lyuynge, and of theyr lernyng, and of theyr lyuelod to / and whither them selfe were such as it were bet­ter to haue them or lacke thē / and then touchynge theyr ly­uelod whyther it myghte be lawfully taken from them or not / and yf if myght, whyther it were expedyent so to be / & if it so were, then to what vse. And in many suche mery tal­kynges I haue alway remē ­bred / & bycause out communicacy [Page 131] on came sometyme to a myche lyke poynte, somtyme haue I told and rehersed the story that Titus Liuius tel­leth of one Pacuuius Cala­nius y Capuaue, in the thyrd boke of his thyrd decade that treateth of y Romayns warre wyth Hanibal and the city of Carthage. This Capua was of all [...]taly the chyefe cytye, and of the gretest power saue onely the cytye of Rome. In which cytye so happed it, that the comynaltye were fallen in grudge and murmur, and at dyuysyon wyth the senate / as thys pacyfyer sayth that the temporaltye is here at these dayes agaynste the clergy.

wherupon this Calanius be­ynge a senator, and [...]atheles [Page] lenynge all vnto the people (bycause he saw them by suf­feraunce and ouersyghte of the senate, growen into an vnbrydeled lyberty / and as they must be what they conspyre whole togyther, waxen the more myghty parte) studyed & bythought hym selfe what meane he might inuente fyrst to brynge the senate in hys daunger / and than by some benefyte wyn all theyr good wyllys / and yet therwyth all encreace his fauoure with the people bysyde. Uppon thys beyng as it happed the chyef gouernour of the citye for the tyme / he brake vppon a daye sodaynly to the senate, & told them that them selfe wyst wel inough what grudge the peo­ple [Page 132] had to them / but the parel and daūgeour that they then presētly stode in, that he sayd wyste they not. But he knew well that the people entended now after y great ouerthrow whyche the Romayns hadde late hadde at Cannas, to kyll vp all the senatours, & breke theyr lege with the Romayns and fall into the part of Han­niball. How be it quod he yf ye dare putte your selfe in my hande / I haue deuised a way wherby ye shall se me shortly, not onely saue all your lyuys but also preserue your state. And whan the senatours in that sodayne fere agreed to putte hym whole in truste to order all y mater as he wold: he commaunded them all so­daynly [Page] to be locked faste in theyr coūsayle chamber / and settynge armed men at the gate to se that neyther any other man sholde entre in vnto them, nor any of thē come out: he called sodaynly to an assemble the whole people of the cytye / & there sayd in thys wyse vnto them. The thynge that ye haue dere frēdes these many dayes myche desyred, that ye myghte ons be reuen­ged vppon thys vnhappy se­nate, and amoue theym from the [...]ome that by theyr coue­touse and cruell delyng haue well shewed theym selfe full vnmetely to bere the name of fathers vnto the people: this thynge haue I now by poly­cy for pour sakes peasybly [Page 133] brought vnto your handes / & that in suche wyse as ye shall not nede to fyghte therfore, or assawte pertycularely theyr howses. In expugn [...]cyon wherof, beyng▪ as they wolde be fensed wyth theyr seruauntes and theyr frendes, your selfe myghte stande in parell▪ But I haue shette them vppe yender togyther alone by thē self, clene out of armour without ayd or any maner defēce, where you shall haue them all without any mannys deth or stroke.

At this word gladde was all the people / and geuynge hym hygh thākes, wold forth wyth fayne haue ben vppon them. Syrs there nedeth in this poynt none hast quod he / [Page] but one thynge is there tha [...] yf ye thought theron, ye wold I dare say do fyrste. For they be the why [...]e [...]aufe ynough, there as they scape not from you. But I haue euer know [...] you so wyse, that ye wyll not I wote well set your short present pleasure byfore your perpetuall welthe, whyche ye s [...] well ye sholde do yf ye sholde lyue lawlesse and wythoute a rule / nor no lawe can s [...]rue excepte there be some gouer­nours. And therfore two thynges muste ye do at ones / that is to wyt, both remoue these, & also set of your selues some better men in theyr places.

wherfore I haue broughte here theyr names in a pot. Let them be drawen oute / and as [Page 134] they come vnto hande, deter­myne your pleasure of theyre persons, and substytute ther­wyth theyr successours. This mociō of Calauius was such, y eyther of reason they could not myslyke yt, or ellys for shame they wolde not refuse yt. And theruppon oute was there drawen a name, at the herynge wherof the cryed out all the company, & euyll and a noughtye man, and bode a way wyth hym. Uery well ꝙ Calauius / whome wyll you now name to put in his place. At that they pawsed a lytle and began to bythynke them. But shortely some named one and some named a nother.

But with perusyng after this fashyon of a fewe, there was [Page] none that one man named & a [...]aunced for good▪ but fyue for that one reiected hym / as eyther very nought▪ or at the leste more vnmete to take in, then he whom they wolde put oute. So that longe ere they hadde perused halfe / as mych as they mysselyked many of they [...] olde, yet founde they yt so [...] a thynge to fynd out th [...] better new▪ that they wa­x [...] [...] of the sekynge. So that Calauius ꝑceuyng them [...] in the mate [...] somwhat to staker and staye / persuaded them easely to concorde wyth t [...]ose that they hadde byfore / & theruppon they left of theyr e [...]ccyon, and let the new cho­s [...]n passe, and kepte theyr old senate styll.

[Page 135]And surely somwhat▪ lyke but not all after this fashyon, hath yt fared in such good cō ­pany as yt hath happed me to be at communycacyon vpon these maters of the clergye.

For in conclusion after many fautes layed agaynst the spyrytualty that is now, and many new dyuyses for theyr landes / when we came at last vnto Calauius pageaunt, and those that founde the fautes in the body at large, in suche a large fashyon layed forthe by them, as though ther were not one good man amonge them: when they had the na­mes of th [...]s prelate and that prelate recy [...]ed and rehersed vnto them by rowe, and were asked what saye you by hym, [Page] and what by hym / all be yt y they dyd by some of them say they were noughte, and that yf lyke as the Capuanys shold haue chaunged a sena­tour for a comuner, so yf they sholde for euery one of the spyrytualtye take into hys plac [...] by choyce and eleccyon▪ some good temporall man, they myght for this prelate or that concernynge some of theym, shortely make a good chaūge. For some of them thoughte they suche, as for one poynte or other they could not lyght­ly find a worse. yet on y tother syde agayne, at some of them they stayed and stakered, and wyth myche worke broughte forth some at last, with whom they myght as they [...]houghte [Page 136] matche them / and yet by theyr owne confession no more then matche theym, & in my mynde not so mych neyther / but lyke as in some they & I somwhat varyd, so in dyuerse other we were agreed both, that for to make the chaunge, neyther coulde they fynde theyr better nor theyr matche neyther.

Nowe where as we went thus no farther they the pre­lates / yf we sholde haue perused ouer y whole clergy bothe relygyouse and seculares / though we mought haue foūd out some that bothe moughte and gladly wolde haue ben chaunged for the prelates (for I haue herde many laye men that wold be byshoppes with a good wyll) and though we [Page] moughte haue also founden ynough of those that wolde matche theym that are euyll & naughty s [...]culare prestes, and them that are runne out of relygyon to, & that wolde and were able to matche theym in theyr owne wayes were they neuer so bad: yet of those that wolde marche y good as fewe as some folke wolde haue th [...] seme, yt wolde not I wene as the worlde goth now, be very easy to fynde oute so many.

But as welthy, and as easy, and as gloryouse as some say to this pacyfyer that religyon is / yet yf some other shold say to them, lo syrs these folke t [...]at are in religyon shall out, come you into relygyon in theyr stedes, and lyue there [Page 137] better then they do, and you shall haue heuyn / they wolde answere I fere me, that they be not yet wery of this world.

Then yf they were inuited into relygyon on the tother fashyon, a [...]d were sayde vnto them thus: Syrs we will not byd you lyue so strayte in relygyon as these men shold haue done / come on and enter, and do but euen as they dyd, and they shall you there haue a good easy lyfe and a welthy, and myche worldely prayse therewyth: I wene a man sholde not yet for all that gete theym to go to yt. But as easy as we call it, and as wel­thy to / and now peraduēture when our wyues are angry, wyshe our selfe therin: yet yf [Page] yt were thus offred, we wolde play as Isope telleth a fable of a pore olde man / whych be­ryng vppe a [...] hyll a bourden of busines in his necke, for helpe of his necessite pa [...]tyng for werynesse, in the mydde way layed downe his burden and satte him down & syghed, and wa [...]ed so wery of his lyfe y he wyshed & called for deth. wheruppon deth came anone redyly towarde hym, & asked hym, what wylt thou wyth me. But when the pore felow saw hym y lene horeson there so redy: I called you syr quod he to pray you do so mych for me, as helpe me vppe agayne wy [...]h this bychede burdayne, and laye yt in my necke. So wene I that for all our wor­des▪ [Page 138] yf that easy lyfe and wel­thy that [...] in relygyon, were offered vs / as wery as we be of weddynge, we wold rather abyde all oure olde payne a­brode, thē in a cloyster take a relygyouse mannys lyfe for ease. So that in conclusyon we sholde be fayne eyther to putte worse in theyre stede, or kepe our old styll, tyll as they lytle and litle dye and depart, god in lyke wyse lytle & lytle as he hath euer hytherto pro­uyded, shall inspyre his grace into the brestes of other, and make theym fall in deuocyon and enter into relygyon, and so [...]uccede in theyr places.

Now as yt fared in our cō munycacyon by the spyritual persons / so fared yt in a ma­ner [Page] by the spyrytuall mennys possessyons. Not for that we myght not alway fynde other ynough content to entre into theyr possessions, thought we coulde not alwaye fynd other men ynough content to enter in theyr relygyons, but for y in [...]yuysynge what way they shold be better bestowed, such ways as at the fyrste face se­med very good, and for the cō fort and helpe of pore folke very chary [...]able, appered af­ter vppon reasonynge, more likely within a [...]while to make many beggers mo, then to releue them y are all redy. And some way y appered at y fyrst to mow stande the realme in great stede, and be an increase of the kynges honour, wyth [Page 139] a great strength for the lande & a gret suerty for the prynce, and a great sparynge of the peoples charge / well appe­red after vppon farther reasonynge, to be the clene contrary, and of all other wayes the worste.

And to say the trouth, mych meruayle haue I to se some folke now so myche & so bol­dely speke of takynge awaye any possessyōs of the clergye. For all be it that onys in the tyme of the famouse prynce kyng Henry y fourth, aboute the tyme of a greate rumble that the heretykes made, whā they wolde haue destroyed not the clergye onely but the kynge also and hys nobylyte to / there was a folysshe byll & [Page] a false put into a parleament or twayn, and spedde as they were wurthy: yet had I ne­uer founden in all my tyme whyle I was conuersaunt in the courte, of all the nobylyte of thys land aboue the nom­ber of seuen (of whyche seuyn there are now thre dede) that euer I perceyued to be of the mynde, that it were eyther ryght or reasonable, or could be to the realme profytable without lawful cause, to take any possessyons awaye from the clergy, whyche good and holy prynces & other deuoute vertuouse people, of whome there be now many blessed sayntes in heuen, haue of de­uocyon towarde god geuyn to the clergy, to serue god and [Page 140] praye for all chrysten soulys. And therfore as for such folk as thys pacyfyer calleth dys­crete, for theyr dyscrete inuencyon of takyng from the clergye the abundaunce of theyr possessyons / I neuer loke to se them so dyscrete, as were those men bothe dyscrete and deuoute that gaue them.

The .xxiii. chapyter.

YEt putteth thys pacyfyer a thyrde kynd of thynkers suche a kynde as I neuer to my remēbraūce haue herde of before, that is to wytte of suche as purposely saye euyll and opēly speke heresye, and for all that thynke well. And those he sayeth are polytyke, whyche to pull awaye ryches [Page] fro the chyrche, speke agaynst all thynge that any thynge brynge into it / as agaynste prayenge for soules in purgatory, grauntyng of pardons, pylgrymages, makynge of lawes, foūding of chaūteries makynge of brothereheddes and many mo.

And though they speke a­gayn [...]e all these thynges / yet he sayth they knowe well inough that all these thinges be good & maye be well vsed. But bycause they brynge ry­ches into the chyrch / therfore he sayth though they knowe them for good & thynke them [...]ood, yet they speke agaynst [...] [...]ll of polycy / not agaynst [...] [...]ses onely, but also a­gaynst the very thinges selfe. [Page 141] For of those y speke agaynste thabuses onely, he putteth another sorte bysyde these men whome he calleth for thys poynt so polytyke. And he sayeth that those that onely speke agaynste thabusys, do better and haue more grace / but yet that excludeth not ye wote well, but that the tother may be good inough, & haue grace inough to, though not so mych.

Thus hath thys pacyfyer put thre kyndes of folke that wold haue the goodys taken from the chyrche.

The fyrst, of those that wold take all and leue nothynge. And those men he sayth haue a good zele.

The secunde, of those that [Page] wolde leue suffycyent & take a waye the remanaunt. And those men haue he saith good dyscrecyon.

The thyrde kynde he cal­leth those, whych rather then the chyrche sholde haue any thynge, lette not to speke a­gaynste good thynges. And those men though they speke openly platte and playne he­resye / yet he denyeth not to be wyse mē & vse a good polycy.

But now where as they denye purgatory / thys is as me thynketh an [...]uyll polycy, for wythdrawynge of offryn­ges fro y clergy, to withdraw therwyth our almoyse frome the pore lay people to / and yet that wurste is of all from the sely soules them selfe, that lye [Page 142] there and pytuousely crye in payne.

By this polycy ye wote wel y these polityke folke might impūgne in generall y affeccion of geuynge any thynge in al­moyse. For that affeccyon ye wote well bryngeth in y yere somewhat into some parte of the clergy. And well ye wote that syth the bylyefe of purgatory and other of those thyn­ges agaynst whyche these polytyke men so speke, be playn and open trew this reueled by god / and the contrary bylyefe is by the hole catholyke chyr­che playnely determyned for heresy / and syth men can not know that a mā byleueth the trewth in his herte, yf he hold agaynste it openly wyth hys [Page] mouth / & those therfore that speke heresyes, euery good man that hereth them is boū den to denoūce or accuse thē / and the bysshoppes are bounden vppon theyr wordes pro­ued to put them to penaunce and reforme them / whyche yf they refuse or fall in relapse, the bysshoppe is bounde to delyuer them, and all good temporall gouernours are than bounden to punyshe them: yf euery other man dyde on all sydes the parte of a good cry­sten man, it appereth that the polycy of those whome thys pacyfyer calleth so politike, wolde within a whyle proue a pore polycy.

How be it what mynd this pacyfyer hath hym selfe cōcerning [Page 143] these poyntes / hym selfe declareth that he byleueth y right waye & the trew. whych I am very gladde to here / & for my parte as helpe me god I veryly trust he fayneth not therin, but as a trew chrysten man veryly sayth as he thyn­keth. And yet is not euery mā therin of my mynde. And therfore it wolde be wronge yf euery some say & euery some thynke, sholde serue to bryng a man in hatered or obloquy. For surely some say that they thinke, that yf some men may as he sayth of polycy fayne them selfe heretykes, and yet bylyue full truely for all that in theyr hertes / some one man may myche better fayne hym self for polycy full catholyke, [Page] and yet in hys herte byleue the whyle full falsely. But what so euer some men say or some men thynke, in that ma­ter I neuer wyll thynke that a man byleueth other wyse than he sayth he doth, but yf hym selfe shold by some other wordes or dedes of hys own, declare of his mynde the con­trary. And as I wyll not a­gaynste a mannys wordes spokē accordyng to the ryght sayth, thinke that he byleueth wronge: surely so can I not thynke that he whyche in hys wordes openly inueyeth a­gaynste good and faythfull thynges, and dyspyseth trew poyntes of the comon knowē catholyke fayth, doth in hys hart secretely thynke and by­leue [Page 144] ryghte / but yf he were amonge Paynems that wold for fere of payn compell hym to renye hys fayth, whyche were yet in that case dampnable to hys soule, and therfore is here amonge chrysten men where no suche force compel­leth hym, but vppon hys pe­tell forbedeth hym, of very good reason dampnable to hys body.

The .xxiiii. chapyter.

HOwe be yt what thys good pacyfyer though he byleue ryght hym selfe and playnly protesteth the treuth of hys bylyete, yet what he wolde sholde be done eyther with those that agaynst theyr owne wronge wordes he byleueth [Page] to byleue tyght in theyre myndes, or wyth those eyther whome he byleueth to byleue wronge in dede, I can not very well gather of his wordes here. For here he saith of them thus: ‘And though some men haue mystaken them selfe in the sayde arty [...]fes / yet dyuerse other haue sayde that yf they had ben well and [...]harytably handeled, they myght haue ben reformed, & peraduenture saued in body and in soule.’

In these wordes I fynde agayn good readers a playne open declaracyon as in my mynde, that thys man byle­ueth in these artycles lyke a trewe catholyke man. For he confesseth in these wordes, that all those that haue dyed in the contrary bylyefe, bene perysshed in body and soule. For he sayth that some men [Page 145] saye, that wyth good hande­lynge they myghte haue bene reformed, and peraduenture saued in body and soule. So that it appereth by these wor­des, that neyther hym selfe thynketh, nor [...]hath herde so myche as any other men say, but that they be now playnly loste and perysshed for those heresyes. whyche is yet an other good token that he not onely byleueth well hym self, but also talketh not myche nor hath no such conuersacyō wyth heretykes, y they dare well and playnely put him in full truste. For yf he were / he sholde here them vndowtedly say, that those folke be saued soulys and holy sayntes / as Baynam that was late bur­ned [Page] sayde by Bayfelde bothe an heretyke and an apostata, that was burned about a yere before hym.

How be it though they call them saued sowles & saintes / yet wyll they say that they be not in heuyn. For there is no soule they saye / but in some place of rest they lye styll and slepe full soundely / and slepe shall they saye tyll Gabryels trumpe a wake them and call them▪ vppe erely, to ryse and recorde theyr apparence by­fore our sauyour at the gene­rall daye of dome.

But in good fayth this one thynge am I sorye to se, that syth hym self semeth to me so faythfull, and that therfore I can not ꝑsuade vnto my self, [Page 146] but that in his owne harte he loueth and fauoreth the cler­gye / whyche no man can as I thynke hartely hate, but he that hateth also y fayth: some of these wyly heretyques lyke the angelys of Sathan transfygurynge them selfe into the lykenes of angelys of lyght, sholde so deceyue this good man, and so abuse hys good gentell nature and symply­cyte, as to make hym wyth theyre wyly inuented fygure of some say, vnder a pyty pretēded toward those herytikes that are in theyr obstynacy peryshed, set his wordes in such wyse, as though his mynde were to aggreue and brynge in hatered amonge the peo­ple, the name and bodye of [Page] the clergye / by makynge the people wene that theyr ordy­naryes hadde wyth euyll and vncharytable handelyng, ben the occasyon that those here­tyques are bothe in soule and bodye destroyed / syth they myght as is here sayde vnder y fygure of some say, by good and charytable handelyng of the clergy, haue ben better reformed, and peraduenture in soule and body saued.

wold god these same some folke that so haue sayde vnto thys pacyfyer, hadde named hym at the lest wise some one, that was so euyll and so vn­charytably handeled, that the lacke of better and more cha­rytable handelynge, hath ben the losse of his bodye & soule. [Page 147] For then myght the clergy declare their demeanure toward that man / and then shold they perceyue by this pacyfyer, in whych parte of theyr delynge good charytable maner [...]ac­ked. But veryly whome so euer they sholde haue named / I [...]oute not but those y were the [...]rdyna [...]yes in the cause, cou [...]de easely proue that they [...] vsed no rygour to hym [...] the lawe, nor omyt­t [...] no charitable meane vnto hym that came to theyr myn­des, whyle the man lyued and the mater in theyr handes, nor in prouydyng for good exhortacyon towarde his conuersy on agayn and his saluacyon, euyn tyll the lyfe lefte hys bodye.

[Page] But nowe for as myche as some so say by thē concernyng some of theym that are gone / the clergye wolde I wene be yet gladde to here, in what wyse maner of charytable fasshyon this pytuouse pacyfyer wold haue them handle other heretyques hereafter, such as shall be denounced, and ex of­ficio broughte byfore theym.

For all be it y this pacifyer in a nother place, somwhat se­meth to mysse like that order: yet I fere me there wolde as I shall after shew you, many a place in the realme swarme very full, ere euer they were brought byfore the ordynary by the meane of accusacyon.

How be yt let vs putte the sample by some one, that is lykely [Page 148] to be broughte and dely­uered vnto the ordynarye, by the meane of the kinges grace and his counsayle. I mean Iohn̄ Fryth. For he is in pryson in y towre all redy taken by the bishoppes seruauntes, by the ayde of the kynges offycers at commaūdement of his grace and his counsayle, and so by the kynges offycers brought into the towre where he remayneth yet / and ther­fore he shall I doute not be brought as I sayd, and dely­uered vnto the ordynary.

Now then yf the ordynary knew this good pytuouse pa­cyfyer, and wolde bycause he seeth his good and charitable mynde, desyre hym of hys good aduyse and coūsayle, in [Page] what wise he myght beste and moste charitably handle hym for the sauynge of hys soule and body, the lawes of Chrystes chyrch obserued, that the sauynge of hym yf he wolde stycke sty [...]e in his obstynacy, shold not be y occasion of cor­ruptynge and destroynge the soules of other men / what coū sayle wolde this man geue hym?

Fyrste yf no man wolde pro­fesse him self for his accusare, and yet there wold twenty be redy when they were by commaundemēt of the court com­pelled, not to lette but depose y trewth, that he hath synnes he came in the towre, wry­ten a fresshe agaynste pur­gatory, and a boke that he calleth [Page 149] the Mirrour agaynst rel [...] gyouse, aduysyng euery man to geue none of them nothing though they be of that relygyon that nothing haue of theyr own / and twyse hath he there in lyke wyse wryten agaynste the catholyque fayth of Cryst concernynge the blessed sacrament of the aulter: whyther wolde now this pacifyer, that the ordynarye hauynge good prouys and yet none accuser, sholde procede agaynste hym ex officio, or ellys for lacke of an accuser lette him fayre go. If he wolde he sholde procede ex officio as I thinke he wolde thynke yt reason: what shold he then do, syth all can not be done in a day. whether shold he let hym walke abrode vpō [Page] his promise to appere agayn, whyche Fryth were lykely to breke and gete hym ouer see / or ellys take suertyes boūden for hys apparence, as Iohn̄ Purser and some such other were boūden for Iohn̄ Byrt, and force not to forfayt theyr bonde for bretherhed, but let hym slyppe a syde and neuer brynge hym forthe, and kepe hym close amōg the brethern as the tother was kept, tyll y postle maye make some bys­shoppes amonge the new brethern / & after his new Titus & Timothe stablyshed eche in his owne see, then the newe Poule thys apostle Fryth, take shippyng at Sandwych and sayle into Freselande.

wold this pacifyer aduyse the [Page 150] ordynarye thus / or ellys to kepe hym in pryson where he sholde do no hurte, and lette the walles and the lokkes be hys suertyes for hys forthe commynge.

Thus farre yet as I sup­pose thys pacyfyer wolde ad­uyse the ordynary to kepe Fryth faste. But now when hys heresyes were layed vnto hys charge, as for to gyue counsayle to the ordynary to exhorte Fryth to leue theym / this pacyfyer I dare say shall not nede, nor to take hym to grace neyther, nor to shewe hym great fauour vpon good tokens of hys repentaunce & amendement. But now yf he were one of thys pacyfyers polytykes, and wold say that [Page] he beleued euer the right way in hys owne harte contrarye to the wordes that hys owne hande wrote / but after the maner that this pacifyer speketh he wrote all these heresyes of polycye, bycause that by the bylyefe of purgatory, and of the sacrament of the aulter, & of myracles ī so many places so playnely shewed theron, he saw that offerynge & rychesse came into the clergye, and therfore wolde saye that he muste not be taken for an he­re [...]yke: but for a man wyse & polytyke: what aduyse wold here thys pacyfyer geue hys ordinary?

what counsayle wolde he geue the ordinary yf Fryth wolde make none excuse by [Page 151] policy, but saye that he w [...]ote agaynste purgatory and all relygyouse orders, and the sacrament of the aulter to, for loue y he bereth to the trouth / & that those heresyes be very fayth, by which he wyll abyde vnto the deth. what aduyse wyll thys pacyfyer geue the bysshoppe than? what good and cherytable handelynde wyll he deuyse to saue hys body & soule / specyally whan he shall se certayne letters whyche some of the bretherne lette fall of late, and lo [...]t them of lykelyhed as some good kytte leseth her kayes / by whiche letters both Tyndale and George Iay wryte vnto Fryth, and counsayle hym to stycke faste / and Tyndale [Page] sheweth hym that all the bre­thern loke what shall become of hym, and that vppon hys spede hangeth all theyr hope. I can not tell what good and cherytable handelynge thys pacyfyer can deuyse / but I dare say that there is neyther ordynary nor other honeste man spyrytuall nor tēporall, but that he is as sory as thys pacyfyer hym selfe, to se that yonge man or any other, so stobernly set in such heresies, that no man can shewe hym the fauour that euery man [...]ayne wolde, wythout the dys pleasure of god and perell of theyr owne sowlys and many other mennys to.

The .xxv. chapyter.

ANd vpon all these maters there [...] rysen a great opynyon in the peo­ple, in maner vnyuersally, that in puny shyng & correccions all these persons before rehersed sholde haue lyke punishemēt, yf spyritual men might haue free lyberty in that behalfe. And that spyrytuall men wold yf they coulde, as well put them to sylence, that speke agaynste the abusyon or dysorder of suche thinge [...] as be byfore rehersed, as them that spek [...] agaynst the thynge selfe.

Those wordes be not very well spoken of thys pacyfyer by the people. For yf he haue spoken wyth many mo then the tone halfe, and felt theyre opynyons hym selfe / ellys is yt not onely agaynst the spyritualty spokē very shamfully, but also to the false contry­ued rebuke of the whole pe­ple in maner vniuersally. For [Page] syth that neyther this pacyfy­er nor any man ellys, can brynge forth any one of these heretyques, that haue ben by theyr ordynaryes delyuered for theyr obstinacy in the seculare handes and burned, that haue hadde any wrong done them, or ben therin otherwyse hādeled then charyte wyth iu­styce, accordyng to the comen lawes of all Chrystes catho­lyke chyrch, and the lawes of thys realme haue requyred: there is no good man nor reasonable that hath any cause therby to conceyue by the clergye such a malycyouse folysh suspycyon, as thys pacyfyer here vntrewly layth vnto the whole people of thys realme in maner vniuersally / whan [Page 153] he maketh as though y hole people in maner vniuersally were so malycyouse and so folyshe, as bycause the clergy whyche hath towarde many heretykes bene ouer myche fauorable, haue of necessyte be dreuen to delyuer thē to the seculare handes & therin haue done them ryghte, he maketh as though the whole people were in maner vniuersally so madde and malycyouse, as theruppon to take an opynyō that to those whych are none heretykes the clergy wold do wronge.

Surely in thys one poynt is thys boke of hys the moste indyfferent that it is in any parte that I se therin. For there is no poynte in all the [Page] booke wherin it more dyffa­meth the spyrytualtye, then in thys one it dyffameth in maner all the whole people vnyuersally.

But now yf he say the peo­ple in maner vnyuersally, thynke that those whyche are as he saith for lacke of good & cherytable handelynge loste and peryshed in body & soule, had wronge and oughte not haue bene by the clergy dely­uered to the seculare hādes / and that therfore the whole people in maner vnyuersally do and well maye, thynke in theyr myndes that the clergy wolde in lykewyse do wrong to other, and brynge to lyke punysshemēt all those persōs that any thing speke agaynst [Page 154] onely the abusyons of suche thynge as brynge rychesse in to the chyrche: now can not thys pacifyer thus excuse his wordes. For he confesseth in hys owne wordes, that they whyche thus haue bene loste and perysshed, that myght as he sayth wyth good and che­rytable handelynge haue ben saued, be of those that haue mysse taken them self in those artycles of purgatory, tren­tallys, obitys, & pilgrimages, and haue as hym selfe sayth before, spoken agaynste them and dyspysed them / and then hadde they no wronge. For I am sure there was none of them, but that he was eyther relapsed, or ellys dyd of obstynacy stand styll in them. And [Page] then appereth it yet agayne, that in goynge aboute to dyf­fame the clergye, he dothe in dede greatly diffame the peo­ple / whan he sayth that by­cause the clergy hath punys­shed th [...]m that haue so farre myssetaken them self in those articles, that they haue spokē agaynst those holy thynges & dyspysed the thynges selfe, the people wolde be so farre vnreasonable as therfore to thynke y they wolde punyshe in lykewyse all those y wolde onely speke agaynst the abu­ses and not agaynst the thyn­ges. For all the people seeth perde, that the clergye punys­sheth those that speke against the sacramēt of matrymony / & yet they punysshe not those [Page 155] that speke against the abuses ther of, as aduowtry / or a­gaynste those that vnder the name of matrymony, lyue in sacrylege and incestuouse le­chery / as frere Luther doth & frere Lābert, & frere Huyskyn and Otho the monke, & suche other.

And yet yf he wyll go from his owne wordes agayn, and saye now that some of theym that be for lacke of good and charytable hādelyng in body and soule so peryshed, dyd not mysse take themselfe at al, nor dyd not speke agaynst any of y thīges, but dyd onely speke against the abuses, & that therfore he may without reproche of y peple well say y the peple haue an opinion, that the [...]ergy [Page] wolde yf they myght, haue fre lybertye in lyke maner to punyshe all other that wolde in lyke maner speke / that is to wytte not agaynste the good & holy thynges, but agaynste the abuses of them: to this I say yet ones agayne, that he styll dyffameth the people of a great intolerable faute, that is to wyt an vniuste and vn­reasonable iudgement / whyle he sayth that they thynke and byleue that the clergye hathe done to those men in so great a mater so great wronge, and hytherto not one such wrong proued.

But I shall in this poynt go yet a litle nerer hym. Sith he speketh of those that might wyth charytable handelynge [Page 156] haue ben in body and soule saved / yt appereth well as I haue sayde, that in thys pyece of his tale he speketh of those that haue not be saued, but in erthe here condemned and burned, and in hell dampned and there burning styll. Now as for any tyme so late byfore this brablynge or speche of a­ny dyuysyon betwene the spyrytualty and the temporalty, that this pacifyer might seme to meane of / I remēber none delyuered to the seculare handes, but syr Thomas Hytton at Maydestone, and syr Thomas Bylney at Norwyche, and one of late at Excester, & one of late in Lincoln̄ diocese, and in London here Bayfeld the monke, and Teuxbery the [Page] powchmaker, and Baynam. Now this wyll I say / let th [...]s pacyfyer come forthe / or yf he be any religyouse recluse that can not come abrode, let hym appere by attourney (How be yt, yt appereth that he can be none suche, but muste nedes be of lykelyhed some suche as gooth myche abrode, for eli [...]s he coulde not surely tell vs of so many some sayes, nor what opynyon the whole people of the realme hath in maner vniuersally) and therfore let hym come forth and appere in hys own proper person, byfore the kynges gra [...]e and his coun­sayle, or in what place he lyst, and there proue callynge me thereto, that any one of all th [...]se hadde wronge, but yf it [Page 157] were for y they were burned no soner / and bycause he shall not saye▪ that I bydde hym t [...]otte about for nought / thys shall I profer hym, that I wyll bynd my selfe for suerty and fynde hym other twayne bysyde of better substaunce then my selfe, that for euery one of these whom he proueth wrōged, hys ordynary or his other offycer by whome the wronge was done, shall gyue thys pacyfyer all hys costes done aboute the profe, and a reasonable rewarde bysyde.

And yet now though no man wolde gyue hym nothynge / it were hys part perde to proue it for hys owne honestye, syth he hath sayde so farre.

And thys dare I be bolde to [Page] offre, to se the trouth openly proued. After whych well proued onys to be as he sayeth, men may be bolde to saye the thynge that they se proued trew / & therupon yf they lyft, to cast & suspecte some ferther fere of the lyke, ye or of wurse yf they wyl, I wyl not let thē. But without any such thyng proued before / there wyll no reason nor good conscyence bere it, that we shuld suspecte that our prelates and ordynaryes in theyr iudgementes a­gaynste heretykes, vse to do them wrong / syth all y lawes bothe spyrytuall of the whole chyrch, and temporall of this realme, haue ordayned full fayth and credence to be gy­uen to them therin. whyche lawes to contrary now there [Page 158] appereth lytle cause, consyde­rynge that the kynge our so­uerayne lorde that now is & longe mote be, hathe in hys tyme as prudentely & as ver­tuousely prouyded for thys realme, that it sholde haue suche prelates and ordyna­ryes as sholde in lernynge, wysdome, iustyce, & lyuynge, be mete and conuenient ther­fore, as any prynce hath (nō ­ber for nōber) that hath reyg­ned ouer thys realme, I dare boldely say thys hūdred yere / and sholde in my mynde kepe my selfe a great waye within my boundes, all though I wolde sette an other hundred to it. But now lettynge thys pyece passe, wherin I myght yet saye many thynges mo [Page] then I do, & wolde saue that the bretherne wolde than call me longe, and wyll yet peraduenture say that I am scant shorte inough: lett vs go fer­ther and spede vppe thys one chapyter of hys.

The .xxvi. chapyter.

ANd many other mur [...]urs & grud­ges besyde these that be before re­hersed / be amonge the people, mo then I can reherse now: but yet a­boue all other me thynketh that it is most to be lamented and sorowed / that spyry­tuall men, knowynge these gr [...]dges and murmuracyons amonge the people, and knowynge also that many lay men haue opynyon, that a great occasyon therof ryseth by spyrytuall men, and that they do no more to appease thē, ne to order them selfe in no other maner for the appeasyng of them, then they do. For all that they do therin mo [...]e commenly is this: they take yt, that they that fynde defa [...]te at suche abusyons and dysorder / loue no pre­fies: & therfore they esteme that they do of [Page 159] malyce all that they do / to destroye the chyrch, and to haue theyr goodes and possessyons theym selfe: and therfore they thynke it a good dede to se them punished, so that they shall not be able to brynge theyr malyce to effect. And therfore haue they punyshed many pe [...]sons, wihch mych people haue iudged them to do vpon wyl / & of no loue vnto the people. And though spyrytuall men are bounde in thys case, for appeasynge of these opynyons in the people, whyche be so daungerous as well to syrytuall men, as to temporall men, that many soules stande in great peryll therby, not onely to reforme theym selfe, and to leue and auoyde all thynges, that gyue occasyon to the people so to offende / that may be charyte be omytted and lefte, but also to fas [...]e, pray, weare the heare, geue almoyse, and to do other good dedes for them selfe and for the people, cryenge contynually to our lorde / that these dyuysyons may cease, and that peace and con­corde may come agayne into the worlde: yet yt appereth not that they do so, but that they rather contynue styll after the olde course, pretendyng by confederacyes and worldely polycyes, and strayte correc [...]yons, to rule the people / and that ys [Page] greatly to be lamented, and yt wyll be harde for theym to brynge yt so aboute.

But yf they wolde a lytell meken theym selfe, and wythdrawe suche thynges a [...] haue broughte the people into thys mur­mur and grudge: they shold anone bryng a new lyght of grace into the worlde, and brynge the people to perfecte loue and obedyence to theyre superyours.

And here me thynketh I myght say far­ther in one thynge / and that is this, that as longe as spyrytuall rulers wyll eyther pretende / that theyr authorite is so hygh, and so immedyatly deryued of god, that the people are bounde to obaye them, and to accepte all that they do and teache / without argumentes, resystence, or grud­gynge agaynste them / or that they wyll pretende, that no defaute is in them, but in the people / and wyll yet contynue styll in the same maner, & after the same worldly contenaunce / as they do now / and haue done late tyme paste: the lyght of grace that is spoken of before, wyll not appere / but that bothe partyes shall walke in this darkenes of malyce and diuysyon / as they haue done in tyme paste.

Hys other murmours & grudges that he sayth he cannot [Page 160] now reherse, he reherseth after many of theym in hys other chapyters / whyche I wyll passe ouer vntowched, bothe for that the more parte of them be such as euery wyse man wyll I suppose answere them hym selfe in the redyng, and satysfye hys owne mynd wythout any nede of myne helpe therin / & for that some thinges are there also therin, that are very well sayed / and some also that be they good or badde, I purpose not to medyll mych wythall, as are the thynges that towche any lawes or statutes all redymade, be they of the chyrch or of the realme, defende theym I am cōtent to do, yf I thinke them good. But on the tother [Page] syde yf I thynke thē nought / albe it that in place and tyme conuenyent I wolde gyue myne aduyce and counsayle to the chaūge, yet to put out bookes in wrytynge abrode amonge the people agaynste them, that wold I neyther do my selfe, nor in the so doynge commēde any man that doth. For yf the lawe were suche as were so farre agaynst the law of god, that it were not possy­ble to stande wyth mānys saluacyon / than in that case the secrete aduyse and counsayle maye bycome euery man / but the open reprofe and redar­gucyon therof may not in my mynd well bycome those that are no more spyrytuall than I. And surely yf the lawes [Page 161] maye be kepte and obserued without perel of soule though the chaunge might be to y better: yet out of tyme and place conuenient to put the defaw­tes of y lawes abrode among the people in wrytynge, and wythoute any surety of the chaūge geue the people occa­syon to haue the lawes in de­rysyon, vnder whyche they lyue, namely syth he y so shal vse to do may somtyme myssetake the mater, and thynke the thynge not good wherof the chaunge wolde be worse: that way wyll I not as thus aduysed neyther vse my selfe nor aduyse no frende of myne to do. And therfore I wyll as I saye leue some thynges of his boke vntouched, whyther [Page] he sya wel or euill. And final­ly for y the towchyng of thys mater is no parte of my pryncypall entent, but happeneth as an incydent to fall in my waye, wherin it suffyseth by the cōsyderacyon of one piece or twayne, to geue men an oc­casyon to loke well to the re­manaunt, and let it not ouer lightly synke depe down into the brest, tyll it be well cham­med & chowed in the mouth / & not onely se what he sayth, but also by the wysedome of the reder consyder what may be sayd agaynste it / and who so hath wytte and redeth it in that wyse, shall I warraunte you soone perceyue that mild indifferent boke, to bere more shrewde store of euyll stuffe [Page 162] therin, then the brethern that boste it wolde that such good folke sholde se, as of a good mynde menyng none harme, wene euery thynge were well ment that they se fayre set out to the shewe, and softe and smothely spoken.

The .xxvii. chapyter.

I wil not also sticke mych vpon his hygh solemne dyuynacyon, wherin he pro­phecyeth that as longe as the spyrytuall rulers wyl eyther pretēde that theyr authoryte is so hygh, and so immedyatly dyryued fro god, that the peple are bound to obay theym, and accepte all that they teache, wythout argument, re [...]ystence, or grudge / and that they wyll pretende that no defaute is in theym, but wyll yet cōtinue [...]tyl in the same maner, & the same worldely c [...]tenaunce as they do now and haue done in late tyme paste / the lyght of [Page] grace that is spoken of before, be with you now & euer more amen.

This ende of this holy sermon is to lytle purpose. For fyrst as for wordly cōtenaūce is amonge the clergy wythin these few yeres not a lytle a­bated. whyche thynge who so lyste wyth an euyn eye to loke vppon yt, and indyfferently consyder yt, shall not fayle to ꝑceyue. And so there is good hope, yf that may helpe the mater, that then the lyghte of the grace that this gracy­ouse pacyfyer spake of before, is not now very farre behynd. And veryly for aught that I can se, a great part of y proud and pompose appareyll that many prestes in yeres not lōg paste, were by the pryde and [Page 163] ouer syght of some few, forced in a maner against theyr own wyllys to weare, was before his godly coūsayle so by this pretye prented boke pryuyly geuen theym in theyr eare, myche more I trowe then the tone half spent, and in maner well worne oute. And I wote well yt is worne out with many, whyche entende herafter to bye no more suche agayn. And for the resydue of the coū tenaunce I dare be bolde to waraunt, that I can fynde of those that moste may spende, whyche were they sure that yt sholde in thys mater do any good, wold be well cōtente to withdraw from all theyr other coūtenaunce the chyefe parte of theyr mouables, & of theyr [Page] yerely lyuelode to, and oute of hande bestow the tone, and wyth theyr owne hand yerely bestowe the tother openly among the pore. And I durst agayne be bolde to warraunt that yf they so dyd / euyn the selfe same folke that nowe grudge and call them proude for theyr coūtenaunce, wolde then fynde as great a grudge and call theym ypocrytes for theyre almoyse, and saye that they spende vppon noughtye beggers the good that was wonte to kepe good yomen, and that therby they both en­feble and also dyshonour the realme.

Now as for the tother part of his prophesye, concernyng that the lyghte of grace that [Page 164] he spake of before, wyll not appere as long as spyrytuall rules wyll pretēde that theyr authory [...]e is so hyghe and so immediately deryued of god, that the people are bounden to obaye them and to accepte all that they do & teche, wythout argumentes resistence or grudgynge agaynste theym: in thys parte he muste fyrste declare whyther he meane in thys wordes, theyr authoryte, all theyr hole authoryte, or theyr authoryte in some parte. If he mene that they say thus of all theyr whole authoryte in euery thynge that they maye now at this tyme lawfully do or saye: I answere that they neither [...]tēde nor neuer dyd, all that authoryte to be gyuē [Page] theym immedyately by god / but haue authorite now to do dyuerse thynges by y graūte of kynges & prynces, as haue also many tēporall men / & by those graūtes haue such right in those as tēporall men haue by the like graūtes in theyrs. And therfore in that part the pacyfyer is answered.

And thā yf he meane that the lyght of hys grace that he spake of byfore, wyll not ap­pere as longe as the prelates pretende y any parte of theyr authoryte is so hyghe that it is immedyately gyuen them of god / then hath thys pacy­fyer loste the lyght of treuth. For the greatest, and highest, and most excellent authoryte that they haue, eyther god [Page 165] hath gyuen theym, hym selfe or ellys they be very presūp­tuouse & vsurpe many t [...]yn­ges farre aboue all good rea­son. For I haue neuer redde, or at the leste wyse I remem­ber not that I haue redde, y euer any kyng graūted them the authoryte, that now not onely prelates but other pore playne prestes also dayly do take vpon thē, in mynistryng the sacramentes and conse­cratynge the blessed body of Cryste, wyth dyuerse other authorytees besyde

But it semeth to hym per­aduenture, that in one poynte at the leste wyse y spyritualty ys to prowde. For he saythe they pretende to be obayed, & haue theyr ordynaunces and [Page] theyr teachynges obserued, without resystence grudge or argumentes to the contrary. Surely in suche thynges as the whole clergy of chrysten­dome techeth and ordereth in spyrytuall thynges, as be dy­uerse of those lawes whyche thys pacyfyer in some places of this boke toucheth, beynge made agaynst heretikes / and albeit that they be and longe haue bene thorow the whole corps of chrystendome bothe temporalty and spyrytualty, by longe vsage and custome ratyfyed agreed and confyr­med, yet he layeth some lacke in them callynge theym very sore / in those thynges I saye, that syth I no thynge dowte in my mynde / but in that con­gregacion [Page 166] to goddys honour gracyousely gathered toge­ther, the good assystēce of the spyryte of god is accordynge to Crystes promyse as very [...]y present & assystente as it was with his blessed apostles, mē ought wyth reuerence & wyth out resystence, grudge, or ar­gumentes to receyue theym. And yf a prouyncyall coun­sayle erre / there are in Cristes chyrche ordynary wayes to reforme it. But in suche thyn­ges as any spyrytuall gouer­nours after a lawfull order & forme, deuyse for the spyry­tuall weale of theyr sowles that are in theyr charge, and whyche thynges are suche as good folke maye soone per­ceyue them for good / in these [Page] thynges at the lest wyse shold the good not geue eare to the bad folke and frowarde, that agaynste the beste thyng that can be deuysed can neuer lacke a fonde frowarde ar­gument. And therfore not onely thapostles beynge dyuerse, assembled togyther wyth the chyrch in theyr coū ­sayle holden at Hierusalem, dyd in those lawes that they there deuised and prouulged amōge the gentyls that were in dyuers countrees farre of conuerted vnto Cryste, dyd wyth authoryte wryte vnto them, these thinges haue se­med both to vs and to the spyryte of god necessary for you to kepe, leste some stoborne folys wolde peraduenture be [Page 167] bolde wyth frowarde argu­mentes and reasonynge to resyste it▪ but saynt Poule also by hym selfe whan he deuysed vnto the Corinthyes certayn good lawes and orders con­cernynge theyr order that he wolde haue them kepe in the chyrch in tyme of goddes ser­uyce, leste such as wold fayne wyth dysputynge agaynste good order, be taken and re­puted for wyse, sholde wyth some propleme pulled out of a peny pycher, enueigle and corrupte the company, whom farre the febler reason maye drawe to the wurse parte for affeccyon vnto lewd lyberty: he fynally bysyde the reasons that he layed for hys law, dyd putte theym to sylence wyth [Page] his authoryte / and forbidyng thē to reason or dyspute there agaynste but obaye it sayed, agaynste all suche argumen­tes and such choppelogiques agaynste good rulys, yf any man wyll be contencyouse in thys mater, lette hym well knowe that we haue no suche guyse or custome, nor y chyr­ches of god.

But now wyll thys pacy­fyer peraduēture, say that he neyther speketh nor meaneth of suche thynges as the spyrytualtye doth or sayth that ys good / but that the lyghte of grace wyll not appere as longe as the prelates pretende that theyr authorite is so hygh & so immediate of god, that the people are [...]ounde to obaye them, and to accept all that they do and t [...]he / with our argumentes, resistence, or grudgyng / [Page 168] so that he hath cyrcumspectly for the nones qualyfyed and modered his tale wyth thys worde all, that the prelates shold not pretēde to be obayed in thynges as well badde as good. who herde euer the pre­lates of this realme pretende thys? that they sholde be o­bayed in all thynges were the thynges bad or good? I am very sure that euer hytherto they haue professed the cōtra­rye / and not letted to say, that yf euer any prelate of thys realme, ye or the moste parte of theym, ye or all the whole mayny were so farre fallē fro god, as to preache the contrary of our olde knowen catho­lyque fayth / as for ensample that there were no purgatory [Page] after thys worlde, or that yt were not lawfull to praye to our blessed lady or other holy saynts, or to preche that there is yet neuer a saynt in heuen, but that all soules lye styll & slepe, or to preache agaynst penaunce as Tyndale dothe, that is as lothe good tender pernell to take a litle penaūce of the preste, as the lady was to come any more to dyspe­lynge that wepte euyn for tender herte two days after whē she talked of yt, that the prest hadde on good frydaye wyth the dyspelynge rodde beten her hard vpon her lyly whyte handes: who so wolde I say preche any of these heresyes, or that in y blessed sacrament of the auter were not the very [Page 169] body and very blood of Crist, but as Fryth teacheth no­thynge but wyne and brede, or elles as Tyndale testeth starch ī stede of brede / though there wolde hereafter (whych shall I trust neuer happen) all the prelates in this realme fall therto & preache the same, yet all the prelates hytherto playnly do preache and teach that no laye man sholde then byleue them.

And therfore lyke as yf the prelates dyd pretēde y thyng that this pacyfyer speketh of, then were his aforesayd wor­des well and wisely tempered and crycumspectly spoken / so whyle they neyther preteude that thynge nowe, nor neuer here before dyd, there is lytle [Page] wytte in those wordes. For now doth all his tale amount vnto no more, but y the lyght of grace wyll neuer appere, as long as the prelates do the thynge that they neyther do nor neuer dyd. Is not thys therfore good readers by this good pacyfyer brought vnto a wyse conclusyon?

The .xxviii. chapyter.

NOw where he moste lamenteth that the cler­gye dothe no more to appease these grudges of the tempo­raltye towarde them, and af­ter he preacheth to them holy­ly what thynges they sholde do that they do not, that is to wyt, forbere such thynges as he spake of byfore / wherby he [Page 170] specyally meaneth as bothe before and in dyuerse places after appereth, the euyll & vncharytable handelyng of heretyques, wherof the man hath nothing proued / but also that they shold do thynges whych he sayth men se them not do, that is to saye geue almoyse, and were heare, and fast,▪ and pray, that this dyuysyon may cease: now y all the spyrytual men do not so, that is very trewe. And yt is as trewe I trow that this thousande yere was neuer the tyme that all so dyd. And therfore yf that thyng cause and kepe in this dyuysyon, yt muste haue ben a thynge of a thousande yere olde. But I thynke that ma­ny of, them do all these thyn­ges [Page] whyche this pacyfyer precheth to haue done. For I am sure that though some do not theyr part therin / yet amōge y spiritualty ther is both geuīg of grete almoyse, & wearynge of heare, and fastyng, & pray­enge for peace. But whether they take this dyuysyon to be so great and so vnyuersall as this pacyfyer speketh of, that can I not tell, and peraduen­ture they do not. And whether they do or no / surely I do not. Nor whyther they praye for the pacyfycacyon of thys dyuysyon in all suche maner wyse as the thyng requyreth, that I can not tell / but there may be peraduenture therin some ouer syght vppon theyr part. For if they leue nothing [Page 171] vnprayed for that maye per­teyne to y pacificacyō of thys dyuysyon, then must they peraduenture put into theyr ser­uyce both matens, masse, and euynsonge, some specyall collect, and therin pray god that yt may please hym that the peple maye perceyue the sotle sleyghtes of the deuyll & some other of hys lymes, in many partes of this boke of this pacyfycacyon / whyche thynges peraduenture the compyler perceyued not hym selfe, but was therin of symplycyte by some sotle shrewe deceyued.

The .xxix. chapyter.

BUt this pacyfyer per­ceyuynge that what one man doth in secretenesse, [Page] a nother can not se / is therfore bolde to saye they do not all those thynges which he wold haue theym do / that is wytte, faste, & pray, were heare, and geue almoyse. For he sayth that they do al [...] these thynges yt appe­reth not.

As for prayenge, yt appe­reth perdye they do. And that so myche they dayly pray, as some of vs lay men thynke yt a payne ones in a weke to rise so sone fro slepe, and some to tarye so longe fastynge as on the sonday to come and here oute theyr matens. And yet is not the matens in euery pa­ryshe neyther, all thynge so erly begonne nor fully so long in doynge, as yt is in the chartrehouse ye wote well. And [Page 172] yet at our slouth and glotony that are lay people, this pacyfyer can wynke & fayne hym selfe a slepe. But that the clergye prayeth not, that can he shortely spye, as sone as theyr lyppes leue styrynge.

Howe be yt bycause he is peraduenture of the clergye hym selfe / therfore leste he sholde seme parcyall to hys owne parte, he rather spe­keth of theyre defautes then oures: wherin I wyll not myche stryue wyth hym. But surely as he may be bolde to preache beynge a prest / so yf I were a preste to, I wolde be bolde to preche thus mych agayne to hym, that for any wynnynge of the glosse and fame of indifferēcy, though he [Page] leue y fautes of vs lay peple vntoucheth, yet of his owne parte the clergye, for no laye mennys pleasure he neuer sholde say more then treuth.

For nowe as towchynge of almoyse / is there none geuyn troweth he by the spy­rytualtye? If he saye as he sayeth here, that it appereth not y they do gyue almoyse / I myghte answere agayne that they folow therin the coū sayle of Cryst, whyche sayth lette not thy lefte hande se what thy ryghte hande doth / as I myght in prayeng haue layed those other wordes of Cryst, Thou whan thou wylt praye entre into thy chamber & shette the dore, and pray to thy father priuely. But like [Page 165] wyse as god for all that counsayle was content that men sholde bothe praye and gyue to the nedy, and do other wurkes bothe of penaunce and of cheryte, openly abrode in cō ­pany where there be no desire of vayn glory, but y the peo­ple by the syghte therof, may haue occasyon to gyue ther­fore laude and glory to god: so dare I boldely lay that as they both secretely and opēly to, do vse & accustome to pray so do they both secretely and openly to, gyue no lytell al­moyse ī the yere what so euer thys pacyfye saye. And I somwhat meruayle that syth thys pacyfyer goth so bysyly abrode, y there is no Some saye any where all most in all [Page] the whole realme, but that he hereth it and can reherse it / I meruayle I saye not a lytell that he neyther seeth nor he­reth any some saye, that there is in the spyrytualty gyuen any thynge in almoyse. I vse not myche my selfe to go very farre abrode, and yet I here some say that there is / and I se somtyme my selfe so many poore folke at westmynster at the dolys, of whome as farre as euer I harde, the munkes vse not to sende awaye many vnserued, that my self for the preace of them haue ben fayn to ryde another waye.

But one answered me to thys onys, and sayed that it was no thanke to them / for it was landes that good pryn­ces [Page 174] haue gyuen them. But as I than tolde hym agayne / it were than myche lesse thanke to them, that wold now gyue good prynces euill counsayle for to take it fro them.

And also yf we call it no gyuynge of almoyse by them, bycause y lādes whereof they gyue it, other good men haue gyuen them / wherof wyl you haue them gyue almoyse, for they haue none other.

The .xxx. chapyter.

ANother thynge also whych thys pacyfyer semeth to disprayse vnder the name of proude worldely coū tenaūce / yf men were as redy in a dede of hys owne nature indifferent, to cōstrue y mynd [Page] and entent of the doer to the better part, as they be of their owne in warde goodnes to cō strue & report it to the worse / than myghte I saye that the same thynge whych they call the prowde worldely counte­naunce, they myghte & wolde call a ful cherytable almoyse / that is to wytte the ryghte honest fyndynge & good bryngynge vp of so many tempo­rall men in theyr seruyce / whiche though they be no beg­gers, yet myghte peraduen­ture the greate parte of them go begge if they founde them not, but sent them abrode to seke them selfe a seruyce.

And lyke as yf you wolde giue a pore man some money bycause he nedeth, and yet [Page 167] wolde make hym worke therfore in your gardayne, lest he sholde by your almoyse lyue idell and waxe a loyterer, the labour that he dothe taketh not away the nature & meryte of your almoyse: no mo [...]e it maketh the fyndynge of ser­uaūtes none almoise, though they wayte on the fynder and do hym seruyce in hys house. And of all almoyse the chyefe is, to se theym well broughte vppe, and well and honestely guyded. In whyche poynte though neyther parte do full theyr dutye / yet I suppose in good fayth, that the spyrytu­alty goth in that poynt which is no small almoyse, rather somewhat afore vs then anythynge dragge behynde vs.

The .xxxi. chapyter.

THen foloweth there fa­stynge / whiche thynges the spyrytualty doth as I suppose, all suche as kepe styll the olde chrysten fayth, and fall not vnto these newe heresyes.

But thys pacyfyer fyndet [...] a faute, and reherseth oute of Iohn̄ Gerson, that the clergy kepeth not nowe the [...] we by whyche it was ordey [...]d that the clergye sholde [...] a len­ger lent thē they now do. And wolde god as saynte Poule sayth, that both they and we coulde and wold euery daye. But this pacyfyer that is so well sene in the lawes of the chyrche, seeth well ynough that the vnyuersall custome [Page] to y cōtrary, dischargeth th [...] [...]onde of that lawe, though peraduenture yt dyscharged not them that fyrst began the breche whereby the custome grewe. For as for fastynge / the [...] of the cūtrey may eyther to the bonde or to the dyscharge and interpretacyō of the [...] made therfore, the custome I saye maye do myche, as saynte Austayne sheweth in [...]o places thē one. For yf it were otherwyse / then fasted almoste no man any [...]ast at all at this daye whyle we dyne at none. For the very [...]aste was of olde, as both by the scrypture and holy wry­ters appereth, to forbere theyr meale tyll nyght / whyche ys as ye se all chaūged. And the [Page] chyrche to condescende vnto our infyrmyte, hath be fayne therfore to say in lent theyre euyn songe byfore none / and bysyde the naturall dayes, to deuyse vs new dayes ex fictio­ne iuris, that we shold at the lest haue euynsonge in the lenton faste byfore we fall to meate. And yet we kepe not that neyther. But as an Almayne of myne acquayntaunce, when I blamed hym lately for not fastyng vpon a certayne day, answered me, Fare to sould telaye men fasten, let te prester faste [...]: so we begynne god wote to faste full lytle for our owne parte / but byd the pre­ster go fasten. And where our selfe wold for our owne parte be fayn that the lent were two [Page 177] wekes lesse: yet wold we that for the clergye the [...]ent were one weke lenger. But some of them tosse yt [...]ro them selfe as faste, and sende yt to the fre­res. And veryly relygyouse folke vse I trow both longe lentes and aduent to, & some of theym dyuerse other fastes besyde / and they be perdye a great parte of the spyrytu­altye.

The .xx [...]ii. chapyter.

[...]Hen preacheth this pacyfyer yet farther, [...]ha [...] the ciergye shold were heare. He is surely somwhat sore, yf he bynde them all thereto / but amonge theym I thynke that many do all redy / and some whole relygyon doth. But [Page] yet sayth this pacifyer, that yt doth not appere y they do so▪ Ah well sayde. But now yf al the lacke stand in that poynt, that suche holynes is hydde, so that men may not se yt / yt shall be from hens forth well done for theym, and so they wyll do yf they be wyse, vpon this aduertysement and preachyng of this good pacyfyer, come oute of theyre cloysters euery man into the market place, and there knele downe in the kanell and make theyr prayours in the open stretes, & were theyre shyrtes of heare in syght vppon theyr coulys / and then shall yt appere, and men shall se yt. And surely for theyr shyrtes of heare in thys waye were there none ypo­crysye [Page 178] / and yet were there also good polycye, for then sholde yt not pryck them.

The .xxxiii. chapyter.

BUt as for all this pacyfyers preachynge, the spyrytualty may be contente to take in good worth. For peraduētur if he were knowē, he were such one as to preche to all the spyrtualtye myghte well become hys personage / and yet yf he be but a symple person in dede, yet the spyry­tualty may meken them selfe accordynge to his good counsayle, and admyt his holsome admonycyons. But surely this one thynge, though the spyrytualtye bere yt and take yt well in worth / me thynketh [Page] y [...]t that euery good tempo­ral man may very mych misselyke, that this pacyfyer in the begynnynge of this his holy preachynge, preacheth vppon them to theyre sore slaunder / fyrst with an vntrew surmyse grounded vppon ymagynacyon, & after wyth a very playn open lye / neyther an ydle lye nor of any good purpose (of whyche two kyndes of lyeng saynt Austayn admytteth neyther nother, in folke of y per­feccyon that th [...]s pacyfyer by his preachyng vsed with such authoryte towarde all the spyrytualtye, sholde seme to be) but a lye very pernycyouse, [...]hyche is one of the thynges y leste can become any good crysten man.

[Page 179] For fyrste hy sayth, that all that the [...]pyrit [...]a [...]ty doth to the appea­syng o [...] the peop [...]e is mo [...]e c [...]menly this, th [...]t they take yt that they that fynde de­faute at abusy [...]n [...] and dysorder of the [...] that they do yt of ma [...]yce all that they d [...], to de [...]troye the chyrche.

Thys is a goodly [...] false surmyse, groūded as I sayed vppon a cherytable imagynacion. But for all this, though good temporall men be euyll content wyth suche as are in the spyrytualty nought, with whome the good folke of the spyrytualtye be as euyll con­tent as they: yet I veryly truste for all thys as I saye, that not the temporaltye nor any one good temporal man, is for them that are nought amonge the spyrytualtye, so dyspleased & angry agaynste [Page] the spyrytualtye, that is to wytte agaynst the corps and body therof, that they sholde greately nede to be appeased / nor do not laye the fawtes of noughty spyrytuall persons, to the rebuke of the hole spy­rytualtye / no more then they wolde thynke it reason, that y straūgers of other realmes so sholde laye the fawtes of euyll temporall folke here to the rebuke of the whole tem­poraltye, y they shold grudge and saye shrewdely by vs for them.

Now yf this pacyfyer wyll saye that it is not lyke / & wyll saye that we be not sewtely y temporaltye and spyrytualty of this realme / but that we be mych better for our part then [Page 180] the spyrytualty be for theyrs: the temporaltye shall not be dispraysed for me. For I trust that though in respecte of the goodnes that goddes benefytes vnto man requyreth of men agayne / and in respecte of the constaunce and perse­ueraunce in vertue that men sholde holde faste and kepe, there are fewe or none good in neyther nother parte: yet in such kynde of goodnes as the frayltye of our nature suffreth in thys worlde, now vp now downe, now fallynge by synne & now rysynge agayne by grace, the temporaltye is good I truste and the spyry­tualtye both, for all that there lacketh not a sorte of some suche as are very desperate [Page] deuylysshe wreches in bothe / as no man dowteth but there was a very good chyrche of Cryste in hys blessed apostles dayes, & yet were there [...] many full very nought & starke heretykes to therin.

And as for the dyfference in goodnes bytwen them and vs, god knoweth the better & the wu [...]se bothe. But straun­gers of other cou [...]treys that come hycther and se bothe (sa­uynge some that haue come bothe oute of Fraunce and Flaūders, and haue here be putte in trouble by the spyry­tualty for bryngyng in of Luthers gospe [...]) other straūgers ellys I saye whan they haue cōsidered y spiritualty of this realme, & cōpared the [...] in theyr [Page 181] myndes not onely wyth the temporaltye of the same, but also wyth the spyrytualtye of theyr owne countreys, haue sayed that oure spyrytualtye maye wythout any specyall reproche, shewe theyr facys among other folke. And ther­fore that the whole body of y spyrytualltye of thys realme is so farre fallē in the grudge and indygnacyon of the hole temporaltye, as thys pacy­fyer speketh / I neyther se cause why it sholde so, nor yet byleue that it is so, nor thinke it eyther good or honorable for thys realme that other realmes shold wene it were so

But where as thys pacy­fyer speketh of appeasyng: I pray god that some of the spyrytualtye [Page] haue not in some thynges gone aboute ou [...]r myche to appease that sort of p [...]ple, by whose meanys they haue thought that all theyr [...]is [...]ase hath come / those folke [...] [...]aye of whome by good in­formacyon they haue had de­te [...]ted vnto theym for [...]ery starke here [...]ikes in dede / whō yt for any fere of suche other folkes false suspycyon spryn­gynge vppon suche slaunde­rouse lyes as thys pacyfyer speketh of, and groūdeth hys conclusyons vpon, the clergy begynne to spare / and for any [...]uc [...]e causes begyn to slak [...], and be the mo [...]e remisse in the callynge▪ attachyng, and cra [...]myny [...]ge, and of the ferther o [...]d [...]rynge of heretykes, god [Page 182] wyll not fayle to make fall in theyr neckes the dowble slaū ­der of that from whyche they fle. For whan they wa [...]e so faynt harted in hys greate cause of repressynge of here­syes and maynteyn [...]nge of hys fayth, that they forbere theyr dewty for fere of false slaunderouse wordes / god wyll than make them fall into the more slaunder, by the selfe same meanys by whiche they fle fro the lesse. For instede of the false slaunder of euyll men and here [...]ikes that they fere in the pursewynge / god wyll sende them a trewe slaunder, and make theym be dyffamed amonge good men & catholyk [...]s, for theyr slacke and remysse handelyng. And [Page] ferther yf they fall into y foly that the prophete reproueth, and ceace to call vppon god for strēgth, and then tremble for drede where there is no perell, and for any drede of men whych yf they not onely wold slaunder the [...] but bete them and kyll them to, can yet kyll but the body and than haue spette all theyr poysen, wolde forgete the fere: god (whiche whan he hath slayne the body maye sende y soule into euer­lastynge fyre) yf (whych oure lorde forbede) any bysshoppe fall in thys fere & cowardyse of faynt harte, that for a [...]y worldly fere they suffer to be blowen out the lyghte of hys lant [...]rne of fayth, he wyll no [...] fayle to make fall vpon them [Page 183] the terryble commynacyon & thrette that the spyryt speketh of in the Apocalyps vnto the byshoppe of Ephesye, I wyll come and remoue thy candel­stycke oute of his place.

The .xxxiiii. chapiter.

NOw where this pacy­fyer here surmyseth, y the spyrytualtye dothe moste cōmunely nothynge ellis, but malycyousely mysconstre the myndes, and therfore malycyousely persecute and pursew the bodyes of all them y fynd defaure at theyr dysorder and abusyons: y vntrewth of this surmyse well and playne ap­pereth by this that euery man dayly hereth, that there is not in all the clergye any man [Page] that vseth to preache the wo [...]de of god, but that as he toucheth the [...]autes of the temporalty, suche as he seeth in that audyēce metely to be spoken of / so toucheth he in lyke w [...]se the f [...]utes of the spyry­ [...]alty / & is for his so doynge not ha [...]ed o [...] the spyrytaulty, no more then of the temporaltye, but well commended of both. But of trouth, he y wold ey [...]er vppon the spyrytualty alone, or vppon the temporaltye alone, or vppon any one parte of eyther the tone or the tother, as of onely kynges, or onely dukes, or onely lordes, or onely ge [...]tylmen, or onely men of law, or onely marcha [...] ̄tes, make h [...]s whole sermon, whē that one part onely were [Page 184] not his whole audyence / and wolde by that parte amonge all folke saye many shrewed thynges by maner of exhortacyon to thamēdynge: though euyl [...] folke and malycyouse wolde haue a pleasure to here y [...] ▪ yet wolde no good folke & indyfferēt thynke that he dyd well / and specyally yf he wold vse that maner, where hym selfe pretended that all the remanaunte of hys audyenc [...] were in grudge and diuysyon al redy agaynst that one part / whose fautes and vyces all his whole sermon holyly put­teth in all the peoples earys to mytygate theyre hatered wyth / and wyth suche prea­ [...]hynge so to make the peace in lyke maner wyse, as y [...] [Page] he fownde a corner of hys neyghbours house burnyng, he wolde of great loue & polycye lay on fagottes and gun­powder to put out the [...]yre.

The .xxxv. chapyter.

NOw where thys pacy­ [...]yer vppon that mysse ymagyned surmyse, goth on farther & sayth, that bycause the clergye so mysse constrew­eth the myndes of all those y fynde f [...]ute a [...] theyr mysse or­der and abusyons, therfore they [...] yt a good d [...]de to se theym punys­ [...]hed▪ & they▪ haue therfore punyshed many pers [...]ns, whyche myche people haue iud­ged them to do vppon wyll and not of no [...]ue to the people: in these wordes how charytably this pacyfyerment I can not tell / but ey­ther by malyce or ouersyght, [Page 185] eyther by defau [...]e of hym selfe or crafte of some sotle shrewe, these wordes are as euyll and as malycyously wryten, as any one y wold fayne falsely dyffame the clergy could ymagyne or deuyse.

For here he sayth that by­cause they haue (as hym selfe bereth them in hande) conceyued a false suspycyon agaynst all those that fynde faute at theyr mysseorder and abusy­ons / therfore they not onely haue persecuted and punys­shed many persones, but also thynke theyr wronge full persecucyon and vnryghtuouse punyshement well done. what can be worse done then thys? and therfore as this doynge were the worst that could be, [Page] yf yt were trew / so is this say­enge the very worste that can be syth yt ys very false.

And in these wordes the figure of some say wyll not wel serue hym / and yet in yt co­meth here also myche augmē ted and increased, in that he sayth not that some men so say, but that myche people so [...]udgeth. How be yt as I sayd thys fygure wyll not serue hym here. But he playeth like a wyly thefe, that bycause he wolde not be knowen wolde were a vysour / and yet forge­tyng hym selfe, wolde fyrste come forth bare faced / & when euery may had sene hym and marked hym well, wold then put on his vysour a pace, and couer hys vysage to walke [Page 186] awa [...] vnknowen. Euyn thus wysely lo playeth this pacy­fyer here. For fyrste he sayth as of hym selfe, that the cler­gye hath punyshed many persons therfore / that is to wytte for the euyll and false sus­spycyon that they haue cōceyued agaynste all those y fynde faute in the [...]r misseorder and abusyons. And when he hath thus sayde as of hym selfe, & therby well shewed hym selfe / then to couer and coloure yt wyth, he sayth that mych people iudgeth so. And therfore his whole tale amounteth vnto no more, but that hym selfe fyrste affermeth yt, and after confermeth his affermac [...]on by the pretence that myche people iudgeth the same / of [Page] whyche myche people he na­meth yet neuer one, nor proueth that myche people so doth, nor sheweth cause wherfore eyther myche people or lytle people, or any one person so sholde / but bryngeth forth a bare surmyse in suche wyse ymagyned agaynste the clergy, as euery man that lyst to lye, may sone ymagyne in some other mater agaynste a­ny temporall men.

But as for his myche peo­ple I sette not myche by. For mych people maye somtyme b [...]leue some one mannys lye. And agaynst his mych peple, yf there were myche of theym that so iudge before the prof [...] and fishe before the nette, and set the carte before the horse, [Page 187] as I wene there is not: yet is there agaynst them myche other peple more wyse in that poynt, and more cyrcūspecte, whyche tyll they se suche an euyll tale proued trewe, wyll eyther of indyfferencye kepe them selfe in a stay, & suspend theyr s [...]ntēce for the season, or ellys o [...] a good mynde rather for the whyle thynke and by­leue the contrary.

Lettynge therfore for this tyme hys mych people passe / I wolde now demaunde of hym how he proueth thys a­bominable fawte that he lay­ [...]th here to the spyrytualtye hym selfe / where he sayeth playnely y they▪ haue punys­shed many persons therfore, that is to wyt [...]e for the thyng [Page] that he there hath rehersed / which is ye wote wel, bycause they haue he sayth conceyued a false suspycyon agaynste them, for fyndyng defaute at theyr mysseorder and abusy­ons, and take it as though they loued not the clergy▪ but of malyce wolde destroye the chyrche & haue theyr goodes and possessyons them selfe.

Now yf the clergy haue ther­fore punysshed many persōs, bycause the same persōs haue onely spoken agaynste theyr mysseorder and abusyons / & that the clergy haue therfore mysse cōstrued theyr myndes, & imagyned that they wolde destroye the clergy for theyr possessyōs, whych those other folke that spake against theyr [Page 188] mysseorder went about with those wordes to gete fro the clergye to theym selfe: yf the clergye dyd I saye for thys cause of theyr own false ima­gyned suspycyon, punysshe those many persons that this pacyfyer speketh of, what thynge in thys worlde coulde they do that were worse? and therfore syth that sayenge a­gaynste the clergy is an intollerable dyffamacyon but yf that be trewe / I aske thys pa­cyfyer by what meane he proueth it trew.

And fyrste to shew that in some part at the lest hys wor­des appere false / euery man knoweth that some of those y haue ben punyshed, haue ben such, as neyther yf the clergy [Page] loste theyr landes shold haue any parte therof them selfe / & were of suche well knowen noughtynesse and lewde ly­uynge bysyde, that no good man coulde thynke it lykely, that suche folke as they were shold do it for any deuocyon / as was syr Thomas Hytton that was waxen a ioynour, & in many a daye neyther sayd ma [...]ens nor masse, but raged and rayled agaynst the bles­sed sacrament / and Blofelde [...]hapostata that was abiured in London, and after rayled agaynste all relygyons at Ipswych, and therupō taken and emprisoned at Norwich / and Bayfelde the monke and apostata, that was as an a [...] ­ [...]ured and after periured and [Page 189] [...]elapsed heretyke, well and worthely burned in Smyth­f [...]lde: these with diuerse such other as haue ben punysshed for heresye, haue bene none suche as the clergy neded to punysshe theym for fere that they sholde gete from theym any parte of theyr landes to them selfe, nor were of suche wys [...]ome, lernyng, nor vertu neither y the clergy could fere y any men of wyt or of autho [...]yte, wold any thynge regard theyr wordes / but onely that the clergy fered, that by theyr meanes myghte growe the losse and destruccion of many lyght persons soules.

For yf thys pacyfyer wyll saye, that the clergy fered lest those folke and many suche [Page] other lyke, sholde conspyre & gather togyther, and pull all awaye from them by force: I can not saye nay but suche a thyng myght in dede by long sufferaunce come aboute, as well in thys lande as [...] hath in other. But than yf the cler­gye feted y thyng / they fered for mo than them selfe. For surely yf suche thynge sholde fortune as I truste it neuer shall / those folke wolde not take onely fro the clergye, but amonge other from some of theyr owne laye bretherne to, such as haue aught to lese.

But thys pacyfyer wyll peraduēture say, that though suche maner folke as euyll prestes & apostatas that the clergye haue punysshed, be [Page 190] none of those that they pun [...]sshed for y cause, but bycause they were heretykes in dede / yet many other haue they pu­nys [...]hed for that cause, that is to wytte bycause they mysse construed theyr myndes and rekened them for enymyes to the clergye, for onely findyng of fawtes at the mysse order & abusyons of the clergy. And he wyll say as he sayth, that not onely hym selfe sayth that the clergye haue punysshed many persons therfore / but that also mych peple (though they saye not so farre as he sayth▪ that is to wytte y they punys [...]hed theym therfore) w [...]l yet saye that they punysshed them rather of wyll than of loue to the people, well yet [Page] [...] [Page 190] [...] [Page] the [...]ame mych people yf this pacyfyer haue herde them so saye, thou [...]h theyr so sayenge be grounded but vpon imaginacyon and gessyng at the se­cretys of other mennes myn­des (as▪ hys owne imagyna­cyon is) yet iudge they not so euyll as hym selfe doth. For yf they iudge in that punys­shemēt no more, but lesse loue to the people then desyre to punisshement / they iudge not yet that the punysshers dyd the partyes wronge as thys pacyfyer doth hym selfe, that sayth the clergye myssecon­strued theyr myndes, and vppon suche myssetakynge of theyr myndes for onely spe­kynge agaynste theyr mysseorder and abusyōs, dyd ther­fore [Page 191] punysshe them.

And therfore lettynge as I sayd before hys mych peo­ple passe by about theyr other bysynesse / I aske thys pacy­fyer hym selfe, syth he sayeth that the clergy hath for that [...]ause punysshed many, what nomber is the le [...]te that he calleth many? For though very fewe be ouer many to be so wrongfully [...] m [...]ssehandeled and punysshed▪ for onely sp [...] ­kynge agaynst mysseorder▪ & abusyons / yet [...] eue [...]more thys worde many, must [...] nedes im­porte and sygnyfye some gre­ter nomber [...]erdye than one or two or thre.

And ouer this, bycause the mater wheruppon this pacy­fyer bryngeth yt in, is for a [Page] [...]ause of a gre [...]t and in ma [...]e [...] vniuersal grudge and diuysyo [...], nowe of late (as he sayth) s [...]rong [...] vppe and growen betwene the spyrytualtye and the tempor [...]l [...]ye / these many persones that he speketh of, whych [...] haue ben so late for onely speky [...]ge agaynst mys­order and abusyōs punyshed, muste nedes [...]e so many as that there haue ben some such so punyshed almoste in euery [...]. For elles he playn re [...]roueth his owne processe, & excuseth the clergye hym selfe v [...]ware / and layeth no lytle [...]au [...]e in the temporalty, yf for the wrongfull demeanoure of one byshoppe or [...]wayn in one pe [...]son or [...]wayne, they wolde [...]ere [...]n vnyuersall▪ grudge [Page 192] agaynste all the remanaunt.

Now to proue to wha [...] passe this pacy [...]yer coulde brynge his proc [...]sse of his many per­sons, so sore myshandeled and p [...]nyshed for onely sp [...]kynge agaynste mysseorder and abus [...]ōs of the clergy / let this p [...] cy [...]yer peruse and rehe [...]se by name all the dyocises of eng­lande and wales therwyth, & I wene veryly that excepte London and Lyncoln̄, he shal scante in any one of all the [...]emanaunt fynde punyshed for heresye foure persons in fyue yere, and in the more parte of them not fyue in .xv. yere / nor delyuered into y seculare ha [...] des in the most parte of them any one in .xx. yere. And then [...]f thys be thus, all though [Page] (whyche I trow no man thynketh) of all those that in al the other dyocises haue ben pu­nyshed were wronged euery chone / yet were not so few ly­kely to haue made so great an vniuersall grudge, as this pacy [...]yer speketh of. For I sup­pose no man doute [...]h, but that by one occasion and other, m [...] men then so many, haue misse happed to be in lesse space mysse punyshed in so myche space of the land by temporall men / and yet hathe there not growē any vniuersall grudge or dyuisyon agaynst any part of the people therby.

Let vs nowe then come to those two dyocises of Lōdon & Lyncoln̄ / & of those twayne fyrste to speke of Lyncoln̄, as [Page 193] great a dyocise a [...] yt is▪ and as many shyres as he hath wyth i [...] yt, yet haue I not her [...]e of late many punysh [...]d for heresy amonge theym all. But aboute a tenne yere a go to my [...]emēb [...]aūce, there we [...]e in that dyocise about. [...] or [...]ourten abiured in o [...] town / and at that tyme euer [...] man that I herde speke th [...] of ey­ther in y court or elles where, appered very glad that suche a bed of snakes was so [...]ound ou [...] and broke [...]. For then were there at that time no [...] to pu [...]te forth bookes and la­ment suche dyuysyons, wyth layēg for a cause of y grudge, y many persones were mysse handeled and punyshed for onely spekynge agaynste the [Page] mysse order and abusyons of the clergye. But nowe euery one y is punished any where, is ynough for a mater of a la­mentable boke of dyuysyon, that may to pacyfye y grudge [...]re yt bygynne, vse a fyguer of some say, & they say, & many say, and myche people sayth, and many men thynke, & such other / & therwith enueygle y reder, & [...]ake som good [...]olke wene that right were wronge and euery one mā an hūdred.

But now come I to the dyo­cise of London, in whyche though there haue ben som­what more a do in these ma­ters there is no great mer­uayle, syth vnto this dyocise there is so great resorte & confluence, not onely from other [Page 194] partes of this realme, but al­so from other landes. And yet euen here of all that hath ben punyshed in this dyocyse, ey­ther in the countye of Essex (for as for in Myddelsex I remember none) or in the cytye selfe, [...]yther of resyau [...]tes therin or of resorters therto, Englishe men or straungers, syth this pacyfyer affermeth that many persons be punys­shed by the clergy for the one­ly spekyng agaynst theyr abusyons and mysseorder / and of those that haue ben punyshed eyther ryght or wronge, farre the moste parte haue ben here double and treble I trowe to all the remanaūt of the whole realme / and this is here nexte at hande, wherby the proues [Page] of all suche myssehandelynge ma [...] here wyth les [...]e laboure and charge be brought forth, and the tre [...]th moste easely try [...]d: [...]tte [...]hys pacyfyer of those many myssehandeled & [...] punyshed persones that he speketh of, come forth and here proue vs some. Let hym proue .xx. let hym proue x [...]. let hym proue .x. let hym proue sy [...], lette hym proue [...] / or for very shame af­t [...]r such a gret word of [...], l [...]t hym proue some one at the l [...]e. But surely I suppose he sh [...]l neuer be able to do that.

The .xxxvi. chapyter.

BUt I suppose in good faith that this pacifyer ha [...]h of some facylyte of hys own good nature, ben easy to [Page 195] beleue some such as haue told hym lyes / and hath ben ther b [...] persuaded to thynke▪ that many other folke sayde and knewe the thynge that some few [...]old hym for very treuth. And surely they that are of this new bretherhed be so bold & so shamelesse in lyenge, that who so shall here them speke and knoweth not what secte they be of shall be very sore a­bused by them.

My selfe haue good expe­ryence of them. For y lyes are neyther few nor small, y ma­ny of y blessed brethern haue made, & dayly yet make by me

Dyuers of them haue sayd that of suche as were in my howse whyle I was chauncellour, I vsed to examyne them [Page] wyth turmentes, causynge them to be bo [...]den to a tre in my gardyn, & there pituous [...]y beten.

And thys tale had some of those good bretherne so cau­sed to be blowen about, that a ryghte wurshypfull frende of myne dyd of late wythin lesse than thys fourtenyghte, tell vnto another nere frende of myne that he hadde of late herde mych spekynge therof.

what can not these brethern saye, that can be so shamelesse to saye thus? For of very trouth, al be it that for a great robbery, or an heyghnouse murder, or sacryledge in a chyrche, wyth caryenge away the py [...]e wyth the blessed sa­crament, or [...] ca­stynge [Page 196] it out, I caused some tyme such thynges to be done by some offycers of the mar­shalsy or of some other prysōs wyth whyche orderynge of them by theyr well des [...]rued payne, & wythout any greate hurte that afterwarde sholde stycke by them, I founde out and repressed many suche de­sperate wreches, as [...]llys had not fayled to haue gone fer­ther abrode, & to haue done to many good folke a gret deale mych more harme: yet though I so dyd ī theues, murderers, and robbers of chyrches / and notwythstandynge also that heretykes be yet mych worse then al they, yet sauyng onely theyr sure kepynge, I neuer dyd els cause any such thyng [Page] to be done to any of them all in all my lyfe, excepte onely twayne / of whyche the tone was a chylde and a serua [...]nt of myne in myne own house, whome hys father hadde ere euer he came with me, nowse­led vp in suche maters, and had se [...]te hym to attende vpō George Iaye or Ge [...] other­wyse called Clerke, whych is a preste, and is now for all y wedded in Antwarpe / into whose howse there, the two nonnys were brought, which Iohn [...] [...]yrt otherwyse called A [...]ryan stale out of theyr cloyster to make them harlo [...]tes. Thys George Iay dyd teche thys chylde hys vngracyouse heresye agaynst the blessed sacrament of the aulter / whych [Page 197] heresye thys chyld afterward beynge in seruyce wyth me, began to teche another chyld in my howse, whyche vttered hys counsayle. And vppon y poynt perceyued & knowē / I caused a seruaunt of myne to strype hym lyke a chyld be­fore myne houshold, for amē ­dement of hym selfe and en­sample of suche other.

Another was one, whyche after that he had fallen in to y fran [...]ike heresyes, fell soone after in to playne open frāsye bysyde. And all be it that he had therfore ben put vppe in bedelem, and afterwarde by betynge and correccyon ga­thered hys remembraunce to hym, and beganne to come a­gayne to hym selfe / beynge [Page] theruppon set at lyberty and walkynge about abrode, hys olde fansyes beganne to fall agayn in his hed. And I was fro dyuers good holy places a [...]er [...]ised, that he vsed ī his wanderynge aboute, to come into the chyrche, & there make many madde toyes & tryfles, to the trouble of good people in the dyuyne seruyce / and specially wold he be most besy in the [...]yme of moste sylence, whyle the preste was at the secretes of the masse aboute y le [...]acyō. And yf he spy [...]d any woman knelynge at a forme / yf her h [...]d hynge any thynge lowe in her medytacyons, thā wolde he stele behynde her, & yf he were not le [...]ed wolde l [...] boure to lyfte vp all her clo­thes [Page 198] & caste them quyte oue [...] her hed. wheruppon I beyng aduertysed of these pageaūtꝭ, and beynge sent vnto and re­quyred by [...]ery deuout rely­gyouse folke, to take some other order wyth hym / caused him as he came wāderyng by my dore, to be taken by the cō stables and bounden to a tre in the strete byfore the whole towne, and there they stryped hym with roddys therfore tyl he waxed wer [...] and somwhat lenger. And it appered well that hys remembraunce was good inough, saue y it wente about in grasynge tyll it was beten home. For he could thā very well reherse hys fawtes hym selfe▪ and speke and trete very well, and promyse to do [Page] afterwarde as well. And ve­ryly god be thanked I here none harme of hym now.

And of all that euer came in my hande for heresy, as helpe me god, sauynge as I sayd the sure keping of them / and yet not so sure neyther but that George constan [...]yne coulde stele awaye: el [...]ys had neuer any of them any strype or stroke gyuē them, so mych as a [...]ylyppe on the forhed.

And some haue sayde that whan Cōstantyne was goten away, I was fallen for anger in a wonderfull rage. But surely though I wolde not haue suffred him go if it wold haue pleased hym to haue ta­ryed stylle in the stockes / yet whan he was neyther so feble [Page 199] for lacke of meate but that he was stronge inough to breke the stockes, nor waxē so lame of hys leggys wyth [...]yenge but y he was ly [...]hte inough to lepe the wallys / nor by a [...]y myssehandelyng of his h [...]d so dulled or dased in hys brayn, but that he had wytte inough whā he was onys out, wysely to walke hys waye: neyther was I than so heuy for the losse, but that I hadde youth inough left me [...]o were it out / nor so angry wtih any man of myne y I spake thē any euyll word for the mater, more then to my porter that he sholde se the stockes mēded and locked faste, that the prysoner stale not in agayne. And as for Cō stantyne hym selfe / I coulde [Page] in good fayth good thanke. For neuer wyll I for my part be so vnreasonable, as to be angry wyth any man that ry­seth if he can, whā he fyndeth h [...]m selfe that he sytteth not at hys ease.

But now tell the brethern many meruaylouse lyes, of myche cruell tormentynge th [...]t heretykes hadde in my house so farforth that one Segar a boke seller of Cābrydge whyche was in myne house about foure or fyue days, and neuer hadde eyther bodely harme done hym, or fowle worde spoken hym whyle he was in myne house, hath re­ported syns as I heare say to dyuerse, that he was [...]oūde [...] [...]o a tree in my gardeyn, and [Page 200] thereto to pyt [...]ousely beten / and yet besyde that bounden about the hed wyth a corde & wrongen, that he fell downe dede in a swowne.

And this tale of his betyng, dyd Tyndale tell to an old acquaytaunce of his owne, and to a good louer of myne / with one pyece farther yet, y whyle the man was in betynge, I spyed a lytle purse of his hangynge at his doublette, wher­in the pore man hadde (as he sayde) fyue marke▪ and that caught I quyckely to me and pulled yt from his doublette, and put yt in my bosome, and that Segar neuer sawe yt af­ter / and therin I trow he sayd trew, for no more dyd I ney­ther nor byfore neyther, nor [Page] I trowe no more dyd Se­gar hym selfe neyther in good fayth.

But now when I can come to goodes by suche goodly wa [...]s / it is no great meruayle though I be so sodaynly gro­wē to so great substaūce of ry­chesse, as Tyndale tolde hys acquayntaūce and my frend / to [...]hom he sayd that he wyst wel [...]hat I was no lesse worth in money and plate and other mouables, then twenty thou­sande markes. And as myche as that haue dyuerse of the good bretherne affermed here ne [...]er home.

And surely this wyll I cō fesse, that yf I haue heped vp so myche good to gether / then haue I not gotē the tone half [Page 201] by ryghte. And yet by all the theuys, murderers, and here­tyques, that euer came in my handes, am I not I thanke god the rycher of one grote, & yet haue they spent my twayn Howe be yt yf eyther any of them, or of any kynde of people ellys, that any cause haue had byfore me, or other wyse any medelyng wyth me, fynd hym selfe so sore greued wyth any thyng that I haue taken of his / he hadde some tyme to speke therof. And now syth no man cometh forth to aske any restytucyō yet, but hold theyr peace and slacke theyr time so longe: I geue them all playn peremptory warn [...]nge now, that they dreue y [...] of no len­ger. For yf they tarye tyll [Page] yesterday, & then come & aske so great somes among them, as shall amount to twenty thousande marke / I purpose to purchace suche a proteccy­on for them, that I wyll leue my sel [...]e lesse then the fourth parte, euyn of shrewden [...]s, rather then euer I wyll pay thē.

And now dare I say, that yf this pacyfyer hadde by ex­peryence knowen the trouthe of y kynde of people / he wold not haue geuen so myche cre­dence to th [...]yre lamentable cō playnynges, as yt semeth [...] by some of his Some sayes he doth.

How by yt what fayth my wordes wyll haue wyth hym in these myne owne causes, I can not very surely saye, nor [Page 202] yet very gre [...]tly ca [...]e. And yet stande I not in so myche dout of m [...] selfe, but that I truste well that among many good & honeste men, among whych sorte of folke I truste I may [...]eken hym / myne own worde wold alone euen in myne own cause be somwhat better byleued then wold y othes of some twayn of this new bretherhed in a mater of a nother man.

The. xxxvii. chapyter.

BUt nowe to come to some spyrytuall mens causes, agaynst whome there are layde lyke lyes / one Sy­mondes a long well knowen heretyke walkynge about the realme, way taken not longe [...]go, by y offycers o [...] the right [Page] reuerende father my lord bysshoppe of winchester / & beyng put in a chamber to kepe, and brekynge oute at a wyndow, hath tolde many of his bre­therne syns, that he was mer­uaylousely tormented by the byshoppes offycers in pryson, and sholde haue ben murthe­red therin to, and that elles he wolde neuer haue runne his way. But he wold neuer syns complayne of his harmes to the kynge or hys counsayle / but wyll rather of perfeccyon suffer them al pacyently, then [...] pur [...]ew & proue them wyth his forthe commynge agayn.

wolde god this pacyfyer myght haue thexamynacyon of that mater. It wolde per­aduēture do hym great good [Page 203] hereafter, to fynde oute the trewth of suche a false heretyques tale.

And nowe not wythstan­dynge that the brethern boste myche of his happy scape: yet yf he happed to dye or be hanged somewhere there as no man wyste where but they, they wolde not let for a nede to say that he scaped not at al, but was priuyly kylled in pryson, and pryuyly caste away. For so sayde some of them by George Cōstantine, not onely vppon his fyrst flyght out of my keping, but also euen now of late, not wythstādyng that they well knowe that many marchauntes of our own had sene hym syns laugh & make mery at Intwarpe.

[Page]Suche luste haue these blessed bretherne y euer talke of faith and sprete and trouth and veryte, continually to deuyse and imagyne lyes of malyce and hatered, agaynste all those that labour to make thē good.

And suche a pleasure hath eyther Fryth hym selfe or els some other false [...]olysshe bre­therne of his secte. For he told one or twayn, and caused the bretherne to blowe it ferther aboute, that worde was sente hym into the towre, that the chaūcellour of London sayde it sholde coste hym the beste bloude in hys body.

Now whyther Fryth lyed or hys felowes, let them draw cut bytwene them. For surely [Page 204] where they tell it vnder suche maner, as though mayster chauncellour shoide reloyce & haue a cruell desyre of the mannes deth: I knowe hym so well that I dare well saye they falsely by l [...]e hym ther [...]n.

How be it some treuth they myghte happe to here wher­uppon they myghte buylde theyr lye. For so was it that on a tyme one came & shewed me that Fryth labored so sore that he swette agayne, in stu­dyeng and wrytyng agaynst the blessed sacrament. And I was of trouth very heuy to heare that the yonge folysshe felowe sholde bystowe suche labour about such a deuelysh wurke / and wys [...]hynge that the man had some good chry­sten [Page] frende to whome he wold geue eare, that myghte wyth drawe hym from geuynge & enclynynge all hys harte to y folowynge of that frantyke heresye, wherwyth he were in perell to perysshe bothe body and soule, sayed in the cōmu­nycaciō these wordes or other of lyke effect: For yf y Fryth quod I swete in laboryng to quenche y fayth, that all trew chrysten people haue in Chrystes blessed body and bloude, whyche all chrysten folke ve­ryly, and all good folke frute­fully receyue in the forme of brede: he shall labour more t [...]an in vayne. For I am sure that Fryth & all his felowes, wyth all the frendes that are of theyr affinite, shall neyther [Page 205] be able to quenche and putte out that fayth. And ouer [...]hat yf Fryth laboure aboute the quenchynge therof tyll he swete / I wolde some good frend of hys shold shew hym, that I fere me sore that Cryst wyll kyndle a fyre of fagottes for hym, & make hym therin swete the bloude out of hys body here, and strayte frome thense send hys soule for euer into the fyre of hell.

Now in these wordes I neyther ment nor meane / that I wold it were so. For so he [...]p [...]e god and none otherwyse but as I wolde be gladde to take more laboure losse and bodyly payne also, thenne peraduenture many a man wolde wene, to wynne th [...]t [Page] yonge man to Cryste and his trewe fayth agayne, & therby to preserue and kepe hym frō the losse and perell of soule & body bothe.

Now myghte it peraduenture be, that I tolde mayster chauncellour this tale, and so I wene I dyd / and he myght theruppon happen to reporte it agayne, or saye some suche lyke wordes of lyke purpose to some other man / and that there vppon these bretherne buyelde vppe theyr tower of lyes. Or ellys whyche were not impossyble, Fryth yf he herde the tale tolde by me, myghte wythdrawynge the beste, and makynge it seme suche as hym selfe lyste, tell it out by mayster chauncellour, [Page 206] to brynge hym amonge the people in opynion of malyce and crueltye. But hys mylde mynde and very tender dea­lynge in suche maters, is amonge all the peple by good experyence so playnly proued and so clerely knowen, that it wyll be harde to brynge any such synyster opinyon of h [...]m in any good honest mann [...]shed, for the wordes of a great me [...]nye suche maner folke as Fryth is / whyche not onely speketh lyes agaynst honeste men, but also wryteth false l [...]es and heresyes agaynste the blessed sacrament of the aulter.

Some man wyll yet per­aduenture saye, that thys is a thynge farre, vnlykely, that [Page] eyth [...]r Fryth or any man els wold wyt [...]yngly take a bour­den from one man and laye it in a nother mannys neck [...] / & namely to laye it to the chaū ­cellour for me, syth that all [...] folke reken in them self, that they haue more cause of gr [...]efe agaynst me then hym.

Surely yf they were wyse and entēded to be good / they sholde neyther thynke them self [...] to haue cause of gryefe or grudge agaynste me nor hym neyther. For of my selfe [...] wore well, and of hym I b [...]leue the same, that we no­ [...]ynge entende vnto theym [...] own welthe / which [...] theyr amendemente of [...] of theyr heresyes [...] the [...]rewe fayth agayne, [Page 207] is impossyble to be goten.

But for the poynt that I spake of, y it were not so farre vnlykely as it wolde happely s [...]me, that Fryth wolde turne y tale fro me to mayster chaū ­cellour / ye shall perceyue par­tely by his own dede, & partely by the dealyng of some other such ī such lyke maner of ma­ter. For ye shall vnderstand, t [...]at after that Fryth had wryten a false folysshe treatyce a­gaynste the blessed sacrament of y aulter / I hauyng a copy therof [...]ent vnto me, made [...]ortely and answere therto.

[...]nd for bycause y hys boke was not put abrode in prent / I wolde not therefore lette myne runne abrode in men­nes handes. For as I haue [Page] o [...]ten sayde, I wolde w [...]sshe that the comon people sholde of suche heresyes neuer here so myche as the name. But for as myche as that thynge is impossyble to prouyde but that heretikes wyll be doing / therfore are other folke sometyme dreuyn of necessyte to speke of those maters also, & to make answere vnto them.

And therfore whan heretykes abiure and do theyr pe­naūce / the prechour is fayne to reherse theyr opynyons in the pulpet, and there answere those deuelyshe argumentes opēly, with whych those here­tykes fyrst deceyue men & wom [...]n in corners secretely, and after sprede thē abrode in au­diēce by defence of those here­syes [Page 208] ī theyr examinaciō opēly.

And also yf theyr bokes be [...]nys putte abrode in prente / it is a thynge very harde to gete theym well in agayne. But as for me, I vsed therin thys prouysyone for the re­medy on bothe partes, that though I wold not put myne answere abrode into euery mannes hādes at aduenture, bycause Frythes booke was not put out abrode in prente: yet I caused myne answere to be prēted vnder myne own name, to thentent I myghte as in dede I haue, gyue oute some to suche as I perceyued had sene hys boke before.

Now happed it that vpon [...] tyme, the ryghte reuerende father my lorde bysshoppe of [Page] wynchester, sent for Fryth vnto his owne place, of very fa­therly fauour towarde the yo [...]ge mannys amendem [...] / whyche he fore desyred, bo [...]e for other causes, and among other causes partely also for thys, bycause he was not many yeres ago a yong [...]oye waytynge vppon hym and [...] scoler of hys. In that commu [...] nicaciō what wordes were bytwene them were now to long to reherse. But [...]uch they were as I wolde wysshe that a [...]l suche as be wyse, and wene y Fryth were wyse (whyche be peraduenture some that here the bretherne speke of hym, & waye not them selfe hys wor­des) hadde there standen by and herde. For they sholde I [Page 209] am sure haue taken Fryth euer after, for suche as he playnely before good recorde proued hym selfe than / which was not an heretyke onely, but bysydes that a proude vnlerned fole.

But as I was aboute to tell you, in that comunycacyon my sayde lorde of wyn­chester among other thynges cōmuned with Fryth agaynst his afore remembred heresye y he so sweteth in, to impugne the trew chrysten fayth concernynge the sacramēt of the aulter. And whē Frith there stode in his heresy, as styffely as he defended yt folyshely secretely betwene them twayn / my lord longyng that the felowes foly myght appere, called good & [Page] worshippefull witnesses vnto thē. And then bycause his lord shyppe perceyued Fryth, loth to haue it knowen abrode out of the bretherhed, as yet at that ty [...]e that he went about to poysene the realme wyth y pestilent heresy agaynst the sacrament: my lorde I say sayd vnto hym, that yt was nowe to late for hym to thynke that he cou [...]e kepe close / reuoke it Fryt [...] (q [...]od his lordshyppe) ye may and repent yt, and so were yt well done ye dyd / but kepe it fro knowledge you can not, ye be gone nowe so farre. For your bokes of this mater haue ben sene abrode in many mennes handes / and that so longe, that lo here is an an­swere all redy made vnto yt, [Page 210] and shewed hym my boke in prent / but of trouth he delyuered yt not vnto hym. How be yt sone after he gate myne answere I can not tell of whom / and syns haue I herd of late, that he sweteth aboute y ma­ter a freshe, and hathe I here saye, the deuylyshe bokes of wyclefe, Swynglius, & frere Huyskyn secretly cōueyed vnto hym into the toure, & hath begonne and gone on a great way in a newe boke agaynste the sacrament.

But the thynge that I tell you this tale for is this. I am well enformed y he knoweth very wel that I made that answere / and yt is not very ly­kely but that by one or other he hath the boke in prent / and [Page] of lykelyhed he neuer had yt otherwyse. For that was as easy a waye ye wote well, as one to wryte it out that hadde it in prent all redy / and before yt was prented I know very wel he could neuer get it. And at the lest wise I know it well that he knoweth wel ynough that the answere was made by me / and yet he dyssymuleth that, and faynynge hym selfe not to know who made it, but to thynke yt rather that my sayd lord of wynchester made yt then any mā elles, maketh his newe boke as I am very certaynly enfourmed, not a­gaynste me by name, but all agaynste my sayde lorde, of a solempne pryde that he wolde haue his boke seme a dyspu­tacyon [Page 211] betwene the boy and the byshoppe.

But there shall not greatly nede suche a byshoppe so ler­ned as my sayde lorde is, to dyspute wyth any suche as Fryth is, for fyue suche bo­kes as that is, yf yt be no wy­ser then was his other, or thē this his new is eyther, yf it be no wyser then one telleth me, that both can good skyll and hath herd a great part redde / nor how so euer he haue han­deled it, wyse wyll it neuer be while y mater therof is so false And therfore whē y boke shal hereafter be finyshed and happeth to come to myne handes, I trust to make almost euery boy able to perceyue the false foly thereof, though he co­uer [Page] hys roten frute as close and as comely as euer any costerdmonger couered hys basket.

But this as I sayde ye may good reders se, that as Fryth taketh myne answere fro me, whyche hym selfe and euery man elles knoweth well for myne, and imputeth yt to the byshop of wynchester: it were not myche vnlykely, that he wolde when he had herde of a thyng that I had sayd, & whē hym selfe had made yt worse, then chaunge yt fro me and impute it vnto maister chauncellour of London.

The .xxxviii. chapyter.

WHyche if he do, he doth yt not alone. For this poynt played also Thomas [Page 212] Philippis of Lōdon letherseller nowe prysoner in y towre▪ whom when I was chauncellour, vpon certayn thynges y I found out by him, by thexamynacyon of dyuerse herety­ques whome I hadde spoken wyth, vppon the occasyon of the heretyques forboden bo­kes, I sent for / and when I hadde spoken wyth hym, and honestely intreated hym one day or twayn in myne house, and laboured about his amē ­dement in as harty louynge maner as I coulde: when I perceyued fynally the person suche that I coulde fynde no trouth, neyther in his worde nor his othe, and saw the ly­kelyhed that he was in the settynge forth of suche heresyes [Page] closely, a man mete and lyke­ly to do many folke myche harme: I by endenture dely­uered hym to his ordynary. And yet for bycause I perceyued in hym a great vayne gloryouse lykynge of hym selfe, and a great spyce of the same spyryt of pryde that I perceyued byfore in Rycharde Hūne when I talked with him / and fered that yf he were in y bys­shoppes prysone, his gostely enymy y deuyll myghte make hym there destroy hym selfe / and then myght suche a new besynes aryse agaynste mayster chauncellour that now is, as at that tyme arose vppon the chauncelloure that was then / whyche thynge I fered in Thomas Philyppys som­what [Page 213] also the more, bycause a cosyn of his a [...]arbour in Pater noster row called [...] Iohn̄, after that he was [...]u [...] spected of heresye and spoken to therof, [...] the shame of the worlde drowned hym self in a well: [...] for these [...] aduysed & by my meanes holpe, that Thomas Philips (whych [...] all be yt that he sa [...]d that y clergy [...]oued hym not, s [...]med no [...] yet very loth [...] to the byshoppes pr [...]on) was receyued pryso [...]r into [...] towre of London. [...]nd yet [...] that he [...] [Page] to know how the mater stode. whyche knowen and reported to y kynges grace / his hygh­nes as a most vertuouse catholyque prynce gaue vnto Thomas Philippis such answere, as yf he had ben eyther halfe so good as I wolde he were, or halfe so wyse as hym selfe weneth he were, he wold forth wyth haue folowed / and not stande styll in his obstynacye so longe, as he hath now put hym selfe therby in a nother deper parell.

Other haue besydes thys complayned, that they haue ben vntrewly and vniustely handeled / and thys haue they not letted to do after that they haue ben conuycted and ab [...] red, and theyr iuste condemnacyons [Page 214] after theyr open examynacyons and playn and clere proues, so well and openly knowen, y they haue by theyr shamelesse clamoure nothyng goten, but rebuke and shame. And yet were some of theym yf theyr ordynaryes had ben so sore & so cruell as this boke of this pacifyer maketh them, fallen agayne in the daunger and parell of relapse.

And some hath ben herd vppon importune clamour, and the cause and handelyng examyned by the greatest lordes temporall of the kynges most honorable coūsayle, and that synnes that I left the offyce / and the complaynour foūden in his complaynynge so very shamelesse false, that he hath [Page] ben answered that he was to easely delt wyth, and hadde wronge that he was no worse serued.

And suche haue these folke euer be foūden and euer shall. For when they fall to a false fayth in herte / theyr wordes can not be trew. And therfore if this pacifier well & thorow­ly knewe them / I bare say he wolde lesse byleue theyr lamē table [...]ales, thē I fere me that he hath byleued some in com­playnyng vpon theyr ordyna [...]es, agaynst whome he se­ [...]th vppon such folkes false complaynyng, to haue cōcey [...]d thys opynyon that hys [...] of dyuysyon sheweth, y is to wit▪ that y clergy thynke that [...] man that speketh [Page 215] agaynst theyr mysseorder and abusyons, loueth no prestes, and that therfore they haue punyshed many men, whyche god forbede were trew. For yf yt were / surely they that so punysshed any one man for that cause, that is to wyt, bycause theym selfe conceyue a false suspicyon agaynst hym / yt were pytye that they lyued. But I thynke in good fayth that the prelates wyll neuer desyre to lyue lenger, then tyl this pacyfyer proue that same false tale trew.

The .xxxix. chapyter.

I Sayed before, that I wolde towche of thys boke, and so haue I towched, [Page] hys fyrste chapyter hole, by­cause it hath for the fyrste set­tyng forth the chyefe counte­naunce of myldenes and cha­ryte. And yet what charyte there is therin, whan it is considered I suppose you se. For no parte is there of the clergy that can please hym, neyther prelates, nor meane seculare prestes, nor relygyouse per­sons, not so mych as any one man / as you may playnely perceyue by other wordes of hys in other places of hys lo­uing boke. And yet among al these fautes, I se hym fynde none with them y rūne out in apostasye / but all the fautes be assygned in them y abyde in theyr professyon styll. Nor I [...] not in hys boke any [Page 216] cause of hys dyuysyon, to be founden in the sowynge and settynge forthe of these newe sprogen heresyes. And yet do they make, and nedys muste make wher so euer they come the greatest dyuysyon that can be / fyrst in opynyons and contraryouse myndes, and afterwarde in feruour of lan­guage and contencyouse wordes / and fynally yf it go forth long, in playne sedyciō, man­slaughter, and open warre.

And this faute of these he­resies he myght as well haue layed vnto y clergye, as some of the tother that he so sore speketh of, yf he take heresyes for any. For lyke as noughty prestes and noughty relygy­ouse persons, haue all waye [Page] bene they that do those other fautes, whyche vnder the [...]y­gure of Some say thys [...] layeth to y [...] charge of the spy­rytualty: so haue noughty prestes and noughty relygy­ouse folke (beynge amonge the clergye as Iudas was a­monge Crystes apostles) by­trayed the fayth of Cry [...]te, & bygonne and sette forth these vngraciouse heresyes, as tast & as feruently for theyr part, as nowghty laye [...]olke [...]or theyrs / and both twayne fyrst corrupte some of theyr com­pany at home, and after rūne [...] in apostasye, and put [...]e abrode theyr heresyes in wry­tynge. And some men saye [...] some pre [...]ates haue not done all theyr partes, in the [Page 217] repressynge and dewe punys­shement of them. And yet as great fautes as these be, and suche as all the tempoa [...]tye sholde be most greued wyth & grudge at, and therfore shold be moste cause of thys dyuy­syon, yf there be suche a dyuysyon / and that euery defaute that is in any noughtye per­sons of the spyrytualty be a cause of all moste an vniuer­sall dyuysyon and grudge of the whole corps of the tem­poraltye, agaynste the whole body of the spyrytualtye: yet I saye for all thys, the booke of thys pacyfyer layeth no pyece of thys faute vnto the spyrytualtye / but rather fyn­deth faute & cause of grudge & dyuysyō in the spyrytualty, [Page] for ouer sore handelynge of them that are heretykes in dede / and laboreth to abasshe the ordinaries with obloquy, and put them in drede wyth fere of infamy, and falsely be­reth them in hande that they haue punysshed many persōs for a wronge suspicyō, falsely cōceyued in theyr owne myn­des agaynste those whome they punysshed.

And thus farre hath he gone in his fyrst chapyter. In whi­che maner all be it I truste in god the man ment hym selfe but well / yet I fere me some wyly shrew hath somwhat set hym a wry in the temperyng o [...] hys wordes.

The .xl. chapyter.

ANd veryly all be it as I sayd before, I pur­pose not to medle wyth euery parte of hys boke y I thynke were well done for hym to a­mende: yet in hys seuenth chapyter & hys eyghte, which twayne create all of these ma­ters of heresyes / for the great weyghte of the mater I shall not forbere to shew you some dyfference and dyuersyte by­twene hys mynde and myne.

An other occasyon of the sayde dyuy­syon hath ben / by [...]eason of dyuers futes, that haue ben taken in the spyrituall courtes of offyce, that is called in latyn, ex of­ficio: so that the partyes haue not knowē who hath accused theym / and theruppon they haue somtyme ben caused to abiure in causes of beresyes: somtyme to do pe­naunce, or to pay great sommes of money for redemynge the [...]of / whyche vexacy [...] [Page] & changes the partes haue thought haue come to them by the [...]udges and the offy­cers of the spirituall courte: for they haue knowen [...]o [...]e other accu [...]ers, and that hath caused myche p [...]ople in [...] par­ties of thys realme to thynke great ma­lyce and parcyalyte in the spyrytuall iud­ges. And yf a man be ex officio broughte before the ordynarye for h [...]resye, yf he be notably suspected of heresye: he mu [...]e purge hym selfe after the will of the ordynarye, or be accursed, and that is by the lawe extrade hereti [...]is. cap. & Ad ab [...]sen­dam. And that is thought by many to be a very harde lawe, for a man may be susspected and not gyl [...]ye, and so be dryuen to a purgacyon wythout profe or wyth­out offence in hym, [...]r be accursed.

I wyll in thys poynt of cō uentynge ex officio, no ferther speke at thys tyme than con­cernynge the cryme of heresy. For I am in good fayth loth to medle wyth thys boke of hys at all. For loth am I any thynge to medle agaynst any [Page 219] other mannys wrytynge that is a catholyke man, sauynge that it semeth me veryly that be thys man neuer so good, yet if his minde were folowed in thys mater, it wold wurke thys realme great harme and no good.

For surely yf the conuen­tynge of heretyques ex officio were lefte, and chaūged into an other order, by whyche no man sholde be called be he ne­uer so sore suspected, nor by neuer so many men detected, but yf some man make hym selfe partye agaynste hym as hys accuser / the stretys were lykely to swarme full of here­tykes before that ryght fewe were accused, or peradē [...]ture any one eyther.

[Page]For what so euer the cause be / it is not vnknowen I am sure that many wyll geue vnto a iudge secrete enformaciō of suche thynges, as though they be trewe, yet gladly he wyll not or ꝑaduenture dare not, be openly a knowen that the mater came out by hym. And yet shall he sometyme geue the namys of dyuerse other / whyche beynge called by the iudge, and examyned as wytnessys agaynste theyr wyllys, bothe knowe & wyll also depose the trouth, and he that fyrste gaue enformacyon also / and yet wyll neuer one of them wyllingly make hym selfe an open accuser of the party, nor dare peraduenture for hys earys.

[Page 220]And thys fynde we not onely in heresy, but in many temporall maters amonge our self / wherof I haue hadde expery­ryence many a tyme and ofte, bothe in the dysclosynge of felo [...]es, and somtyme of mych other oppressyō vsed by some one man or twayn in a shyre, wherby all theyr neyghbours sore smarted / and yet not one durste openly complayne.

How be it, it cometh in here­syes somtyme to mych worse point. For I haue wyst where those that haue bene in the cō pany at the tyme, beyng folke of good substaunce and such as were taken fro wurshyp­full, beyng called ī for wytnesses, haue fyrst made many de­layes / and afterwarde beyng [Page] examyned on theyr othes, haue sworne that they herd it not, or remembre [...] it not, and toke no hede to the mater at the tyme / where as it well ap­pered by y deposycyons of dyuers other beynge wyth them at the tyme, ȳ [...] in euery man [...]es conscyence they lyed.

whan wolde these folke by­come an hertykes accusar, agaynste whome they wolde rather be forsworne then of the trouth to bere wytnesse.

And thys thynge maketh, that yt may be somtyme (all be yt very selde yt happeth) that in heresy vppon other vehement suspycyons wythout wytnesse, a man may be put to his purgacyon and to pe­naunce also yf he fayle therof▪ [Page 221] whyche thynge why so ma­ny sholde now thynke so hard a lawe as this pacyfyer sayth they do / I can not se, nor those wyse men neyther that made the lawe. And yet were they many wyse men / and not one­ly as wyse, but peraduenture many mo also in nōber, then those that this pacyfyer cal­leth many nowe, that as he sayth fynd now the faute. For though yt be alledged in the extrauagat de hereticis ca. Ad abolend [...]: yet was that lawe made in a generall counsayle.

And veryly me thynketh that he whyche can not be pro­ued gyltye in heresye, and yet vseth such maner of wayes y all hys honeste neygh [...]ours wene he were one, and ther­fore [Page] dare not swere that in theyr conscyence they thynke him any other / is wel worthy me thynketh to do some pe­naunce for that maner of by­hauour, wherby he geueth all other folke occasyon to take hym for so noughtye.

And by the comen lawe of this realme, many tymes vppon suspycyon the iudges a warde a wrytte to enquyre of what fame and behauour the man is in hys countrey / and hym selfe lyeth somtyme styll in pryson tyll the retourne / & yf he be retourned good, that is to wyt yf he be in a maner purged, then is he delyuered, and yet he payeth his fees ere he go. And yf he be retourned nought / thē vse the iudges to [Page 222] bynde hym for his good abe­ [...]ynge, and somtyme suertyes wyth hym to, suche as theyre dyscrecyon wyll allowe. And then to lye styll tyll he fynde them, is somtyme as mych penaunce to the tone, as the spyrituall iudge enioyneth to the tother. For the tone cometh to the barre as openly as the tother to the cōsystory / & som­tyme hys feters waye a good py [...]ce of a fagot, bysydes that they lye lēger on y tone mans legges, then the fagot on the tothers sholdre. And yet is there no remedye but bothe these muste be done, both in the tone courte and in the to­ther / or ellys in stede of one harme (whyche to hym that deserueth yt not happeth sel­dome, [Page] and as seldome I am sure in heresye as in thefte, & myche more seldome to) ye shall haue tenne tymes more harme happen dayle to folke as innocent as they / and of innocentis many made no­centes, to the destruccyon of them selfe and other to, bothe in goodes body and soule.

And bycause this pacifyer taketh yt for so sore a thynge in the spyrytuall lawe, that a man shall be called ex officio for heresye, where he shall not know his accuser: yf we shold chaunge the spyrytuall lawe for that cause, then hadde we nede to chaūge the temporall to, in some suche poyntes as chaunge yt when ye wyll, and ye shall chaunge yt in to the [Page 223] worse for aught that I can se, but yf yt be better to haue mo theuys then f [...]wer.

For nowe yf a man be en­dyghted at a sessyons, & none euydens geuyn openly at the barre (as many be, and many may wel be. For thendytours maye haue euydence gyuen them a parte, or haue herde of the mater ere they cam there, & of whom be they not boūdē to tell, but be rather bounden to kepe it close, for they be sworen to kepe the kynges counsayle and theyr owne) shall than the party that is endyghted be put vnto no busynesse about hys acquy­tayles? And who shall tell him there the names of hys accu­sers, to entytle hym to hys [Page] wrytte of conspyracy? Thys pacyfyer wyll peraduenture say, that the same twelue men that are his endyghtours are hys accusours, and therfore he maye knowe them. [...]ut what helpeth that hys vn­deserued vexacyon yf he were fautelesse? For amendes the law geueth him none against any of theym, nor it were not well done he sholde / but may whan he is after by other .x [...]i. acquyte, go gette hym home and be mery that he hath had so fayre a daye / as a man get­ [...]eth hym to the fyre & shaketh hys hatte after a shoure of rayne. And now as it often happeth, that a man cometh into a shoure by hys owne ouersyghte, though somtyme [Page 224] of chaunce and of aduenture: so suerly though somtyme it happe that a man he accused or endyghted of malyce, or of some lykelyhed whyche hap­ped hym of chaunce and not hys faute therin / yet happeth it in comparyson very [...]elde, but that the party by some demeanure of hym selfe gyueth occasion that folke haue hym so suspected.

Now yf thys pacyfyer say, that yet here is at the leste wyse in a temporall iudge an open cause apperyng, where­vppon men maye se that the iudge calleth hym not, but vppon a marter broughte vnto hym / where as the spyrytuall iudge maye call a man vp­pon hys owne pleasure yf he [Page] bere the party dyspleasure: this is very well sayde as for the tēporall iudge. But what sayth he nowe for the tempo­rall .xii. men? For ye wote wel they may do the same yf they were so dysposed / & then had I as lyue the iudge might do yt as they. For in good fayth I neuer saw the day yet, but that I durst as well trust the trouth of one iudge as of two iuryes. But the iudges be so wyse men, that for the auoy­dynge of obloquye, they wyll not be put in the truste.

And I dare saye the ordy­naryes be not so folysshe ney­ther, but that they worlde as fayne auoyde it to yf they myghte / sauynge that very necessyte lest all sholde fall to [Page 225] nought, compelleth them to take thys waye / whyche necessyte sometyme causeth also bothe the temporall iudges & the kynges counsayle, to put some foke to busynesse or dyshonestye sometyme, wythout eyther iury or bryngynge of the accuser to the prose of the mater in the partyes presen [...]e

For yf the iudge knowe by sure enformacyon, that some one man is of suche euyll de­meanure amonge hys neyghbours, that they may not bere it / & yet that the mā is bysyde so violent and so iubardouse, that none of theym dare be a knowen to speke of it: wyll there no iudges vppon many secrete complayntes made vnto them, wythout makyng [Page] the partye preuy who tolde hym the tale, bynde that busy troubelouse man to good aberynge? I supposeyes, & haue sene it so to / and wrong wold it be sometyme wyth good pore peasyble folke in the cū ­trey, but yf it were so done a­monge. And my selfe whan I was chauncellour, vppon such secrete enformacyō haue put some out of commyssyon [...]nd offyce of iustyce of the peace, whyche ellys for mych money I wold not haue done and yet yf I were in the tone rome styll & they in the tother agayn, but yf they be mended (wherof I neyther than saw [...] nor yet here any lykelyhed) I wolde put them out agayne, and neuer tell them who told [Page 226] me the tales that made me so to do.

But yet wyll peraduenture thys pacyfyer saye, that some tyme in some very specyall case, he coulde be content that the spyrytuall iudge sholde vpon hys dyscrecyon call one for suspycyon of heresye ex of­ficio / but he wolde not haue men comēly called, but eyther by accusacyon or presentemē [...] in theyr senys or endyghte [...] mentes at the comon lawe. I had as lyefe for any thyng that I se, that thys pacyfyer sholde say thus: By this way that they be called I wolde not haue theym called / but I wolde haue them called after suche an order as they myght be sure that than sholde they [Page] neuer be called. For as for ac­cuse folke openly for heresye, euery man hath experyence inough, that ye shall seldome fynde any man that wyll / but yf the iudge sholde set an offycer of the court therto wyth­out any perell of expensys / & than were thys way and that waye all of one effecte. And as for presentementes and endyghtemētes, what effecte wolde come of theym concer­nynge heresy, ye se the profe I trow metely well all redy.

For thys is a thynge well knowē vnto euery man, that in euery sene, euery sessyon of peace, euery sessyon of gaole de [...]yuery euery lete thorough the realme, the fyrste thynge that the iury haue gyuē them [Page 227] in charge is heresye. And for all thys, thorowe the whole realme howe many presente­mentes be there made in the whole yere. I wene in some seuen yere not one. And I suppose no man dowteth, but that in the meane tyme some there be. I wyll not be cury­ouse about the serchynge out of the cause, why it is eyther neuer or so very selde presen­ted, not fyue in fyftene yere.

But thys I saye, that syth some wyll not, some can not, and none dothe / yf he sholde putte awaye the processe ex of­ficio, the thynge sholde be lefte vndone / and than shold soone after wyth heretykes encrea­ced & multiplyed, the fayth be vndone / & after y thorough [Page] the stroke of god reuengyng theyr malyce and our negly­gence, sholde by sedycyon, & trouble, and derth, and deth, ī this realme many men both good and badde be vndone. And therfore for conclusyon of this pyece, my pore aduyce and counsayle shalbe, that for heresye, and specyally nowe this tyme / men shall suffer the processes ex officio stande / & for as many other synnys also as are onely reformable by y spyrytuall lawe, excepte there be any suche synnys of them as ye thynke were good to growe.

The .xli. chapyter.

ANd yt appereth de heretici [...] li.vi. in the chapyter In fide [...] fauorem▪ that they that be accursed and also partyes to the same offence, maye [Page 228] [...]e wytnesse in heresy: and in the chapite [...] Accusatus perag. licet / yt appereth, that yf a man be sworne to saye the trouth co [...] cernynge heresy, [...]s well of hym selfe a [...] [...]f other, and he fyrst confesset [...] nothyng▪ and after contrary to his fyr [...]te sayenge he appeleth both hym sel [...]e and other: yf yt appere by manyfeste tokens, that he doth it not of lyghtnes of mynde, ne of hatered nor for corrupcyon of money: that then his wytnesse in fauour of the fayth shall [...]ande / as well agaynst hym selfe, as a­gayns [...] other: and yet yt appereth euy [...] ly in the same courte, and in the same mater, that he is a periured person.

This is a daungerous lawe, and more lyke to cause vntrew & vnlawfull men to condempne innocentes, then to cōdempne offender [...]. And yt helpe [...]h lyttell, that yf there be token [...], that yt is not done of hatered, nor for corrupcyon of money: that yt shulde be taken: for somtyme a wolfe may shewe hym selfe in the apperell of a lambe. And yf the iudge be parcyall, such token [...] may be sone [...] accepted then trew­ly shewed.

Thys pyece concernynge the testymony of knowē euyll [Page] persons to be receyued and taken in heresy / I haue some what touched in the thyrde chapyter of the thyrde booke of my dyaloge / where syth they may rede it that wyll, I wyll make here no longe tale agayne therof. But well he woteth that heresye, wherby a chrysten man bycometh a false traytour to god, is in all lawes spyrytuall and tempo­rall both, accompted as great a cryme as is the treason commytted agaynst any worldly man. And than why shold we fynde so greate a fawte, that suche wytnesse sholde be re­ceyued in a cause of heresye, as are receyued not onely in a cause of treason, but of mur­der also, and of other more [Page 229] syngle felony / not onely in fa­uour of the prynce, and [...]e [...]es­tacyon of suche odyouse cry­mes, but also for the necessy [...]e whych y nature of the mater wurketh in the profe. For s [...]th euyll folke vse not to make good folke of theyr counsay [...]e in doyng of theyr euyl dedes / those that are done, sholde passe vnpunysshed, and molyke be commytted a fresshe, but yf they were receyued for recordes to theyr cōdēpnyng, that were of theyr counsayle and perteuers to the doynge. whyche kynde of folke wyll not let to swere twyse naye, before they confesse onys ye / & yet theyr one ye more trewe vppon theyr bare worde, thā theyr twyse naye vppon a so­lempne [Page] othe / and yet confesse they not so symply, but that it is comenly holpen wyth some suche cyrcumstaunces as make y mater more clere.

Now se you well that as hym selfe sheweth, the lawe prouydeth well agaynste all lyghte receyuynge of suche confessyon. And yet thys pa­cyfyer sayth that all that hel­peth lytle, bycause the iudge may be parcyall, and the wytnes may be a wolfe, shewyng him selfe apparelled in the apparell of a lambe, which apperynge in apparell, poore men that can not apparell theyr speche wyth apparell of rethoryke, vse comenly to call a woulfe in a lambes skynne.

But what order may serue agaynste suche obieccyons? [Page 230] what place is there in thys worlde spyrytuall or tempo­rall, of whyche the iudge may not haue some say that he is, or at the lest wyse (as he sayth here) maye be parcyall? And therfore not onely such wyt­nesse sholde be by thys reason of his reiected, in heresy, trea­son, murder, or felony / but also by hys other reason of a woulfe in a lambys skynne, all maner of witnesse in euery mater. For in euery mater maye it happen, that he that semeth a lambe, maye be in dede a woulfe / and be nought where he semeth good / and swere false where he semeth to saye trewe. And therfore thys patche of thys pacyfy [...]r concernyng wytnesses / euery [Page] wys [...] man may bere wyt nesse [...] there is [...] wyt therin / and lesse good wolde growe t [...]erof, yf folke wolde folowe hys [...]uencyon, and make of the lawes a chaunge.

The .xlii. chapyter.

ANd in y chapyter there, that begynneth Statuta que [...], yt is decreed / that yf the bishoppe or oth [...] enquere [...]s of herely, se that any great daunger myghte come to the accu­so [...]s or wytnes of heresye by the great power of them that be accused: that then they may commaunde, that the names of the accus [...]urs or witnes shal not be shew [...]d but to the bishoppe or enquero [...]rs / or such other lerned men as be called to them, and that shall suffyce / though they be not [...] to the partye. And for the more in [...]mpnytye of the sayde accusours and wytnesse yt is there decreed / that the bys­shoppe or enquerours may enioyne such as they haue shewed the names of such wyt­nes vnto / to kepe them close vppon payn of [...], for disclosyng that [Page 231] secrete wythout theyr lycen [...]. And [...]urely [...] / that a man shall be cō ­d [...]m [...]d / and not knowe the names of t [...]m that be cause [...] th [...]rof.

[...]nd though the sayde lawe seme to be [...] vppon a good consydera [...]yon for the [...] of the accusours and witnes / [...], that that cōsyderacy [...]n can [...] to proue the law reasonable.

F [...]r yt semeth that the accusours & wyt­nes myght be saued fro daunger by a no­th [...] w [...]y, and that is by this way. If the [...] or enquer [...] drede, that the [...] and wytnes myght take hurt / as is sayde before: then myght they shew yt [...] the kynge and to his counsayle / bese­ [...]g his grace of helpe in that behalfe / to [...]ue and defende the accusours and wit [...]es fro the extort power of theym that be acc [...]d: And yf they wolde do so: yt is not to suppose / but that the kynge wolde sufyciently prouyde for theyr sauegarde. But for as myche as yt sholde seme / that spyrytuall men somwhat pretende to pu­nyshe here [...]yes onely of theyr own power / wythout callyng for any assystence of the temporal power / therfore they make such lawes, as may helpe forth theyr purpose / as they thynke: but surely that is not th [...] charytable way, to put the knowledge of [Page] the names of the accusours and wytnes fro hym that ys accused / for yf he knewe them / he myght percase alledge & proue so great and so vehement cause of racour and malyce in them that accuse hym / that theyr sayenges by no lawe ought not to stande agaynste hym. And that spyrytuall men pretende / that they onely shuld haue the hole inquyry and pynyshement of he­resye / yt appereth extra the heretices li.vi. cap. Vt [...]inquisitionis, perag. Prohibemus: where all powers, and all lordes temporall and rulers be prohybyte / that they shall not in any maner [...]ke knowe­ledge or iudge vppon heresye / syth yt ys mere spyrytuall / and he that inquyreth of heresy / taketh knowledge of heresy. And so the somme called Summa rosella / ta­keth yt titulo excommunicat. perag. iiij. And yf that be [...]rew, yt semeth then, that all instyces of peace in thys realme be ex­communycate: for they by authoryte of the kynges commyssyone and also by sta­tute, enquyre of heresyes. And I thynke yt is not in the chyrch to prohybyte that: for though yt were so / that the temporal men maye not iudge what is heresye and what not / yet they may / as yt semeth, by theyr own authoryte enquyre of yt / and informe the ordynarye what they haue [Page 232] founde. And also yf a metropolytane with all his clergye and people of his dyocyse fell into heresye: yt wolde be harde to redresse yt wythout temporall power. And therfore temporall men be redye and are bounde to be redye to oppresse heresyes, whē they ryse: as spyrituall men be. And therfore spyrytuall men may not take all the thanke to theym selfe / when heresyes be punyshed / as though theyr charytie & power onely dyd yt, for they haue thye fauour and helpe of temporall men to do yt / or els many times it wold not be brought aboute.

The prouysyon of the law that he speketh of, was made as appereth vppon a greate cause, in the aduoydynge of the great daūgeour y myght in some specyall case happen to those, by whose meanes he­resyes were detected and conuycted. But thys lawe thys pacifyer accompteth sore and vncherytable / and deuyseth [Page] as he thynketh a better But his deuyce ꝑaduēture though it wolde serue in some one lande, wolde yet not serue in some other / & they that made that law, made it as it myght serue moste generally thorow chrystendome / where as thys deuise though it myght serue in England, myght not haue serued well in many places of Almayne that are peruer­ted synnys, not euyn whyle y mater was in a mameryng before the chaūge was made.

But surely that lawe and other of olde made agaynste heresyes / yf they had bene in Almayne dewly folowed in y begynnyng, the mater hadde not there gone out at length to suche an vngracyouse en­dynge. [Page 233] And vndowtedly, yf the prynce, and prelates, & the noble men of this realme, & the good peple of the same, had not bene dylygent in the tyme of the prince of famouse memory kyng Henry the .iiii. bothe to haue agaynste here­sies those lawes of the chyrch kepte wyth whyche thys pa­cy [...]ier fyndeth now these fau­tes, and also to make greate prouisions agaynst it bysyde: it was than very lykely and comynge to the poynt, as vt­terly to haue subuerted the fayth in thys realme here, as it hath done synnys in any parte of Swycherlande or Saxony.

And also the dowte that this pacyfyer putteth, ī excepcyōs [Page] to be layed by the party a­gaynst the accu [...]ours or wy [...] ­nesse / syth the knowledge of the party lacketh must be sup­plyed the more effectually by the iudges, to enquyre and enserch by theyr wysedomes, whyther any suspycyon of [...]yll wyl or other corrupcyō, myghte lede the wytnesse or accusers any thyng to depose or do in the mater. wherin yf dylygence be by the iudges vsed / it wyll be very harde y any suche thynge sholde be of any weyghte but they shall here therof, and maye consy­der the mater accordynge.

And on the tother syde, the re [...]dy that he deuyseth for the sureiye of the wytnessys, sholde not peraduēture make [Page 234] th [...] men so bold, as in a cause of heresy to medle in y mater, a [...]aynst some maner of man / but that they rather wold for [...] owne surety, kepe theyr owne tonges styll, than wyth all the suretye that coulde be founden theym bysyde, haue theyr parsons dysclosed vnto the party.

And as touchynge the [...] of thys pacyfyer, that the sp [...]rytualty pretende [...]o that [...] man shold haue the en­query and punysshem [...]nt of heresyes: the lawes of thys realme and the lawes of the hole chyrche maye w [...]ll stand togyther for awght that I se in theym bothe / and so haue they in these maters of heresy god be thanked hytherto full [Page] well. And therfore thys pacy­fyer semeth me to br [...]ing ī this mater to no greate purpose now, but yf it be eyther to set some deuysyon, or els to fyll vp the lefe. And therfore syth as I sayd before, I purpose not in any open englysh boke to ransake and rebuke eyther the tone lawe or the tother: I shall let hym with that mater alone.

The .xliii. chapyter.

NEuerthelesse myne entent is not to proue the sayde lawes all holly to be cruel and vnreasonable / for I knowe well / that yt is ryght expe­dyent, that [...]rayt lawe [...] be made for pu­nyshement of heresyes, that be heresyes in dede / more rather then any other of­fence / and that the dyscrecyon of the [...]d­ges spyrytuall may ryght well as wage the rygour of the sayde lawes, and vse them more fauorably agaynst theym that [Page 235] [...]e innocentes / then agaynst them that be wylfull offendours / yf they wyll chary­tably serche for the trouth. But surely yf the sayde lawes shuld be put into the ha [...] delyng of cruell iudges, yt myght happen that they shulde many tymes punyshe in­nocentes, as well as ofendours / but I truste in god, yt is not so. Neuerthelesse whyther yt be so or not▪ certayn it is / that there is a great tumour amonge the peo­ple that yt is so, and that spyrytual men punyshe not heresye euely for zele of the sayth / and of a loue ond a zele to the peo­ple / wyth a fatherly pytye to theym that so offende as they ought to do, how great offenders so euer they be / but that they do yt rather to oppresse theym that speke any thynge agaynste the worldely power or ryches of [...]pyrytuall men, or agaynste the great confede [...]acy, that (as many men say) is in them to maynteyne yt.

Nowe his entent is not he sayth, to proue the said lawes of the chyrche agaynste here­syes, wholly cruell and vnreasonable / but so myche of them as yt standeth not wyth hys [Page] pleasure to approue. And now he is conten [...] that strayt lawes [...]e made for punyshe­ment of heresyes, suche as be heresyes in dede / wherin [...] this boke of his meaneth two thynges. One, that he is content they be sore puny. [...]ed yf they be cōdempned. But fyrst he wolde haue them called by such meanes, as he seeth well they neuer shold be sent for.

And then he wold erclude all such witnes as were likely to by wray them. And when that no man shall accuse them, nor no man be receyued that can proue yt agaynste them: then when the iudge can lawfully conuyete theym, he wolde I trow be contēt that they were burned twyse / and so wold I [Page 236] wene them self be content to / for they shall be saufe I now I warraunt you then.

yet a nother mystery he m [...] neth what so euer yt be, in those wordes, the punyshement of [...] that be he [...]e / yes in [...]ede

Here wolde he peraduenture haue euery heresy when th [...]e newe br [...]therne were taken therin, be brought in que [...]y­on agayne, and stand in con­trouersy whyther yt were he­resy or not / and that were another good helpe for theym / as though the chyrch vsed to lay to theyr charges the spekyng agaynst some false taith / or at the lest wyse wolde proue thē heretikes in speking agaynst some suche thynges as they had neuer herd of byfore.

[Page]But now he sheweth why he doth not wholly cōdemne these lawes of the chyrche.

But then y cause he sheweth to be such, as he by and by taketh yt away. For he layeth the cause to be, for that the iudges (yf they be good and charytable) maye by theyre wysedome and goodnes mo­der and temper the rygoure of the laws / but on the tother syde the euyll iudges may do by those lawes he sayth mych harme. But now what lawes are there or maye there be, by the abuse of whych none euyl iudge may do harme.

But then to shewe that by these lawes of the chyrche, myche harme and lytle good or none coulde come / he han­deleth [Page 237] [...] so that he wold make men wene, there were not a good indyfferent iudge in all the whole clergye. For when he hath shewed what hurt an euyll iudge and a cruell shold do by those lawes / he sayth y hym selfe trusteth the spyry­tuall iudges be not suche.

How be yt lest we sholde take hym at that word and byleue hym / he sheweth vs yet that the comen peple wyth a great rumour say the cōtrarye. And the thynge that he sayth here vnder the name of the people and great rumour / that sayth he in his fyrst chapyter vnder the name of many men. And yet immediatly before that / he sayth myche worse as of hym selfe / affermynge that many [Page] persones haue ben punyshed by the spyritualty for an euyll suspicyon and a false of theyr owne ymagynacyon, bycause those many persons so punysshed had byfore spoken onely agaynste spyrytuall mennys mysseorder and abusyons / whyche poynt, honesty wolde he sholde haue proued fyrste, and then wryte yt after.

And nowe cometh he and couertely goth about to make men wene, that no spyrytuall iudges be indyfferent. For thus he sayth.

And though many spyrytuall men may be founde, that haue ryght many great vertues and great gyftes of god, as cha­ [...]tytie, lyberalytie, pacyence, sobernesse, temperaunce, connynge, and suche other / yet yt wyll be harde to fynde any one spyrytuall man / that is not infecte wyth the sayd desyre & affeccyon to haue the worldly [Page 238] honour of prefies exalted & preferred / and therfore yf any lay man reporte any euyl of a prest, though it be opēly knowen that yt is as he sayeth / yet they wyll be more dilygēt to cause the lay man to cease of that sayenge / then to do that in theym is to reforme that is a mysse in the preste that is yt spokē of, takynge as it were an occasyon to do the lesse in suche reforma­cyons / bycause saye men speke so myche agaynste them: But surely that wyll be none excuse to spyritual rulers afore god, when he shall aske accompt of his people, that were committed vnto theyr kepyng.

If the best spyrytuall men be such as thys pacyfyer here sayth they be, than be they a very sherwde sorte in dede, yf they be all so badde that it be harde to fynde any one, but that though any preste be so noughty that hys lewdnes is openly knowen, yet yf any ley man reporte it / the beste spyrytuall men wyll he sayth [Page] be more dylygent to cause the ley man ceace of hys sayeng, than to do theyr deuoyre to reforme the preste / ye and yet more then this, he sayeth they wyll do the lesse towarde the amendement of the preste, by cause ley men speke so myche of it. And thys sayth thys pa­cyfyer hym selfe, shewynge forth boldely therin hys own open face without any visour of some saye. And therfore syth he sayth this euen by the best / tyll he proue it somwhat better, thys shamefull tale is somwhat shamelesse dare I say / and somwhat is it folysh to, syth he saith therwith that those whyche thus wyll do, haue yet amonge many other great gyftes of god, pacyēce, [Page 239] sobernesse, temperaunce, and cunnynge to. For I am sure yf they haue that condycyon, that they be so affeccyonat vnto euery euyll preste, that they can so euyl bere y disprayse of his opē knowē vnthriftynesse, that they wyll do the lesse to­warde hys amendement, by­cause ley men mych abhorre his lewdenesse: this pacyfier maye be pacyent I wyll not say nay, & may peraduenture haue myche connynge to / but surely eyther is this pacyfyer not very sober, or hath hys brayne otherwyse somewhat out of temper, if he take them (as he calleth them) for paciēt folke or for temperate eyther.

The .xliiii. chapyter.

ANd yet to brynge the spyrytualty in y more hatered, & to make the name of the spyrytualtye the more odyouse amonge the people / thys pytuouse pacyfyer in dyuerse places of hys booke, to appease this dyuysyon with­all, alledgeth agaynst theym that they make greate confe­deracyes amonge theym, to make & maynteyne a parte agaynst the temporaltye / and by suche confederacyes, and worldely polycyes, and strayt correccyōs, to rule the people and punysshe them, and kepe them vnder. And thys poynte he bryngeth in here and there in dyuerse places, sometyme wyth a some say, and somtyme [Page 240] wyth a they say, and sometyme he sayeth it hym selfe. And I wote not well yf he hated the spyrytualtye in dede (as some saye he doth, and yet I truste he doth not) what more ody­ouse thynge he myght say.

what any one kynde or sort of peple is there ī this realme husbande men, artyfycers, marchauntes, men of lawe, iudges, knyghtes, lordes, or other, but that euyll dysposed people myght begyn agaynst them a sedycyouse murmure / castyng abrode a suspicyouse bablynge, of gatheryng, and assemblynge, and rownynge, and talkynge, and fynally cō ­federynge togyther? and yet all such suspycyouse bablyng not worth a fether al togither [Page] when it were well cōsydered.

But in sundry places mych he harpeth vppon the lawes of the chyrche / as though the spyrytuall lawes whyche the spyrytualty here haue made, were a grete cause of this dy­uysyon. And than dyuerse of the lawes that he speketh of, be lawes not prouyncyall made by the clergy here, but the lawes vsuall thorow the whole chyrch of Cryst / wher­of the makynge maye not be [...]ayed to theym / nor men are not therfore so vnreasonable (thoughe those lawes were lesse good thanne the greate wysedome of thys pacyfyer coulde deuyse) as to be angry for them with our clergy that made them not, but haue be [Page 241] bounde to kepe them.

And as for dyffamyng them with the abuse of those lawes towarde cruelty, as he bothe in hys boke / there is no great cunnynge in the makynge of that lye. For euery [...]ole that lyste, maye deuyse and laye y lyke to some other folke whā he wyll.

Now as for theyr assem­bles and comyng to gether to the makynge of theyr lawes and constytucyons prouin­cyall / thys pacyfyer to laye those for any confederaeyes, that sholde be now a cause of this so sodayne a late grudge & deuysyon, were a very farre fette inuencyon. For settynge a syde the dysputacyon, why­ther those constytucyons be [Page] so vnreasonable as thys pa­cyfyer wold haue them seme [...] thys thyng suffyseth agaynst hym, y there is not I thynke veryly any one prouy [...]cyall co [...]sty [...]ucyon that he speketh of, that was made, or to any mānys gryefe or grudge put in execucyon, in the tyme of any of all y prelates that are now lyuyng. And how could than any of them be any such [...] or cause of thys late spronge [...] dyuysyon.

But I suppose he calleth those assemblynges at theyr conuocacyons, by the name of confed [...]racyes. For but yf he so do / I wote nere what he mean [...]th by that worde. And on the tother syde yf he so do / for aught that I se he [Page 242] geueth a good thynge and an holsome, an odyouse heygh­nouse name. For yf they dyd assemble ofter, and there dyd the thynges for whyche suche assembles of the clergy in euery prouynce thorow all crystē dome from the begynnynge were instytute and deuysed / mych more good myght haue growen therof, then the long dysuse can suffer vs nowe to perceyue.

But as for my dayes as farre as I haue herd, nor as I suppose a good parte of my fathers neyther / they came neuer to gether to cōuocacyon, but at the request of the king / and at theyr suche assembles concernynge spyrytuall thynges haue very lytle done. [Page] wherfore that they haue ben in that great necessary poynt of theyr dewty so neglygent, whyther god suffer to growe to a secret vnperceyued cause of dyuysyon and grudge a­gaynste theym, god whome theyr suche neglygence hath I fere me sore offēded, know­eth. But surely this hath in my mynde ben somewhat a greter faute in y spyrytualty, then dyuerse of those fautes whyche vnder his fygure of some say thys pacyfyer hath made very great in his boke.

But surely yf this pacyfyer [...] those assembles confede­racyes / I wolde not greatly wyshe to be confederate wyth theym, and theyr assocyate in any suche confederacyes. For [Page 243] I could neuer wyt theym yet assemble for any great wyn­nynge but come vppe to theyr trauayl, labour, coste, & payn, & tary and talke & cetera & so gete them home agayne. And therfore men nede not great­ly to grudge or enuy them for any suche confederacyes.

The .xlv. chapyter.

BUt what fautis so euer this pacyfyer fynde in the spyrytualty / yet of his tender pytye he hath euer a specy al eye to se that they shold not rygorousely mysse handele such good men as are suspec­ted or dedected of heresy. And therfore where as in other places he hath shewed byfore, y they haue punyshed many [Page] men of malyce, for onely spe­kynge agaynst theyr mysseorder and abusyons: now he cō meth in the .vi [...]i. chapyter / & leste bysyde theyr malyce they myghte happen to punyshe them also for theyr owne ignoraunce, therfore he teacheth the spyrytuall iudges one great poynt cōcernyng here­sye and sayth:

It is a com [...]n opinion among doc [...]our [...] / that none is an heretyke for that onely that he er [...]eth / but for that he defendeth opynatynely his errour. And therfore he that erreth of symp [...]ycyte maye in no wyse be sayde an here [...]que. And Sum­ma R [...]ella, in the tyt [...]e [...]ereticus in princip [...], sayth / that a man may erre, and meryte therby: and he putteth this example. If a symple vnlerned man heare the preachynge of his byshoppe, that prea­cheth happely agaynste the fayth / and he byleu [...]th yt wyth a redy mynde to obay: this man [...] / and yet he erreth: but that is to be vnderstande where ignoraūce [Page 244] [...] [Page] any thynge that is heresy / though [...] speke yt onely of an ignorannce / or of a pussyon / or yf he can by interrogatorye [...] [...] questyon [...] be dryuen to confesse any thyng / that is prohybyted by the chyrch: anon they wyll dryue hym to abiure / or hold hym atteynted without examynyng the entent or cause of his sayenge / or whether he had a minde to be reformed, or no [...] and that is a very [...]ore way / our lorde be more mercyfull to our soules, then so greuo [...]ely to punyshe vs for euery lyght de­ [...]aute.

Thys processe were a prety pyece, and somwhat also to y purpose, yf thys pacyfyers doctoring were a good profe, that the spyrytuall iudges knew not this tale before, nor wyste what appertayned vn­to theyr parte in thys mater, vntyll thys pacyfyer taughte them thys greate secrete [...] S [...]mma [...]osella, so [...] a boke to fynde & [Page 245] so harde to vnderstande, that very few men hadde medeled wych it byfore.

But the tale is not so mych tolde of any pryde to teache them, as of cheryte to teache vs, to take & byleue for trew, euery false fayned tale wyth whych any man lyste to bylye them. For vppon thys lesson he bryngeth in as you se hys cherycable infamacyon of the clergyes crueltye / makynge men wene it were so, vnder his fayre fygure of lamenta­ciō, & great pytye that it were yf it sholde be so / but yet it is (he sayth) reported so, & some saye that it is so.

But surely some say agayne, that lyke as there is nothyng so euyll, but that some maye [Page] happe to do it / so is there nothynge so false, but some may happe to saye it. And some other saye also that lyke as there is nothyng so false, but some man may happe to saye it / so can no mā say any thing so false, but some man vnder precexce of pacyfyenge maye happe to repete & reporte it.

For as [...], all that gaye re­ported tale that some ley men say that some spyrytuall men haue [...] great desyre to haue men ab [...]u­red, or to h [...]ue extreme punyshement for [...], that yf any wyll wytnesse that a man haue spoken any thyng that is here­sye, though he speke yt but of ignoraūce [...] [Page 246] all this tale though he tell ty but as yt were by some spyry­tuall men, yet is yt tolde to make all laye men wene that those some spyrytuall men were so great a somme, that it were some great cause of all this great grudge and dyuysyon, whyche he sayth that the temporaltye now hath in this realme agaynste the spyrytualty in maner vnyuersal­ly. wherin he maketh yet as I truste in maner an vnyuer sall lye / syth I can yet se no such vnyuersall cause / & lest cause of all in this poynt specyally, whyche most specyally as y sorest & the moste cruell [...]eyghnouse poynt, in sundry places of his boke this pacy­fyer preacheth and preaceth [Page] vpon, that is to wyt the mys­handelynge of men in y cause of heresy / makyng men wene wyth his heyghnouse handelynge, that the spyrytuall iudges in thys realme handeled that thyng so cruelly, that all the worlde had cause to won­der and grudge thereat.

But when all his holsome holy babelynge is done / euery mā may se these thre thynges trew. Fyrst that syth in punysshynge of heresyes, there is & a good while hath ben, so litle besynes in all the shyres of Englande and walys, bothe about examynacyon and pu­nycyon of heretykes, excepte onely London and Essex, and those are both in one dyocyse / his some spyrytuall men that [Page 247] he wolde haue seme so great [...] somme, are yet of trouthe so few, that he semeth in maner to poynte them wyth his fyn­ger, and myght as well in maner reherse thē euyn by name.

Secundely of those same some so few / yet is there some so lerned to whome the mater moste specyally pertayneth, that yf this pacyfyer kepe no more connynge in his breste t [...]ē he putteth out in his boke (as connynge as he weneth yt were) he is no more able to reache some one of those the lessons that longe to the ma­ter, then he that lerned to spel, is able and mete to teache a good mayster in grammer to rede.

Chyrdely y al his whole tale [Page] of theyr great desyre of mens sha [...]e or harme, & of their mishandelynge of men, and of vncharitable dealyng, is a very false fayned ta [...]e / and so hath ben all redy proued & foūden, in those y haue had there sur­myse broughte forth vnto the tryall / and so shalbe prou [...]d agayne I doute yt not, when so euer this pacyfyer wyll fall fro y babelyng of a generalty (wherin he may poi [...]t & spyce a false tale wyth suspycyouse wordes) and come to the na­mynge of any one person spe­cyall, & byfore any folke indyfferēt offer hym self to y profe.

For lette hym come forth & name any one whom he wyll / and I warraūt you the dede shall shewe it selfe, that the [Page 248] spyrytuall iudges which had the mater in hande, were ney­ther suche as neded of thys pacyfyer to be taught what longed vnto ryght / nor were so malycyouse and cruell, but that they wolde be as loth as hym selfe to do them rygoure or wronge.

And he shall fynde whom so euer he wyll name, that hath bene eyther punysshed or ab­iured, that the maters whych haue bene layed vnto theym, they haue not bene by any subtyle questyons enduced to confesse them / but they haue ben both well proued agaynst them / and neyther haue bene sleyghte, nor lyghte, nor so straunge artycles and vn­knowen, as they myght ther­in [Page] of ignoraunce or symply­cyte so sore ouershote theymselfe.

But where thys pacyfyer speketh of passyons & of wyl­lynge to be reformed: surely yf he wyll so lyghtely perdon all passyōs, that he wyll haue no man punysshed for any thynge done or sayd in a pas­syon, than shall hys pytuouse affecciō many tymes do mych harme, by the takynge awaye of the punysshement wherof y fere is ordayned to refrayn the passyō, and to make other also forbere the lyke for any suche maner passyon.

For well ye wote, men fall in aduowtry thorow such dāpnable passyōs. And by the pas­syon of [...] and angre, men fal [Page 249] into manslaughter. And by a passyō of pryde, many a man falleth to treason. And by the same passyon also, men fall into heresye, and sometyme ye wote well fall in a playne frā ­sye to. And in theyr passyons of heresye, they speke vngra­ [...]yousely, & contende agaynst the sacramentes, and blas­pheme our blessed lady, and our sauyour hym selfe also, & horrybly dyspyse y holy how­sell, and make mockes and mowys of the masse, & rayle on Crystes owne blessed body and bloude in the blessed sa­crament. wyll thys pacyfyer that all these blasphemouse dampnable heretykes shalbe spared, for such desperat dāp­nable passyons? If that way [Page] were allowed / than were that [...] most sure, y agaynst all the fayth most could rayle and rage. For than myghte it be sayd that the man was in a greate passyon.

Now as for wyllyng to be reformed / I dare say that the spyrytuall iudges wold glad­ly se euery man, and therin wolde gladly shewe them all the fauour they coulde, but somtyme they can not shewe all the fauour that they fayne wolde. For though they maye receyue hym and saue his lyfe at the fyrst tyme: yet are they streyghted by the playne law that they may not so do at the seconde, whan the man is re­lapsed.

And the lawes haue deter­myned [Page 250] who shall be taken & reputed fo [...] an heretyke, and who not, as well as thys pa­cyfyer can teache vs▪ & a l [...]tell better to. And they haue both had a respecte and a sure eye to prouyde, that neyther innocentes or playne symple folke sholde be for any sleyght of­fēce sore hādeled or vntrewly cyrcumuēted aud punysshed / nor that wyly false wreched heretykes, sholde by crafte & sophems be suffered to seme wyse among vnlerned peple, and fayne simplycyte and say they repente and so be sente awaye lyghtely, to go teache theyr heresyes and sow theyr poyson into mennys soulys agayne.

For yf that way were t [...]ken [Page] whych it semeth that this pa­cyfyer wolde haue, that euery man myghte be holde excused that wolde saye he spake he­resye of ignoraūce, or of ouer­syghte, or of symplycyte, or of a passyon, or whyche as often as he wolde not defende his heresye and stobornly stycke therto, or though he dyd for the whyle, wolde afterwarde yet offer to be reformed, and promyse y he wolde amende: yf all these I saye sholde all waye passe vnpunysshed, the chyrche of Cryste at the ma­kyng of the lawes foresawe, and all chrystendome sholde shortely fynde, how lytel frute wolde growe therof.

And whan thys pacyfyer hath tolde thus, myche mysse [Page 251] handelynge and crueltye of the clergy, wherin yf he sayde trew it towched yet very few, and hath proued it by a some saye of as fewe / and fyndeth some such thynges for fautes as yf they were chaunged af­ter the fasshyon of hys boke, wolde of heretykes in many places for a very few make a very greate many / & the lyes that heretykes of malice blow about agaynst theyr iudges, laboreth to make men byleue them for trewe, by hys repe­tynge and reportynge vnder a pretext of cheryte: than en­deth he that paynted processe with his deuout prayour full holyly and sayth, ‘This is a very [...] way / our lorde be more mercyfull to [...] soules, then so greuousely to punyshe [...] for euery lyght defaute.’

[Page]Whan he hath proued those euyll deuyses good, and those false lyes trewe / than let thys good syr Ioh [...] ̄ Some saye take hys portuouse and hys bedys and praye. But in the meane whyle those good men whome by suche fygurys and such holy pretertes, he goeth aboute vngodly to dyffame / do ernestely praye god for him, to gyue hym the grace to c [...]aunge thys euyll fasshyon and thys very sore waye. And they praye god hartely to be more mercyfull to thys pacy­fyers pore soule▪ than thys pacyfyer is to other mennys / whose sou [...]ys (byleue hym self neuer so well, and meane he neuer so well therwyth) [...]et hys [...]ooke go [...] abou [...]e by [Page 252] sowynge of dyssensyon and emboldynge of heretykes, to enfecte and enuenome wyth a grudge & hatered agaynste the spyrytualty, and wyth the cankar of pestylent poysened heresyes / & all agaynste theyr owne saluacyon.

The .xlvi. chapyter.

FOr here shall ye se to the ferther encoragyng of heretykes, what an other goodly Some say thys good syr Iohn̄ Some saye fyndeth Lo thus he sayth.

And here some say / that bycause there is so great a desyre in spyrytuall men, to haue mena [...]i [...]e, and to be noted with he­ [...]esye / and that some as yt were of a poly [...]ye d [...] noyse yt / th [...]t the realme is full of heretykes, more then yt is in dede: that it i [...] very peryllon [...]e / that spyrytuall men [...]ulde haue authorytie to [...] a man for [Page] euery lyght suspeccyon, or complaynte of heresye / tyll that desyre of punyshement in spyrytuall men be ceased and gone: but that they shulde make processe agaynste them to brynge theym in vppon payne of cursynge: and then, yf they tarye fourty dayes / the kynges lawes to bryng them in by a wryt De excommunicato capien do, and so to be brought forth out of the kynges Gaole to answere. But surely, a [...] yt is somwhat touched before in the .vii. chapyter, yt semeth that the chyrche in tyme paste hath done what they coulde to brynge about, that they myghte punyshe heresye of them selfe / wythout callynge for any helpe therin of the seculer power.

And therfore they haue made lawes that heretykes myght be arrested & putte in pryson, and f [...]okes yf nede were / as ap­pereth Clementinis de hereticis. Capi. Multor [...]m querela. And after at the specyall callyng on of the spyritualty / it was enacted by parlyament / that ordynaryes myghte ares [...]e men for heresye: for some men thynke, that the sayde Clementyne was not of effecte in the kynges lawe to are [...] any mā for heresy: but if a man were [...] and notably suspected of heresye, and that there were suffycient recorde and wytnes agayn [...]t hym / and there were al­so [Page 253] a dout that he welde flee & not appe [...] [...] he myght infect other: yt [...] that he be [...] by the bodye [...] but not vpon euery [...]yght complaynt, that full lygh [...]ly may [...]. And yt wyll be right expedyēt that the kynge [...] hy [...] ­nes and hys counsayle [...] specya [...]ly [...]ppon thys mater / and not to cease / [...] yt be broughte to more quyetnes then yt i [...] yet, and to se wyth great dylygence, that pryde, couetyse, nor worldly [...] be no [...], nor [...] be punyshed, ne yet [...]t wylfull o [...]enders go not wythoute [...].

In this processe lo good rea­ders this pacyfyer decla [...]e [...]h, that he wold haue the kynges hyghnes and his coūsayle so specyally loke vppon this mater, that neyther innocentes sholde be punyshed, nor yet wylfull offenders go without dew correccyon▪ who coulde ende and conclude all his mater more frutefully?

[Page]But now the specyall ways wherby he deuy [...]eth, that the kynges hyghnes and his coū sayle sholde bryng this chyng about / betwayne.

The tone is, yf they pro­uyde that neyther men that be proude nor couetouse, nor haue any loue to the worlde, be suffered to be iudges ī any cause of heresy.

The tother is, that the bysshoppes shall arrest no man for heresy, tyll the desyre that spyrytuall men haue to cause men abiure heresyes and to punyshe them for heresyes, be ceased and gone.

And surely I thynke that his two dyuises will serue suffycyently for the tone parte / that ys to wyt that none innocentes [Page 254] shalbe punyshed. But I fere me very sore, that they wyll not serue halfe so suffycyently for y tother parte, y is to wyt that wylfull offendours go not wythout correccyon.

For now to begynne wyth his fyrst dyuyce, y none be susfered to be iudges in cause of heresye, that are proude, or couetouse, or haue loue to the worlde / yf he meane of suche as haue none of these affeccy­ons wyth notable enormyte, then tyll he proue theym that are all redy worse then he proueth theym yet / that is to say tyll he proue yt otherwyse by some of theyr outragyouse dedes in the dealynge and mys­handelynge of men for here­sy, that he here defameth them [Page] of, then he hath yet proued, & that he proue theyre cruell wrongful dealyng, otherwise then by some sayes, or by his owne sayenge: the kynges hyghnes and his counsayle can se for al his holesome coū sayle, no cause to chaunge those iudges that are all redy, but to leue them styll / and thē serueth that diuyce of nought

And on the other syde, yf he meane that y kynges hyghnesse shal suffer none to be iudges in cause of heresye, that hath any spyce at all, eyther of pryde, or of couercyse, or any loue at all vnto this worlde: heretyques may syt styll and make mery for a lytle season, whyle men walke aboute and seke for suche iudges. For yt [Page 255] wyll not be lesse thē one whole wekes worke I wene, both to fynde such, and to be sure that they be suche.

And yt wyll be somewhat the more harde, bycause that where as men wolde haue went soneste to haue founde them, there this pacifyer hath put vs out of dout, that there shall yt be merurylous harde to fynde any one of them / that is to wytte in a [...]y parte of the spyrytualty, prelates, seculer pres [...]es, or relygyouse per­sons, any one or other. For he sayth playnely that haue they neuer so many vertues bysyde / yet yt wyll be hard to fynd any one spyrituall man, but that he is so infected with desyre and affeccyon to haue [Page] the worldly honour of prestes exalted, that he is thorowe suche pryde farre fro suche in differēce & equyte, as ought & muste be in those iudges tha [...] this pacyfyer assygneth, why­che muste haue no spyce of pryde, couetyse, nor loue to­warde the worlde. And then syth in all the spyrytualtye yt wyll be as he sayth harde to fynde any one / yt wyll be ye wote well twyse as harde to [...]ynde twayne / and yet be they to few for all y realme though they were made iustyces of Ayer.

Nowe yf it wyll be so harde to fynde any one suche in the spyrytualtye / I can scant be­leue but that it wold be some­what a do to finde many such [Page 256] in the temporaltye eyther / & specyally not onely suche but those also that y kyng myght be sure to be suche / bysydes y there must be thā many chaū ­ges and many newe deuyses of lawes for y mater, bycause fewe temporall men be suffy­cyently lerned in those lawes of the chyrche, by whych that mater hath bene accustumed to be ordered before. And happely yf any such men be so suffycyentely lerned / yet is it possyble that those men whiche are so lerned, are not those y are so pure and clene frome euery spyce of pryde, couetyse & worldely loue. And therfore were y heretykes lykely thus to make mery a good whyle, before there sholde be found [...] [Page] good iudges for them.

Now as for the [...]other poynt, that bysshoppes sholde not arreste them / thys wolde also helpe to the surety of innocentes, as frome any trouble of suyt / & so wyll it also ferther, yf neyther bysshop nor kynge arrest them. And in lyke wyse wyll it saue innocentes from y trouble of all false endygh­tementes, yf no man shold be neyther for no felony arrested nor endyghted neyther.

But than thys waye wold not well serue for the tother syde, that wylfull offenders sholde not passe vnpunyshed. And therby syth it wold helpe wylfull offendours to passe wythoute punysshement / it myghte happe to punyshe in­nocētes [Page 257] more sore, than shold the trouble of suy [...] & wrong­full arrestyng do.

But yet is thys pacyfyer not so fauourable towarde folke suspected of heresye, as to take away the power of the bysshoppe for euer, of arre­stynge them, and to dryue the ordynaryes for euer to suecytacyons agaynst heretykes and processe of excommuny­cacyō / but wyll haue he sayth the bysshoppes power of ar­restyng no lenger suspended, than as longe as spyrytuall men haue that greate desyre to cause mē abiure or to haue them punysshed for heresye / as though he had wel proued that they haue so, bycause he sayth that some men saye so.

[Page]But now yf Some say be no suffycyent profe / than is hys tale los [...]e. For than he sheweth no cause why that power of theyrs shold in any cause be more supended now, than in any tyme here before. [...]nd on y to [...]her s [...]de, yf some saye be a good profe / than the suspendynge wyll be as long as a [...]pryuyng for euer, syth there shall neuer be any tyme [...]n whyche there shall lake one or other some say to say more than [...]routh.

yet is he content at the last, lest euery man myghte spye the perell of hys deuyce, to [...]empere hys deuyce in suche wyse, that tyll the spyritualty [...]aue lefte theyr cruell desyre [...] [...]urynge and punyshyng [Page 258] folke for heresye, they sholde not be suffred to arreste folke for euery lyght suspycyon, or euery complaynt of heresye. How be it he graunteth that where one is openly and no­tably suspected of heresy, and suffycyēt recorde and wytnes agaynste hym, and bysydes all that, a dowte that he wold fle wherby he myghte enfecte other: than he graunteth it conuenyent that he sholde be arrested by y body. And therin he bryngeth in the Clemētine and the statute, by whych the ordynaryes haue power to arreste folke for suspycyon of heresye / and wold as farre as I perceyue, haue the kynge [...]eforme thē after his deuyce. But yet syth which is a lyght [Page] suspycyon, and whyche is an heuy / and whyche is a lyghte complaynte and whych is an heuy / and whyche is an open s [...]spycyon, and whyche but a preuy, and whyche suspycyon is notable, and whyche is not notable, & whyche wytnesses b [...] suffycyent, and whyche be not suffycyēt, be thynges that must be wayed by the spyry­tuall iudges / and vpon theyr wayenge of y mater for lyght or heuy, must folow the arre­ [...] of the party or the le­uynge of the arreste: we be come agayne as in a mase to the poynt where we beganne, that be the mater g [...]ate or smale, leste all the whyle they [...] cruell they sholde iudge [...] heuy and smale greate, [Page 259] theyr arrestynge of any at all muste be suspended fro them, and sende them to sue by cytacyon, tyll menne se that same mynde of theyrs of desyrynge mennys abiuracyon and pu­nyshement vtterly chaunged and ceace / that is to saye tyll there be no man left that wyll so myche as saye that some men saye that they haue not lefte that mynde yet, & make a lye agayne of them than, as those some haue done that haue so sayde all redy to syr Iohn̄ some saye now. And longe wyll it be I warraunt you ere euer all suche folke fayle.

And therfore syth in the meane season by thys pacy­ [...]yers good deuyse, heretykes [Page] may go vnarrested / I can not byleue that yf hys waye were folowed, it wold be any good mene to make that wylfull offenders in heresye sholde not passe vnpunyshed, as fast as bothe in the ende of thys chapiter and the tother before also▪ he calleth vppon the kynges hyghnes and hys coun­sayle and hys parleament, to loke vppon thys mater after hys good aduertysemēt, and neuer ceace tyll they brynge it to effecte.

I lytle doute but that yf the kinges hyghnesse do as I doute not but hys hyghnesse wyll do, maynteyne & assyste the spyrytualty in executynge of the lawes, euyn those that are all redy made agaynst he­resyes [Page 260] / and commaunde euery temporall offycer vndes hym to do the same for hys parte: though there were ne­uer mo newe lawes made therfore, yet shall both inno­centes be saued harmelesse well ynough, and offendo [...]s punyshed to.

The .xlvii. chapyter.

NOw where as this pa­cyfyer sayth, that some of the spyrytualty as of poly­cy do noyse yt, that the realm ys full of heretikes more then yt is in dede: I thynke there is no polytyque man of the spyrytualty that wyll make that noyse, wherby the here­tikes might be the more bold, and the catholiques more in­clynable [Page] to the worse parte, and y more faynte and feble in the fayth.

But I know this very well that heretyques haue made that noyse, both for the cause afore sayde, and [...]lso to fere the ordynaryes therwith, and to put theyr offycers in drede from doynge of theyr offyce. And peraduenture vpon such noyse some offycers haue ben aferd. And at the leste wyse I wo [...]e well, some heretyques haue ben so bolde, that they haue not fered to flocke to gether / not all ar the fyrste for heresy, but some fall in amōg t [...]em [...]or good companye, to [...] some s [...]rewd turne they [...] greatly what / but [...] wyth a lytle more ac­quay [...]taunce [Page 261] and communy­cacyon, haue fallen into theyr heresyes also. And suche noy­ses be some tyme for the ad­uauntage and fortherans of them that entende vnhappynes, to make folke wene they were very many, be they ne­uer so few.

I remember many tymes that euen here in London, af­ter the gret besynes that was there on a May daye in the mornynge, by a rysyng made agaynst straungers / for why­che dyuerse of the prētyces & iourney men suffered execucyo [...] of treason, by an olde sta­tute made longe byfore, a­gaynst al such as wold violat the kynges saufconducte: I was apoynted among other [Page] to serche oute and enquyre by dylygent examynacyon, in what wyse and by what per­sons, that pryuy confederacy beganne. And in good fayth after great tyme taken, and myche dilygence vsed therin / we perfytly tryed out at laste, that all that bysynes of any rysynge to be made for the mater, byganne onely by the conspyracy of two yonge laddes that were prentyces in chepe. whych after y thyng dyuysed fyrste and compaced betwene theym twayne, perused pryuyly the iourneymen fyrste, and after the prentyces▪ of many of the meane craftes in the cytye / beryng the fyrst that they spake wyth in hand, that they hadde secretely spoken wyth [Page 262] many other occupacyons all redy, and that the [...] were all a­greed therunto▪ and that bysydes theym there were two or thre hundred of seruyng men of dyuers lordes houses, and some of the kynges to, why­che wolde not be named nor knowe [...], that wolde yet in the nyght [...]e at hande / and when they were ones vppe, wolde not fayll to f [...]ll in wyth them and take theyr parte.

Now this vngracyouse inuencyon and these wordes of those two lewde laddes (whyche yet in the besynesse fledde awaye theym selfe, and neuer came agayne after) dyd putte some other by theyr ouersight and lightnes in such a corage & boldenes, that they wende [Page] them self able to auenge theyr [...]yspleasure in the nyght / & after either neuer to be knowē, or to be strong ynough to bere yt out and go farther.

And the lyke vngracyouse [...]olycy dyuise now these here­ [...]yques that call them self euā gelycall bretherne / some pot-heded postles they haue, tha [...] wander about the realme into sundry shyres, of whome euery one hath in euery [...]hyre a dyuerse name / and some per­aduēture in corners here and there they brynge into the brether [...]ed. But whyther they gete any or none, they let not to lye when they come home, and say that more then halfe of euery shyre is of theyr own secte. And the same boste [Page 263] Bayfelde thapo [...]ata whyche was after burne [...] in Smyth­felde, made vnto myne owne selfe. But blessed be god whā he came to the fyre, he fownd none very redy to pull hym fro it.

How be it there was in one place of the dyocyse of Londō but la [...]e, a company that by such meanes eche encoraging other, toke suche harte and boldenes, and openly by day they ensembled them selfe to­gyther to the number of an hundred or aboue, to rescue a well knowen open hertyke out of the ordynaryes hādes. Howe be it as many as they were they spedde not, & som [...] of them punysshed after.

And in y same dyocise also, [Page] when there was a preste takē for heresye, and in the cōmys­saryes handes / worde was brought hym that excepte he delyuered the preste and lette hym go, he sholde within two howres haue .ii. or .iii. hun­dred come fet hym, that wold pluck down his house or burn it ouer hys hed. wheruppon the commissary wers afrayed then hurte, delyuered out the preste / whom yf he had kepte styll, there wolde peraduen­ture for all y crakes, not one heretyke of them all haue ben so bolde to come fette hym.

But yet that could I not well haue warraunted hym.

And in some place of the same dyocise also, they haue made a greate face, and sayd [Page 264] that though the kynge sente hys commyssyon vnder hys great seale therfore / they wold not suffer a sore suspected preste of theyrs for heresye to be taken thense. How be [...] when that after I s [...]aled a cō ­missyon and sent it vppon the assaye, it made theyr hartes (god be thanked) faynted and were so well come downe, that they layed all the wyghe to a fewe lewde felowes and women in the towne.

And therfore boste & bragge these blessed br [...]therne neuer so fast, they fele full well them selfe, that they be to feble in what cuntrey so euer they be strengest. For yf they thought theym selfe able to mete and matche the catholykes / they [Page] wolde not I wene lye styll i [...] reste thre dayes.

For in all places where he­resyes haue sprongē hytherto so hath it euer proued yet.

And surely so neglygently myght it be handeled, and the mater so longe forslowthed, y at length in tyme so myght it happe here to. And veryly that they loke onys therfore (as farre as they be yet fro the power) some of them haue not lette to say, nor some to wryte it neyther. For I redde the letter my selfe which was cast into the palyce of y ryght re­ [...]erende father in god Cuth­ [...]rt now bysshop of Durhm̄, and at that [...]me bysshop of London / in whyche amonge many other bragyng wordes [Page 265] mete what so euer they were for those heretyke bretherne that made it, were these wor­des conteyned.

There wyll onys come a day.

And out of questyon that day they not onely longe for▪ but also dayly loke for / and wold if they were not to weke not fayle to fynde it / & in some mornyng erly lyke good thry­uynge husbandes, aryse by them selfe vncalled, as they sodaynly dyd in Basyll.

And the greter hope haue they, bycause in places where they fall in company, men vse them not now adayes as the tyme was when they dyd.

For they se [...] that it begynneth almost to growe in custume, that amonge good catholyke [Page] folke, yet be they suffred bol­dely to talke vnchekked.

whiche thynge all be it farre from commendable, yet wyth many folke it happeth vppon a good surety, that good men in theyr owne mynde cōceyue of the strength and fastnes of the catholyke fayth / whyche they verely thynke so strong, that heretykes for all theyr bablynge shall neuer be able to vaynquyshe. And therein vndoutedly theyr mynde is not onely good but also very trewe. But they thynke not farre inough. For as the se [...] shall neuer surunde and ouer whelme all the lande, and yet hath it eaten many places in▪ and swalowed hole cuntrees vppe, and made many places [Page 266] nowe see that somtyme were well inhabyted landes, & hath lost parte of hys owne posses­syon in other partes agayne: so though the fayth of Cryste shall neuer be ouerflowē with heresyes, nor the gates of hell preuayle agaynste Crystes chyrche / yet as in some places it wynneth in new people, so maye there in some places by neglygence be lost tholde.

For yf that we bycause we know our cause so good, bere our selfe theruppon so bolde, that we make lyght & sleyght of our aduersaryes: it maye happen to fare bytwene the catholykes and heretykes at length, as it fareth somtyme in a suyte at the lawe by some good man, agaynst whome a [Page] su [...]tle wily shrew begynneth a false accyon, and asketh from hym all the lande he hath.

Thys good man somtyme that knoweth hys mater so trew, persuadeth to hym selfe that it were not possyble for hym to lese it by the law. And when hys counsayle talketh wyth hym, & asketh hym how he can proue thys poynt or y, for hym selfe / answereth a­gayne, feare ye not for that syr, I warraunt you / all the whole cuntrey knoweth it / the mater is so trew, and my part so playne, y I care not what iudges, what arbytrours, what .xii. men go theron. I wyl chalenge no man for any labour that myne aduersary can make therin. And wyth [Page 267] suche good hope / the good man goeth hym home, & there sytteth styll and putteth no doubte in the mater. But in the meane whyle hys aduer­sary (which for lacke of treuth of hys cause, must nedes put all hys truste in crafte) goeth abouth his mater busely, and by all y false meanes he may maketh hym frendes, some with good felowshyppe, some wyth rewardes, fyndeth a fe­lowe to forge hym false euy­dence, maketh meanes to the shyryffe, geteth a parcyall pa­nell, laboreth the iury / and when they come to the barre he hath all hys trynkettes redy / where as good Tomme Treuth cometh forth vppon the tother syde, & bycause he [Page] weneth all y worlde knoweth how trewe his mater is, bryngeth neuer a wytnesse wyth hym, and all hys euydence vnsorted. And one wyst I ones, that broughte vnto the barre when the [...]ury was sworne, and openly delyuered his coū sayle hys tender boxe wyth hys flynte and hys matches, in stede of his bo [...] of euydēce, for that had he lefte at home / so neglygent are good folke somtyme, whan the knowen [...]routh of theyr mater maketh them ouer bolde.

And surely myche what after this fashyon in many pla­ces play these here [...]ykes and we. For lyke as a few byrdes alway chyrkynge and fleyng from bushe to bushe, many ty­mes [Page 268] seme a great many: so these heretyques be so besyly walkynge, that in euery ale house, in euery tauerne, in eu [...] ry barge, and almoste euery bote, as few as they be a man shall alwaye fynde some / and there be they so besye wyt [...] theyr talkynge, and in better places also where they maye be herd, so feruent and impor­tune in puttynge forth of any thynge whyche may serue for the fortheraunce of theyr purpose, that betwene theyr im­portune preasyng, and the dylygence or rather the negly­gence of good catholyke men, appereth often tymes as gret a dyfference, as bytwene frost and fyre.

And surely bytwene the tre [...] [Page] catholyke folke and the false heretykes, yt fareth also mych lyke as yt fared betwene false Iudas and Crystes faythfull apostles. For whyle they for all Crystes callynge vppon them to wake and praye, fell fyrst in a slumber, and after in a dede slepe: the traytour neyther slept nor slumbered / but went about full besely to betray his mayster, and bring hym selfe to myschyefe.

But yet whē he came with his company, they scaped not all scot fre / nor Peter well a waked oute of his slepe was not so slouthfull, but that he could cut of one knaues ea [...]e / nor all the wreches of theym with all theyr wepens, able to stande agaynste Crystes bare [Page 269] worde, when he sayde, I am [...] whom ye seke / but to groūde they fell forthwith vp ryght vpō theyr backes. wherby we be sure that neyther heretikes nor deuyls can any thyng do but by goddes spe­cyall sufferaūce / & that they shall betwen them both, neuer be able to destroye the catholyke fayth, nor to preuayle agaynst y catho­lyke chyrch / and all the myschyef shall be theyr owne at lengthe, though god for our synne suffer them for a scourge to preuayle in some places here and there for a whyle / whom vpon mēnes amen­dement he wyll not fayle to serue at the last, as doth y tēder mother whyche when she hath beten her chylde for his wantōnes, wypeth hys [...]y [...]n & kysseth hym, & casteth the rodde in the fyre.

How be it yf euer it shold (as god forbede it shold, & I trust it neuer [Page] shall) [...]y such [...]old slouth & negly­gence on the catholyke part, and suche hote feruent labour of the heretykes, y the heretykes parte shold happe to grow so strong, as they shold cōspyre to geue the ad­uenture by fete of handes: I no­thyng dout of good mēnes good hertes, nor of the present ayde & helpe of god, but that the presence of parell raysyng men out of this dulle slepe, wold cause them than so to waxe warme & dylygent in y mater, that the heretykes sholde haue such spede, as they haue be­fore this tyme had in thys realme when they haue attēpted the like.

But yet though the heretykes part shold (as I verely trust they shold) haue euer more the worst / yet very sure it is, y neyther parte shold haue y better / but y it wold then well appere, that it had bene mych more wisedome for al good [Page 270] catholyque men, to haue waren warmer afore, & to haue repressed those heretykes in tyme, before they grew to so many.

And this thyng was perceyued very well both before the making of that statute of kyng Henry the iiii, whiche statute this pacyfyer wolde haue now reformed, & also at the tyme of the makynge / & yet mych better sone after in y reygn of the prince of famous memory kyng Henry y .v. For before this statute made / the parleamēt ī the fyfth yere of kyng Richard the ▪ii. complayned of heretikes / & foūde grete harme grow that they were not arrested, but wythout arreste in cōtempt of the censuris of holy chirch, spred theyr heresies about fro shyre to shyre & fro dyocise to dyocise. wherof the realme fered as y statute expresseth, that therof wold at length grow some great [Page] cōmocyō & perell. And therfore it was than prouided, that at the request of thordinary y chaūcellour shold fro tyme to tyme award out commyssyons, to attache such he­retykes and kepe them in strong pryson, tyll they were iustyfyed & ordered accordynge to the lawes of the chyrche. And yet was it afterwarde well perceyued, that this prouisyon could not suffyce. For the heretykes wold comenly be gone before the cōmissyō could come, and do as mych hurt in an other place. And therfore the par­leamēt in the second yere of kyng Henry the .iiii, both beyng enfor­med by the clergy, & also by them selfe perceyuynge that those here­ [...]kes encreaced styll, & wolde at lēgth do some gret myschiefe but y [...] they were better repressed / dyd among other good thynges pro­uyde, that thordynaryes myghte [Page 271] arrest the heretykes, & imprysone them them selfe. And yet was all that to lytell to. For in some pla­ces y heretykes waxed to strong, & wolde not be arrested for them. And therfore at last it cam to that poynt, that men longe hadde lo­ked for. For those heresyes by­gonne by wycleffe in the tyme of the noble prynce kynge Rychard the .ii, & beyng then by some folke mayntened, & by many men wyn­ked at, and almost by al folke for slouthed / the parell was so longe neglected, that y heretykes were growen vnto such nūber, corage, and boldenes, that afterwarde in the tyme of y said famouse prince kyng Henry the fyfth, they cōspy­red amonge them, not onely the abolycyō of the fayth, & spoylyng of the spyrytualtye, but also the destruccyon of the kyng & all hys nobylyte, wyth a playne subuer­syon [Page] & ouerturnyng of y state of hys hole realme. Uppon whyche theyr false conspyracy dysclosed / when they were by the policy of y noble prynce & hys counsayle dysappoynted, & secretely preuēted, & the felde takē vp before, ī which they had entēded to gather to ge­ther by night, & frō thens to haue made theyr [...]nuasyon: than after dew punyshemēt done vpō many of thē, it was well ꝑceyued what grete nede it was euer after to re­presse & subdue suche sedycyouse heresies forthwith at y fyrst springyng. And therfore was there by & by therupon by the full perlya­ment, not onely that law confer­med whiche lawe this pacyfyer here speketh of in this chapyter▪ but also mo made therunto / as y they that were delyuered to y se­cular handes, shold forfayt both goodes & landes / & that the great [Page 272] officers of the realme shold be so­lempnely sworen to represse here­tykes & assyst y ordynaryes. And therfore vndoutedly y good chri­sten zele of the prynce, the nobles, & the comons, toward the mayn­tenaūce of the fayth / & theyr hygh wysedome in prouydynge for the conseruacyon of the peace, rest, & suerty of the realme, were the au­thours & very doers, in y making and passynge of that very vertu­ouse & very prudent acte. whyche acte, that euer thys pacyfyer, or a great many suche, shall be able to [...]nduce thys prudent parlyament to chaunge, that wyll I se ere I byleue. whyche I truste I neuer shal in this tyme / namely in whi­che, though there be not the .xv. parte of so many heretykes as these y be wolde very fayne there were, and whyle there be not, yet wold haue thē seme to be, yet are there of trouth many mo then [Page] there were within these few yeres past / & therby the cause for which the statute was made, not onely stādeth styll, but is ouer y of late very gretely encreased / & so more nede to lette those lawes stande & make mo such to thē besyde, then by the asswagyng & mytygacyon of any part of thē, to brynge these heretykes into suche corage and surety, as the goodly dyuyses of thys pacyfyer coulde not fayle yf they were folowed to bring them.

The .xlviii. chapyter.

WHich, where as he vseth to y settyng forth of his purpose, a surmised suspicyō agaynst the spyrytualty, makyng men by­leue vnder his fygure of Some saye, that the spyrytuall iudges mysse handle those maters, & vse them selfe therin cruelly: I dare be bounde to warraunt, that ryght good wytnesse & worshypfull shal recorde and testyfye, that they [Page 273] haue ben present and sene the iudges hādle them with very great fauour alway, and somtyme to say the trouth to ten­derly.

wherof for the meane whyle me thynke I may take to re­corde for all hys Some sayes this pacyfyer hym selfe and hys awne wordes, whyche in this pyteouse booke of dyuysyon hym selfe sayth. For in hys fyrste chapyter he sayth (as I shewed you) that some men to pull rychesse from the chyrch, haue not onely spoken and by playne wordes affermed he­resye, but haue also dyspysed pylgrymages & purgatory, & playne inueyed agaynst them of polycy.

Now seeth euery man that [Page] any eyen hath, that yf the or­dynaryes and the spyrytuall iudges were so fyerse and so cruell as thys pacyfyer spe­keth of, then wolde not those other men thinke that openly to speke and afferme false he­resyes, were for any maner purpose any proper polycy. And therfore as for such cru­eltye and mysse handelynge of innocentes / that thys pacyfyers [...]ale is vntrewe, bothe other good folke can testyfye, and hys owne wordes also beare wytnesse.

And therfore nede we no suche chaunge of the lawes for that purpose. But on the tother syde, what harme wold come of hys mytygacyons, & what increace of heretykes, [Page 274] the hole summe and sequele of hys deuyses do more than many festely shewe.

For suppose me now, that a tynker or a tylar whyche could (as some there can) rede englysshe, and beynge instructed and taught by some olde cunnyng weuar in wyclyffes wyckette, & Tindals bookes, and Frythes, & frere Barons were now become hym selfe an vsshar, or after hys may­sters deceace a doctour / & that were suche a one as Fryth wryteth resorted to hym, wh [...] ­che though he was but Fry­thes dyscyple and scolar, was yet (he sayth) more meately to be bysshoppe than many that weare the myter: now yf this tynker or tylar lurking about [Page] and teachynge hys gospell in corners, were secretely detec­ted to his ordynary, and ther­vpon sent for & came / he shold by the deuyse of this pacyfye [...] for the fyrste shyfte say bryng me forth myne accuser / & thā syth the callynge ex officio were gone, home goeth the tynkar agayne merely for that tyme, and taketh forth hys scolars a newe lesson.

Then yf the court will ap­poynt an offycer of theyr own for an accuser, as an officer of a temporall courte may geue informacyon for the kynge: the tynkar yet when he were called agayne, wold crye oute vppon that. And who so hol­deth agaynst the processe ex of­ficio, wolde take the tynkars [Page 275] parte therin to, and call those twayne but bothe one / and so home goth the tynkar agayn.

Then yf some man (whych wolde be longe erste I wene) could yet at the laste be foun­den, that wolde offer hym self as an accuser agaynst this tinkar, when he were called a­gay [...], and his heresyes were layed vnto his charge: yet yf the wytnesses were peraduen ture some scolars of his own / and lackyng the wyly shyftes that hym selfe had, fyrst had denyed theyr heresyes vppon theyr othes, and after yet confessed theym agayne both vp­pon them self and theyr may­ster tynkar to, then were there neuer so many of them, yet by the deuyse of this pacyfyer, al [Page] theyre wytnes were naught worth, bycause they were naughty men, here [...]ikes them self, and fyrst forsworen also / [...]o that yet home goth the tynkar agayne.

Nowe yf there were after other good honeste proues, that wolde come in and proue playnely the heresyes that he helde / when the tynkar were therto called, he wolde say he [...] yt all of ignoraunce.

Then yf the mater were such, as he muste nedes haue herd of and knowen the trew fayth byfore, as pylgrymage, purgatorye, or the sacrament of the autre: he wyll not yet stycke myche to saye, brynge in some bodye here that wyll swere that euer he dyd teache [Page 276] yt me. And yet when that answere in suche an open mater wyll not serue / he wyll saye that he sayd yt of symplycyte, and that he byleueth as the chyrche byleueth he. And whē he is asked howe the chyrche byleueth, he wyll saye he wo­teth nere. And yf his wordes be rehersed vnto hym clene cō trary to the comen knowen catholike fayth of the chyrch / he wyll say he was not ware that the chyrche byleued so / & wyll say that they sholde not speke of suche hygh maters y serue for doctours, to suche a pore tynkar y medleth wyth brasse and not with latyn. And there shall he then haue some of his other faculty gather & stande about, and saye yt is pytye in [Page] dede that suche a pore symple soule sholde haue any suche questyons asked hym. But they wyll put yt for no pyty [...] at all, that suche an vnlerned fole shall amonge suche other as are lesse lerned then hym selfe, teache boldely the false parte, and there brage & boste that he better vnderstandeth y mater, then all the doctours in the towne.

yet yf it appere that by sore wordes he despysed & inueyed agaynst pylgrymages & pur­gatory, & suche other thynges so that he dyd it not of sym. plycyte when he spake therin so shrewdly / then hath thys pacyfyer taught hym to saye, that he dyd it of polycy to pul awaye ryches from the chyr­che [Page 727] / and therfore can that be no heresye.

Now yf the iudges be so sore & so cruell, that they wyll not alowe that polyccy / yet hath thys pacyfyer taughte hym farther to say, that he dyd but speke it affyrmatyuely, and wyll not hold it opinatyucly / and than ye wote well it is by thys pacyfyer no heresye.

And therfore muste hys iudges when they haue all done, sende thys tynkar yet onys home agayne / and not kepe hym to longe a way, lest hys scolars sholde playe the truantes and lacke theyr ler­nynge the whyle.

And yet yf he sayd as myche after agayne, and theruppon were called agayn / he myght [Page] say agarne that he were ouer [...]sene in y sayenge, of a [...]yght­ne [...]e of wytte and slyppernes of tonge. But he wyll not holde it opynatyuely / & ther­fore yet agayne it maye be no heresye / so that home muste the tynkar agayne.

And now y [...] it sholde hap­pen him to say and do so farre as he were afrayde to byde any farther rek [...]ning, namely where spyritual men so f [...]erce and so cruell sholde be hys iudges / the bysshoppe myght not arest hym yet, tyll proues be brought in fyrste, that the spyrytualtye haue lefte theyr greate desyre to abiure and punysshe heretykes / but must all the meane whyle cyte hym suspende hym, & accurse hym, [Page 278] and fet hym in by the kynges wryt when he is runne ou [...]e farre of into an other cūt [...]ey, and there ha [...]h chaunged his name and set vp a newe scole, where as men can neyther fynd hym nor yet wote where to seke hym.

when sholde there by these meanes wylfull offenders be punysshed? whyche though thys pacyfyer pretende that he wolde haue done / yet con­syder these th [...]e chapyters of hys whyche I haue rehersed you, the fyrste, the seuenth, & the eyghte, and ye shall fynde hys deuyses come to lytell better effecte, than after thys fasshyon that I haue here de­scrybed you.

And than yf suche good [Page] prouysyons may be made for them, that they maye neuer be brought into answere, and that they may haue so many shyftes whan so euer they come: it wyll lytell fere them what payne ye sette after con̄ ­uyc [...]yon / burne them twyse yf ye wyll after iudgement, they wyll wyth good wyll agre / prouydynge fyrste such good actes for them as they shall neuer come so farre.

And therfore good chrystē readers, wolde god the world were such as euery man were so good, spyrytuall, tēporall, and all, that neyther parte coulde fynde any fawte in other / and all these heresyes so clene gone and forgeten, & al those that are infected were [Page 279] so clene turned and chaūged, that no man neded eyther ab­iuracyon or punysshement.

But syth that thys is more easy to wyshe, than lykely to loke for: therfore is it wyse­dome that spyrytuall & tem­porall both, albe it men be not all sayntes, yet yf theyr condycyōs be tolerable, eyther part labour to make hym self bet­ter, and charytably somwhat eyther part beare with other. And those extreme vices whi­che neyther the tone nor the tother ought in any wyse to suffer, as thefte, adultery, sa­crylege, murder, inceste, and periury, sedycyon, insurrec­cyon, treason, & heresye / bothe partes in one agreyng, to the honour of god and peace of [Page] Chrystes chyrche, wyth reste, welth, and surety of y prynce and the realme, dylygently refourme and amēde in suche as are mendable / and those whose corrupt canker no cure can heale, cut of in season for corruptynge farther.

The .xlix. chapyter.

ANd thus good crysten readers I make an ende of this mater, the boke I meane of thys dyuysyon / wherin I haue nothyng tou­ched nor entēded, but onely y I wold not the tēporalty bare the spiritualty y worse mynde or affeccyō, for any such suttle inuēced ways that lay the fau [...]es of the badde to the whole body, wherin be many good / [Page 280] and vnder a fygure of some say, saye some thynges false them selfe / nor that men shold causelesse vppon such surmy­sed and vnproued crueltye, chaūge the good lawis byfore made agaynste heretyques, wherby to the dyspleasure of god & prouokynge of his in­dygnacyon, we were lykely to haue the fayth decay, & more harme grow theron then any man yet can tell.

The whole sōme & effect therfore of my mynde in this ma­ter is, that as touchynge the spyrytualtye, I bere a tender mynde of trouth towarde (I say) y body not toward those that are noughte therin. And thys mynde ys euery man bounde to bere / and I truste [Page] so doth this pacyfyer to, and wyll of hym selfe I wene do well ynough, yf he vse to the contrary none euyll coūsayle.

As touchynge here [...]ykes, I hate that vyce of theyrs & not theyr persones / and very fayne wolde I that the tone were destroyed, and the tother saued. And that I haue to­ward no mā any other mynde then thys, (howe lowdely so euer these blessed newe bre­therne the prof [...]ssours & preach [...]rs of verycye bylye me) yf all the fauour and pytye that I haue vsed amonge theym to theyre amendement were knowen, y [...] wo [...]de I warraūt you well and p [...]ayne appere / wherof yf it were requysyte I coulde bryng forth wytnesses [Page 281] mo then men wold wene.

And sure this one thynge wyll I be bolde to say, that I neuer founde any yet, but had he ben neuer so bad, nor done neuer so myche harme byfore: yet after that I founde hym ones chaunged and in good mynde to mende, I haue ben so gladde therof, that I haue vsed hym fro thens forth not as an euyll man or an abiect, nor as a straūger neyther, but as a good man and my very frende.

Howe be yt bycause yt were neyther ryghte nor honestye, that any man sholde loke for more thāke then he deserueth / I wyll that all the world wyt it on y tothersyde, that who so be so depely grounded in ma­lyce [Page] to the harme of his owne soule and other mennes to, and so set vppon the sowynge of sediciouse heresyes, that no good meanes that men maye vse vnto hym, can pull that malycyouse foly oute of hys poysened proude ob [...]tynate harte: I wolde rather be con­tent that he were gone ī tyme, then ouer longe to tary to the destruc [...]yon of other.

Finally as for the authour of y boke of dyuisyō, bycause he ꝓfesseth these herety [...]ues opyniōs for heresies as thei be / I truste in all his other thynges hym selfe meaneth but well / but partely may be by some pytyfull affeccyon ledde. And some thynges he sayth but vppon report / and somethynges [Page 282] affermeth peraduenture as of hym selfe, bycause of y fyrme c [...]edence that he therein hath geuen to some that were not so credyble as he toke theym fore. But in conclusyon what so euer he be, for a [...]y thynge that I perceyue in his boke, he shall I trust in conclusyon be founden no suche maner of man, as folke shold of reason reken to bere vnto the weale of the prynce and the realme, any better mynde thē I. How be yt yf his wytte and hys lernynge fynde a better waye, then not onely I (whyche am but a playne soule and can inuent no neweltyes, but am content to stande to the olde order and lawes) but also then all they, whyche for [Page] this realme in specyall, and for the whole chyrche of Cryst in generall, haue made those prouysyons of old: I neyther can nor wyll forbede any man to folowe hym.

But thys wyll I be bolde to counsayle euery man, to whose parte so euer any suche chaunge shall perteyne, fyrste that they haue as I dout not but they wyll, a good christen mynde to the mayntenaunce of Crystes catholyke fayth / & that they therin stande by the olde, wythout the contrary chaunge of any poynt of our olde bylyefe, for any thynge brought vppe for newe, not onely by Luther, Tyndale, Fryth, or frere Barons / but also yf there wolde (as there [Page 283] neuer wyll) an angell (as saīt Poule sayth) come out of he­nyn & preche a contrary new.

Secundely for as myche as these newe fathers of these new bretherne, lyke as they make falsed treuth & treuth falsed, and fayth heresies and heresyes fayth, so do call also the newe olde and the olde newe / not lettynge to call in theyr bookes that fayth but new, whyche them selfe con­fesse in the same bookes to be more old than thage of eyght hundred yere: I wyll aduyse you therfore good readers for the trewe takynge of the olde fayth, and for the dyscernyng therof from all newe, to stand to the common well knowē by­lyefe of the comon knowen [Page] catholyke chyrche of all chry­sten people / such fayth as by your selfe, and your fathers, and your graūdefathers, you haue knowen to be byleued / and haue ouer that herde by them that the contrary was in the tymes of theyr fathers & theyr graundefathers also, taken euer more for heresye. And also ye y rede but euyn in englysshe bookes, shall in many thynges perceyue the same, by storyes fyue tymes as farre afore that.

we must also for the percey­uynge of the olde fayth from newe, stande to the wrytyn­ges of olde holy doctours & sayntes / by whose exposicyōs we se what poyntes are ex­pressed in the scrypture, and [Page 284] what poyntes the catholyke chyrche of Cryst hath bysyde the scrypture receyued & kept by the spyryte of god and tra­dycyon of hys apostles.

And specyally must we also stande in this mater of fayth, to the determynaciōs of Cry­stes catholyke chyrche.

Now yf any man wyll bere other in hāde, that this poynt or that poynt is not determy­ned, or that the holy doctours of y chyrche wryte not in such wyse but the contrary / than who so euer is not of suche lernynge, as to perceyue by hym self whither of those two saye trewe that holde therin contrary partys: than except the artycle be a playne open knowen thynge of it selfe, not [Page] dowted of before, let hym not be lyght of credence in the by­leuynge eyther the tone dys­puter or the tother, thoughe they wolde bothe preche hygh prayses of theyr owne con­nynge, and saye that bysyde all theyr mych worldely busy­nesse they hadde spent many yeres about the studye of scrypture, and bost that theyr bo­kes of dyuynyte were worthe neuer so myche money, or that by the spyryte they were inspired and wyth the celestyall dew sodaynly sprongen vp dyuynys, as lustye freshe and grene as after any showre of rayne euer spronge any bedde of lekes. Lette no man I say be lyght in byleuynge theym for all that / but let hym by my [Page 285] pore cōsayle pray god inspyre hym self, to byleue and folow the thynge that [...]aye be hys hygh pleasure / and lette hym therupon appoynt with hym selfe to lyue well / & forth with to beginne well, gete hym self a good goostely father, and shryue hym of hys synnes / & than concernyng the questiō, aske aduyce and counsayle of those whom hym selfe thyn­keth bytwene god & hys new clensed cōscyence, for lernyng and vertue moste lykely, without any parcyall lenynge, in­dyfferētly to tell hym treuth.

And thus farre I saye for the fayth it selfe, bycause I here some men myche speke & boste that they wyll labour for declaracyons of heresye, [Page] whyche as me semeth is a thynge that lytell nedeth. For I neuer wyste any man in my lyfe putte in trouble for any poynte of heresye, but suche poyntes as were for heresye well and openly knowen a­mong the comon p [...]ople. And saynt Poule sayth y heresyes be manyfest and open / so that he thought as it semeth, that there neded none other decla­racyon than the comon recey­ued fayth of the chrystē pepl [...] to the contrary.

But now as touchyng any new order concernynge here­syes, wyth the chaunge of lawes before dyuysed for the repressyō of them: I haue n [...] more to say therin, but aduys [...] euery good man endeuour [...] [Page 286] hym self to kepe well y lawes all redy made of olde / excepte he se the cause of the makyng chaūged, or some other great necessyte / and that he se that poynt by more ordinary mea­nes proued, than eyther by some say, or they say, or many say / or ellys that he perceyue well at y leste, that those folke which wold labour to chaūge them be better & wyser bothe, than euer were those y made them. And thus fynysshe I thys mater concernynge he­resyes / besechynge our lorde and sauyour for hys bytter passyon, that as hys holy sa­cramentes therof toke theyre strength, so by the prayour of all those holy sayntes y haue bothe by theyr holy doctryne [Page] and ensample of lyuynge, some of them planted y fayth, and some of theym in sundry tymes well watered the plan­tes, so hym selfe wyll of hys goodnes specially now vouchsaufe as the warme sonne (the [...]ery eternall onely begotten sonne of hys eternall father) to [...]prede hys beames vppon vs, and aspyre hys breth into vs, and ī our hartes as saynt Poule sayth geue hys fayth strength and encreace.

The .l. chapyter.

NOw come I to the last [...]wt that the brethern fynde in my bokes. For as for one more that was shewed me wyth [...]n thys seuen nyght, I not so myche esteme, as to vouchesau [...]e to answere, that [Page 287] is to wyt where they reproue that I brynge in amonge the moste ernest maters, fansyes and sportes, and mery tales. For as Horace sayeth, a man maye somtyme saye full soth in game. And one that is but a lay man as I am, it maye better happely become hym meryly to tell hys mynde, thā seryously and solempnely to preache. And ouer thys I can scant byleue that the brethern fynde any myrth ī my bokes. For I haue not myche herde y they very merely rede them.

But as to the laste faute that they fynde, which I was about now to speke of, where as they saye that as concer­nynge the chyrch, I haue not fulfylled my promyse / I shall [Page] here fyrste put you in remem­braūce what my ꝓmyse was.

In the ende of my preface byfore Tyndals confutacyon these are my very wordes.

Nowe shall I (god wyl­lynge) at my nexte [...]eyso [...] go farther in his boke / and come to the very breste of all this batayle / that is to wytte the question whych is the chyrch. For that is the poynte that all these heretyk [...] by all the mea­nes they may labour to make so darke / that by theyr willes no man sholde wyt what they mean [...]. But I trust to drawe the serpent out of his darke d [...]nne / and as the poetes [...]a [...]n that [...]ercules drew vp C [...] [...]erus [Page 288] the mastrffe of hell in to the lyghte where hys eyen dased: so shal as I wi [...]h y grace of that lyght whyche illumy­neth euery man that cometh into this wor [...]de / make you that ma [...]er so lyght some & so clere to euery man / y I shall leue Tyndale neuer a darke corner to [...] into / able to hyde his hedde.

Then after that I laue so clerely confu [...]ed Tynda [...]e cōcernyng that poynt / & shall haue playnly proued you the sure and stedfas [...]e authoryte of Cristes catholike knowen ch [...]rche / agaynste all Tyn­dales tryflyng sophys [...]ycacy­ons / whyche he wolde sholde [Page] seme so solempne subtile ins [...] [...]ub [...]es / whych ye shall se prou [...]d very [...]rantyke folyes: after this done I say / before I go farther wyth Tyndale / I purpose to answere good yon [...]e fath [...]r Fryth.

Now god readers who so lyst to saye that I haue not fulfylled thys promyse / yf he rede not my boke, I can not make hym se the thynge that he lyste not to loke on.

If he haue red it, & thynke hym selfe not satisfyed / I can not make hym perceyue more then hys wyt wyll serue hym.

If he vnderstande it well, and yet wyll say my promyse is not fulfylled / I can not let hym for hys pleasure to lye. [Page 289] But lette hym what so euer he be put in wrytynge what moueth hym so to saye, and I shall than I dowte not make other folke perceyue, that all my promyse in that poynt I haue fully pertormed & more / that is to wy [...] by as myche more at the [...]este, as all myne eyght booke amounteth. For lyke as in the tother I haue fully cōfuted Tyndals chyr­che: so haue I in that booke confuted as for thys worlde, the chyrche that frere Barns had falsely framed here also / wherof I promised nothyng. So that as towchynge the certentye of the chyrche, and of y infallible doctryn therof / who so rede and aduyse well thys worke of myne made for [Page] the confutacyon of Tyndale / and therwyth rede and consy­der y .vii. fyrst chapyters and the laste of my seconde booke of my dyaloge, wheruppon Tindale made all his wurke: I dowt not but he that thus wyll do, shall fynde hym selfe fully satysfyed.

And therfore good crysten readers, as for suche farther thinges as I haue in my sayd preface promysed / I purpose to pursew at some other far­ther leysour. But fyrste I thynke yt better to bes [...]owe some tyme vppon an nother thynge / and leuynge for a whyle bothe defence of myne owne fautes and fyndynge of other mennys in wrytynge, thynke better to bestow some [Page 290] tyme about the mendynge of myne owne in lyuyng, which is a thyng now for many men more necessarye then is wry­tynge. For of new boke ma­kers there are nowe mo then ynough.

wherfore that all suche as wyll wryte, may haue y grace to wryte well / or at the leste wyse none other purpose then to meane well / and as well wryters as other to amende our owne fautes & lyue well: I beseche almyghtye god to graunt vs / and that all folke spyrytuall and temporall in this world lyuyng, & all good crystē soules departed hence and yet not out of payne, may for grace euery parte pray for other / & all y blessed holy sayntes [Page] in heuen, bothe here for grace & there for glory, praye to god for vs all. Amen.

¶Prynted by w. Rabell in Fletestrete in saynte Brydys chyrch yarde. 153 [...] Cum priuilegio.

The fautes escaped in the prentyng of this Apology.

Fo. [...]a. [...]inea.The fautes.The amende­ments.
40iiviiimyght semyght not se
44iixviG [...]ekeGrece
51iixicon [...]oded me [...]confounded me
58ivi.e [...]eccyon begynnynge. Ifeleccion, begyn­nynge yf
66ixxivntou [...]hedvntouched
66iixithe temporalty& the tēporalty
75iiifor asas for
76iviispyrituall man / butspyrytuall man to my knowe­lege / but
76ixvthi [...] ofthis daye of
95ixiiiafter holyafter this holy
1 [...]4ixii& euyllan euyll
162ixviiiteachedo and teache
167ixiiiiproplem [...]probleme
[Page]171iiiiiiis wytte,is to wytte,
219iiiiimany wyllmany a man wyll
225ivif [...]ok [...]folke

The fautes escaped in the pretynge of the second parte of the con­futacyon.

Fol.lineaThe fautesAmendemēte [...]
xiiiiL 14 [...]goodnes
xviiB 1lyfe to come,lyfe, to come
xivL 12 [...]theo [...]her
xxiiiL 5Now is thisteachynge [...].

☞ I haue consyde [...]ed good rea [...]ers of late, a place in a boke of Tindale, whe [...] he somwhat [...] and gooth bakke, & modefyeth parte of his olde posycyons agayns [...] satysfaccyon. For he agreeth in that p [...]ace, that bycause whē a mā hath synned, he is as after a sykenesse the wea­ [...]er / therfore he mus [...]e tame the body the more, and do the more good to make hym agayne the [...]enger. Whyche wordes of Tyndale yf I had marked, I wold haue touched in the sayd place. And syth I haue sene them synnes / I geue you knowlege therof, bycause I wolde not willyngly in any thynge mysse rehe [...]se hym.

How be yt though he by those wordes som­what more mytygate the mater, then he was wont to do byfore: yet as for any sacramentall penaūce to be taken of the preste, or any penaūce to be done, in reuengynge vppon hym selfe the [...]yspleasure that he hath done to god, or almes, or other good worke for helpynge to weshe [...] any synne passed, or to mynys [...]e any part [...] [Page] of the payn dew therunto, or for the aswagyng of the wrath of god: all this gere for all hy [...] moderacyon is great synne wyth him styll. And therfore as touchyng the sacrament of penaūce, his moderacyon nothynge mendeth his heresy.

xxviiiB 1thenthat
xxxviL 3perceyueperceyued
xxxviC 14vnkyndnessevnkyndnesse [...]d dempne hym / yet he
xlA 11fyrssefyrste
xliiC 4happe to anyhappe any
xlvA 6hardynessehardnesse
liA 12debe
lixB 2bloutelyblountly
lxviL 2lakeloke
lxviiiA 8boudenbounden
lxxC 11trewtrow
lxxiiiiB 5furmentyeinfyrmyte
lxxviiC 11bybe
lxxxii [...]C 3allin all
ciiiiB 3tempeyonstemptacyon [...]
cxA 5& C 1 smallfynall
cxiiB 2towardestowardnesse
cxiiiA 6saas
cxviA 11do thyngedo nothynge
cxviiA 7whomwhen
cxviiiC 10or a cōformableor in workyng of a conformable
cxxA 8releuedreueled
cxxxi in the margēt Apoca. 30.Apoc. 3.
cxxxii.C 11farre fattefarre fette.
cxxxixB 3rymayneremayneth
cxxxixB 4beis
cxlvB 13as for asas farre as
cxlviA 10that he fellthat fell
cxlixA 10the sokethe yoke
clB 6world withworld without [...]
clC 9he [...]esyheresyes
clviiC 5though theythough he
clviiC 6kylye [...]ebelyef
clviiC 11iptointo
clixC 4raylethrayled
clixC 6byfore yt camebyfore they came to yt agayn
clxviiiC 2But notBut out
clxixA 12that he thatthat that
clxxiA 6he defamedhe defyned
clxxiiiiB 11faystfyrste
clxxvA 4chapyter ofchapyter
clxxixB 1reuocacyonrenouacyon
cxciiC 11deadelldede [...]y
cxcvB 3Tyndale hothTyndale doth
cxcvB 7luskusluskes
cc in the mergent ayle vpon the prefies goodesrayle vppon the goddes
ccC 1authoryteauthorytees
cciiiA 13poynt / the pope, though [...]poynt / though
cciiiiA 5them somtyme dothem do
[Page]ccviC 11Noth wythstan­dyng as bycauseNot wythstandynge bycause
ccxA 12by some places, as somelay some places, and some
ccxixA 10varyauncethe varyaunce
ccxxviA 8ryse vpryse vppon
ccxxxA 8swareswarne
ccxxxiB 14,be no moby no mo
ccxxxvA 4grounethgroneth
ccxxxviiiC 12goodgod
ccxlixB 13then woldethen wyll
ccliiiC 9wereand were
cclvB 2lyuys bakeleuys backe
cclviA 6to be wel saued ynoughto be saued well ynough
cclviiiC 5satysfaccysatysfaccyon
cclxB 14that is saythat is to say
cclxiiiiB 12for all at hys lawfull lybertyefor all that at hys lybertye
cclxviiiA 12gosgod
cclxixA 1also thealso that the
cclxxA 4downethdowne the
cclxxiA 5commaudedcommended
cclxxiiiiC 14& there& theyr
cclxxvA 7vs thevs with the
cclxxviA 8teache hymteache them
cclxxviiA 10note of theout of the
cclxxxiiiiA 5syth hersyth he
cclxxxvA 2haue byleuehaue byleued
cclxxxviiiA 13shypwarkeshypwrake
ccxcixB 7two thyngetwo thynges
ccxcixC 1m, tanhat is sayman that is to say
cccC 8he guehe gaue
cccC 12that wtyhoutthat wythout
ccciB 11teachedteacheth
cccviB 2takentake
cccxiiiiA 12Now where the wretcheNow the wretche
cccxviA 12tell vstell you
cccxviiC 10in hysin this
cccxixC 6this answere & thishis answere & his
cccxxiiA 5that haththat he hath
cccxxiiiA 8my plyableme plyable
cccxxviiB 5hym / this flock he menethhym this flock, he nameth
cccxxviiiA 4ValenciusValentinus
IbidemA 8CelestinusCelestius
cccxxxB 5the worldethe worde
cccxxxiB 3vertuousevertues
cccxxxiiA 6trew thethe trew
cccxxxiiiiB 4holy Austaynholy saint Austai [...]
cccxlviiiA 13forwardnessefrowardnesse
IbidemB 4workedworketh
cccliiiiC 9doctoursdettours
ccclvB 5that yt isthat is
ccclviiiB 2frutefullyfrutefull
[Page]ccclxiC 3proundeprowde
ccclxiiA 5spyryeespyryte
ccclxiiiA 6xx. or. xx.xx. or. xxx.
ccclxiiiiA 11bad / of [...]o men suchebad / so men of suche
ccclxviA 10confyrmableconformable
ccclxixA 5shewedsheweth
ccclxxiA 5Iraell are IraelytesIsraell are Israe­lytes
ccclxxiiiB 5cū patre quiqui cum patre
IbidemC 12knowen / knowen chyrch /
ccclxxviiC 14bnby
ccclxxviiiA 12dydedyed
ccclxxixA 4that tothat is to
ccclxxxvA 5IraelIsraell
IbidemA 6Esauand Esau
ccclxxxviiC 13Esus,Esaus,
cccxcC 12now isnow yf
cccxcvB 9bybe
cccxcviA 7redy downeredy done
cccciiiB 11the wordethe worlde
ccccviiA 6apperethapproueth
IbidemB 5he askewe aske
ccccxA 6fogyueforgyue
ccccxiA 6her bytterhis bytter
ccccxiiB 14yet for theyryet theyr
ccccxiiiiA 4hyshym
ccccxviiA 11grategrace
ccccxviiiC 12suffycyentinsuffycyent
ccccxixA 7habytullhabytuall
ccccxxB 8onan
ccccxxviB 13bullyngebussynge
ccccxxixB 14that canthat he can
ccccxlviiC 4sufferedsuffereth
ccccliA 5leue herlyue here
IbidemB 9mysierymasiery
ccccliiiB 2he hathhath he
IbidemC 7wythwytte
cccc [...]ixC 15wordewordes
cccclxiA 12handeleth mater that woldhandeleth the mater that he wolde
cccclxviiB 11& 12 an answerean vnsure
cccclxxvA 3IouyIoy
cccclxxviC 3. 6. 7.EnnuchusEunuchu [...]
IbidemC 11to hymto answere hym
cccclxxviiB 10not thatnor that
IbidemC 7do soto do so
cccclxxxviA 1ye wote ye woteye wote
ccccxciB 7dela [...]edeclare
ccccxciiA 2chyrcheschyrche
ccccxciiiB 13a [...] [...]of all
ccccxciiiiB 4holynesse, but because of that holynesse that is in yt besyde / of theyr professyon, nor isholynes of theyr professyon, but be cause of that holynesse that is in yt besyde / nor is
ccccxcixA 14& werethat were
[Page]ccccciiiC 10our ownyour own
cccccviiiB 7neuer fullneuer so full
cccccixB 5in spyrytthe spyryt
cccccxiiA 9matemake
cccccxviB 10oyseoyle
IbidemC 2could not hauecoulde haue
cccccxxviA 6bnebene
cccccxxviiiB 13our owneyour owne
IbidemC 4holy fatherholy fathers
cccccxxxiB 11whenwhen he
IbidemC 5of thyrcheof the chyrche
cccccxxxixA 12fallyfully
ccccclviiiC 8he calleththe crede calleth
ccccclxvC 8blolkyngebolkynge
ccccclxviB 7and vnknowēan vnknowen
ccccclxixB 10a sagitte volā tis in die, a negocio peram­bulātisa sagitta volante in die, a negocio perambulante

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